Other Smithy Owners ?

[milmat1]

Hey guy's:
I was just wondering how many other smithy owners we have out there, Who would like to share experiences or ideas. Such as modifications you have done or special tools/jigs you have made etc..
Maybe some photos of special set-ups even. I have a smithy and i am relitively new to machine work(at least doing it myself). And would love to hear what some of you have been able to do with your machines.
Since the 3in1 machines are nearly always getting trashed on the forum, maybe we can share some set-up ideas or just complain about the machines lackings. I am building a scale model hit or miss engine on mine right now(well trying to !).
Tell me about your experiences with your machines. Or whatever !!!! MATT

[jdk]

Milmat1
Good to hear of someone else who has a Smithy. I was beginning to think I had made the only purchase.
I'm new at this too, and a tad old to try and grasp so much in so little time. But it sure is fun trying.
Keep in touch. Jim, Elmira, NY

[mot]

Hi milmat1,
I have had a smithy for about 5 years now, 1224xl, and every day I use it I can learn new stuff,mostly I am an old dog who teaches himself, but I find a lot of useful things in HSM and MW,.
My primary use is building muzzleloader black powder rifles and pistols, ramrods, cleaning jags etc.
not long ago they had an article on an EDM (electric discharge machining) in MW and I am in the process of building this,
but I am off on a tangent, since this is about a smithy, I did make a modification, and then i changed it back, but you might find it of interest, I attached a motor to the back of the milling head (similar to a larger unit)(can't think of the unit number right now), anyway, what this allowed me to do was have a power feed while I was milling,A small half horse motor ran the mill while the powerfeed ran thru the lathe,I hope you get the idea.
Smithy has always been there for parts etc. but I buy most tooling and things from enco or msc.
One of the things I would like to findis a way to index or lock the head from the headstock. (say you want to mill a flat on a piece of stock that is chucked in the lathe).
I know I am rambling, but this is another thing I have done that works for me, I have to change from four to three jaw and back quite often, so I replaced the bolts on the chucks with studs so the studs slide in the holes and make mounting a WHOLE lot easier.
The swarf be with you. MOT.

[jbucko]

milmat1: I have owned a 1220XL for about 8 years.I use it in my shop for small items and jobs that won't easily fit my larger lathe and mill.I was working at the time I purchased the Smithy (since retired),so I worked a little extra ot,and purchased most of my tooling for it from them.I have found the customer support people to be very friendly and helpful,and the prices and quality of the tooling to be reasonable and acceptable respectively.No you can't "hog" anything on the mill,but lite cuts and patience are fine for the small parts I modify or create on this machine.If I had to use this machine exclusively,I would probably go with the bigger Granite model,as it has features of the bigger machines,ie;gearbox,variable speed,threaddial,R8 spindle,D1 chuck mtg,etc.But the 1220XL has served me well and helped me earn a little extra cash to purchase my larger equipment. Jim

[jdk]

milmat1
I really like mot's idea for the mill head. I can see where the would be useful at time, and there is a definite need to be able to lock the head of the mill and chuck for certain opperations.
I purchsed a sall Horz/Vert. Rotary table for the times I need to mill a flat or such.I mounted a 4" 4jaw chuck to the table. It works fine and looks pretty SWEET for a dumbhead like me.
Heres a good one...When I decided to buy a rotary table. I found one on sale in HSM. It was an 8" and I thought -what a perfect size giving the small size of the mill table any way. """WRONG""" this thing weighed nearly 70 pounds and gave the UPS MAN hernia when he dropped it off at the house. It was a bad scene. So from that little experiment I learned just how small the table is on my 1220. I won't go into how much it cost to ship it back. Live and Learn.Good luck and keep in touch. Jim

[milmat1]

Thanks for the replies folks, I was starting to feel like the lone ranger to jim. Like i said before i am new to machine work though i have spent my whole life in and around machine shops. Just never really gained any experiance on the machines.
My machine seems to have a great deal of backlash in the leadscrews, though i have learned to compensate for it. One smithy 1220 owner i spoke with said he had a great deal of trouble with the millhead moving on him while he was milling, I was actually impressed with my machine in that respect i have taken some pretty big cuts on mine without any problems. I have days where i come out here and do a little machining or make a part. And i feel real good about the machine and myself. Then other times i try to make something and just can't get it right and end up feeling like throwing the thing in a dumpster(HAHA), But it always seems that once i calm down and think a little it is usually me and not the machine.
I am having a problem with the talestock, i just cant seem to get it aligned so it will bore true. Has anyone else had the same ?
Another problem is the short travel of the tailstock, If you need to use a center to hold the end of the part, unless the part is quite long the table either hits the tailstock or the lathe chuck. They sale an extension socket for that. But i really figured that it would be very unstable. Does anyone have one of the extensions for the tailstock ?
And thanks again for the replies, and keep it coming........matt

p.s. i may try the seperate motor idea, that sounds really helpfull.....

[mot]

milmat1
I sympathise about the dumpster and after I calm down, i realise I am still learning.
My tailstock bores O.K., but the tailstock does limit the table travel, I have built an extension from some 1" cold rolled (about 6" long) that i put in the drill chuck, this helps, but i have plans to make it again with a morse taper to fit right in the tailstock-(maybe about 8 or 9 inches long.MOT

[Locksmith]

Milmat,
I have one of Smithys tailstock extensions, and from my limited experience with it, it seems to work fine. I hasten to add that I'm not a Machinist by trade, but still, it seems to be Alright.
I got my 1324 in December and started a votech 72 hour course in February and so far it has been worth every dime. I won't be a 1st class machinist at the end of the class, but I will certainly be a little less dangerous.
Look and see if my original post "What I've learned..." is still on the bb.
PS the advice on my taking the class came from the guys on this BB.

[milmat1]

I would love to take some classes myself, But i travel with my job and my schedule is just to unpredictable. I never know when or where i am going to be.
As many of us i'm sure, i have burned up a tool or two ! The feed speed is still set-up the way it came from the factory. I really havn't found a need to change it yet. And the manuel is very vaque about the speeds. I geuss what i need is some videos and or books that i can take with me. Anyone know of a cd-rom based refference for machining?
The tailstock extension sounds like it would work ok as long as the tailstock is correct to start with.
The angle vise i got from smithy isn't much either, But the vises are expensive as heck.
I need to bore a piece of aluminum today, i have a couple of boring bars but none of them will do this job. I am thinking of making a holder out of round stock, milling some flats on it and cross drill the end, so that i can insert a re-ground drill bit in it and clamp it with a set screw. In think it will work ok for aluminum...

[jdk]

"milmat1"
You must get your hands on a MT3 tail stock extention. Its the only way to get some breathing room over the cross slide table.
I got mine from MSDC for about eight bucks. Worth the money as far as I can see. There is a fella' there at MSDC by the name of Isac. He has been quite helpful with my Stupid questions and its nice to hear a human voice with a quick answer.
As far as the tail stock alingment goes, I think if you center drilled a length of drill stock [1/2' shuold be about right] then chucked up in the 3 jaw chuck with a dial indecator mounted over the cross slide you should be able to get things pretty squared up after couple of full length passes with the lead screw. ""Question for You fellas"" What did you think of the 1/2 - JT-33 Drill chuck that came with the machine. Mine wouldn't even hold a 3/8 bit snug let alone a 1/16 center drill.
Have fun, Jim, Elmira, NY

[Techtchr]

Well, I'm not exactly a smithy owner, but we recently had one donated to our school from a local business. In moving the machine to our new lab area, our maintainance staff dropped the lathe, and it fell the height of the stand it set on down to a concrete floor.

Here's what I've found in repairing, obtaining parts and dealing with Smithy. 1) Found their website on line and 800 number easily, 2) Phone rang maybe twice before a gentleman who was very knowledgeable answered all of my questions about obtaining parts.3) I was expecting to be quoted $200 or more for the parts and was ready to say thanks but no-thanks I'll make my own, when he told me the bill would be $52.00 including shipping and a shop manual.

Unfortunately the quality of the machine isn't as good as my experience with their service department. 1) Fit on gear train mechanism under side cover is poor. 2) bearing holder in milling head has a very small support area for the retaining ring I could see someone getting carried away taking a collet out, and actually breaking this. 3) mechanism for changing from lathe to mill spindle power seems undependable. In the few times I've gotten a chance to run the machine the mill popped in and out of gear. 4) Odd method of attaching chucks to spindle back plate. 5)Fwd/Rev On/off is not typical of most machine tools I've used

Ok, What I liked: for the price it is an amazing little machine.(mine was free, but even if you have to pay it is a good value) My students will be able to use it to do milling in machinable wax and aluminum with no problem. I'm sure it will do steel too, but we don't do much of that. It is also convertable to CNC or can be purchased that way. It is also compact, and will substitute for a mill and lathe, and seems to be ideal for our prototyping needs.

I recently had a teacher friend call to ask me about this machine, and my advice was to come look at mine before he decided, but as I saw it, it was a pretty good value. It couldn't replace my 10" Sbend for quality, but then again I paid almost 1/2 for my 15 year old used sbend as I would pay for a new smithy with all the bells and whistles. I don't even want to know what a new Sbend lathe would cost.

Oh yea, the reason the lathe fell was because maitainance was sliding the lathe across the floor of a truck onto a lift gate, and the Kennedy work bench the lathe came with had one of its sheet metal legs fold, and the machine slid off the top( never bolted on). So if you purchase the Kennedy bench with the lathe, add reinforcements to the bottom of the bench where the legs meet the bottom shelf.

Matt

[witkowbj]

I am a Smithy owner as well (about 6 months), I have the Granite 1220LTD, and am a newbie. I got the 3in1 for the same reason as others, space. I have to share space in my garage with 2 cars, my table saw, bandsaw, etc, and all the other junk. I've done ok with it, mostly for some hobby stuff, but I've managed to make some money selling simple aluminum molds for cast urethane and have paid for all my tooling this way. I've used the lathe the most, and while its short on the features of the Logan that I used at a friends shop, it does what I need. The mill I need a bit more experience with, but I was thinking I may be able to fix the 0.040 spindle feed problem by making a gear setup with reduction to the hand wheel and mounting it to where the stepper motors would mount, I guess that will be the summer project, I'll be moving soon so the machine will be out of commission until mid june. Has anyone dis-assembled one for moving? I plan on removing the mill head and the table, tailstock and motors to make it light enough to get into my basement.

[This message has been edited by witkowbj (edited 04-01-2003).]

[mot]

jdk
Your right about the drill chuck not being top line,but here is a tip, tighten each of the three holes in the drill chuck whenever you tighten a bit (or anything) MOT

[jdk]

Thanks Mott. I'll try that tonight. But I made a 1/2-20 Drill chuck work for now by milling an adapter to fit my 1/2 MT3 holder I bought from Grizzly. This will work until I can afford a good jacobs chuck.
Atten. "witkowbj" Just follow your owners manual under *MOVING THE MACHINE*. It explains very well what you need to do to make this happen. I took my down in order to get into my basement. Its not a one man job.Plus it wouldn't hurt to pound down a couple bowls of Cherrios. Especially if your not big and bulky. But all kidding a side its pretty stright forward, but pay special attention to the gear for the mill head. Its plastic.!!! You know what that means. But it all just falls back into place very well. See Ya Jim

[milmat1]

Lots of good smithy tips going now ! Thanks everyone for your time and effort.
Ordered the tail stock ext. and a few other small goodies today.
Question : I noticed the mill head has a lot of play in the vertical axis. What i mean is with it unlocked i can grab the mill spindle and push it up, havn't measured the amount. But is close to 1/16". This is on a 1220xl..
Think i'll call smithy before i take it apart,It isn't a problem with milling because of gravity and the lock. But it makes it hard to drill a precise depth using the depth dial..
The drill chuck isn't the best thats for sure but i get by with it, as long as like was said earlier tighten all three places on the chuck.
I have heard of the mill head jumping out of gear though mine has never had a problem. First thing to do when you get the machine is to get the junk oil out of it and replace it with some good stuff.
Anyone found an affordable vise that is better than the one that comes with it?

[jdk]

To milmat1: Soon as I read you entry I ran down stairs to check mine. I have a 1220 also but not the XL [low buget- midas].
I didn't take the time to put a dial on the mill but as I could tell I have very little if any movement. Plus there has never been a time that it has jumped out of gear.
VISES' I stll use the angle vise that came with mine. But I did make 1/2 plate 5Wx8L to mount the vise centered over the mill table. This make it much nicer when you try and center something under the milling tool. Took the time to mill a couple of centering lugs on the bottom of the plate so it goes in the same location when ever I return the vise to the table its very close zero x-y each time. Saves me a lot of time and head ach.
Heres one for ya!! I'd like to mount a 4" dial caliper to the face of the mill head to get a more accurate down feed reading. A fella did this to a Jet mill/drill in Feb/March issue of Mach. Workshop. But his machine has much more room to mount the Caliper to than does the Smithy. any ideas??
Thanks Jim.

[mot]

Hey Smithy owners,
Question!!!! How can You Slow a 1220 xl down, without buying a lot of extra hardware?
Sometimes speed is nice, but some fine work and threading would benifit from a slower feed. Thanks to you all, this makes winter go a lot faster. Mot

[jdk]

The best advise I can give is to buy the pulley set up that Smithy Sells. Its about 90 dollars and I can help with the part number. I have tried to use a reostat type devise to slow down the motor [rpm] of my drill press but the draw back is that it takes all fo the tourqe away from the machine too. Good luck, Jim

[davestea]

HI guys - YIKES! I didn't know you were here - don't usually look here - only in the General section also check out this forum for 3-in-1's we need some more action there too --

http://www.chaski.com/ubb/ubbthreads.php

there are several other very good forums going there also.

I have a 1220XL -

On the kennedy stand - nice stand - pretty flimsy - I had the same thing happen to two legs when in my apartment just moving a couple inches. When I moved into the house I went to Home Depot and bought that angle iron with all the holes and slots in it. Completely reenforced the WHOLE table. Looks kinda hokey but it is strong now. I put a frame around the bottom - put new legs on - put another frame around the first shelf and then bolted it all together - the legs bolt to the top of Kenedy frame.

Changes - well I am in the process of building a tumbler reverse - want to put a thread dial on but can't find any information on the size gear needed. Any help there guys? Have you seen the Frog?

http://www.emachineshop.com/frog/index.htm

Spun the drill taper in the tail stock - new tail stock taper $20 - Smithy IS good with the parts. Hint - I made a nice knurled pin and in the OLD tailstock ram drilled a 1/4" hole down through everything. The built in drill/mill made THAT really easy! Now I lock my drill chuck into tailstock and no spin. Use the new tailstock ram for other stuff now when I need a good tight fit.

Here is a something new I just figured out last night. I check this on the 3 to 2 taper adapter but should work on the 4 to 3 adapter also. Need a chuck stop? buy the 4 to 3 sleave and cut off the tang (just the tang you'll need the rest). 3/8 works for the 3-2 so I'd guess 1/2 will work great for the 4-3 (ymmv). Anyway - drill and tap for 1/2x20 or whatever - get a nice long piece of 1/2 threaded rod. Notice that you will need to drill and tap some of the open area into the internal taper (you won't need it anyway - this just gives you a nice cheap ($5) #4 taper to put into the headstock.)

The drawbar -
You will need to make a cone for the left end of the through bore to accept the 1/2 threaded rod - you'll need a nut also.

Now put the taper sleave in the headstock and lock it down with your new draw bar. You may need (or want) to take some meat of the front edge of the sleave so the chuck will fit.

Now there are a couple ways you can go -

1 - quick and dirty - use the threaded rod itself as the stop - spin it through the taper measure and lock it down - or

2 - thread it throught - put a 1/2 coupler on it with some kind of solid stop and use the collar and jam nut to adjust the stop position.

Setting is a little tricky - you have to get the taper locked in first because it moves just a little when you tighten it down - then you can adjust from the rear to the stop position and lock down.

The taper can be inserted throught the chuck so with some setup measurements first you can adjust the stop foot in your hands and feed the taper into the headstock and lock it down. You will need to measure the distance from the front end of the taper to some point on your chuck - then measure the distance from the edge of the taper to the front of the foot to set the stop distance.

glad to see you guys here - felt like a loaner here.
d

[davestea]

had my Smithy for about 8 years - doing hobby stuff - mostly home automation.

I have been using a 6" rotary table for some time now. Yikes - can't even imagine using an 8" rotary on that little Smithy table. I also have a 4" that works well.

A hint - notice on most 6" rotarys you will have a #2 taper - you can use this to mount a lot of different tooling options - you can use it for a chuck centering fixture - I like to use it for the Harbor Freight collet chuck to hold smaller work when milling. This can also be used with an adapter for turning and then transfering to the mill for other machining operations.

[OutlawSmithy]

Damn! I was beginning to think that I was the only one with a Smithy, the only one that posts, anyway. I've had mine for about 8 months and most of what I do is for making parts for Radio Control vehicles. But, like most everyone else, space dictated the 3-n-1. I'll say this much about a Smithy, it does what I want it to, tho, changing over can be a pain.
This is what I'm working on now: http://www.radiocontrolzone.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=114234
It's an 1/8th scale monster truck. Most everything, with the exception of the engine & gears were made on the Smithy, including the frame, gearcases, 2 spd trans, deep dish alloy rims. Although, this is my first project on my machine, I'm delighted with the results. When I bought this machine, it came with a video that included small "exercise" projects, and all of them useless and rather than make those useless pieces, I decided to make something useful and incorporate those "exercises" within it....and I've learned a lot doing it this way!!

By the way, davestea, I have an 8" Phase II rotary table that I use on my 1220XL and I gotta tell ya, it works out real nice!! The only real downside is lifting this 90+lb "anchor" from the bench to the table! I'm very happy with it!!

[jdk]

For "OUTLAWSMITHY'....ON YOUR 8" ROTARY TABLE your had to use some sort of mounting plate. What did you use? Something like a 1/2" plate mounted to the cross slide table. When I ordered mine I had no idea that the monster would be so heavy. Long story there so I'll head out for now. See Ya.

[OutlawSmithy]

jdk, I mount it to the cross-slide table directly, and yer right, IT IS HEAVY!! As far as securing it to the table, I use the big T-bolts & clamps that held the Smithy to the crate it came in.Tho, I did have to grind the heads of the T-bolts to fit the table slots, they work real well. As for the rotary table I find myself using it most of the time, if for nothing else, but, to elevate the work up to the quill. Plus, while making parts for radio control vehicles, largely requires turning the piece to whatever angle. Sure beats the hell out of clamping, repositioning and re-clamping. I think the only reason I didn't go for the 10" rotary table was the weight!!! 90+# is plenty thank you.

[This message has been edited by OutlawSmithy (edited 05-06-2003).]

[jdk]

"outlawsmithy"
I never even considered the material that came with my machine. I still have it too.
I'll bet with that 8" table on your cross slide you don't have to worry about clamping down the cross slide during machining. Yuk-Yuk. By the way; I checked out the r/c web site. Very nice work. see-ya, Jim

[milmat1]

"WoW" What a thread! I started this because it seemed like there was no place for us 3-1 owners, And most of the experienced machinist dismiss them pretty fast.
However as we see now there are a large number of people who have these machines and are happy with them. Great tips as well, man you guy's have come up with some great mods and ideas. Thanks for all the help !
And keep them coming ! I havn't had time here lately to play out here in the shop, And hoping to get some hobbie time in this weekend. ( if the grandson will allow it ! ha ha). Thanks again guys and keep em coming !!! MATT

[OutlawSmithy]

Well, then, I guess my timing is "dead-on-balls accurate", (it's an industry term).

Today, I went to tighten the gibs on the re ar of the table and guess what? One of 'em broke off. $#@^*& I did manage to get part of it out, but, had to take the table off the machine for the other pieces. Rather than to replace those CHEESY internal allen adjustment screws, I replaced them with 2 1/2" 8mm bolts! Much easier too adjust...and these won't break!!

Just looking at these cheesy allen screws, Smithy could have disassembled one of their machines and replaced these screws & bolts with ones of decent quality, US made! I also replaced the locking gib with a 10mm bolt, rather than to risk the same thing happening again.

I've never had a problem with JT chuck, but, I've always tightened all 3 sides on most chucks, they seem to grip better. Plus, if I use the drill, it's usually for precision drilling, anything else, I'll use my drill press. When it can no longer tighten or when it's more of a hassle to use than it's worth, I'll replace it with a Jacobs.

One other thing.....the angle vise that's included.......as far as I'm concerned, it makes a fairly good drill press vise and not much more. Tho, sometimes, it comes in handy as an "extra" pair of hands at the bench. My main vise is a 4" lockdown vise and a 4" milling vise and both come in handy, and seem to be very accurate.

[This message has been edited by OutlawSmithy (edited 05-24-2003).]

[rmatel]

Hi,
I have a 1220 LTD. In order to improve the quill depth indicating I mounted a 4" dial caliper from Grizzly to the mill head. Works great; dial is just below the height adjust knob, facing the operator. To attach it to the quill, I used a system suggested by another Smithy owner-- a finger attached to the plastic "chip guard" on the quill.
Here's the catch! Since the quill is keep from rotating by a single screw in a slot instead of a rib with gibs, there is a slight rotation to the quill under load. This enough to twist the caliper enough to cause binding, etc. Still trying to come up with a solution to allow enough play yet hold the caliper firmly to the "finger".
Until then, I am using a high tech solution, a rubber band. Ain't this game fun??

[OutlawSmithy]

milmat, how 'bout these vises from Enco: 425-7240 4" JAW WIDTH 4" LOCKDOWN VISE & JAWS $69.99? Or a 5" for $74, a 6" for $79? I bought the 4" vise and I think got a good bang for the buck! Yea, I know they're made in China, but, I can't justify $400-$600 for a Kurt.

[OutlawSmithy]

Anyone know where I can get a steady rest for my Smithy? The one that Smithy has is $189, sounds a bit high(!)....and I've given them enough money already.

[Dick Payne]

Outlaw Smithy:
I made my own steady rest and modified a follower rest I bought from Harbor Freight for $16. It was origionally for their 9x20.
If I knew how to post a picture of it I would. Send me youe e-mail address and I will send you a picture of both of them. They are for a Smithy 1220 machine.

------------------
Dick

[bandm]

Hello Matt,

I just purchased a Smithy Granite 1340.
Just put it in my basement 2 nights ago.
I would love to correspond with you about the Smithy or machining in general.

Bill


<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by milmat1:
Hey guy's:
I was just wondering how many other smithy owners we have out there, Who would like to share experiences or ideas. Such as modifications you have done or special tools/jigs you have made etc..
Maybe some photos of special set-ups even. I have a smithy and i am relitively new to machine work(at least doing it myself). And would love to hear what some of you have been able to do with your machines.
Since the 3in1 machines are nearly always getting trashed on the forum, maybe we can share some set-up ideas or just complain about the machines lackings. I am building a scale model hit or miss engine on mine right now(well trying to !).
Tell me about your experiences with your machines. Or whatever !!!! MATT

</font>

[ralenr]

Hi Guys,

Just thought I should throw my hat in the ring too. I got a 1324 about six months ago. Long time woodworker now learning metal work. Having a great time learning new things. Only wish I had more time to spend in my shop. Just started to try to turn threads. Didn't go too well the first time but will try again soon. I'm really enjoying this new obsession.

Allen

[axl]

I have been in machining for about 10 yrs. I purchased a granite 1340 about 6 months ago and am very please with it. I'm thinking of converting it to cnc and would like some info about the kit smithy offers. Does it allow variable feed rates? How does it work on turning radiuses? Does it allow vertical feed on the mill? Smithy has very little info on this unit.

[OutlawSmithy]

axl, I can't answer your questions, even tho, I have a Smithy, a 1220, and it is CNC copatible, tho, I have no plans to convert it. What I would suggest is to give Smithy a call; they seem pretty honest & sincere, so, I don't think they'd have any problem answering your questions. Good luck.

[DanB]

It is great to find a Smithy forum; I am the happy owner of a Granite 1220 LTD. I have just begun to bring the machine online and am excited about the possibilities. But first a simple question: How do you remove the taper shank from the tailstock? After some lathe drillng I removed the chuck but the taper shank stuck rock solid! Is there a simple way or do I dismantle the entire tailstock? Thanks guys!

[rmatel]

DanB,
There is a set screw that replaces the drawbar when the "jacobs" is used in the tailstock. This gives the taper sufficient length to be released by cranking the slide in all the way.
You will have to loosen the set screw on the bottom of the tailstock by the crank handle. This will allow you to "unscrew" the leadscrew assembly and let you insert your drawbar to tap out the taper.
Remember to protect your ways ;-)

[Locksmith]

DanB: Ask Smithy for this set screw, if it didn't come with it. They're very good about that.

[dplugs39]

TO THE SMITHY OWNERS....JUST A FEW WORDS ON THE SMITHY 3-1 MACHINES....I HAVE A OLD (10 YEARS) CB1220 MACHINE, AND WITH MANY PROJECTS I HAVE PUT OVER 4000+ HOURS ON MY MACHINE.. AND WITHOUT ALMOST ANY MECHANICAL PROBLEMS...I HAVE OVER THE YEARS BEEFED UP THE LOCK ON THE MILL HEAD, REPLACED THE ORIGINAL 3/4 HP AC DRIVE WITH A 2 HP DC VARI. SPEED MOTOR - SURPLUS COSTS $39.00 (BELTED DOWN WITH A 2-1/4TO 1 RATIO) WHICH GIVES ME OVER 4 HP TO WORK WITH..I INSTALLED A DIGITAL CALIPER ON THE MILL HEAD TO SET THE DEPTH OF CUT ON THE MILL..OVER THE YEARS I HAVE MADE 5 STERLING ENGINES ,2 SINGLE CYLINDER IC ENGINES , A TWIN CYLINDER ENGINE,(MY DESIGN) AND THREE 4 CYLINDER HORZ. OPPOSED ENGINES (MY DESIGN), TWO 1/3 SCALE 22 CAL. GATLING GUNS, 1/3 SCALE MIN. MUZZLE LOADING RIFLE, PLUS PARTS FOR ALL OF THE NEIGHBORS, AND THINGS FOR MY KIDS, AND THINGS FOR MY GRANDKIDS.....A LOTS OF PROJECTS AND A LOT OF HOURS ON THE MACHINE , AND IT STILL HOLDS UP VERY WELL...I HAVE A 6" ROTARY TABLE WITH A 5" 3 JAW CHUCK MOUNTED ON THE TABLE, PLUS A LOT OF TOOLING ....LIKE EVERYONE DOES EVERY NOW AND THEN, I START THINKING ABOUT GETTING SOMETHING "BIGGER" "NEWER" "FASTER" , AND I ALWAYS TAKE A FEW STEPS BACK AND ASK MYSELF "WHAT MORE DO I NEED?" AND THE ANSWER IS NOT MUCH!!!! JUST KEEP THE MACHINE CLEANED , OILED , AND TIGHTNED UP AND IT WILL SERVE YOU WELL....ANY QUESTIONS ON THE CHANGES , YOU CAN EMAIL ME (OFF THREAD) AND I WILL TRY TO ANSWER YOU...DALE DETRICH

[davestea]

dplugs39

thanks for the input - I agree -

what did you do to beef up the lock on the mill head?

Seems I have to be really careful with the cut and/or really lean on the clamp.

just a hint - for me all caps is hard to read - and most people consider it to be hollering in e-mail text, which this counts as.

[dplugs39]

davestea....On the mill lock....I removed the stock locking lever and using a metric tap,tapped all the way through the back half of the casting..Then I used a piece of hardened metric all thread the full length of the casting...then I made a heavy flat washer that just fit into the recess in the casting, then I took a chunk of 1" steel hex stock aprox 3" long, drilled and tapped the same metric thread that is used in the mill clamp, then turned a bull nose on the hex about 3/4" long that would fit into the recess...This gives you a long threaded area for the all thread and a 3" long nut, then I used a 1" deep socket and have fixed about a 24 " lever on the socket to allow you to really tighten the clamp....After doing the above mods. I have not had the mill move during a cut...And I did not even shout....Dale Detrich

[chollopeter]

When using the Mill on my 1340, using the cross slide table to move the workpiece in the "Y" direction I have noticed a tendency for the table to creep in the "X" direction. Anyone else had this problem? Any fixes or suggestions? Seems a lockdown to the ways of some sort would be good but, havent seen or heard of anything available. Maybe I'll try to rig something up, if it works I'll post the info.

[Fasttrack]

When using the Mill on my 1340, using the cross slide table to move the workpiece in the "Y" direction I have noticed a tendency for the table to creep in the "X" direction. Anyone else had this problem? Any fixes or suggestions? Seems a lockdown to the ways of some sort would be good but, havent seen or heard of anything available. Maybe I'll try to rig something up, if it works I'll post the info.


There should be a set screw in the middle of the two pairs of gib adjusting screws on the table. This is the lock - tighten that one set screw down and it will lock the table

[motomoron]

On the rear of the carriage in the middle between the cross slide dovetails should be a socket head cap screw, probably 10x1.5mm or so. That's the carriage lock for the X axis. I lock it generally for anything other than the crudest of hogging-off. I made a nice knurled knob so I don't have to dink around trying to find the hole w/ an Allen wrench.

Other worthwhile improvements on my Granite 1324:

Shooting Star 3 axis DRO. Paid for itself with productivity and better parts.

Timken precision lathe spindle bearings. The originals took a crap at about a year, and the Smithy replacements were sh1te. It's a way better lathe now.

Welded new longer handle on mill head height adjuster tool.

Removed handle from leadscrew handle. No more vibration.

Disassembled, debured, stoned, fitted, and carefully assembled most of the machine. They're put together in a pretty haphazard way. You can fix that.

[rustyswarf]

deleted by rustyswarf.

[Boomer Mikey]

I purchased a Smithy 1324 granite 3-in-one machine Mill-Drill-Lathe in 2001; this was my first machine tool. For gunsmith hobby work this is all I needed according to some of the books I got. This is true, the Smithy is all you really need for hobby gunsmith work and I built a 338-06 from a Mauser 98 action with the Smithy that easily shoots 1 MOA. So far I've built 4 complete rifles, re-barreled a Winchester 94, re-chambered 2 TC Contender barrels, made numerous pilots, nose punches, sizing dies, firing pins, etc. It's real handy to make a simple part or gadget you need instead of waiting two weeks or months for it.

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9015/Making_a_Thrust_Bearing_Housing.JPG

Making a thrust bearing housing for my mini mill.

The milling head is so noisy in operation the neighbors and my wife had to leave home for me to use it and it's a major pain to switch setups between lathe operations and milling/drilling operations. So... I purchased a Harbor Freight round column gear head milling machine on sale...

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9015/Smithy_Lathe_Gearhead_Mill.JPG

The Harbor Freight gear head mill was well worth it's cost... this machine delivered the best value/performance ratio of all my machines.


http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/505/Mini_Mill_4_1_1_1.JPG


With the Smithy lathe and Harbor Freight mill I designed and made this CNC MiniMill. This took over a year to make and I had a blast making it. I built 3 different spindles for the machine and the machine controller too. This project was a major disaster for my bank account because I wanted more "capability" to make bigger and better things.


http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9015/Industrial_Hobbies_Mill.JPG

Out with the Harbor Freight mill and in with the Industrial Hobbies "Big Mill" with it's 30" table. This machine had awesome capability and a square column. I could now raise and lower the gear head without loosing zero!

The Smithy 1324 was a good "starter" machine; it has served me well, and factory support has been very good. I'm not going to replace it anytime soon but it barely serves my needs as a lathe, it's underpowered, lacks rigidity and requires it's owner to learn to work within it's capability, the Smithy mill head is better than nothing but a $500 Mini Mill has more power. Once you get a benchtop mill you'll forget about using the Smithy mill head. IMO a 13" - 14" X 36" - 40" gap bed lathe with a QC gearbox and a gear head bench top mill is a better value.

I made a new compound slide to use a Phase II QC AXA tool post, a cross slide table lock screw, a spider collar nut assembly for the outboard end of the headstock to support long stock and gun barrels through the spindle bore, reconfigured the original 3 jaw chuck to a "set true" configuration, made my own sets of indexable tool holders for TNMG 321 and 221 inserts, and added travel dial indicators to the saddle and cross slide. I also purchased a set true 5C collet chuck another 6" 3 jaw chuck, tool post grinder, faceplate, and steady rest.

Boomer

[Boomer Mikey]

My Smithy 3 jaw chuck was running so sloppy I decided to try to make it run true.

I was hoping to get it to run with .0005" runout. One of the jaws in the chuck is off by .001". The best it will run is .001" a significant improvement from the .006" it was running.

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9020/Set_Tru_Chuck_Mod1.JPG


I cut an additional .005" off the inside of the center of the D1-4 back plate to allow the chuck movement.

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9020/Set_Tru_Chuck_Mod2.JPG

I drilled holes with 120 degree spacing in between the pinions.

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9020/Set_Tru_Chuck_Mod3.JPG

I tapped the holes for 6mm x 1mm thread 22mm long set screws.

http://www.cnczone.com/gallery/data/9020/Set_Tru_Chuck_Mod4.JPG

The front and back shcs were installed with light tension, then I centered the chuck by adjusting the set screws with a DTI to run true and tightened the front shcs's then unmounted the chuck and tightened the shcs's on the back plate. The set screws may be removed afterwards.

I did this about 3 years ago and it is still running with 0.001" TIR on a 1" gage pin.

Boomer

[Vintage Mutes]

Hi -
I'm new to the group. Had a small amount of machining experience back in college years ago and always wanted more. I've changed careers and have more time to explore this itch.

So I was on the lookout for a 3 in 1 machine, but had ruled out Harbor freight due to lack of support, parts difficulties, and general quality.

So after looking for a while, I recently "stole" a 10 year old CB-1220, bench, and toolbox with all the original tools for $500. The unit had zero hours on it according to the seller and from what I see I believe him.

The unit was like new except for some problems which had arisen from sitting idle for 10 years (loose wire in the motor terminal block, dry rotted poly belts, and frozen mill spindle). Got em all fixed and now I am looking to learn and do some projects. So all in all I think I got a good deal.

My areas of interest are brass musical instruments and (as my name implies) vintage mutes.

Is anyone out there in Central FL on the forum?
Can anyone recommend any online courses (with video). I have books but seeing it done is much more useful to me.

Thanks.

[smiller6912]

It ain't cheep but it's on DVDs.............
http://www.americangunsmith.com/allitems.php?page=8
I have a friend who really likes this, I have only seen a short portion but, I found it useful. Call them, I think that they have some deal for the full machine shop set.

"This is not an endorsement, I have not used this program"
"Use at your own risk", "mileage may very"

[Vintage Mutes]

Lol - umm $500 for a few DVDs is outta my price range. If I had that moola available I'd put it toward a dedicated mill. But thanks anyway.

[rustyswarf]

I've had a Smithy 1220 since 1995. It has been good to me. I made about $700 with it making parts for a 3-ton ice machine for an AC/Refridgeration mech. friend of mine. Made a replacement hood latch for a friend's Caddy coupdeville (freebie job) that his car dealer wanted $500 for. Made pins for obsolete firearms and replacement pins for reloading dies that were hard to find for my friends. Made brass panhead screws for 1890's era Victrola phonographs--(have a friend that collects and restores them). Made new bushings and spindle shaft for a friend's 1936 Atlas lathe that went down. That job showed me how accurate a Smithy can be. I make tools and parts for my friend's wood lathes.
Best thing I ever did was convert it to a Phase II quick change tool post set up. The Phase II (piston type) was good, but the base plate and shaft that came with it was a nightmare. It leaned. Underneath the bottom of the top half of the compound slide is a slot milled out to hold the Smithy 4-way toolpost shaft from rotating. I got a harder grade bolt and nut from the hardware store. Cut a new busing that fit inside the QC toolpost body that fit the hole and the new bolt closely (to tighten tolerances). Ground the head of the bolt to fit the milled slot in the underside of the compound slide, and put everything together. Only other thing I had to do since I usually work with 1/2" toolbits, was mill a little off the bottoms of the QC toolholders so I could get on center. Voila! Quick and dirty QC toolpost fitting.:)

[monkeyb0y]

I've seen the lathe series and they are really pretty well done. They cover the basics very well. They are pricey to buy but they are available at Smartflix.com (formerly Technical Video Rental) a video rental site like Netflix but for instructional videos. They have a good selection of machinist video and very reasonable prices.

[smiller6912]

Just in case anyone has been thinking of buying a new Smithy, I just got a flier in the mail and through Feb. 29 they are including a free $375 machine stand. (I love mine). The offer does not show up on the web site, you have to call 800-476-4849.

[JerryL]

Hi to the group

I bought my Smithy Granite 1324 ( regular one ) in July / 2007 . the shipping was great as well as the packing .

I unloaded the machine from a very low utility trailer with a 2 1/2 ton cherry picker / engine puller and it had the load leveler bar with it . I used a combination of chains and nylon straps .
I also used this equipment to lift it into place onto the Smith stand / bench .

I have had some leg / back issues and have not been able to do a lot as far as checking it out and setting it up let alone doing much machining .

I did have some chuck run out and fixed / adjusted that . I had a tapper problem and I THINK I have that solved .... I cleaned / honed and adjusted ALL the Gibbs on anything that has them ... I had a real problem mounting the new style DRO as I was one of the first to get the new units that they started using . ( had to make several of my own shims / bushings and get different screws )
So far I like the machine ...but I think there are a few other tweaks and adjustments that will have to be made ???

If I was to do it all over again I'd have gotten the INDUSTRIAL SMITHY and or I see they have a new model Granite with all kinds of zippy bells and whistles ..... Mainly for the motor and the bearings )

I will try to make posts as I go along here now that I am somewhat feeling better and able to stand while by the machine .

JerryL JerryLeskovec

[smiller6912]

I ordered the quick change tool post for my G1324. It came today, it is worth every penny ($229). I've had it half a day and already saved an hour setup time. NO MORE SHIMS, YIPEEEEE.......
http://www.smithy.com/accessories.php?acid=20&aid=812&code=
check it out...............

[JerryL]

I already have a SMITHY 1324 Granite (2007) Version.

I am wondering if SMITHY would do a COMPLETE SET UP / CHECK OUT ( For REAL ) on a machine if a buyer asked them to ...of course for a nominal charge .

1. I mean take the gibs out polish / hone them .

2. Check all the gears for alignment and any burs etc .

3. Check the chuck for run out / tail stock in line with head spindle/

4. Check out the mill head and column.

5. Make sure that the speed dial and motor are in sync .

6. whatever else that could be set up before shipping .

Just a thought ???

JerryL

[smiller6912]

I am wondering if SMITHY would do a COMPLETE SET UP / CHECK OUT ( For REAL ) on a machine if a buyer asked them to ...of course for a nominal charge .
JerryL
I have had real good luck with their tech. department, they are always very helpful and seam to know the machines "inside and out". I was having a little chuck runout problem and a call to them narrowed it down to a cam lock stud, the FREE replacement was in my mailbox the next day.
What could it hurt to give them a call..........

[JerryL]

Hi Sam

SMITHY has been VERY GOOD to me and very helpful as well as EVERYONE is VERY knowledgeable about their products and machining .

I have called then at least a dozen times with various prob that I have encountered and they have helped me through EVERY TIME and then some .

I wasn't " Bitching " about them . I was just thinking that if they offered what I had described ,maybe it would save someone who is a first time buyer and don't care to tinker with the machine or at least as little as possible a option.

I don't know how the other 3 in 1 machines are or compare as well as their tech support teem etc .
But judging from what i read about the top selling 3 - 5 brands of 3 in 1 and single use mills / lathes Smithy has the least complaints in the last 4 - to present years .
If I had it to do all over again I think I would go the same way I did , but going now with Smithys top of the line Granite Max machine .

Take care have fun be safe ...... JerryL

[torchroadster]

I usually lurk on the general site, but saw this and wanted to check in. I have a Smithy Granite 1340 - bought it used a little over a year ago.

[smiller6912]

I called Smithy today about the new DRO and talked to Kerry Ballard, he could not have been more helpful. First he told me that the first units that they got (Sino) were sent with the mounting hardware made backwards (for you drafters, its a first angle / third angle thing), second he sent me pictures and diagrams and descriptions of how he installed the one in their store.
I mentioned to him that I thought that I was feeling a wobble in the lathe spindle, he immediately explained that the tapered roller bearings were set loose at the factory for breaking in and how to adjust them, it worked great.
After a bit of joking around with him, he ended up giving me a $100 discount on the Sino DRO and the shipping.
Great people, they always have the right answer.
(Make sure you have time to talk, he does like to chat).

[torchroadster]

I'll be anxious to read your report on the install and performance of your SINO DRO. Did he tell you what the accuracy specs were? I asked them a while back and they didn't have the numbers yet.

[JerryL]

Hi All
I got my Smithy 1324 Granite in July 2007. I was to receive a FREE DRO as part of my package ... The machine came and the DRO was on back order . I waited and called and waited until about Sept .
Smithy kept saying they had changed over to a new Brand / Style and where getting the installation parts made etc .

I got it and it was the Sino... I started to try and hook it up and the directions at that time where about useless and very skimpy and NOT CLEAR AT ALL.

It ended up that I had to make several spacers / bushings / and Modify 2 of the brackets .....

I was on the phone several times with Smithy and they where very helpful and gave some suggestions ..... They also sent me a replacement Mounting rail for the Y Axis .

I had gotten one of the VERY FIRST ones that they sent out the day after they got them from their supplier .......

Smithy did take care of me for all the probs . THEY ARE VERY GOOD AT DOING THAT FOR A CUSTOMER ..

The SINO has way more features than I'll ever use or want .... It is VERY SENSITIVE and reads down to 0.000000 You breathe on it and it changes .
That I know of there is no way to make the read out less sensitive or use less digits .

I would rather have a DRO that just gives you a +/- Position and read to 0.0000 ( Tens of Thousandths )

If was free so I guess I can't complain .

JerryL

[smiller6912]

I received my DRO this morning and I have it installed. I had only two minor problems, first- one of the mounting plates was taped for M6 (per the instruction) and there were M5s in the hardware pack, second- one of the "Y" axis mounting screws went thru the mounting angle and up against the cross slide table, I had to shorten it by 8mm. Other than that installation was a breeze (well except for the hour and a half that it took to index everything in plumb and square).
The display mounting arm is up to you to locate. The pictures that Smithy sent me showed them using a vertical column on the right rear of the chip tray, I brought home a 3x3x1/4 angle from the shop to use in that location but decided I liked it better on my left so I used a 3" piece of 4x2x1/4 that I had here and mounted it to the top of the gear box cover. I like it there as I don't have to reach over the machine to get to it and it is right over the rest of the controls. I have been told that some people mount it to the wall behind the machine, that wasn't going to work for me.
I found out that the first units that they received had the mounting hardware fabricated backwards. It seams that the Chinese use first angle projection and we use third angle projection on the detail drawings (I've run into that problem before with European drawings). So, some of the first people to get them had quite a hard time figuring out the mounting. I believe that has been fixed with the ease that I installed mine.
It is loaded with way more bells and whistles that I normally use but I'm going to try them out.
According to sino-ld website, these have an accuracy of .0002, we shall see.

All in all, I'm very happy, so far.....................

[HSS]

I installed the Sino DRO on my 1324 2 weeks ago and am very pleased with it. The manual leaves a lot to be desired. (it is horrible, actually). The DRO isn't hard to figure out, but it would be wise to write down what you did to get it to do what you wanted, for future use. I have been using the bolt circle feature a lot making a disk for a dividing head. I agree with others in prior posts that .00000 is way too much accuracy.

[torchroadster]

Glad to read the reports - sounds like everyone is reasonably happy. One question - does the Sino have functions for the both lathe and mill operation? Or just one? One thing that has been holding me back (other than $) on a DRO purchase for my Granite 1340 is that all of the commercial units seem to have functions for either a mill or lathe but not both. Since the Smithy is really both it'd be nice to have both supported in the DRO - I'd always figured I would get the mill version on others and make do on the lathe.

[smiller6912]

Glad to read the reports - sounds like everyone is reasonably happy. One question - does the Sino have functions for the both lathe and mill operation? Or just one? One thing that has been holding me back (other than $) on a DRO purchase for my Granite 1340 is that all of the commercial units seem to have functions for either a mill or lathe but not both. Since the Smithy is really both it'd be nice to have both supported in the DRO - I'd always figured I would get the mill version on others and make do on the lathe.
This unit is programed specifically for the 3 in 1 machines. It uses the "3MS" display head. If you are interested, I have a (MS-Word) copy of the manual that I would be happy to share. It might help give you a better idea of the functions. -WARNING- You will need to speak Chinglish.

[HSS]

This unit is programed specifically for the 3 in 1 machines. It uses the "3MS" display head. If you are interested, I have a (MS-Word) copy of the manual that I would be happy to share. It might help give you a better idea of the functions. -WARNING- You will need to speak Chinglish.
Is your MS-Word copy of the manual the same translation as the one in the manual? I have the manual and they leave out steps that are required to get the results you want. Also their translation of a flow chart is "a circulation schematic diagram". I think they translate straight from a chinese-english dictionary. If your copy is easier to understand, I sure would like a copy.:D

[HSS]

Glad to read the reports - sounds like everyone is reasonably happy. One question - does the Sino have functions for the both lathe and mill operation? Or just one? One thing that has been holding me back (other than $) on a DRO purchase for my Granite 1340 is that all of the commercial units seem to have functions for either a mill or lathe but not both. Since the Smithy is really both it'd be nice to have both supported in the DRO - I'd always figured I would get the mill version on others and make do on the lathe.
The Sino will work in lathe or mill, equally well. I mounted my pendant on the wall to the right end and behind the machine. Easy to see and reach and no vibration from the machine. Even tho you use a DRO, don't get rid of your mics or calipers, I have found errors in accuracy with the DRO. Even so the speed of getting to tolerance is better, just check it with instruments before you unchuck.;)

[torchroadster]

Even tho you use a DRO, don't get rid of your mics or calipers, I have found errors in accuracy with the DRO. Even so the speed of getting to tolerance is better, just check it with instruments before you unchuck.;)

I understand that the DRO isn't a replacement for measuring tools - but about the SINO accuracy are you seeing something more than the stated accuracy? I think it's 0.0002? Or are the errors just related to variation in the machine or zero setting tolerances?

smiller; Thank you for the generous offer of the manual. I've found the one online but like HSS said if your's is something different then I'm very interested.

[smiller6912]

I don't know what version you guys have but, I have two, the one that came with the DRO and the Word copy and, in looking them over, they are not exactly the same (the one that I got on line does not include the Smithy version 3MS) but they are about the same. I don't think there would be much different in the copy you have. I will still be glad to email you a copy of the one I have but I'm pretty sure there is no big differences.
I was mostly offering the copy just to give someone a look at the capabilities, it is still impossible to read.
I was talking to Smithy this week and they told me that they have hired a consultant to do an update to the manual but, it is a way off yet.
I didn't have a lot of problems understanding most of the instructions with a little trial and error and where I did have problems, the folks at Smithy have been very helpful.
Never hesitate to call them, I've found them to be great people to deal with.
My hat is off to Kerry, he is always right there with the info I need and he seams happy to do it.

[HSS]

You are right about Kerry, Smiller, but I think he prefers the DRO from Canada over the Sino. Kinda makes me think I might have liked the one from Canada, also. The reason I went with the Sino was that Kerry said the Sino was somewhat easier to install. Having installed the Sino and the things I had to do to install it, I wish I had gotten the Canadian one. It couldn't have presented any more installation shortcomings than the Sino.:rolleyes:

[HSS]

I think I'm going to reroute my cables. They are ok the way they are, but I don't like the way it looks. I also have to be careful or at least aware of how far around, I push the milling head to get out of the way when turning on the lathe.

[HSS]

Smiller, have you used the bolt circle feature yet? I have mine set up for inches and in bolt circle it wants the dia. in mm. Haven't figured that one out yet so when I get to there I just use mm. Maybe that is their way of getting me to go over to metric.

[smiller6912]

HSS,
I find that interesting, I had negligible installation problems. I had to shorten the screw on the front of the Y scale mount (8mm) where it was extending through and hitting the table and I was missing 2 M6 screws for the mounting of the Y read head, and I had to tap 2 holes for the X scale (as indicated in the installation instructions), but everything else was very straight forward and simple. I got the impression that he preferred the Sino for the added capabilities and better resolution. The exchange rate between the US and Canada verses China made the Sino less expensive.
Anyway, I'm happy with mine. I've only had it two days and I'm still just playing and learning but I already see how this is going to save me a butt-load of time.

[smiller6912]

OK, I've said it before and I'll say it again, if you own a Smithy and have any questions or need some help, just call Kerry. I've been tuning up my G1324 and every time I call or email he has been right there with what I need. He is very knowledgeable about the products, and goes out of his way to make sure that I get everything I need.
This is the way tech help should be done.
Great job Kerry.........................:D

[HSS]

Smiller,
Have you used the arc function on your sino dro yet, and if so, how? The manual is a joke.
Thanx
Patrick

[smiller6912]

Smiller,
Have you used the arc function ............
No I haven't. I have a turning project that I have been working on and I haven't even looked at the milling functions yet. I don't have the manual with me here toady but, I will be home later this afternoon and I would be happy to see if I could help you (NO promises). I have found the tech folks at Smithy to be very helpful, you may want to try giving them a call also.
If you want, send me a pm or email with specific questions and I'll see if I can help.

[HSS]

Just got off the phone with Kerry @ Smithy. He hasn't been able to get arc function to work yet either. He said he would try it again
Patrick

[smiller6912]

Just got off the phone with Kerry @ Smithy..........
You didn't tell him that I told you to call did you? He gets a little busy sometimes and I don't want him mad at me for telling folks to call him....... (just kidding, LOL).
Seriously, he is usually very good about trying to help.
(Did you notice that he is a chatter, I need to set aside a block of time when I call him).

[HSS]

You didn't tell him that I told you to call did you? He gets a little busy sometimes and I don't want him mad at me for telling folks to call him....... (just kidding, LOL).

No, he answered the phone.
I talk a lot also but I listen more than talk if it is a good subject.

[yeehaanow]

I picked up a used 1220 LTD and find that it's been a great machine to learn on.

When the motors (both that lathe and mill) are spinning down, right at the end they SQUEEK. Also if I move the chuck by hand they squeek. Is there something I should do? I don't remember if it did it when I first got it.

I have a couple small dings on the ways. I think one of them I can feel a little "bump" when passing it with the tail stock or the table, but I usually never use that part in practice anyway. How do you go about fixing this?


Seems like a great machine for beginners and hobbyists like myself, but as with everything else it's the tooling that's the real killer. Luckily, it came with a lot to begin with.

[Astronowanabe]

I have joined the ranks of smithy 1220 owners with
an old blue one that cost less than its' weight as scrap
it will be a few days before I have cleared enough room
to bring it home. (it is made for people without much room)

The compound looks funky not sure if it original
or a hack job.

[arclight]

I have one of early 1220's, purchased second-hand at a very reasonable price. It does pretty good work once everything has been shimmed up and tightened.

One trick for making it mill a LOT better: mount it to a heavy base. I made a stand out of 1.5" square tubing, welded a heavy steel plate apron to it and then filled the tubing with concrete. Way less chatter, and I can cut steel at a good speed. Also, use only good US or equivalent endmills. The cheap imports just make life worse on a not-so-rigid machine like this.

I have some 3-flute endmills in 1/2 and 5/8", and these do a great job.

Also, the milling vise it comes with is pretty crappy. Upgrading that to a good quality Kurt knock-off will probably be my next purchase.


Arclight

[smiller6912]

....
Also, the milling vise it comes with is pretty crappy. Upgrading that to a good quality Kurt knock-off will probably be my next purchase.....

I have the Smithy Granite 1324 and got a 5" Kurt style vise, well.... you may want to think about a 3" or 4" one. This thing is honkin' huge and I can only mount it with the swivel base set at an angle across the "T" slots, it's a bit of a bear to dial in.
Just something to keep in mind.........;)

(PS. I love my Smithy...)

[carlquib]

Little Machine Shop has a 3", the add says it is supposed to be a phase II but the one that they sent me looks more like the elephant brand. Even though it isn't a phase II it is worlds better than the vise that came with the machine. About 13 years ago, I made a similar mistake. Enco had their 6" kurt clones on sale for $49 with free shipping so I ordered one. It completely overwhelmed the machine and was difficult to lift up and down but it worked very well. I don't use the mill on the smithy very often now because I have two other mills but it worked very well for a number of years. I have the lathe set up with a 5C collet chuck and just leave it like that most of the time. I built a speed reducing pulley system that had a 7 to 1 reduction and that made all the difference in the world. The only other mods that I have made are better chip guarding on the carriage and a new motor and speed control. I have replaced all the bearings in my lathe spindle and in the mill spindle. The originals brinnelled not long after I got the machine. I also had to make a new washer for the end of the mill spindle. When I pulled mine the original cast washer cracked. Overall it has been a good machine. It doesn't have the fit and finish of a LeBlonde or a Monarch but it fit in the space I had at the time very well and did all that I asked of it. By the way I have one of the first granite 1324 machines, wish I would have ponied up for the 13 x 40 but space was an issue.

-brian

[arclight]

I bought the 3" Kurt-style vise from LMS (cool store to visit in person, BTW) and I am very happy with it. It's about as big as I want to go on the 1220. It's much more rigid than the stock vise, and I am getting around .001" total change across the top now with my test indicator. Not bad, especially since my machine is probably off by that much.

Arclight

[reggeee]

I was wondering if anybody has had these problems? I am new to metalworking and purchased a Smithy 1324 granite. Before i even had a chance to plug it in, i had my first major problem. After cleaning the machine as instructed i raised the mill head to get familiar with the operation of the controls etc. when i went to lower it, the head would not lower back to it's original height. It was jammed. I called the company and they were as dumbfounded as i was. Following their instructions, i disassembled everything that could be. It still wouldn't go down. keep in mind, i have now owned this machine for 4 hours. I decided to the only thing left to do. I jammed a screwdriver into the gap used to lock off the head and with one whack of a hammer the head fell back down to zero. It seems the post was caught up on the edge of the rough casting inside. The head was down and operating again, but i now have a huge ugly scar in the paint job. Oh well!!
After reading all the instructions and many articles on how to get started, i did. Everything was working fine. I was really happy with all the features and extra tooling smithy provided. After about 2 hours of operation (all at low speed. maybe 450 rpm) a huge spark jumped out of the motor and it died. I called the company again and Dave the technical guy walked me through some test that confirmed my motor was indeed fried. AFTER 2 HOURS of operation. My machine is now a huge paper weight. I got passed along to customer service and they put in the order for a new motor only to tell me they are back ordered and won't be in for 3-4 weeks. 1. do these motors burn out so often they can't keep up with the orders? 2. Should i just re-crate it and send it back? needless to say, i feel like i made a huge mistake.

[rmack898]

Reggee,

I had a somewhat similar problem with a 1324 I that I bought new. The speed controler fried within the first hour, I called and they sent me a new one overnight, I installed it and it fried right away. I was feeling like you are probably feeling right now. I talked to the tech guy and we determined that the controller they sent me was 110v instead of 220v. The 220v speed controller was not in stock so the tech guy pulled one out of a new machine and sent it right out to me and I was up and running with no other problems. I no longer have that machine but I had many hours of use on it and I know that it's present owner has been using it for the last 2 years with no problems.

I would call back and talk to the tech guy again and tell them to pull the motor off a new machine and get you running. Let them wait for a new motor. The squeaky customer gets the grease.

[reggeee]

Thanks Mac. customer service called me today and left a message that they wouldn't have a new motor until the first week in DEC. but they do have a second hand one i can have right away. I will call them in the AM and suggest they pull a motor off a new machine and send it to me. Great idea! i'll let you know.

[spirit20]

Reggee:
Have you opened up the motor to look inside? I have a 1340I and the motor started to make some noise, spark, and smell. They sent me a new one but it took quite a while. In the mean time I opened up the motor and found that a washer was in it from the factory. I removed the washer and tested the motor and it seems to work fine. I also had a problem with the 3-jaw chuck; it ran out of true by .060. I could not dial it in any way I tried. I removed the inside jaws and put in the out side jaws that came with the machine, still no good. I called the company and the sent out a new one, the tech said he has never heard of this happening before on any of the machines. Other wise I am pretty happy with the machine.

[reggeee]

hey Spirit.

yes, i did dismantle the motor while i was on the phone with the tech guy. no washer inside. but there was a big burn mark and a large pitted area in the middle of the winding casing. So there was some sort of short that caused the burn. I cleaned it up but it just sparked again and died. following Rmacks advice, i told them this morning i didn;t think i should have to wait and they should pull one off a new one and send it to me. They called me back and told me they did that today and it was on it's way!!!!! Ask and you shall receive.
I keep hearing about their customer service and now i'm experiencing it. thanks Rmack. i'll keep you posted. I haven't gotten a chance to check runout yet. did you just put a dial indicator to it to test it?

[rmack898]

Ya just got to squeak a little Reg ;)

[reggeee]

OK. Assuming i get my motor soon from smithy and actually get to use it for a while, i need someone to answer this question. every catalog and web site i look at has tons of collets for sale. I generally know what they do, but why are they so important to me while machining? My machine:confused: came with two drill chucks. one for the mill R8 and one for the tail stock R3. i realize someone who now owns a lathe probably shouldn't be asking this basic a question, but i also think the cart before the horse is a pretty exciting ride. Be nice!!

[rmack898]

Drill chucks are just that, a chuck designed to hold a drill, they do not have the grip or can they support the side loads associated with milling. A collet is designed to hold a specific size and has a much greater contact area than the 3 narrow grip points in a drill chuck. A basic collet set and about 3 different size end mill holders should do most everything you need to keep you busy for a while.

[reggeee]

Thanks again rmack. So collets are basically meant for milling? I got the shipping notice from smithy. UPS ground. it'll get here in 5 days. I guess i didn't squeak quite loud enough to get 2 day service.:)

[reggeee]

Finally got the new motor from Smithy last night. I was standing by all day with a wrench in my hand, but of course UPS whose delivery hours are 8am-7pm showed up at 7:05. The new motor went on without a hitch and it started up flawlessly. Here's a question. In the manual it says to turn the speed controller down to zero then turn it off. Then to restart it make sure the controller is at zero, start it up and then turn the speed controller up to your RPM. Is that the "law", or is it a precautionary measure by Smithy to protect our dumb asses from starting it up at full throttle and have something fly at us? Does turning the "volume" down to zero in between stops and starts protect me or the machine?
Well...... I guess it's time to start over and learn how to use this thing again which leads me to another question. Is there a proper or smart sequence to learn machining? I.E..... don't run before you can walk kinda progress i should be trying to follow? All Advice is welcome. The plus side of all the trouble i've had is I've learned how my machine works inside and out. And i've also had a lot of time to search ebay for my next lathe.:)

[smiller6912]

Here is a place to start: http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/videos/142-machine-shop-1

If possible, I would suggest a class at your local community collage or trade school. That is where I started.

I have, and like very much, the video series available from AGI: http://www.americangunsmith.com/allitems.php?page=9
Very informative step by step instructions.

They are VERY expensive to buy but I think that they are worth it. They are also available for rental at: http://smartflix.com/store/category/61/Professional

[Corm]

So collets are basically meant for milling?

No, that isn't totally true....

Collets are handy in a lathe if you have a lot of small stuff to turn. For example, if you find your self turning a lot of, say, 5/16" rod, using a 5/16" collet would work well. They hold real well, and take no time at all to set up the work in the collet. You could use collets for anything up the the max size available for the type of collet you use. A complete set of collets costs $$. Collets are very accurate.

You may find it less expensive to get your self a chuck, either a 3 jaw or a 4 jaw. A 3 jaw is typically a self centering scroll type chuck, and most are accurate to about .003, give or take a couple .001's. . A 4 jaw chuck usually requires one to adjust each jaw separately, but you can always make your stock concentric to .000 is you work at it a bit. They can also be used to hold something that isn't round, or can be used to hold a round object off-center. Either type of chuck will allow you to work on stuff that is much bigger than a collet would allow, up the the max swing of your lathe. Either type of chuck is much more versatile than a collet.

In a milling machine, collets are the universally accepted way to hold endmills. The only other way that I know of to hold an endmill satisfactorily is to use an endmill holder. They have their pro's and con's, but some folks like them a lot.

Hope this helps a bit

[reggeee]

Smiller....thanks so much for pointing me in the right direction. just watched the first one at MIT. Fantastic. really helped. The DVD's are expensive, but not as expensive as breaking my machine or hurting myself doing something dumb. They'll be a good xmas gift for myself. thanks again

[reggeee]

Thanks Corm. it makes perfect sense to me now. I will by a set of collets asap. Do they have lathe rehab anywhere so i can kick this expensive habit before it starts??:)

[Corm]

Do they have lathe rehab anywhere so i can kick this expensive habit before it starts??:)

Nope, too late for you now! You're hooked along with the rest of us!

[reggeee]

How deep of a cut can i expect to take in aluminium with a 1324 granite using an indexable tool? I've been taking .030 quite easily but i don't really know what i'm doing yet.

[HSS]

Depth of cut may not be constant on each Granite 1324 because your limiting factor will be the motor fuse located beneath the start/stop buttons. I machine mostly steel and take pretty aggressive cuts and have gone thru all the fuses sent with the machine. I had to go into town and buy another box of fuses Sunday. Each time I have blown a fuse, there was no fore warning from the motor, no change in sound, it just stopped running. Then I lighten up on the cut a little. I guess I might call that roughing rush.
Just a little advice, buy a box of spare fuses when you can.;)

[HSS]

Well, about to fry another fuse, however I did find out I'm not blowing fuses, I'm melting the durn things. The fuse holder gets so hot you can't hold on to it. I was turning a steel alignment bushing last night and smelled something burning and saw smoke coming out of the reverse switch cover. Shut it down until I get with Smithy. I bought a 20 amp circuit breaker to replace the fuse, but it is awfully tight in that control box. I may extend the fuse wires and mount a box for the breaker outside the control box. Oh well, I guess I'll stay in and watch tv tonite.
Pat

[reggeee]

hey Pat

i blew fuses at the beginning but it was because my motor was dying and i didn't know it. Now that smithy sent me a new motor, no problems. my circuit breaker in my shop is 20 amp.

[HSS]

Reg,
My motor and controller are fine but the fuse holder is so hot after just a little turning that you can't hold on to it. The last fuse I changed in it, had the solder melted out of the end of the fuse. I talked to Dave @ Smithy and he said I could replace the fuse with a circuit breaker of the same amp rating. The only problem with that is the space, where the fuse is now, is very cramped. I figure I might make a box for the breaker and place it over the existing fuse locaton and orient it so that the breaker is pointing up instead of out. We'll see....:rolleyes:
Pat

[HSS]

Well, I took off from work long enough this morning to remove the old fuse holder and install the circuit breaker. Turned some teflon to use as a bushing in the fuse holder hole so that the breaker would tighten up. Everything is working good so far. But then I haven't gone back to turning steel yet either. We'll see.....:)

[HSS]

Well, the breaker fixed the problem. Turning steel again with no problems. Now, if I can just stay off this computer long enough to get something done in the shop. Cold as a witches tit out there now. I think I'll stay in tonite.:D

[reggeee]

Hey There HSS. could you post some pics of your new breaker set up? I'd love to see how you did it. Just in case......

[HSS]

Reg, I took 2 pictures tonite of the breaker. One of the front of the breaker and one of the back. The back is covered by the power cords and can't see much. It's an easy conversion, just a tight location. The breaker had flag connections but I soldered them instead. I used a set of hemostats as a heat sink when soldering so that I wouldn't overheat the breaker.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii285/goochiepepper/P1010024Small.jpg
The picture below has a 1/2 inch tall black box above the cord on the right. That is the back of the breaker and it nearly touches the metal control cover on the back. I used the insulator off of the old fuse holder to put between the back of the breaker and the control cover.

Pat
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii285/goochiepepper/P1010023Small.jpg

[BMSS]

I am new here to this site, though I have had a Smithy 1340 for 4 years now. I am a retired toolmaker who is running a small machine shop business out of my garage. I bought the Smithy because I had heard a lot of good things about their quality.
I like my 1340, but in the first year of ownership, the original motor "fried". I contacted Smithy directly, and they were very helpful. They sent out a new motor and motor controller under warranty.
In the second, and third year of ownership, I have had one of it's two electrical brushes burn out. I replaced them on my own. Since then, I listen for a change in the motors sound, and if necessary, I will pull the motor and clean the brushes and the contacts on the armature.

I am curious if others have had these experiences, and if anyone has found any replacement motor other than "more of the same" from Smithy?

[torchroadster]

.
I like my 1340, but in the first year of ownership, the original motor "fried". I contacted Smithy directly, and they were very helpful. They sent out a new motor and motor controller under warranty.
In the second, and third year of ownership, I have had one of it's two electrical brushes burn out. I replaced them on my own. Since then, I listen for a change in the motors sound, and if necessary, I will pull the motor and clean the brushes and the contacts on the armature.

I am curious if others have had these experiences, and if anyone has found any replacement motor other than "more of the same" from Smithy?

The motor on my Granite 1340 fried last night. I went through the Smithy troubleshooting procedure and traced it to the motor not the controller. I called Smithy today, after ordering a new motor I asked them what might have caused this. I learned that the motor can overheat at low speeds. They told me the fan on the motor doesn't generate enough airflow to keep it cool when running slow. The cure is adding an external fan, possibly through a duct hose, and/or an idler pulley which is available as a kit or could be fabbed on your own. The idler pulley will help keep the speed up on the motor, although presumably with a reduction in top speed.

Tonight I took the motor off and disassembled the brushes. I found that the bottom brush and brush holder was badly overheated and charred. I cleaned it all up, put it back together and now the motor seems to run fine on the bench. I am going to try to catch the motor before it ships from Smithy and just get them to send new brushes and brush holder instead. Could be a reasonably inexpensive fix.

[BMSS]

The motor on my Granite 1340 fried last night. I went through the Smithy troubleshooting procedure and traced it to the motor not the controller. I called Smithy today, after ordering a new motor I asked them what might have caused this. I learned that the motor can overheat at low speeds. They told me the fan on the motor doesn't generate enough airflow to keep it cool when running slow. The cure is adding an external fan, possibly through a duct hose, and/or an idler pulley which is available as a kit or could be fabbed on your own. The idler pulley will help keep the speed up on the motor, although presumably with a reduction in top speed.

Tonight I took the motor off and disassembled the brushes. I found that the bottom brush and brush holder was badly overheated and charred. I cleaned it all up, put it back together and now the motor seems to run fine on the bench. I am going to try to catch the motor before it ships from Smithy and just get them to send new brushes and brush holder instead. Could be a reasonably inexpensive fix.
Yes I do agree with you about the overheating problem. One of the things I have done is to set my lathe up using the idler pulley, (or instead of using just the one long belt, I use the two belt set up, and reduce my output speed) This keeps the motor speeds high, though it really limits your top RPM when turning parts.
I like th idea of fabbing an additional fan motor to the back of the lathe motor to keep airflow high, and I will be working on that in the next week or two. Maybe if I get it working I can post a few pictures of the fix.

Thanks for the advice torchroadster