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mochinist
08-07-2005, 10:17 PM
This guy post over in the PM site, under the antique machine section, I was reading this thread and thought you guys might be interested, they do some beatiful work. http://www.practicalmachinist.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=001210

This is their website http://www.coolweldstudios.com/index.htm

This is a micrometer they make, look at the rope knurl, that is sweet. I wouldn't really want one of these mic's for the shop but it sure is nice looking.
http://www.coolweldstudios.com/jeffpics/CWSmike1.jpg

P.S. I am in no way affiliated with them or anything like that. And sorry if someone already posted it, but I couldn't remember seeing it and the search function on this website sucks.

Furnace
08-07-2005, 10:20 PM
Purdy.

Ian B
08-08-2005, 12:19 AM
Pretty indeed!

Ok, how do they (or more to the point, how do I) do that rope knurling?

Ian

Evan
08-08-2005, 12:51 AM
You buy a Millgrain rope knurler.

Here (http://www.gesswein.com/catalog/catalog.cfm?cat=24&sub=7&subsub=2&catalog=1&CFID=540869&CFTOKEN=60317563)

jburstein
08-08-2005, 02:21 AM
Mr. Frank Ford has a bit of a page about it here:

http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Machining/Projects/RopeKnurl/ropeknurl.html

-Justin

Ian B
08-08-2005, 02:32 AM
I wondered if a concave knurling tool would do it - but I thought the edges might not come out looking nice. Seems they do!

Thanks for the info guys.

Ian

matador
08-08-2005, 03:59 AM
That sure is a pretty tool.Much too nice to use.It's even got one of my old brass doorknobs on the end http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif.A work of art.

------------------
Hans

JCHannum
08-08-2005, 05:46 AM
The anvil and spindle do not line up.

They took a decent micrometer, drilled some holes in the frame and stuck some brass do-dads on it for coffee table art. As a mic, it is useless.

Ian B
08-08-2005, 06:13 AM
It's for measuring offsets and eccentrics

Mcgyver
08-08-2005, 12:19 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JCHannum:
The anvil and spindle do not line up.

They took a decent micrometer, drilled some holes in the frame and stuck some brass do-dads on it for coffee table art. As a mic, it is useless. </font>

you are right, as far as looks go, the ornamentation had me fooled. lots of old prints of tools and engines were embellished but the holes like "rc car-ish"

I've got some mic's supposedly turn of the century (not the last one) and they are very plain

L Webb
08-08-2005, 12:48 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">The anvil and spindle do not line up.
They took a decent micrometer, drilled some holes in the frame and stuck some brass do-dads on it for coffee table art. As a mic, it is useless.</font>

JCHannum, you have based this claim on what? Have you checked these against calibrated standards? Or is it just your opinion by looking at a photo that they are useless?

I would really like to know how you can proclaim these as useless.

Les

topct
08-08-2005, 12:57 PM
You could bury it out in the yard for about a year, dig it up, some steel wool, and get lot's of money for it on E-bay.

I like the idea of trying to create something that looks antique. But the entire thing should be made from scratch not just a $5 dollar mike fancied up. The rest of their stuff looks nice though. A bit to shiny however.

------------------
Gene

JCHannum
08-08-2005, 01:19 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by L Webb:
JCHannum, you have based this claim on what? Have you checked these against calibrated standards? Or is it just your opinion by looking at a photo that they are useless?

I would really like to know how you can proclaim these as useless.

Les</font>

A good micrometer that has had holes drilled in the frame, and whose anvil and spindle are out of line is nice decoration. The frame is more than likely sprung, making it useless as a micrometer. I would like to see someone calibrate it.

Here are a couple of old French micrometers that would be typical. I don't know age, perhaps someone can provide that information, but probably 100+ years old.
http://members.aol.com/jchannum/mics

Mcgyver
08-08-2005, 01:26 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by topct:
You could bury it out in the yard for about a year, dig it up, some steel wool, and get lot's of money for it on E-bay.
</font>

a new business model for the ebay guy everyone loves so much http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

I agree with the fun of making an reproduction that looks authentic - thats the enjoyment of model engineering imo, but at second glance imo this is overdone. the pics jc posted look more like the antique mic's i have and have seen

[This message has been edited by Mcgyver (edited 08-08-2005).]

L Webb
08-08-2005, 01:57 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">A good micrometer that has had holes drilled in the frame, and whose anvil and spindle are out of line is nice decoration. The frame is more than likely sprung, making it useless as a micrometer. I would like to see someone calibrate it.</font>

JCHannum, you didn't answer my simple question. You have said these are useless as a mic. How did you come to that conclusion?
Did you test them or just conclude it by the picture?

Les

topct
08-08-2005, 02:54 PM
Take a good look at the rest of what they are doing. The oval chuck seems to look very well done. I've never seen anything like it. And the level looks to be a very good representation.

Judging by the rest of what they are doing, I'm wondering if the mic may be a prototype.

------------------
Gene

pgmrdan
08-08-2005, 03:01 PM
Les, from the photo you can see that they don't line up.

L Webb
08-08-2005, 03:20 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Les, from the photo you can see that they don't line up.</font>

pgmrdan, that makes them useless?

Les

jburstein
08-08-2005, 03:58 PM
well, the fact that the spindle and anvil don't line up could be a sign that the frame is bent, or that it was poorly constructed in the first place. I would imagnine either one of those scenarios would put its usefulness in question.

-Justin

Mcgyver
08-08-2005, 04:20 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by L Webb:
pgmrdan, that makes them useless?

</font>

not unless you bury them for a year, clean them up, and sell them on ebay

topct
08-08-2005, 05:25 PM
Actually it doesn't matter if they are off that way as long as the faces are exactly parallel. It's how it disturbs the eye that matters. The thing probably functions just fine. But there is also a conflict between the style of the frame and the style of the knob that also disturbs the eye. It's a little bit like seeing a model of an old steam engine that has been put together with socket head cap screws.

Again I'm thinking prototype. If the style of the thimble was carried on to the rest of it, it truly would be a jewel. This just isn't quite there.



------------------
Gene

J. Randall
08-08-2005, 06:00 PM
You guys who are saying the mike does not line up should read the whole thread before condeming it. That was answered in that thread if I remember right. James

pgmrdan
08-08-2005, 06:30 PM
Les, if it's from being sprung, yes.

Does anyone intentionally make them misaligned???

Frank Ford
08-08-2005, 06:52 PM
Interesting how our first impressions differ.

Some immediately compare it to a new precision tool and try to judge its utility from a photograph.

It's priced at about double the price a new Starrett, so some also declare it not to be a good "value."

I had a different reaction. My first thought was to compare it to other decorative art - jewlery for machinists. So I immediately put in my order. I've missed this kind of presentation tool before, and I'll be danged if I will ever again! It's the kind of thing that often doesn't exactly pay the bills for anybody, so it may well be available for only a short while.

And, while waiting for it to arrive, I got fired up enough to try making some knurls of my own, for a very different project. I'll be making some little repro knurled thumbwheels for adjustable instrument bridges.

Check out the ones that got away:

http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Museum/SpecialItems/GezaBurghardt/gezatools.html

Their availablility was only for a few months. . .

JCHannum
08-08-2005, 07:40 PM
Actually, I have read the thread. He does not address the alignment, just says they "float the anvil" and cement in place.

I see the frame and thimble are their fabrication, spindle and hub purchased. Does not say from who though. A more rigid frame, lacking the holes would make it a more serviceable micrometer.

It is very nice work, but I would class it the same as fantasy knives, nice to look at, but not exactly functional. The holes in the frame would make it limber, the large thumbwheel would make it easily overstressed. The apparent offset in the anvil and spindle if nothing more displays inattention to detail that I would not expect to find in a precision instrument costing this much.

Some of the items on their site are very well done, but not for me. If you want to consider them as jewelry or decorative art, that is fine, as working tools, they are less than practical, and I feel the micrometer would not be a reliable instrument.

The oval chuck is a nice piece of work, and it is nice to see someone doing what they enjoy and making a living at it. I wish them the best.

The tools on Frank Ford's post are beautiful, but were make to perform their purpose, then embellished. I appreciate this kind of tool. They are in a different class than something that is made for appearance with function secondary.

[This message has been edited by JCHannum (edited 08-08-2005).]

mochinist
08-08-2005, 08:02 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JCHannum:
Actually, I have read the thread. He does not address the alignment, just says they "float the anvil" and cement in place.

I see the frame and thimble are their fabrication, spindle and hub purchased. Does not say from who though. A more rigid frame, lacking the holes would make it a more serviceable micrometer.

It is very nice work, but I would class it the same as fantasy knives, nice to look at, but not exactly functional. The holes in the frame would make it limber, the large thumbwheel would make it easily overstressed. The apparent offset in the anvil and spindle if nothing more displays inattention to detail that I would not expect to find in a precision instrument costing this much.

Some of the items on their site are very well done, but not for me. If you want to consider them as jewelry or decorative art, that is fine, as working tools, they are less than practical, and I feel the micrometer would not be a reliable instrument.

The oval chuck is a nice piece of work, and it is nice to see someone doing what they enjoy and making a living at it. I wish them the best.

The tools on Frank Ford's post are beautiful, but were make to perform their purpose, then embellished. I appreciate this kind of tool. They are in a different class than something that is made for appearance with function secondary.

[This message has been edited by JCHannum (edited 08-08-2005).]</font>

24th post down on them pm site link, he states that they are aligned. I see it in the photo too, digital camera's do weird things sometimes, I don't know if they are misaligned or not. I would be curious to hear a quality feedback report from FrankFord when he gets his.

I do think it is funny that a bunch of guys who spend thousands of dollars on machines, so that they can make useless hobby engines that sit on a desk would be so quick to jump on this mic as useless or overdone.

Mcgyver
08-08-2005, 08:13 PM
anyway personal taste aside on that one piece , thanks for the link, some cool stuff...and Frank, I just looked over your site and thats a very respectable workshop effort! thanks for making it available

JCHannum
08-08-2005, 08:18 PM
"Adam - like current B&S and Mitutoyo products we "float the anvil in the frame" while making sure we have parallelism. We then use a very viscous high strength adhesive as they do to premanently fix the anvil's position."

Copied from 24th. post. It says parallel, not aligned. Two different things.

I am not jumping on anything or anyone. My shop has paid for itself, and now most of what I do is for my own benefit and enjoyment, not for resale. If it were, I would take extra pains to be sure it was the best possible.

Their work is very nice, and I commend them. It is not for me.

mochinist
08-08-2005, 08:52 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JCHannum:
"Adam - like current B&S and Mitutoyo products we "float the anvil in the frame" while making sure we have parallelism. We then use a very viscous high strength adhesive as they do to premanently fix the anvil's position."

Copied from 24th. post. It says parallel, not aligned. Two different things.

I am not jumping on anything or anyone. My shop has paid for itself, and now most of what I do is for my own benefit and enjoyment, not for resale. If it were, I would take extra pains to be sure it was the best possible.

Their work is very nice, and I commend them. It is not for me. </font>

Okay I can live with that, I agree the mic is not really my cup of tea either, but it is nice work indeed.

L Webb
08-08-2005, 09:05 PM
JCHannum, you never answered how you were qualified to rate or judge the micrometer as useless only by looking at a picture. You proclaimed the tool as useless to the whole world that reads this forum.

If that tool doesn't tickle your fancy that is fine. I just found your consumer report rather ignorant. If you had personally used and checked one then maybe you could make the claim you did.

I see where the holes in the frame could affect rigidity, if you are using the mic as a c-clamp or spanner wrench. Geez, it is just a small micrometer. Rigidity should not be a problem if you use the mic with the proper established techniques.

Les

wierdscience
08-08-2005, 09:42 PM
The Mic is cute,but I am with JC,it is just decoration.I don't see any spanner holes to allow adjustment.

I have made a few rope knurls over the years for antique reproduction.
My method for making the knurls is to figure the diameter for the pitch knurl I want and machine two blanks from drill rod.I mount the two blanks on to a piece of coldrolled flatbar on shoulder screws so they have very little slack but still turn free on a center distance that is equal to the od of the tap,less the height of the thread.Then I set them up in the mill and feed a spiral flute tap down between them.The result is a self corrected set of knurls.By having two they can be setup in a gang with a spacer keying the two together so the produced knurls line up perfectly everytime.

JCHannum
08-08-2005, 09:44 PM
Les;

I did answer in my second post. If the spindle and anvil are out of line as it appears, and the maker does not refute, it will not be possible to calibrate accurately.

It is very nice work, and decorative. But it is not a precision instrument.

jero100
08-08-2005, 09:58 PM
Why will it not calibrate?

[This message has been edited by jero100 (edited 08-08-2005).]

chief
08-08-2005, 10:24 PM
And the 30 thrity year old rusted, $1.00 yard sale is more accurate and a better deal?
Perhaps it's just jealously, the website says he doesn't use CNC, that probably comes as a shock to many of the "experts" here.
People will buy these as decorations and gifts, no need to freak out about accurate readings, if accuracy is the determing factor then every tool without a vernier scale and carbide faces should be thrown away the same goes for hand ground toolbits. chill out.

wierdscience
08-08-2005, 10:53 PM
"Folks, at Cool Weld Studios Inc. We have created a line of custom machinist tools reflecting the quality and craftmanship of U.S. tool making at the turn of the 20th. century. The 0-1/2" mike is carbide tipped, reads tenths and has a speeder knob. The 6" level has brass & bronze vial tube, ground tool steel base, .005"/foot vial and is adjustable. MADE IN THE U.S.A.!!"

Made in the USA!So that's why the anvils don't line up.High dollar paper wieghts.I like the rope knurl job,but the rest detracts from it.

It's not meant to be used,it is meant to be displayed,but there are errors that shouldn't be in a display piece.The polishing on the frame is off and the anvils not being lined up even close is visually obvious.Maybe they should drag it behind a car for awhile to give it "character".Sorry,it is what it is.

yo
08-20-2005, 11:42 AM
JCHannum & weirdscience,you got to be kidding me. Are you completely stupid? YES!!! Let the group see your creations. What do your mikes look like? Got the guts? NO!! Those French pieces of garbage were imported by companies like E.G.Smith.They were low ball crap back then at less than $3.00ea. Spanner holes - do you even know what these are? HAVE YOU EVER seen these in the same view of a Sterrett mike? NO!!! That's because they are located at about 4 O'clock on the barrel blind to the viewer in the image. You think your really blowing smoke up every bodies but here vand believe your own bull crap!! Having negative big mouths here just show your envy and how dumb you really are. We ordered 10ea. count 'em 10 IN FRONT OF US. recieved them and they are STUNNING!!!!! They check in SPINDLE TO ANVIL alignment, parrallelism, accuracy to Starrett AND Sherr-Tumico mike test sets @ 72*F. NOW are you going to dog those test sets? So if you can't make these or have them - they are no good. If you don't have anything constructive to say - keep your dumb but mouths closed and do us ALL a favor!!!

Ian B
08-20-2005, 11:51 AM
Hello Yo,

Welcome to the group. Good first post...

Ian

lynnl
08-20-2005, 12:20 PM
Good Grief! ...a little grouchy I'd say.

Phil McCrackin
08-20-2005, 01:14 PM
It looks to me like the alignment problem has to do with camera angle more than anything else. I dunno.

Anyhow, I sure wish I could make a set of mics that nice. Nice Job!

P.S. Maybe the holes will lower the friction coefficient for high speed machining...

Mcgyver
08-20-2005, 01:42 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ian B:
Hello Yo,

Welcome to the group. Good first post...

Ian</font>

Now that was funny. They may be the most accurate imaginable, but I still say they look garish, like at a regal scepter collided with an RC car part.

Frank Ford
08-20-2005, 01:49 PM
My CoolWeld mics arrived last week and yesterday I presented one to my machining pal to whom I owe so many small favors - he was blown away, both by the gesture and the tool. If it has one best use, that has to be it!

I got a pretty good pic of mine:

http://www.frets.com/coolweld/coolweldmic01copy.jpg

Comparing both of them to my trusty Starret, there's a general agreement as to the size of my gauge blocks. . .

IOWOLF
08-20-2005, 02:00 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by yo:
JCHannum & weirdscience,you got to be kidding me. Are you completely stupid? YES!!! Let the group see your creations. What do your mikes look like? Got the guts? NO!! Those French pieces of garbage were imported by companies like E.G.Smith.They were low ball crap back then at less than $3.00ea. Spanner holes - do you even know what these are? HAVE YOU EVER seen these in the same view of a Sterrett mike? NO!!! That's because they are located at about 4 O'clock on the barrel blind to the viewer in the image. You think your really blowing smoke up every bodies but here vand believe your own bull crap!! Having negative big mouths here just show your envy and how dumb you really are. We ordered 10ea. count 'em 10 IN FRONT OF US. recieved them and they are STUNNING!!!!! They check in SPINDLE TO ANVIL alignment, parrallelism, accuracy to Starrett AND Sherr-Tumico mike test sets @ 72*F. NOW are you going to dog those test sets? So if you can't make these or have them - they are no good. If you don't have anything constructive to say - keep your dumb but mouths closed and do us ALL a favor!!!</font>

Do us a favor and go away again. That thing is so pimped up it has no real reason to be in a "machinists" box,though as a xmas tree ornament it is ok.

3 Phase Lightbulb
08-20-2005, 02:23 PM
Personally, I think they are stunning. Very nice work indeed. The brass/bronze with tool steel looks great. http://www.bbssystem.com/images/smiles/newsmile_notworthy.gif

-Adrian

Ian B
08-20-2005, 02:37 PM
Hey,

Could be the start of a new TV series:

"Pimp My Tool"

(er - maybe not...)

Ian

Ian B
08-20-2005, 02:38 PM
Hey,

Could be the start of a new TV series:

"Pimp My Tool"

(er - maybe not...)

Ian

IOWOLF
08-20-2005, 04:43 PM
3p h, if I thought it was cool,like a kid would , you would think is sucked,whatever.

wierdscience
08-20-2005, 11:31 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by yo:
JCHannum & weirdscience,you got to be kidding me. Are you completely stupid? YES!!! Let the group see your creations. What do your mikes look like? Got the guts? NO!! Those French pieces of garbage were imported by companies like E.G.Smith.They were low ball crap back then at less than $3.00ea. Spanner holes - do you even know what these are? HAVE YOU EVER seen these in the same view of a Sterrett mike? NO!!! That's because they are located at about 4 O'clock on the barrel blind to the viewer in the image. You think your really blowing smoke up every bodies but here vand believe your own bull crap!! Having negative big mouths here just show your envy and how dumb you really are. We ordered 10ea. count 'em 10 IN FRONT OF US. recieved them and they are STUNNING!!!!! They check in SPINDLE TO ANVIL alignment, parrallelism, accuracy to Starrett AND Sherr-Tumico mike test sets @ 72*F. NOW are you going to dog those test sets? So if you can't make these or have them - they are no good. If you don't have anything constructive to say - keep your dumb but mouths closed and do us ALL a favor!!!</font>

Premodonna panty wieght!I'm sorry,well actually your sorry.The picture cleary shows a mic with a misaligned spindle,there is no excuse for this on a "Made in the USA" product.I have two beater Chiwan mics at work,both are over ten years old and have seen rough use,both cost less than $10 each,tell me this why do the're anvils line up and yours don't?If they do as you claim,then what happened with the one pictured?Defect?Is it so f--king hard to wring the anvil and spindle face together,maintain alignment with a $2 drill bushing and zero the timble while the epoxy cures?Oh,BTW,the people at Starret and Mito use the epoxy because it's cheap,not because it's better.Drill a sloppy hole and glue it in,it's the American corprate crap factory way!

So,what do we have here? A historically accurate replica?A functional tool for daily use?See it's kind of a bastard child because it's neither.A historic replica wouldn't have carbide faces and a fucntional tool for daily use would not have a swiss cheeze frame until it got larger than a 3-4" mic.

The next question I have is,WTF would I want to build a Mic? Starret has been doing it for how long?They sell for how much?Hardly worth the effort.

I can also tell you that if I made a level the vial posts would BOTH be in the center.That was not the fault of the camera,one or the other was off center by a soild 1/32",what happened,epoxy slumped in the heat?And did the original have grind marks left in the finish?

I really enjoyed all the "decorative elements"and other such BS banter,to answer the question why do all hand tools have to be boring?Because they are not made to be looked at,they are made to be used.

So you have a anvil and spindle made by someone else(because you don't know how)that has admittedly some nice rope knurls glued on to and into a frame full of holes for how many times the cost of a factory mic?It's nice to look at,but the calibration sticker will deminish the "asthetics" real quick if you decide to run work through it that will pass a good QC program.Which brings us back to "if you need a ride into town,will you drive the car or the hood ornament"?

I really enjoyed all the childish BS in your post,really puts you into perspective,gives us insight to your character.Me I can dish out much better than I get,but not on this forum,I DO have respect for it's membership and owners.
You made short sighted comments about JC and I AND YET YOU KNOW VERY LITTLE OR NOTHING ABOUT US.Sure we haven't made our own mics(as I said before that would be pointless)but we certainly could.I for one am too busy making a livivng AS a machinist to have the time to waste re-inventing the wheel.

If Koolaid studios gets the anvils aligned,ditches the holes in the frame,adds a tenth scale and reduces the "lead fishing wieght" proportions of the (as I said twice before)nicely done knurling I will be satisfied,but still won't buy one as I have plenty of Christmas oranments now.As for the level,Captin Nemo wants his paper wieght back.

wierdscience
08-20-2005, 11:46 PM
Oh,and uh I do post pictures of my work,it's not much,didn't take long to make,but it preforms it's intended function and cost way less than a comparable commercially made unit,no hood ornaments,so you obviously won't like it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/wierdscience/ts2.jpg

Notice the lack of glaring grind marks and miss aligned parts?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/wierdscience/ts1.jpg

Oh and if you want to be a critic,feel free,unlike some I can take it.

mochinist
08-21-2005, 01:05 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by wierdscience:
Oh,and uh I do post pictures of my work,it's not much,didn't take long to make,but it preforms it's intended function and cost way less than a comparable commercially made unit,no hood ornaments,so you obviously won't like it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/wierdscience/ts2.jpg

Notice the lack of glaring grind marks and miss aligned parts?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/wierdscience/ts1.jpg

Oh and if you want to be a critic,feel free,unlike some I can take it.</font>

I like it, what is the dimension of the base?
I may have to make one of those, but I am defiantely adding rope knurls and maybe some rhinestones to mine.

Joel
08-21-2005, 02:30 AM
Ohooo, weird LOVES rhinestones. Maybe he should hang some of those fuzzy dingleberry balls on it too. It’ll be cool, really. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

JCHannum
08-21-2005, 06:59 AM
I had chosen to let this thread die, as it had all the earmarks of becoming another "Dead Cat" thread, and we don't need anymore of those right now.

Since yo has chosen to enter the fray with his valued opinion, I will respond.

First, I must complement yo on his eloquent endorsement of the Coolweld Studios products. I am sure Coolweld will immediately incorporate it into their literature to show the high caliber and discerning taste of their customers. Good job.

Second, as far as CWS's response to criticism about the misalignment of the micrometer, he never makes a statement that the micrometer does line up, or has an accuracy that a number can be assigned to, lines of parallelism for instance. He states he has seen Starrett mics new in the box that are mis-aligned, and mumbles about his camera after someone suggests it might be a poor photo. One must assume that is mis-aligned.

Rather than defend the product, CWS goes into attack mode against his critics, and shows his appreciation of other manufacturers tools by calling Bridge City Tools "an ugly tool with lots of wood in it." Anyone familiar with Bridge City Tools knows this is far from true. They are beautifully made tools, capable of the job and representative of tools produced for their purpose.

On the PM site, he has posted a photo of a mic made for Frank Ford, and Frank has posted a photo upon receipt. It is different in some details, and is in alignment. I hope he changes the photos on his website to reflect this, as apparently he has previously had this problem when the products are shown to people with machining knowledge. He refers to the RCM site as being critical too. Apparently knowledgeable people object to the presentation.

There have been several references to the micrometer as stunning, men's jewelry, it would look cool on a desk etc. If this is what it was made to do, it is fine. Then it is a matter of taste, not accuracy or function.

I never made a negative comment about the quality of work, and was complimentary of the work they do. It is very nice. The products are not for me however.

As for me, I buy and sell precision tools, machine tooling and tools for a living. I can pretty well tell if a micrometer or other simple tool is good or not rather quickly, and if it is obviously bad by a photo. Kind of like a car with four flat tires.

I recently sold a lot of 12 new Mitutoyo micrometers, and have at least that many more new and used 1" mics from a variety of manufacturers of all quality around right now, and none of them are mis-aligned. If they were, they would go into the scrap bucket for project mics. BTW, none of the project mics I have now are mis-aligned.

Regular visitors to this site know that I frequently post photos of my projects with all their warts and pimples. I am not a professional machinist, but one need not be a concert pianist to recognise a clinker when someone hits one.

In the past year, I have posted photos of two engines I have built, a partially completed Bill Harris steam roller and pics of tools and tooling I have made as well as my small, manual shop. I have also contributed two articles to HSM and MW. So, yes, I do show my work.

wierdscience
08-21-2005, 07:58 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Joel:
Ohooo, weird LOVES rhinestones. Maybe he should hang some of those fuzzy dingleberry balls on it too. It’ll be cool, really. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif</font>

LT.Joel http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif I was figuring on maybe some spinner hub caps,a turbo kit and maybe some neon lights under the bottom,15 or 20 colors in the paint scheme,and graphics,got to have graphics!Oooohhh and I got to have a spoiler!


NOT! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

J Tiers
08-21-2005, 08:13 AM
As far as the misalinement thing.....

Of course its BS, in terms of being a real indicator of function.... but;

"if they don't even care enough to aline the anvil on a piece they use in advertising, what DO they care about, and what else is wrong with it also?"

Now then, I assume these are NOT INTENDED to be "functional" pieces, as has been suggested, but rather decorative or "presentation" pieces. In that case, they are a bit better, although using a "real" thinble assembly should mean it would be usable.

I agree, I do NOT care for the combination of "aerospace" lightening holes with "retro" rope knurling.

My message to "coolweld"

"Folks, I would suggest from a design standpoint that you choose either retro or new, and stick to that theme, and not mix it up with elements from other eras, because I don't think (and I have company) that they go together well in the ones we have seen".


He also ain't making friends with the backhanded slam (on teh PM board) at home shop people, including, by reference, Barry Jordan, and Sherline contest winners, etc...... Many of them do work than makes that mic look kind of crude..... and he makes a point of mentioning his years of experience etc, etc. Work speaks, people squeak.

I might repeat that the coolweld pieces are evidently intended to be examples of "fine craftsmanship".

Now, "fine craftsmanship" includes getting ALL the details exactly right.... including alinements such as the anvil. When accomplished, it speaks for itself, whether the maker has 60 years or 60 minutes of experience.

Otherwise it is merely "good acceptable commercial work", which many others can do just as well (I may not be included, but I know it when I see it).

I still sorta like the pieces for what they are... although I would NOT characterize them as really being reproductions or whatever the term he used was, of old stuff. They are much more "interpretations", if you will. Nice, no doubt.

[This message has been edited by J Tiers (edited 08-21-2005).]

Rustybolt
08-21-2005, 09:49 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JCHannum:
A good micrometer that has had holes drilled in the frame, and whose anvil and spindle are out of line is nice decoration. The frame is more than likely sprung, making it useless as a micrometer. I would like to see someone calibrate it.

Here are a couple of old French micrometers that would be typical. I don't know age, perhaps someone can provide that information, but probably 100+ years old.
http://members.aol.com/jchannum/mics

</font>


I had one that my grandfather had when he worked for Stewart Warner before WWI. It was a B&S I believe(somebody lifted it) and it looked much like ours do today. Your's look much older. They have that 'one off' look. Before 1890 maybe?

J Tiers
08-21-2005, 09:58 AM
.

[This message has been edited by J Tiers (edited 08-21-2005).]

JCHannum
08-21-2005, 02:15 PM
Jerry; I read your post on the PM site, and I very much meant to make the point that lack of attention to detail indicates poor quality work. In my third post, I said, "The apparent offset in the anvil and spindle if nothing more displays inattention to detail that I would not expect to find in a precision instrument costing this much."

I was surprised at the reaction of many on the PM site. Several of these "professionals" seem to be happy with something that looks good.

Thanks for sticking up for the HSM. Very nicely put. Ability has nothing to do with the cost of the tools used.

Rustybolt; the two micrometers were both made in France. The smaller is marked France, and the larger "Aux Forges De Vulcain, Paris".

They are both metric, and may be late 1800's. I have no idea of the age. Brown & Sharpe saw a French micrometer at the Paris Exposition of 1867, and brought the idea to the US, they and L.S. Starrett refined it. There has been little change in construction since 1900.

wierdscience
08-21-2005, 08:57 PM
JC,the comment our"friend" made about those mics being "lowbuck" is proof positive of his ignorance.He makes note of them costing "less than $3.00 each(BACK THEN)"

I hope he realizes,back then $3.00 was half a weeks wages for a machinist and a new lathe could be bought for less than $100.

If he had done his research he would have found that ornamentaion on machinery and tools was pretty much out by the late 1850's and was all but gone after the Civil War.

Those are neat mics you have there and worth more to me(and you too I am sure)for the're simple witness to times past and the hands that held them.

Mcgyver
08-21-2005, 09:13 PM
JC you got me thinking about the history. I'd read once the Maudsley (SP?) invented the tenths mic around 1800, but the first mic was invented in the Baroque area, by William Gascoigne an Englishman in 1636.

Seems like B&S and Starrett were rather late comers to the party.

http://www.worldwideschool.org/library/books/sci/history/AHistoryofScienceVolumeII/chap43.html