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View Full Version : Another lurker down, Capain!



Scatterplot
05-10-2006, 06:21 PM
EDIT- OK so I misspelled 'captain'- oops


Well OK I'm only a semi-lurker, since I have posted stuff, but never of anything I've worked on myself, only text posts. So I finally completed my first welding project last night, and wanted to put it up. I KNOW the welds are HORRIBLE, but they seem to hold OK, but I wanted to post here and maybe get some hints. I'm working with a cheapo HF 110 flux cored (gas capable) so that's one reason they look so bad. (Oh and please don't just say to buy another welder, I'm poor :)). What it is is a benchtop grinder stand that I got a long time ago, before my current grinder. This one is used for little stuff like wire wheels, buffing, and my brother's occasional use of an old wheel to shape some thin plexiglas :eek: . That's why it doesn't need any work stands and why it will be kinda awkward to get to. It's gonna sit right behind the good grinder on this little stand, but up higher so it's easy to reach. One other thing, both me and my brother are like 6'4" or so so reach isn't a problem. Anyway, onto the pics-

Here's a link to Photobucket with 5 pics. Forgive the messiness behind the stuff. Couple general shots, a couple showing the welds and the general construction. One showed a weld I'm a little more proud of.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/th_P1280144.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/P1280144.jpg)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/th_P1280145.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/P1280145.jpg)





Oh yeah, one more thing- made it out of 1"x1/8" steel bars, hence the welds along all the angles. More of an exercise in welding than a need for a stand, although both got done.

Scatterplot
05-10-2006, 06:22 PM
Oops, pic space limited- here's the rest-
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/th_P1280146.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/P1280146.jpg)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/th_P1280147.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/P1280147.jpg)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/th_P1280148.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/bertmcmahan/Grinder%20Stand/P1280148.jpg)

spkrman15
05-10-2006, 06:35 PM
Hey Scatterplot,

those are not that bad. Practice makes perfect. As far as hints go.

1)You will see a major improvement if you switch to the gas. It will weld thinner metal and give you less splatter.

2)You can leave a gap, approximately the thickness of your metal, i usually do ½ of the thickness, so your weld is not trying to burn through the metal but rather fusing with the edges of the metal, giving you better penetration.

3)Preparation. Get ride of any paint or oil on your metal. Migs do not like any contaminents.

4)A guy who worked for me and is now a welder by trade, told me to weld forward when using a mig. I.E. you are always pushing the gun forward with the weld exiting the back of your hand. Basically the oposite of Arc. Personally i find both ways have their advantages. I usually weld forward though.

5)A good grinder can make some crappy welds look great!!!! Trust me!!! ;)

Rob :)

pcarpenter
05-10-2006, 06:38 PM
Don't apologize for the welder....it will probably work fine if you get rid of that (*&%4 flux core wire. I have a Millermatic 175 and started out with the partial spool of flux core that came with it. At the very best, it is spatter central. I also never got it to produce neat welds. Tried some other flux core wire and still not good results. I consider this to be second rate even compared to stick welding.

I finally bought a regulator, some CO2/argon mix, a spool of .030 wire (number escapes me), switched polarity and never looked back. It makes nice welds now if I get the wire feed(current) and voltage tap set for the appropriate material. The chart is just a starting point.

I have heard that you can use the flux core wire with gas and get somewhat better results. I don't know what polarity you use then, though as flux core wire is usually used with polarity that is the opposite of solid wire with gas flux. There is no good reason to do this once you have gas as the solid wire is much cheaper than the flux core stuff, but I have 30# of the flux core stuff to use up :(

Congrats on your project!
Paul

TECHSHOP
05-10-2006, 07:08 PM
Scatterplot:

I too am poor, and got more that way when I bought my 110V Lincoln MIG, but my welds don't look any better than yours, must be our machines, no?

torker
05-10-2006, 07:54 PM
Scatterplot...Don't feel bad about those welds. The ones I could see look fine. That little flux core wire IS hard to weld with. Using lots of preheat helps a lot. And you will get spatter with it.
Sometimes I HAVE to run T-11 on real dirty jobs outside in the wind. Usually 1/16" or 3/32" wire. It's gawdawfull crap to weld with. I hate it.
Just remember not to weave too wide with it and if you are making multi pass welds, clean the previous bead well before going to the next.
Russ

Scatterplot
05-10-2006, 08:32 PM
Wow, thanks for the positive input guys. I'm looking at buying some gas real soon, cause I know it will make the welds look infinitely better. Torker, one question- what is T-11? I would assume a type of flux-core, but not real up to date on what it is exactly.

Also, when I switch to gas, what wire should I get? Just a standard purpose MIG wire would suit my needs.

torker
05-10-2006, 08:54 PM
Scatterplot...T-11 is probably what you are using or close to it. We use it in heavy industry when mig or dual shield won't work and where stick would be too slow.
The T-11 3/32" wire running at 30+ volts is nasty stuff. Big fireballs come off it and will burn right through your heavy gloves.
Get yourself some 0.030 S-6 wire and a bottle of C-25 gas. You'll love it.

charlie coghill
05-10-2006, 08:58 PM
Not bad at all. I have used flux core one time and that was a 120 volt machine running off a generator. It worked of for the job but would not want to make a habit of it.

lane
05-10-2006, 09:54 PM
Dont feel so bad .That look`s as good as mine an I use GAS with a lincoln sp 100 I do know practice makes perfect.

Fasttrack
05-10-2006, 10:42 PM
Lookin' good - try pushing the gun forward as sprkman noted. It will provide a little better penetration and help your bead lie down a little better. Plus you can weld slightly dirtier material this way. Still make sure the material is as clean as you can get, turn up the heat and get a nice fluid bead. Then start weaving back and forth a little or leafing the bead. You can also do the forehand movement when stick welding. You need a rather shallow angle to prevent burn through. This method is effective with 6011 rods and very dirty material. This is also the principle in pipe welding - for good penetration you actually start at the base of the pipe and work your way upward with the rod "pushing" into the puddle. Thats the one method of stick welding i still havent gotten down - pipe going the other way and all other posistions no problem but working bottom up on pipe, even with a 6011 is tough. The advantage to using backhand, which i think is the direction you were going, on a mig is that it is easy to get a continous bead and you can move much faster but the penetration is sacraficed.

torker
05-11-2006, 12:14 AM
Ummm.... a little bit of misinformation here.
Now your in my house :D
Most reputable welding schools teach you to "pull" your mig gun instead of pushing it.
The reason is, you get better penetration if it is done correctly.
Some fab shops I work in will fire you if they catch you pushing a weld.
Lots of repair proceedures from heavy equipment mfg's specifically caution against pushing welds with wire.
For light guage material it's not a huge deal but for heavier weldments you are better off to pull the weld.
Most people don't like to weld backhand because it's too hard to see where you are going.

The pipe welding one...
For a beginner to run a root pass, you need a perfect fitup and a perfect land size. That is the biggest thing. It can make a pass or a failure.
I always use 6010 for pipe root and hot. It's DC only.
I don't like running roots with 6011. It's an AC/DC rod but I find it has a funny arc...mainly because the flux contains properties that produce gas to help stabilize the AC arc.
6010 is for pipe...up here any place that works with pipe calls for it. I find it digs a bit harder, especially the red flux rods and it freezes a bit quicker than 6011.
Welding a perfect root pass takes a lot of practice. It should look like a half of a smooth rope from the inside when done.
A thousand feet of running pipe root will get you practiced up.
After that you'll "hear the jet" and can almost run a root with your eyes closed.
Most beginners whip the rod too far ahead on pipe and heat the metal up in front of the bead too much. This causes root land burnout and drop though on the hot pass.
You can use a very small weave, small circles or a J-hook to run the 6010 into the hotpass groove.
Russ

Scatterplot
05-11-2006, 02:42 AM
Wow, last post was a little over my head, but I think I got it. The method I used was to do it from left to right, and I'm right handed, so I guess I'm pulling the weld. Like I was writing a little line of squiggles across a page with my right hand.

torker
05-11-2006, 09:07 AM
Wow, last post was a little over my head, but I think I got it. The method I used was to do it from left to right, and I'm right handed, so I guess I'm pulling the weld. Like I was writing a little line of squiggles across a page with my right hand.
You got it figured! As with any welding...watch the sqiggles. Any movement of the tip (or rod) has to be smooth. Always pause on the sides to properly fill in the edges. The pause is sometimes only a millisecond but you do need it.
If you whip it too fast the puddle gets sucked back into the bead and can cause undercut.
Russ

Wirecutter
05-12-2006, 01:04 PM
Thanks for the info on pushing vs pulling. I've also noticed that I can sometimes get welds to look better by "pushing", but it's a PITA for the obvious reason - you can't see where you're going. It's like writing right-to-left when you're left handed.

I used to sometimes try to MIG in little circles, but that's usually a disaster. I do the little sawtooth pattern or zig-zag, in pulling mode, and that seems to give good results. I never thought about the little pause when you change directions, but you're absolutely right about that one, Torker. Big difference. And unless I'm working with lighter or thinner materials, I seem to get the best results by initially turning the machine up too hot (burning through) and then backing off just a bit. I'm not a great welder, so I always set the machine up using sample parts similar to the real victims first.

Oh, and the grinder is always handy when I'm welding. I only have one right now, and I'm getting pretty good at swapping the disks out for different tasks, be it cutting welds out, correcting screwups, or making a pretty finish. If I want it strong, I generally care a bit less about making it pretty, of course.