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View Full Version : Retired Inventor needs machining help



ted schorling
04-13-2006, 07:28 PM
I am looking for a machinist hobbyist who can help me to build some small
parts max. dia 1.4" in stainless for a new invention. Preferably in Southern California. I live in Orange County -Long Beach area. Some lathe work and some milling. You can call me at
(562)980-6897

SJorgensen
04-13-2006, 10:43 PM
Inventors don't retire, they just watch more TV.
Once an inventor, always an inventor.

How about introducing yourself and taking part in some discussions. I'm sure that some of us would enjoy hearing more about your needs. I have no doubt that many of us here could make your part for you, but most of us are busy on our own interests. Please don't expect people here to jump out to make you a custom part for free. And keep in mind this isn't a commercial site, it's more for hobby people (some of considerable experience.). You might have some luck with someone, and you might even get a part made for a fair fee, but I think you'll have to be much more interesting than you've been so far.

Evan
04-13-2006, 11:41 PM
What are you inventing (general terms should do)? There are people on the board that live in your vicinity but you need to make it interesting. Are you willing to pay for work? Also, isn't "new invention" somewhat redundant? :)

david_r
04-14-2006, 02:51 AM
Evan,
If he was willing to pay he'd be a business, not an inventor.

Sorry, couldn't resist the cheap shot. Come out and play. Let us know what you're working on.

IOWOLF
04-14-2006, 03:44 AM
WOW, and you guys think I am harsh. ;)

lynnl
04-14-2006, 05:37 AM
I agree Wolfie.

Where does everyone get the idea he wants it done for free? ..Huh?
It struck me simply as an initial 'feeler' posted to establish dialogue with someone, during which the particulars would be divulged.

Tho I will agree the term "retired inventor" raises some interesting questions. :D Maybe he meant he's retired from some other vocation and is now an inventor.

Alistair Hosie
04-14-2006, 05:43 AM
C'mon guys give the poor man a chance he's just introduced himself and he's already being taken apart thats unfair we never used to be like this don't lets start emulating other less sophisticated sites .Alistair

Evan
04-14-2006, 08:30 AM
I don't think we are being too harsh Alistair. As a sweeping generalization (usually true), private inventors are normally up against the wall for funds. It may be possible to interest someone to help with the work, even for "free", but it will take some more convincing. Also, there is no reason not to give some idea what is being worked on, such as "I am working on a better way to homogenize milk..." or some such. As well, if Ted is willing to pay for work he should say so. That will definitely attract more interest.

Your Old Dog
04-14-2006, 09:32 AM
WOW, and you guys think I am harsh. ;)

Must be the way I'm reading it too IO !! Me thinks there just giving him fair warning that a little more info might net him a differant response! But hey, it's early in the thread yet :D Wait til the rest of the crew smell the fresh blood !! It reads a little harsh but don't think it's meant too.....

JCHannum
04-14-2006, 09:56 AM
Yes, it is annoying when a newcomer, instead of being welcomed is criticized and possibly driven away.

Nowhere did he say he wanted anything for free, and it is plain rude to assume he is looking for a hand out. Since advertising is discouraged here, the lack of monetary discussion is not inappropriate.

If he has previous inventions to his credit, this would certainly be a new (to him) invention.

IOWOLF
04-14-2006, 11:42 AM
Ted, Email me, I am in Iowa but something can be worked out.

TECHSHOP
04-14-2006, 01:06 PM
The man said retired inventor, not unemployed inventor!

That would indicate a slight difference in the available amount of capital and experiance, no?

Herm Williams
04-14-2006, 01:47 PM
Hello
I have done a lot of prototype lathe and or mill one of a kind. Most of the time it takes a lot of time and mid fabrication changes that shops are not interested in. That being said some small parts are a natural for a screw machine or a cnc machine (BUT) it takes time to program a cnc or make cams for a screw machine. What I'm trying to get across if you make one part it may cost $100 or if you make thousands it may cost $1 each. I have a friend who forges an item, costs him from $700 to a $1000 to make one but for 10k the price is down to less than $1. This is a long and rambling reply but there would have to be more general info to make a reasonable guess on what the end price would be. Anyway I for one would be inerested in the final resolution of this problem. my two cents worth.
re

level head
04-14-2006, 02:16 PM
hey this question is for the inventor

-what inventions have u patent so far
i am really interested
thanks

Evan
04-14-2006, 03:15 PM
Since advertising is discouraged here, the lack of monetary discussion is not inappropriate.

There is a distinct difference between promoting your goods and hiring.

JCHannum
04-14-2006, 03:35 PM
There is a distinct difference between promoting your goods and hiring.

By leaving any mention of money out of the discussion, the poster very nicely eliminated any opportunity for a response which could have become advertising.

plastikosmd
04-14-2006, 04:21 PM
I'm not sure what all the whining about the need for a "full time moderator" was about. We seem too many already.

suprdvn
04-15-2006, 09:39 AM
He may be the type that throws out a request for help on his lame invention and wants us to help design it. He will get ten to twenty machine shops to quote on it. Each of those shops will pick the design appart and give suggestions. So he gets an hour of free engineering and cost estimation from each shop.

In the end he may never build more than one of his invention.

Sorry for being so pessimistic but I think that a lot of people think that they have this fabulous idea for a product, but by the time the product would be built the price would be higher than anyone would be willing to pay.

You've heard the adds "Do you have an invention or an idea to improve an existing product?" They pray on these people. Of course existing products can be improved! But would anyone buy it after the increase in price???

JCHannum
04-15-2006, 10:40 AM
What a thoughtful, considerate reply. It is comforting to know that so many members will go out of their way to ensure that newcomers with their lamebrain, panhandling ideas will stay away in droves.

It is ironic that a similar request on the PM site a few weeks ago got a similar response. The "experts" blew the guy away, criticizing everything including his website.

dsergison responded to him, and it appears he may have found a pretty lucrative sideline for his CNC mill.

I have gotten involved in similar projects from time to time and find they can be challenging and rewarding. The home shop is an ideal place to work on projects like this and develop ideas and creations. That is what many of us do for ourselves, and helping others with theirs can be just as enjoyable.

There is little to be lost in asking what is involved, the choice to pursue the project or not is yours.

gundog
04-15-2006, 01:06 PM
I am far from being a real machinist but I guess a hoby machinist might fit. If you were in my area I would try and help you out. Depending on how complicated the parts are and the level of accuracy needed. You need to be a little more detailed in the parts needed. For example I need some shafts with a certain counter bore a shoulder of x amount made from xy type material you don't have to explain your invention just a little more info.
GD

Millman
04-15-2006, 01:12 PM
JC, beat me to it. Excellent reply, maybe he will elaborate now.

suprdvn
04-15-2006, 05:08 PM
He got me thinking negatively when he called himself an inventor. That term probably works well for the ladies. There's a lot of people who work in product developement that don't go around calling themselves an inventor. Ted doesn't seem to be chatty so we don't have much to go on. I'm developing a product that I can make and sell but I would not consider myself an "inventor" unless it was sucessful in making me a ton of money.

So Ted, set me straight. Tell us about yourself. What products have you designed or helped design? We really would like to hear about them.

On edit:
I never intended my comments to be directed at you personally, Ted, rather what may be the case with some people some of the time.

MPHJUNKIE
04-15-2006, 08:29 PM
I am new to this forum but I have done my share of prototyping. Some have been patented and some didn't make it. In every case I have had to sing non-disclosures when I'm working on them. Which means I can not tell people what I'm working on, who it's for, How it works and so on. Don't take offence to the lack of information. It sounds to me like Ted is asking for some help with somehing he can't do himself. It can pay well for the time spent or you could always say no thankx. If he was close to me I'd look into it.

lane
04-15-2006, 10:02 PM
Dont be so hard on some one who maay need some help. Arent mostof us inventers in some sence of the word. YOU can`t be a machinist if youare not some kind of inventer. If I was not half way across the country I would offer my services.

J. Randall
04-16-2006, 12:05 AM
I mostly just read, and get a lot of enjoyment from this forum, but have to say a lot of your lame replys and second guessing probably drove this guy off. We will probably never know if he was legit, and he might well have been an asset to the forum. James

gmatov
04-16-2006, 03:53 AM
J.,

I'll second that. Rarely have I seen such antipathy toward a new poster, on any site I have been on. You should at least give him a hearing.

Some one of you, in his immediate neighborhood, or even farther afield, has just lost a chance at a commission. I would even say those who were antagonistic have probably lost any chance at a job from any other poster who wants someone to do a machining job for them. "Joe Blow? Nah, I saw how they treated old John when he asked for a machinist's help. I won't even consider that bigot. He considers anybody who can't do his own machining as beneath his contempt."

Hardly a way to build up a business, is it?

Cheers,

George

david_r
04-16-2006, 04:56 AM
Bunch of over-ripe tomatos around here.

JCHannum
04-16-2006, 07:53 AM
Hardly a way to build up a business, is it?

Cheers,
George

If the person who makes these kind of comments were the only one to suffer, it would be their misfortune.

When this type of comments are posted on a forum, we all end up painted with the same brush, and all forum members suffer for the actions of a few.

Evan
04-16-2006, 09:19 AM
Nonsense. First, if the somewhat sceptical tone of some of the replies is enough to put off someone who names themself an "inventor" then they don't have what it takes to see an invention through to a marketable product, not even close. Self proclaimed "Inventors" are a dime a dozen and the patent files are stuffed to overflowing with "inventions" that don't work, can't work and should never have been granted a patent.

If somebody is going to make a request as Ted has then it would be simple courtesy to indicate if he is looking for a partner or simply farming out some work. It would also be nice to be able to make a quick judgement as to what level of expertise is required and the amount of work involved. Were I him I would give at least some indication of that to avoid wasting other's and my own time.

trigger
04-16-2006, 10:10 AM
Unfortunately the treatment that Ted received from some of the members here seems to be common throughout this bulletin board. This is why I suspect lot of members either don't post anything or rarely do. Why would they want to put up with judgement from one of our resident blowhards when what they are really looking for is good advice?

topct
04-16-2006, 10:23 AM
Yes it makes it kinda scary for anyone to ask any kind of question here.

You could be torn to shreds by the so called intelectual snots I sometimes see responding.

Has anyone in his area bothered to even call the guy?

I guess I'm a little cranky this morning, sorry. :o

Wuzupup
04-16-2006, 12:01 PM
I have received the same treatment from PM and probably won't post there any more and it seems that it might be the same here.:mad: Ted probably won't be back with a posting but he is probably reading what is said and will look somewhere else for help. Ted don't get discouraged some one will want to get there hands dirty and not care how much you are willing to pay or not pay or what the invention is. Just my 2 cents T.

MikeHenry
04-16-2006, 01:18 PM
You could be torn to shreds by the so called intelectual snots I sometimes see responding.

It helps to develop a thick skin if you go looking for help on the Internet

IOWOLF
04-16-2006, 01:58 PM
It helps to develop a thick skin if you go looking for help on the Internet

Why should one have to?:confused:

Evan
04-16-2006, 06:12 PM
Precisely. If Ted is willing to pay for services instead of looking for some free machining I am sure there are plenty of shops listed in the Yellow Pages. The fact that he is asking here with such a paucity of details is bound to make some (including me) suspicious.

JCHannum
04-16-2006, 06:26 PM
Henry Ford had the same problem. After being rebuffed when asking for machining help on several websites, he resorted to making his first engine out of pipe fittings in a shed in his back yard.

"Screw 'em all," he was heard to say, "I'll just keep all the money for myself."

All those cheap panhandling, no talent inventors should be driven away. Guys like Henry Ford and the Wright brothers, Thomas Edison, John Browning, Eli Whitney, Googie Marconi, Robert Fulton and all the others. They are all a bunch of no account, lame brained dead beats. The world would sure be better off without the likes of them.

Millman
04-16-2006, 06:30 PM
Evan, what if he needs free machining? Just because you're suspicious; does that make him wrong to ask? Speaking of moderators=censorship=communism! That should ring a bell.

Evan
04-16-2006, 07:17 PM
He could also be a troll. How do we know? As I said, any inventor who is serious about an invention better be prepared to meet a good deal more skepticism and outright rejection than a lukewarm reception on an online forum of machinsts who are accustomed to "inventing" solutions to difficult problems as a matter of course.

Invoking the names of past great inventors (Edison excepted, he wasn't a very good inventor) is a lame tactic and has no relevance to this. That's a straw man argument. So Ted, are you reading this? If so, how about some clarification on what you are doing? I for one would be very interested.

JCHannum
04-16-2006, 09:16 PM
Ted asked a very plain question. He is looking for someone who might be willing to help him by doing some lathe and mill work on a piece of stainless steel with a max OD of 1.4". Anyone who cannot understand something worded that basically cannot have much on the ball to begin with.

He gave his location and phone number for anyone interested in responding and working out the details. That is not the work of a troll.

I see nothing to be suspicious of and nothing that would make anyone feel he might be forced to give anything of time or monetary value if they did not want to respond.

This board is about sharing ideas and other things related to machining. There are many posts of people sending material and tools to others. Several have visited other members who lived in their area to help them with setting up or learning how to operate their equipment. It is not a requisite to insult someone merely because he has the audacity to come here looking for some help.

I still maintain that those who have made the negative responses to Ted's request are rude and narrow minded, and are not helping in furthering the image of this forum.

Evan, I guess you do not understand sarcasm. My example is quite relevant and echoes your own statements. It points out the ignorance of those who feel they somehow improve their own image by denigrating others. How can you or anyone else pretend to know who today may become the equal of these great men?

MikeHenry
04-17-2006, 12:49 AM
Why should one have to?

There was supposed to be a bit more to my reply but it got lost in editing.

Basically, I meant that there always seem to be a few folks here just chomping at the bit to denigrate a poster (new or old) and it is easier to persevere to an answer if one can ignore those folks.

Evan
04-17-2006, 01:45 AM
"How can you or anyone else pretend to know who today may become the equal of these great men?"

How you can derive that conclusion from what I have said defies all logic.

BTW, the telephone number belongs to Verizon but is not assigned to any residential address according to Verizon. There are also exactly zero public records in the Long Beach area with the name Ted Schorling, T. Schorling or Theodore Schorling nor does it appear that a Ted Schorling has ever posted on any other forum anywhere.

It's very difficult to remain completely anonymous today, especially if you use the internet at all. For instance, you posted some years ago on the Smokstak forum about removing a stuck piston.

SJorgensen
04-17-2006, 02:28 AM
Great work Evan,

I'm all for giving a guy like Ted a chance, but we have to remember that we are a hobby group. Any new person, who won't introduce themselves and won't get involved in any form of general discussion, should be viewed with some skepticism. If they visit just to have some person here work for them at below market rate on something that they hope to profit in, I think that is commercial activity and outside the scope of the site. Ted might be a great guy, how can we know. He can hire someone to cut the part that he needs in Newport Beach. I'm somewhat of an inventor myself and there is so much to know about materials, tolerances, lubrication, temperature effects and on and on, that a person who does all the work to make an idea successful should probably have a contractual relationship with the inventor. Even at the end of all that work in getting something to function as the inventor imagines it, there are still dozens of reasons it will fail in the market place, or even be successful for someone else. Ted got a lot of responses to his inquiry here. He should be very happy with that and that so many are willing to help him.

I agree with everything Evan has said.

Spence

Peter N
04-17-2006, 03:24 AM
I'm somewhat of an inventor myself and there is so much to know about materials, tolerances, lubrication, temperature effects and on and on, that a person who does all the work to make an idea successful should probably have a contractual relationship with the inventor.

I'd agree with that. It has been my experience that most 'inventions' end up as a triumph of development over design. I have a couple of patents myself that are assigned to and make money for others. (US5599314 & WO9404272)

My approach now is to either obtain a fair fee up front for the work, or take a modest intial fee backed up with a royalty agreement. The only caveat here (and in general) is that for those with a modest financial backing we should not let an over-commercial approach stifle a good product idea in the early stages

Peter

JCHannum
04-17-2006, 07:33 AM
"How can you or anyone else pretend to know who today may become the equal of these great men?"

How you can derive that conclusion from what I have said defies all logic.


How about; "Self proclaimed "Inventors" are a dime a dozen and the patent files are stuffed to overflowing with "inventions" that don't work, can't work and should never have been granted a patent."

Every one of the people mentioned were no different than any other "self proclaimed inventor" until they became successful. Then they became geniuses. Most had many unsuccessful inventions and/or patents to their name, but are remembered for their successes.

The question of patents and inventors is secondary. The issue is that it seems to becoming more and more the norm to greet new posters with something less than enthusiasm, and this is a shame. J Tiers posted a couple of weeks ago questioning whether the board should be shut down. Many responded that it should not, but being offensive and unwelcoming to new members is the surest method there is of making this a closed club and driving contributors away.

I have no idea what you hope to prove by snooping about my presence on the internet. Any 12 year old can come up with that information and more I am sure.

My first post on Smokstak on removing a stuck piston and my first post here on the use of a T&C grinder were both met with helpful and considerate replies. I gave no more information about myself other than that I needed some help & advice. No one questioned my credentials or intentions, and all responders gave me good information. This is the experience everyone should be entitled to.

Millman
04-17-2006, 07:58 AM
Agreed, Didn't someone also snoop and publish D. Thomas' tax and real estate info, not long ago? That's pretty lowlife any way you look at it.

Evan
04-17-2006, 11:01 AM
Agreed, Didn't someone also snoop and publish D. Thomas' tax and real estate info, not long ago? That's pretty lowlife any way you look at it.

Well, that wasn't me and I would not and did not do that. That's another strawman argument since that also has no relevance. JC is being deliberately obtuse. As I said it is virtually impossible to frequent the internet without leaving a trail. I simply demonstrated that without revealing any significant information.

As for the charge of "snooping" it is hardly snooping when you read public information freely given by you and posted in public.



Any 12 year old can come up with that information and more I am sure.

Exactly, but not on Ted Schorling.



How about; "Self proclaimed "Inventors" are a dime a dozen and the patent files are stuffed to overflowing with "inventions" that don't work, can't work and should never have been granted a patent."

That comment is the simple truth. If you disagree with it then attempt to refute it. Please stick to the point though.

JCHannum
04-17-2006, 11:31 AM
Evan, your comment was your opinion.

By objecting to your web search, I am not being obtuse. I am merely stating the fact that what & where I may have posted has nothing to do with the discussion. Actually, it helps my argument by pointing out how new members are treated by other forums.

As I stated, the question of patents and inventors is secondary and needs no more discussion here. The point, which you need to be reminded of, has nothing to do with that. It is that posting negative and insulting replies to new members is not helping the forum grow, but it is discouraging any who feel their questions or comments might earn a similar response. That is a shame and is not the intention or goal of this forum.

If you feel this is not the case look back at some of the responses to this thread. I correspond by e-mail with several people. Some are members, but contribute infrequently, some are non members. Several have said that they don't participate in the forum because of the negativity expressed by a few.

If you take a look at the user count at the bottom of the opening page, the ratio of visitors to members is usually two or three to one. I am sure some of the visitors are just passing through, but I am equally sure that more than a few of them would like to ask a question or share in the forum but are put off by thoughts of having one of the resident "experts" accuse them of of being a troll,or having a lame idea.

IOWOLF
04-17-2006, 11:35 AM
You know up untill a couple of years ago we all got along here,can we or will we ever get back to that?

Evan
04-17-2006, 11:43 AM
By objecting to your web search, I am not being obtuse. I am merely stating the fact that what & where I may have posted has nothing to do with the discussion.

It has everthing to do with my point that when you use the internet you tend to leave a trail. Ted Schorling hasn't, except in a single post here. It is entirely relevant to this discussion. It is likely that Ted Schorling is not the poster's real name.

Evan
04-17-2006, 11:48 AM
Evan, your comment was your opinion.


No, it isn't. A quick perusal of the patent office records will verify that.

ted schorling
04-17-2006, 01:42 PM
Hi everybody I was amazed at the response I got to my "humble" inquiry.-
I was a mechanical design engineer for 40 years and as a retiree 70 years old,
I have limited funds to spend on new ideas. But this is not the real reason I wanted to contact somebody with a home shop. I shurely went to several machine shops here in the area (Southern California) and the shops are very busy... they gave me 6 weeks until they could start on something new and one shop told me that "him touching the Cnc would be $500.-, just like that",
so I got tired of those primadonnas, besides they dont wont to make prototypes and dont want to deal with small quantities. I need somebody with patient and where you can get intelligent feedback not to invent.... or come up with new ideas as somebody mentioned - but where you can cooperate and communicate - and that is why I thought about home machinists. I am not saying that there is no compensation and its not absolutely necessary to live here in California.
So -- I am not a mystery man, or Gnome, or mizer, or conceited, or taking advantage of somebody, or weirdo....
I just wanted to find somebody to communicate with and maybe develop something.....
I apologize not responding immediate as I came back from a trip over easter.
Anybody interested can call me or email me and leave me his phone numer and I will call back.
Hope you all had a nice Easter.
Ted Schorling
email address: detscho12@yahoo.com
phone 562-980-6897

IOWOLF
04-17-2006, 01:47 PM
Well that answers a few questions for the Holyer than Thou folks here.
Of course some will never be satisfied.

Evan
04-17-2006, 01:53 PM
Thanks for the reply Ted. Is it possible to give some more information on just what you need made?

JCHannum
04-17-2006, 01:57 PM
Ted; It is a pleasure to hear from you. I apologize for some of the less than tolerant members here. Most of us enjoy a challenge and a new face.

Aside from what help we may be able to offer you, I am sure a person with your experience and background will be an asset to the board. We look forward to hearing more from you.

plastikosmd
04-17-2006, 02:13 PM
welcome back ted! love to help you if i were a bit closer.

And as a question to the group, ...The what is the point of researching a guy on the net, arguing about his real name, looking for his last completed tax record, maybe his property values, motives of posting, qualify him as an inventor, berate the term inventor, demonstrate yours than ask him for his previoius patents, or inventions, assume his method of payment for future work that you, yourself are never going to do, etc when he LEAVES HIS PHONE NUMBER in his first post? probably sitting right next to the computer you are typing on is a phone that you could just dial and talk to him, if you really cared. maybe i'm wrong...dunno

SJorgensen
04-17-2006, 03:04 PM
The simple answer is to quickly find out if it is "legit." Ted did exactly what he should have done in his first post. That is just a little conversation to let us get to know him a little. Of course many people aren't very use to the etiquete of a forum but it isn't much different from other forms of interaction. I'm excited to know more about Ted. In my opinion we can't have too many Mechanical Engineers in our group, especially experienced ones. If we can make him feel welcome here, I'm sure we can all benefit from his input. I'm sure everyone feels the same way about that.

One thing in defence of initial scepticism on the internet; you know that "Supermodel" that you met in a chat room? She isn't likely 5' 6" and 100lbs. More likely, 5' 2" and 350lbs and with extra bits and a hair problem. "Not that there is anything wrong with that."

Spence

Mcgyver
04-17-2006, 03:10 PM
Ted, good thing you came back....this might have gone on for decades, with never another thing being built in a home shop :D welcome to the board