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DR
01-21-2006, 11:59 PM
This is driving me crazy.

My wrench is "missing". That's the way it's been as long as I've been speaking English.

Recently people have started saying "gone missing", even newscasters.

As someone said "Could we, like, pass a law in the U.S. against using British expressions?"

Anyone here participating in this nonsense?

J Tiers
01-22-2006, 12:05 AM
.
Well, globalization is a fact..... just one more facet of it.

More and more foreign expressions get into english. Even English ones.

Do the British expressions cause bad feng shue?

Or do they lead to bad karma?


Sounds like someone is going French on us..... language purity and all that.

The idea of eliminating British expressions from the "english" language has a peculiar piquancy.....


[This message has been edited by J Tiers (edited 01-22-2006).]

Millman
01-22-2006, 12:06 AM
Give you another example; Why is a snowblower now called a snowthrower? Just bought a new 9hp, 2 stage that is called a snowthrower. Think it has to do with the word "BLOW". Must be some more of that politically correct bull****. Maybe someone reads sexual into that term BLOW? Well, they can ALL blow me, free of charge! Can't you just see that in a few years; your furnace breaks down, you ask for a new THROWER motor? What the hell happened to this country? IF you ask, you'll get me started, so don't ask!

------------------
Dave da Slave , BFH

[This message has been edited by Millman (edited 01-22-2006).]

Tinkerer
01-22-2006, 12:11 AM
What the hells the difference... the important thing is did you find your wrench... or did that SOB that's gone missing take it? What drives me crazy is when I loose things in plain sight. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//eek.gif

J Tiers
01-22-2006, 12:13 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Millman:
Why is a snowblower now called a snowthrower?
</font>

Possibly because that is what it is.........

It picks the snow up and throws it.....

A snowblower would not touch the snow, but simply blow it away like those things the paving folks use to clear dust off before laying asphault.

Millman
01-22-2006, 12:18 AM
J, you missed the point, even though you are correct. Due to the speed it does actually blow it in various directions.

[This message has been edited by Millman (edited 01-22-2006).]

TECHSHOP
01-22-2006, 12:24 AM
Maybe, Dr sets his 1 inch wrench down and could only find a 25.4mm wrench?

I think English will continue to "flatten" as we become less local in everthing we do.

Not saying good/bad, just the way it will be unless you really want to go the French way.



------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

Millman
01-22-2006, 12:27 AM
See, if nobody can use the terms good or bad, that's where it gets worse.

TECHSHOP
01-22-2006, 01:00 AM
The Cajuns, since they were told by law in 1929 that English was the official language of Louisiana, can speak "standard" English at gunpoint but are happier with their own idiomatic use of it.

Ah may not be raht, but ahm sure.

------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

mike.a.henry
01-22-2006, 01:03 AM
Maybe "snow blower" has a room full of lawyers protecting the name, and they figured “snow thrower” sounded pretty good after all??

BTW, it frosts me to hear "Bloody". It's pretty stupid to hear an American say it, no accent, it loses all credibility. Ya know? We tossed enough tea in the drink to keep murdering the language in our own unique way. Ever hear a Brit say "Fer-Shur, Totally". Hearing a Brit say it would make you change the channel and/or consume more alcohol.

Evan
01-22-2006, 01:28 AM
Well, you bloody well aren't going to stop us from saying it here. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif The Queen still owns title to all public lands in Canada. The Royal Union Flag (Union Jack) is still an official flag of Canada.

Millman
01-22-2006, 01:34 AM
So when South Park declared war on Canada; We were actually fighting her HIGHness? Come on, ya' gotta' bloody right ta'say.

------------------
Dave da Slave , BFH

[This message has been edited by Millman (edited 01-22-2006).]

Timleech
01-22-2006, 01:45 AM
Since when has 'gone missing' been a British expression?

Tim (British) http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

speedy
01-22-2006, 05:14 AM
"Gone Missing" What does that mean?
Gone, chasing single women? http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

Ken


[This message has been edited by speedy (edited 01-22-2006).]

Warren
01-22-2006, 05:44 AM
Millman I can remember seeing the term snow thrower in the 70's I think it depends on the brand.

Snow blower is correct, Because no matter what way you direct the chute, the bloody wind blows the airborne snow right back in you face http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

PTSideshow
01-22-2006, 06:12 AM
Those are al well and good but the talking heads on the news channels. Have got to stop saying to the people they are interviewing.
"give us a sense of" How about just stating the facts of a story. LOL

------------------
Glen
Been there, probally broke it doing that

pgmrdan
01-22-2006, 06:40 AM
Interesting topic!

Language is not static. It changes over time.

Have you noticed the big change in what used to be used as singular nouns are now being considered plural? Singular nouns that signify a single group of people are now being treated as plural nouns. Quite British!

"The family are going on vacation."

'Family' is singular. It's one group. The same with 'company'.

One other thing that bugs me is the current abuse of the work 'I'. It's so abused that some day the abused use may become accepted.

I hear statements such as, "Please send a copy of the report to Dan and I." You wouldn't say, "Please send a copy of the report to I." You'd say, "Please send a copy of the report to me." So the correct way would be to say, "Please send a copy of the report to Dan and me."

Also, the abuse of the word "ran" such as, "The job needs to be ran again." when it should be, "The job needs to be run again."

I don't think many of the so-called computer professionals I work with would do very well on a 6th grade grammar test.

I probably wouldn't do as well as I would have in 6th grade but I think I'd do better than many of my peers. Scarey!

Another thing that bugs me is the overuse of certain words in speech. 'Basically' was one of them but people seem to be backing off from its use. 'Absolutely' is in current overuse. How many things are truly absolute?

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-22-2006).]

IOWOLF
01-22-2006, 07:26 AM
A snow thrower has no fan in the middle,A snow blower has a set of blades that are simular to a squrel cage fan though fewer vanes.This is sometimes called a 2 stage snowblower.

Dr. sorry about your wrench ,Hope you find it.

------------------
The tame Wolf !

Evan
01-22-2006, 07:56 AM
Pet peeves:

Orientated. What happened to oriented?

Impacted: Oh, you mean affected, right?

Speaking of which, Affect and Effect.

These are probably the single most misused words in the language. What I say may or may not affect you but it does not effect you. Effectively, the effect of confusing effect with affect is to affect the affective effect of the sentence.

Anyways. WTH is that? The plural of anyway?

Very unfortunately the list is too long to enumerate in full here.

Sigh.

Evan
01-22-2006, 08:00 AM
Speaking of usage changing I have noticed an interesting effect as of late in daily speech. You can tell a forum junkie when talking to them in person when they change the subject by interjecting "Oh, and off topic..."

Millman
01-22-2006, 08:05 AM
If language is changing that fast; you guys aren't going to start using "Ebonics", are you? I was just "axeing" !

[This message has been edited by Millman (edited 01-22-2006).]

railfancwb
01-22-2006, 08:11 AM
Heard recently that the Philippines supply 25% of the world's merchant sailors, partly because they all speak English -- the language of the seas. The Chinese are the largest shipper and are pushing their people to learn English so they can also be the largest source of crew members. English has become the lingua Franca of the world... Charles

thistle
01-22-2006, 08:17 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by railfancwb:
Heard recently that the Philippines supply 25% of the world's merchant sailors, partly because they all speak English -- the language of the seas. The Chinese are the largest shipper and are pushing their people to learn English so they can also be the largest source of crew members. English has become the lingua Franca of the world... Charles</font>


what a bunch of cunning linguists.

wierdscience
01-22-2006, 08:33 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Millman:
Give you another example; Why is a snowblower now called a snowthrower? Just bought a new 9hp, 2 stage that is called a snowthrower. Think it has to do with the word "BLOW". Must be some more of that politically correct bull****. Maybe someone reads sexual into that term BLOW? Well, they can ALL blow me, free of charge! Can't you just see that in a few years; your furnace breaks down, you ask for a new THROWER motor? What the hell happened to this country? IF you ask, you'll get me started, so don't ask!

</font>

Well it could be a slang term for interacial sex,you know,like coal burmer,floor grinder,carpet muncher etc http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

Oh,wait that last one is gender nuetral and not really interacial,so lets go with white hoe http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif



[This message has been edited by wierdscience (edited 01-22-2006).]

wierdscience
01-22-2006, 08:36 AM
Me I hate it when the talking heads pick the "obscure,seldom ever used word of the month"and then proceed to beat it to death.

An example would be "confligration"

claw
01-22-2006, 08:43 AM
Today's Ebonic word from the
(insert southern state here). Public School System:


OMELETTE


Let's use it in a sentence:

"I should pop yo ass fo what you jus did, but omelette dis one slide."

DR
01-22-2006, 08:52 AM
Yep, the talking head have started picking up this "gone missing" nonsense.

I'm not against the evolution of language, but the "gone" seems so unnecessary and affected.

BTW, "Googling" this (there's a new word that's crept into everyday usage) hinted at British origins of the "gone" business.

J Tiers
01-22-2006, 09:34 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
Pet peeves:

Orientated. What happened to oriented?

</font>

Agree, although orientated IS a word, and IIRC means to turn towards the east..... the "orient".

I suppose we are all being orientated now......

Your Old Dog
01-22-2006, 09:48 AM
I view our world as an analog world. In all things analog it's the natural tendancy to mix, melange, wind down encountering each other or blend until we rich a state of stagnation. But don't worry, odds are a big a$$ lunar object will arrive here to stir it all up again !! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

As for your wrench: In my profession some pimply faced college kid would step up to the mic, jerk his head from side to side and up and down as the constultants tell them to and proclaim, "News 4 has learned a mans wrench met with a mishap. In this exclusive............." The important thing here is that the kid got to jerk his head around enough to cause you to not get bored and listen to his tale!

I need more duct tape....

[This message has been edited by Your Old Dog (edited 01-22-2006).]

aboard_epsilon
01-22-2006, 09:52 AM
The British.
We have to put-up, with every news reader saying the word "unprecedented" at least once in any news broadcast,.
This word was not known to me 10 years ago.
Must be a USA derived word.

all the best...mark

[This message has been edited by aboard_epsilon (edited 01-22-2006).]

pgmrdan
01-22-2006, 10:05 AM
You got that right Evan; oriented instead of orientated.

Why isn't one who comments called a commentor instead of a commentator. Does a commentator commentate?

One 'computer professional' (???) I worked with posted a notice about system 'degradization'. It may be a real word by now but I don't care. It should never be used. The system's performance was degraded due to a problem. Instead he said the system degradization was due to a problem. At the time he had made up the word. I could see using degradation.

Now I have a comment about input and output. Input and output are nouns not verbs. You enter data that is used as input. You don't input data. A report is the output from a computer program. The computer program doesn't output the report.

I'll stop now. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

barts
01-22-2006, 10:12 AM
From dictionary.com:

tr.v. Computer Science in·put·ted, or in·put in·put·ting, in·puts

To enter (data or a program) into a computer.

Usage Note: The noun input has been used as a technical term for about a century in fields such as physics and electrical engineering, but its recent popularity grows out of its use in computer science, where it refers to data or signals entered into a system for processing or transmission. In general discourse input is now widely used to refer to the transmission of information and opinion, as in The report questioned whether a President thus shielded had access to a sufficiently varied input to have a realistic picture of the nation or The nominee herself had no input on housing policy. In this last sentence the meaning of the term is uncertain: it may mean either that the nominee provided no opinions to the policymakers or that she received no information about housing policy. This vagueness in the nontechnical use of input may be one reason that some critics have objected to it (including, in an earlier survey, a majority of the Usage Panel). Though the usage is well established, care should be taken not to use the word merely as a way to imply an unwarranted scientific precision.

pgmrdan
01-22-2006, 10:22 AM
So it would have been incorrect to use input or output as a verb but since it has been so abused for so long it has now been accepted, i.e., people have given up on limiting them to their correct usage.

As I said earlier, language is not static.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-22-2006).]

thistle
01-22-2006, 10:30 AM
one really annoying news /politician catch phrase is "as a whole"

and then with the Winter Olympics coming we are going to have to hear about all those
"medalling" athletes.

Guido
01-22-2006, 11:00 AM
Ya' gotta love it when SHIPments arrive via trucks and CARgo arrives via boats.
G

malbenbut
01-22-2006, 11:05 AM
One word which I seem to hear quite often is summise instead of summerize which I heard on both British and American newscasts quite often recently. I wonder how long it will take before it is entered into the dictionary.
MBB

[This message has been edited by malbenbut (edited 01-22-2006).]

Your Old Dog
01-22-2006, 11:24 AM
How about "gravitas" ?

On Monday no one ever heard of it.
By Tuesday evening we were all tired of hearing it!!

Alistair Hosie
01-22-2006, 11:29 AM
"Could we, like, pass a law in the U.S


"COULD WE LIKE" THAT'S NOT GOOD ENGLISH USA OR UK http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gifAlistair speaking Scottish english awe mah life laddie

malbenbut
01-22-2006, 11:37 AM
The more vibrant the language the quicker it changes only dead languages dont change. English language is the fastest changing language in the world and the richest.Tough on the Froggies they will soon be speaking a dead tongue
MBB

Wirecutter
01-22-2006, 11:48 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pgmrdan:
You got that right Evan; oriented instead of orientated.

Why isn't one who comments called a commentor instead of a commentator. Does a commentator commentate?

One 'computer professional' (???) I worked with posted a notice about system 'degradization'. It may be a real word by now but I don't care. It should never be used. The system's performance was degraded due to a problem. Instead he said the system degradization was due to a problem. At the time he had made up the word. I could see using degradation.
</font>


Oh, I always liked sentences with phrases like "the data is" or "the data indicates". Data is plural, the singular is datum. Once in a great while, you hear the correct "data are" or "data indicate".

When someone tries to use a "50 cent" word, and gets it wrong, it can be hilarious. I like the word "irregardless". WTF is that?



<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pgmrdan:
Now I have a comment about input and output. Input and output are nouns not verbs. You enter data that is used as input. You don't input data. A report is the output from a computer program. The computer program doesn't output the report.
</font>

This little "feature" of the English language (taking nearly any word and using it as a verb) has pretty much been accepted, from what I can tell. Calvin, from the cartoon "Calvin and Hobbs", summed it up as follows:

Verbing weirds language.

lynnl
01-22-2006, 12:40 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Your Old Dog:
How about "gravitas" ?

On Monday no one ever heard of it.
By Tuesday evening we were all tired of hearing it!!</font>

Yeah, where did that one come from, and what the hell does it mean?

But (excluding teenagers) I think the corporate "suits" are the worst proliferators of all this verbal horse****. Pick up any financial statement or quarterly report and you'll find it just a bunch of over-used cliches. One that especially gets my goat is "going forward", as in "...we're taking X and Y actions to better position our R&D effectiveness going forward.

Hell, any idiot would know there's nothing you can do to help your past R&D efforts!


A few years ago one of the woodworking writers got on his high horse over the use of the term planer in thickness planer. He insisted it be called a "thicknesser". Next thing you know, seems like every writer is calling it a thicknesser.
If it was going to anything like that it should've been called a thinnerer.

New technologies, methodologies, processes, etc.,etc. are going to give rise to new words and evolving meanings, but why change an old word that has been working just fine.

But my personal choice for single most stupid word is in the sports world the last few years: athleticism!
Watch any TV sports event and you'll hear that til you're sick of it.

Frankly I'm LIKE tired of it. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

Evan
01-22-2006, 12:56 PM
"When someone tries to use a "50 cent" word, and gets it wrong, ..."

Heh. My favorite saying when someone uses a word such as that is "Now there's a word you can tie between two trees and trip over..."

halac
01-22-2006, 01:18 PM
My pet peeve of the vernacular.

You hear this phase at the end of a statement, particularly when interviewing sport types, "you know" , repeatedly after almost every sentence, ya know.

------------------
No matter where you go, there you are!

Hal C. , www.teampyramid.com (http://www.teampyramid.com)

[This message has been edited by halac (edited 01-22-2006).]

TECHSHOP
01-22-2006, 03:42 PM
Having spent plenty of time in places where my eastern USA "PA dutch" combined with habits adopted from a Cajune English speaking wife, a few years on the left coast has resulted in me being misunderstood no matter what I say. I wish I could get one of those call center jobs in India http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//tongue.gif

------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

QSIMDO
01-22-2006, 03:48 PM
"Pre-drill" just sets me spinning.

Norm, Tommy, the guy on DIY ...."pre-drill."

Whatever happened to "pilot hole"?

At least the girl on Freeform Furniture gets it correct.

To all this I say "sod the lot of 'em, they're all bollocks."
Something like that. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//wink.gif

IOWOLF
01-22-2006, 04:10 PM
Depends on the task, pilot hole and predrill are different things.

------------------
The tame Wolf !

Wirecutter
01-22-2006, 04:14 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by lynnl:

A few years ago one of the woodworking writers got on his high horse over the use of the term planer in thickness planer. He insisted it be called a "thicknesser". Next thing you know, seems like every writer is calling it a thicknesser.</font>

There was a TV program I saw a while back - one of those NY cop shows. There's a guy in the emergency room holding his hand to a bleeding head wound. He corrals a cop and says he wants to file a complaint against his wife...

"She hit me on da head wiff a smoovah!"

"A smoovah???? What the hell is that?", the cop says.

"You know - a clothes smoovah - ya smoove out da wrinkles wit dem!"

The guys probably lucky it wasn't made out of billet! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

QSIMDO
01-22-2006, 04:27 PM
I don't buy it.

It should be obvious one must "pre-drill" as "post-drilling" would be somewhat anticlimactic, especially when it's equally obvious they're talking about drilling a pilot hole.

While were at it, if I can "dismantle" something likewise should I not have been able to "mantle" it in the first place?

"Hit the ground running" with that one.

Peter S
01-22-2006, 04:30 PM
"Oriented"

Describes the effect on the world as its sinks under a layer of junk from Asia - we are being oriented.

TECHSHOP
01-22-2006, 04:46 PM
QSIMDO:

mantle- to cover with or cloak

dismantle- to strip of covering

dem words will get you sometimes, no?
http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

IOWOLF
01-22-2006, 05:11 PM
Tech, you beat me to it.

------------------
The tame Wolf !

pgmrdan
01-22-2006, 05:25 PM
You caught me wirecutter. I said, "data ... is" and I should have said, "data ... are". I've heard it wrong so long that I'm even guilty. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

pgmrdan
01-22-2006, 05:31 PM
A business term that bugs me is "outside the box". If we need to think "outside the box" to solve a problem it's because we've incorrectly defined the box to begin with.

J Tiers
01-22-2006, 07:29 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pgmrdan:
A business term that bugs me is "outside the box". If we need to think "outside the box" to solve a problem it's because we've incorrectly defined the box to begin with.</font>

The "outside the box" comes with the following as an "understood but unverbalized" meaning:

The "box" is what your limited little one-track and excessively literal mind is stuck in, as opposed to the wide world of new and modern possibilities where those of us who are young, creative, and unbound by tradition exist.

charlie coghill
01-22-2006, 07:41 PM
How about "ya all" with a British accent. Guess what that would sound like. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

ricksplace
01-22-2006, 07:43 PM
I had this discussion with a colleague from the USA:

She said, "You folks put the letter "u" in a lot of words, such as colour, and neighbour."

I replied, "No we didn't, you folks took them out."

QSIMDO
01-22-2006, 07:46 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by TECHSHOP:
QSIMDO:

mantle- to cover with or cloak

dismantle- to strip of covering

dem words will get you sometimes, no?
http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

</font>


"Rhetorical" and "saracasm".
Just follow the bread crumbs. ;p http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

Evan
01-22-2006, 07:50 PM
"The "outside the box" comes with the following as an "understood but unverbalized" meaning:

The "box" is what your limited little one-track and excessively literal mind is stuck in, as opposed to the wide world of new and modern possibilities where those of us who are young, creative, and unbound by tradition exist."

I'm with Dan. After 23 years working for a giant multinational I really began hating those types of expressions. The one I hated the most was "It's not a problem, think of it as a challenge".

Oh yeah? Well, on more than one occasion I took that advice. Except my solution was to get rid of the person that was the problem. One was my manager at one time. He was becoming a BIG problem. When I worked "there" I kept some careful records and had unsuspected sources of information. I applied this to the "problem" and the "problem" suddenly decided an open position in Toronto was much more attractive than living in BC.

Boy do I hate/detest/loathe Corp speak and Corp think. Never again.


[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-22-2006).]

halac
01-22-2006, 09:03 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
Boy to I hate/detest/loathe Corp speak and Corp think. Never again.</font>

Yeah, I agree also. One they used to use at a place I used to work at was "A change of culture in the workplace". In other words a change of attitude.




------------------
No matter where you go, there you are!

Hal C. , www.teampyramid.com (http://www.teampyramid.com)

J Harp
01-22-2006, 10:07 PM
I'm just waiting for the headline "boss caught having gender with secretary in broom closet".

------------------
Jim

matador
01-23-2006, 12:16 AM
My pet hate is the current (mis)use of "lifestyle".What the hell is a "lifestyle garden"?A "lifestyle"s.u.v."?A "lifestyle block"(of land)?
These are unfortunate leftovers of the "yuppie"era,but somehow seem to have taken root in daily life,or at least in the minds of advertising people.Pretentious nitwits,"bollocks" to the lot of 'em.

------------------
Hans

malbenbut
01-23-2006, 04:09 AM
I did have it,I looked for it,
I could not find it. "There it was, gone."
MBB

[This message has been edited by malbenbut (edited 01-23-2006).]

Ian B
01-23-2006, 04:55 AM
The days of good English has went...

Ian

moobak
01-23-2006, 07:31 AM
Hello Am i the only one that hears
'EGGZZACLY" about 200 times aday?

Mcgyver
01-23-2006, 08:12 AM
radio dj's or commercial voices that pronouce luxury, lugshury. or eggsit instead of exit. ~~~ shivers of disgust ~~~~

J Tiers
01-23-2006, 08:15 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by moobak:
Hello Am i the only one that hears
'EGGZZACLY" about 200 times aday?</font>

Exactly!

The "yuppies" seem to have been , and still be, people whose education is very limited. Limited to their specialty, with very little general knowlege.

For instance, the CPA who had no idea where Saudi Arabia is.... nor Yugoslavia (back a while....). Barely knew where Wash. DC is.

You get the picture.... just robot moneymaking people. Of what use is language to them? Only to communicate with others of similarly limited education.

Millman
01-23-2006, 08:21 AM
It's good to see I'm not the only one who puts all those EGGZ in one basket!

------------------
Dave da Slave , BFH

Weston Bye
01-23-2006, 08:59 AM
Listeners to NPR will regularly hear the expression "more on this later". It comes out sounding like "MORON this later". To avoid using such terms like imbecile, idiot or moron, or other insensitive or non-PC terms, or even anything that sounds like them, perhaps the better wording would be "more about this later".

Of course, maybe they *really do mean* that one of their morons will be blathering about the subject later.

Wes

malbenbut
01-23-2006, 09:04 AM
Exactly.
Having said that.
No problem.
When talking to a contractor this was the content of his vocabulary, he used any one of the three replies to every thing said to him or asked of him. so if you are intending to start a business learn these phrases and you will be a great success
MBB

Millman
01-23-2006, 09:18 AM
Just read a report on MSN that stated 1 in 5 teenagers are manic depressive. What? After several years on drugs; wonder what their vocabulary will be once they're in the workforce, if they can even enter the workforce. Scary,huh?

Wirecutter
01-23-2006, 09:23 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pgmrdan:
You caught me wirecutter. I said, "data ... is" and I should have said, "data ... are". I've heard it wrong so long that I'm even guilty. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif</font>

Well, I can't go getting all high and mighty, either. We probably all have done it.

Confusing the issue even further, we have the dictionary. Years ago, the dictionary was the authoritative source for a word's spelling, meaning, usage, etc. (Anyone remember the expression "Ain't ain't a word 'cause it ain't in the dictionary..." etc?) Well, it is in most dictionaries. The American English dictionaries that I know of will base their content on what is actually used in the language, not necessarily what is correct.

As for phrases like "thinking outside of the box", there was once a little game circulating called "Meeting Bingo". I think it came from a Dilbert cartoon or something. Go to a meeting and fill in the appropriate square on your game card whenever you hear one of those over-used "business speak" expressions. When you win, jump up in the middle of the meeting and shout "Bingo!" What was amazing to me was that, at the time, all the expressions on the sample "game card" were used all the time by a manager where I worked. I didn't realize how prolific and trite they all were...

Your Old Dog
01-23-2006, 10:23 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by moobak:
Hello Am i the only one that hears
'EGGZZACLY" about 200 times aday?</font>

exactly!............fer sure.........you hear what I'm saying?

Wirecutter, I'd play your little game if I could have the phrase "we're so excited about....." In my business I hear it 100 times a day as managers pump sunshine up eache others a$$ with business power words and phrases http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif Sometimes I'm tempted to tell'em, "yea boss, me too, actually got a river of watch-a-callit running down my pant leg now I'm so darned excited!" But they'd label me not a team player!

[This message has been edited by Your Old Dog (edited 01-23-2006).]

Millman
01-23-2006, 10:59 AM
YOD, that reminds me of the TEAM PLAYER, ASSOCIATE terms. I used to say, "If I'm an associate, then I expect 50% of the profit". these terms did not earn any Brownie points!

Wirecutter
01-23-2006, 11:07 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Your Old Dog:
exactly!............fer sure.........you hear what I'm saying?</font>

Absolutely! That's right on point! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif



<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Your Old Dog:

Wirecutter, I'd play your little game if

...
managers pump sunshine up eache others a$$
...
got a river of watch-a-callit running down my pant leg now I'm so darned excited! </font>

And I'd play if it included phrases like that. Thanks, YOD - I'm glad I read this before I started into my lunch and soda. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

TECHSHOP
01-23-2006, 03:11 PM
This was asked in another thread by Alistair Hosie:

"What does WAY TO GO mean and where did it come from only used in usa sorry I always wanted to know like taking a rain cheque now I understand that after many years wonderring ???please advise an old Scotty"

And thought should turn it over to the Language Police thread.

So how bigs my Reward?

------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

lynnl
01-23-2006, 03:25 PM
Way-to-go! ? It's just a variation of "attaboy!"

Weston Bye
01-23-2006, 03:30 PM
The Language Police:

http://www.lssu.edu/banished/

They have been doing this for years.

Wes

lynnl
01-23-2006, 04:01 PM
This is not really just a word, but I've wondered what happened with the expression so popular a few years back: "If you can't run with the big dawgs, don't get off the porch!"

I always liked that one. Kinda down home sounding. ...but, I guess the novelty wore off after everybody started using it 4 or 5 times a day.

sauer38h
01-23-2006, 04:19 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Wirecutter:
The American English dictionaries that I know of will base their content on what is actually used in the language, not necessarily what is correct.</font>

The big American dictionary, the Merriam-Webster Unabridged, caused a scandal when the 3rd ed. dropped its preferred usage listings, and started listing words and meanings as they were actually (mis)used. The outrage caused the announcement of a new unabridged from American Heritage to fight that newfangled trend. However Am. Heritage grossly underestimated the time and money needed to do a full unabridged, and I don't think theirs ever did appear. The Am. Heritage desk/collegiate dictionaries are pretty good, though.

This dispute is why any American public library of consequence will have both the 2nd and 3rd Merriam-Webster Unabridged still on the shelves - the 2nd isn't considered obsolete. I never bothered with the 3rd. I have a 2nd, and had to buy a whole truckload of other books to get it (at a pre-eBay auction).

A note of interest - for some strange reason, "Webster's" is public domain in the US. So most good American dictionaries, and all not-so-good American dictionaries, have Webster's in the title, as the general public thinks it denotes quality and authority. The worthwhile ones are the Merriam-Webster (available as the Unabridged and the Collegiate) and the Webster's New World (no Unabridged, just a Desk version). Even the American Heritage put "Webster's" in its title a few years back.


[This message has been edited by sauer38h (edited 01-23-2006).]

wierdscience
01-23-2006, 08:13 PM
The one that really frosts my ass is repeated on NPR every ten minutes,every three on weekends.

The word comes in three forms,NEUANCE,NEUANCES,NEUANCED

I am sick of hearing those words,enough aready,I realise that whoever uses those words is a stuckup arrogant snob that thinks everyone else is completely brain dead,but do they have to use it that often?I mean really,is every topic discussed truly worthy?

"The public really doesn't understand the NEUANCES of the current sanitation workers strike" Give me a f---ing break Pyle!

Rant off:

woman
01-23-2006, 10:43 PM
Ever met a newfie?

How about...

"Stay where you're at and I'll come where you're to."

Q. "How is ya?"
A. "I's good."


"Where's it to?"

That's only the beginning!

speedy
01-23-2006, 11:30 PM
Thank goodness that the gangsta rap ghetto language is here to rescue us. I just love that stuff http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif

Ken

DanR
01-25-2006, 08:29 PM
The original post stated:

my wrench is "missing". That's the way it's been as long as I've been speaking English.

MY QUESTION IS:

If it has been missing that long, why not just buy a new one?

J Tiers
01-25-2006, 11:12 PM
Well, if it is "missing", WHAT is it missing?

Is it missing you? Missing jaws? missing a handle?

Just tossing a wrench into the mix here........

BillH
01-25-2006, 11:20 PM
I axed youse ah question.
Cant not hear that on Jerry Springer

matador
01-26-2006, 01:08 AM
And then there's the wrench itself.Our good friends in (or should that be "on")the British Isles have a "pipe wrench",or the adjustable wrench is often called a"shifting spanner.
My father always called them "bahco",after a well known brand of said item.Likewise ,here in NZ they are usually known as "crescent",or "knuckle cracker".Or,in more basic form,nut f#*^*er http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif.

------------------
Hans

irontoart
01-26-2006, 05:37 PM
The guy that works in the next cubicle over always says boughten instead of purchased.
"I see you have boughten that wrench before" "This drives me nuts.

Evan
01-26-2006, 05:43 PM
Standard Scottish syntax: "It needs washed."

pgmrdan
01-26-2006, 06:15 PM
A lady at work is a part-time waitress. She said something about serving a customer expresso. I said, "Serving what?" She said, "Expresso!" I said, "There's no 'X' in espresso. If you don't believe me just axe Gary." http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

Well, I thought it was funny.

pgmrdan
01-26-2006, 06:22 PM
Where did the word 'preventative' originate? I always thought 'preventive' was correct but I hear 'preventative' all the time.

Just last week I took the time to look up pandemic. I still like the word epidemic but I understand why the word pandemic exists.

How many times have you heard someone call a regular abbreviation an acronym? An acronym is a special case of an abbreviation. It can be pronounced like a word. Acronyms include 'radar', 'laser', and 'maser'. LSD is an abbreviation but not an acronym.

Gee! Some people. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif How anal retentive can this thread get? Am I helping?

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-26-2006).]

Wirecutter
01-26-2006, 06:25 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Millman:
Why is a snowblower now called a snowthrower? </font>

Said Frosty the Snoman: Hooray!
I'm agog with excitement today.
The reason, of course,
A reliable source
Said the snowblower's headed this way!

Jpfalt
01-26-2006, 06:43 PM
A woman reporter at the presedential press meeting this morning,"...officials you conversated with.....".

How about ...conversed with...., ..spoke to..., spoke with..., ...met with..., ...contacted....

Evan
01-26-2006, 07:07 PM
"LSD is an abbreviation but not an acronym"
It is so an acronym.

define:acronym
A word formed from the initial letters of a series of words. (eg, IEEE is an acronym for Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers).

LSD=Lysergic Acid Diethylamide



[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-26-2006).]

matador
01-26-2006, 08:24 PM
And here was i thinking it meant Limited Slip Differential.OOOOOOOOOOOOOOh,you mean THAT LSD http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif.I couldn't even afford a car,much less drugs or booze http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif.

------------------
Hans

lynnl
01-26-2006, 08:41 PM
The keyword is 'word'. An acronym is a "word" formed from...

ie. NASA, pronounced "In Eh Es Eh" is not an acronym.
but pronounced "Nah-sah" is an acronym.

U S A F is not an acronym. But pronounced "You-SAF" is an acronym.

L-S-D would not be an acronym. "LlSsDd" (or something like that http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif) would. (Kinda hard to say "loose-d" on the keyboard.)

PACAF (Pacific Air Forces): pronounced 'Pack-Af' is an acronym. But P A C A F (pronounced as individual letters) is not.

[This message has been edited by lynnl (edited 01-26-2006).]

speedy
01-26-2006, 09:07 PM
'Green pyramid' was good.
i like the inglush langwige; itz sow verse r tile
I especially enjoy listening to Bush; he is brill.

ken

TECHSHOP
01-26-2006, 09:23 PM
I am a little surprised the "Z" issue has not popped up yet. Especially with my north neighbors http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//tongue.gif



------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

Evan
01-26-2006, 11:20 PM
I forgot to put it in the German (first synthesized by the Swiss)

LSD= Lyserg Säure Diethylamid



[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-26-2006).]

speedy
01-27-2006, 12:59 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by TECHSHOP:
I am a little surprised the "Z" issue has not popped up yet. Especially with my north neighbors http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//tongue.gif </font>
----------------------
the "Z" issue ??

Ken

TECHSHOP
01-27-2006, 01:07 AM
USA&gt; Zee

Not USA&gt; Zed

Usually hear older Canadians complain about the "Zeeifcation" creeping in from the south.

&lt;edit&gt; can't spell worth crap
------------------
Today I will gladly share my experience and advice, for there no sweeter words than "I told you so."

[This message has been edited by TECHSHOP (edited 01-27-2006).]

Millman
01-27-2006, 06:14 AM
Some guys sound like you went to different schools together with Ernest T Bass. Remember Kelsey's woods, Kelsey's ocean???? In a way; Ernest T. Bass helped our language and phonics! He wasn't very good in geography!

small_e_900
01-27-2006, 07:48 AM
I would give 110% of my effort towards finding out who is responsible for causing the wrench to go missing but I've got things to do over their....they're...there.

You do the math.

You see what I'm saying?

[This message has been edited by small_e_900 (edited 01-27-2006).]

[This message has been edited by small_e_900 (edited 01-27-2006).]

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 09:46 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Evan:
[B]"LSD is an abbreviation but not an acronym"
It is so an acronym.

No it's not!

http://departments.kings.edu/library/glossaryr.htm

Acronym - a new word or pronounceable and hence memorable name coined from the first or first few letters or parts of a phrase or compound term (HUD for Housing and Urban Development).

How do you pronounce LSD? You don't! It's not an acronym.


[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 09:47 AM
"I would give 110% of my effort towards finding out who is responsible for causing the wrench to go missing but I've got things to do over their....they're...there."

Those are things up with which I will not put.

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 09:53 AM
Dan,

Prounounced "lucy" as in "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds"

This is sort of like fish spelled ghoti.

Also sometimes pronounced as "lucid".

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-27-2006).]

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 09:56 AM
Lucy may be a slang term for LSD but it's not a way to pronounce the abbreviation 'LSD'.

I've never heard of a word with no vowels so I don't know how you can pronounce 'LSD' as a word. Again, I would consider 'lucid' slang.

Anyway, my point was that acronyms are a subset of abbreviations. The definition you posted is incorrect.

I hope your post was done tongue-in-cheek. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 10:14 AM
define:nth

"last or greatest in an indefinitely large series; "to the nth degree"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn"

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 10:17 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
define:nth

"last or greatest in an indefinitely large series; "to the nth degree"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn"</font>

I didn't say that something like 'nth' doesn't have a generally accepted meaning/definition but it's not really a word is it? Is it even an abbreviation? It can be pronounced. I consider it a shorthand for referring to item 'n'. 'n' has a generally accepted meaning when used to indicate an item in a series.

Is the letter delta (not the word 'delta') a word? No, but it does have a meaning/definition. And the letter does have a name which is the word that is pronounced when the letter is encountered.

How do they pronounce 'LSD'? (I think you're getting off-track here.)

What is their definition for 'acronym'?

http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

a WORD formed from the initial letters of the several words in the name

I capitalized 'WORD' for emphasis.

I really don't see how 'LSD' can be considered an acronym.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 10:37 AM
define:word

"The smallest meaningful element of language. When written it stands alone with a space on either side of it. (19 words)
www.davidappleyard.com/english/grammar.htm (http://www.davidappleyard.com/english/grammar.htm) "

The definition of "word" does not include a requirement that it contain a vowel or even be pronouncable, only that it have a recognizable meaning.

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 10:44 AM
You're 'cherry picking' your definition.

That would mean 'BTW', 'BFD', 'BFH', etc. are words. They're not.

As far as 'nth' I would think that fits in the same category with '1st', '2nd', and '3rd'. 'First', 'second', and 'third' are words but '1st', '2nd', and '3rd' are not. 'nth' has meaning and accepted usage but it is not a word, IMHO.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 10:54 AM
Heh. This happens to be a popular topic on language forums.

sauer38h
01-27-2006, 11:02 AM
If you wish to bother you can find authoritative definitions for either interpretation. The "nym" in acronym implies a name, but whether a name has to be pronounceable either is another question.

The Slavic languages use names which an unimaginative person would consider unpronounceable. The second-largest city in the Czech republic is Brno. The Germans, not as imaginative as the Slavs, call the same town Brünn. Similarly Gdansk and Danzig - same town, semi-pronounceable. Russian has a word "s" ("C" in Cyrillic) and another toughie "v" ("B" in Cyrillic), both unpronounceable by English rules, but the Russians manage anyway. So, are they words, or not?

Whatever definition you choose it won't fit particularly well, since we don't use acronyms strictly as words, pronounceable or not. Unlike real words, we spell acronyms with capitals, as in FIAT (Fabbrica Italiana Automobili Torino), or SAAB (Svenska Aeroplan A.B.) or FORD (Found On Road Dead).

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 11:05 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
Heh. This happens to be a popular topic on language forums.</font>

And it is interesting, at least to you and me. We may be boring the hell out of everyone else. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

I suppose we should stop punishing everyone else. What d'ya think? http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

Evan
01-27-2006, 11:16 AM
Two words (actually just one): http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

01101111 01101011

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 11:20 AM
I was toying with the idea of bringing up the Comp. Sci. definition for word then I decided too few of us would 'get it'.

Is there a hidden meaning there? I have EBCDIC references but not ASCII.

Evan
01-27-2006, 11:31 AM
"I have EBCDIC references but not ASCII."

Do you work for IBM?

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 11:38 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
"I have EBCDIC references but not ASCII."

Do you work for IBM?

</font>

Not for IBM but with IBM (and compatible - AMDAHL) mainframes for about 28 years professionally and 4 years while in school.

lunkenheimer
01-27-2006, 12:16 PM
My favorite quote (via Dave Barry):
"If I'd a knownt that you'd wanted to went, I'da made sure you'd got to get to go"

Makes sense if you say it out loud...

Arcane
01-27-2006, 01:55 PM
An old joke....
"There are 10 kinds of people in the world...those who know binary, and those who don't."

Evan
01-27-2006, 02:13 PM
Actually it goes:

There are 10 kinds of people in the world, those who know what little endian means and those who don't.

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 02:39 PM
How about -

There is 10 person in the world who know what little endian is.

MrFluffy
01-27-2006, 02:47 PM
What? all two of them?

[This message has been edited by MrFluffy (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 02:49 PM
I prefer big endian myself. Did you know that endianness is a word?

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-27-2006, 03:08 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
I prefer big endian myself. Did you know that endianness is a word?</font>

Why do you prefer big endian?

Evan
01-27-2006, 03:13 PM
It just seems more natural to me. Also, the first machine I ever programmed was a big endian machine, the Bendix G-15.

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-27-2006, 03:36 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
It just seems more natural to me. Also, the first machine I ever programmed was a big endian machine, the Bendix G-15. </font>

If you did a lot of 8-bit 6502 programming, then you would definitely prefer little endian. Little endian is also faster for 16-bit incremental addressing and calculating.

Evan
01-27-2006, 04:40 PM
I did plenty of 6502 programming. It really doesn't matter much which end is which. The 68000 is big endian, the 65xx are little as is 8086. The PDP 11 is middle endian. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

[added]

Some are even "bytesexual". http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 01-27-2006).]

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-27-2006, 05:53 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
I did plenty of 6502 programming. It really doesn't matter much which end is which. The 68000 is big endian, the 65xx are little as is 8086. The PDP 11 is middle endian. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif
</font>

Endianness certainly matters to a programmer and especially a CPU designer.

On a 6502, the native data size is 8 bits, the physical data bus width is 8 bits, and instructions are either 8, 16, or 24 bits long. The only way to write fast code that does &gt;= 16-bit addition, subtraction, multiplication, and division is with &gt;= 16-bit LSB (little endian) first byte Read/Modify/Write processing. The 6502's variable instruction length Fetch/Decode/Execute unit also relys on LSB for efficient branching.

On a 68000, the native data size is 32 bits, the physical data bus width is 16 bits, and instructions are all exactly 16 bits long. The 68000 programmer hardly ever needs to operate with data types larger than the native 32-bit size so MSB (big endian) is more efficient due to it's pipelined execution unit.

-Adrian

Evan
01-27-2006, 06:10 PM
Of course it matters to the programmer. You must account for it at many levels. I just don't care much which way it is implemented although I do prefer big endian. It seems slightly more logical. If you lay out memory with lowest address on the left and highest on the right then big endian gives the bytes most significant on the left and least on the right. It's how we usually write numbers.

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-27-2006, 07:05 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
Of course it matters to the programmer. You must account for it at many levels. I just don't care much which way it is implemented although I do prefer big endian. It seems slightly more logical. If you lay out memory with lowest address on the left and highest on the right then big endian gives the bytes most significant on the left and least on the right. It's how we usually write numbers.</font>

That's a good example why computers are logical, and people are not. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

For basic computation, computers don't care about the most significant bytes until they have processed the least significant ones first.

Naturally, providing the least significant bytes sequentially in memory is very logical.

-Adrian

pgmrdan
01-27-2006, 08:43 PM
Evan,

Didn't you attend University in California? If yes, was it the University where Dr. Donald Knuth taught? (It looks like he's at Stanford now but I thought he taught at some other(s).)

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-27-2006).]

Evan
01-27-2006, 08:52 PM
"Naturally, providing the least significant bytes sequentially in memory is very logical."

Yes it is. That is why both methods are widely used and some cpus can be set to work either way. There is no clear advantage to either method.

Dan,

Yes, I studied computer science at UC Berkeley. Knuth was originally at Cal Tech. I don't think he taught at Berkeley. Berkeley however is where BSD UNIX was developed.

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-27-2006, 09:42 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
"Naturally, providing the least significant bytes sequentially in memory is very logical."

Yes it is. That is why both methods are widely used and some cpus can be set to work either way. There is no clear advantage to either method.

Dan,

Yes, I studied computer science at UC Berkeley. Knuth was originally at Cal Tech. I don't think he taught at Berkeley. Berkeley however is where BSD UNIX was developed.

</font>

Actually there are significant unquestionable disadvantages using big endian on almost all non-RISC/non-symmetrical instruction set CPUs including the 6502 and the entire Intel/AMD x86 family. The x86 family would perform horribly and would be very clumsy to program if it was using big endian. Multi endian CPUs Like the PowerPC and MIPS provide the ability to run I/O in little endian (The PCI Bus is little endian for obvious reasons). Most RISC cores and misc trivial CPUs can run little or big endian if their instruction sets are symmetrical and force strict code/data alignment.

As a BASIC programmer, endianness wouldn't affect you.

-Adrian

Evan
01-28-2006, 12:29 AM
The majority of my programming was/is in assembler. I use BASIC for quick and dirty stuff or when perfomance isn't an issue. I first learned to program in straight machine code with no assembler, strictly octal code on a ones complement machine. After that I learned FORTRAN at UCB.

http://vts.bc.ca/pics/pcard.jpg

Another language I use is POVray scene description language. It runs the POVRay ray tracing application. It's a Turing strong language with a syntax based on C.

I haven't programmed as a job although I have had articles published in the past dealing with kernel level programming on Commodore products. The longest application I wrote in assembler was about 10,000 lines of code for the 6502. That was a complete comm package including peer to peer file transfer back in the early 80s for the C-64. I also implemented low level high speed routines to run the very slow disk drive at about 4 times faster speed. I rewrote most of the Basic 8 kernel extensions in hand optimized machine code to speed it up.

One of my projects was to implement a satellite photo receiving system that picked up FSK transmissions from short wave. These are GOES images that are broadcast for ships at sea. This involved some very tricky machine code on the 6502 to ensure precisely accurate timing for the scan line decoding.


This is an example image as received on my C-128 from my Yaesu comm receiver through the FSK decoder I designed. I overclocked the video system on the C-128 to increase the resolution capability. In order to print these images in a reasonable time I rewrote the printer driver in assembler.

http://vts.bc.ca/pics/sat1.jpg

Evan
01-28-2006, 01:01 AM
"Most RISC cores and misc trivial CPUs can run little or big endian "

The Intel Itanium is bi-endian . I wouldn't call it a risc CPU or trivial.

3 Phase Lightbulb
01-28-2006, 08:21 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
"Most RISC cores and misc trivial CPUs can run little or big endian "

The Intel Itanium is bi-endian . I wouldn't call it a risc CPU or trivial.</font>


The Itanium is really a little endian processor. The only time big endian can be enabled is for selected data accesses.

As for the 6502, it was an amazingly simple and excellent learning platform. Those who mastered it moved on to bigger and better processors.

-Adrian

Evan
01-28-2006, 08:36 AM
Yep, the 6502 is my favorite cpu. It is very flexible with all the addressing modes available.

J Tiers
01-28-2006, 08:38 AM
Apparently even fewer know how and why "big endian" and "little endian" entered the language, let alone when.

pgmrdan
01-28-2006, 08:49 AM
Evan,

Speaking of BSD UNIX I began working with AT&T's UNIX in 1978.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 01-28-2006).]

Evan
01-28-2006, 08:58 AM
JT,

I seem to recall something to do with eggs.

J Tiers
01-28-2006, 10:07 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
JT,

I seem to recall something to do with eggs.</font>


That thought really is all it is cracked up to be......