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View Full Version : O.T. Intelligent Dog (help)



A.K. Boomer
06-27-2007, 09:26 AM
I know this is way off topic but you can only find so much info on google,
It appears that Iv got a pretty intelligent dog after all,
Luka has learned how to open doors, not just any doors, doors that are pull type and go from the basement to the upstairs, This means she has to be standing upright on the stairs and then has to keep BOTH front feet off the door and off to the side in a little 4" corner so she doesnt load the door with her own weight, then she either backs up or uses her neck muscles WHILE TURNING the porcelin door handle with her teeth (evidence of snout gunge just above door handle)

She is doing this while im away, and she is doing this because she is afraid of two things this time of the year, thunder and firecracker noise, she starts panting even though it can be raining and nice and cool, its like a panic attack, I tried latching the door from my side and she starts chewing up the wood and paint, She works her way into the wood that is part of the door holding mechanism to the point of getting into nails, then gets bloody and smears it all over the white door, i opened it up one time and it looked like a horror movie down there, I dont want to be mean to her but she's testing my patience, If I build a partition she will just take the distruction to that part of the basement, but it will at least be better because its less finished down there... still it wont cure her trauma...
both my girls have a pet door in the basement, they have a nice yard to play in and can chill in the basement, yet iv been coming home to find Luka inside the house and sometimes all wet and in my bed, Now that she know's she can do this she wont quit, So I tried the tuff-luv thing, Iv set little mouse traps all around the door, It drastically slowed her down but now she's plowing right through them --- what the hell can I do, A friend says fight fire with fire and attach those little Pull type "poppers" to the mouse traps, But that would probably hurt her ears and give her a heart attack at the same time, She's a sweet girl ------- what to do?

Dawai
06-27-2007, 09:47 AM
I was once drinking beer on my lunch break, a fitter asked me how to stop his dog from barking all night. Laughing, I suggested he shock therapy the dog, hook a 120 volt cord up to the dogs chain. (I was about 18 then) THE boob did it, and left the 120 cord plugged in all night long, and then was mad at me when his dog was dead. Some people should not reproduce. That guy has children.

Shock collars do not work on stubborn pitt bulldogs. Spray bottles full of water do thou. Funny you can hurt thier feelings more than thier hide.

Learned Bad behavior is very hard to stop. I have been trying to stop this pup from jumping his 100lbs onto me, or crawling up on my chest while I am sleeping.. He makes my wife cry he is so heavy and left bruise paw prints on her. He is still a lap dog too. A whole lap full. He is so spoiled he may never get over it. Recently he has stopped eating all dog foods, only human food will do.. he can go days with dog food in the bowl (tough love)

dan s
06-27-2007, 10:01 AM
pick up a bottle of sour apple, and spray it on the nob. Dogs hate the taste.

tattoomike68
06-27-2007, 10:02 AM
Wow, I thought I was the only one with a door opening dog. mines a 9 month old brindle pitbull mix.

Now if she is a smart girl you should be able to point at the damage and scold her with a loud "NO" (she knows)

Dave is right,
Funny you can hurt thier feelings more than thier hide.


As far as the door you might add a simple sliding pin type latch to the door.

Rusty Marlin
06-27-2007, 10:08 AM
First you need to break him of beign afraid of loud noises.

I had a hunting dog that during training went gun shy on me.... some hunting dog hu?

The cure, I took him to the local trap range and tied him to the trailer hitch about 100-150 feet behind the firing line, far enough that ear protection isn't needed but close enough that its noisey and he was very unhappy. Then I went and shot a couple of rounds of trap. The first round was BAD, by the end of the second he was curled up under the bumper to get out of the sun, but still nervous, and by the third he was napping. After that he was ready to go hunting and gunshots didn't phase him in the least.

Basically what your dog needs to learn is the loud noises aren't going to hurt him. Anything that scares him then hurts him he will be afraid of forever.

Don't use Poppers, these will scare him and hurt his ears and will make the problem worse.

malbenbut
06-27-2007, 10:09 AM
I had a dog once I was training him not to eat, just when I had him trained he went and died.
MBB

Dawai
06-27-2007, 10:11 AM
Yeah, I forgot about Butch pulling all the insulation off the outdoor spickots.

I used a habanero pepper sauce I could not eat.. I painted all the insulation with it and BUTCH left it alone.

He damn near pulled all the plumbing from under the house before.

A.K. Boomer
06-27-2007, 10:12 AM
Mike68, Luka is a 9 year old brindle pittbull mix (small world)!

I already tried latching from my side (the house side) ----- if i try to close her out she chews up the door and stuff, She knows she's done wrong the second i come home, she feels guilty as hell --- this is a stronger instinct to her than "doing the right thing" so it doesnt matter, it will happen again and again, I think I may have something to try, She gets upstairs to seek comfort, ever since she was a pup she would gather up my dirty clothes into a pile to sleep on them, they have carpet in the basement but im going to build them a little "duplex" --- I will work out in the sun all day with old clothes and then line the duplex with them, Its worth a try...

topct
06-27-2007, 10:21 AM
Mike68, Luka is a 9 year old brindle pittbull mix (small world)!

I already tried latching from my side (the house side) ----- if i try to close her out she chews up the door and stuff, She knows she's done wrong the second i come home, she feels guilty as hell --- this is a stronger instinct to her than "doing the right thing" so it doesnt matter, it will happen again and again, I think I may have something to try, She gets upstairs to seek comfort, ever since she was a pup she would gather up my dirty clothes into a pile to sleep on them, they have carpet in the basement but im going to build them a little "duplex" --- I will work out in the sun all day with old clothes and then line the duplex with them, Its worth a try...

You might have something there. Check item #4

http://www.bcrescue.org/barking.html

Evan
06-27-2007, 10:23 AM
Play the 1812 Overture loud every day.

Seriously, Rusty is correct. You can't punish a dog out of a bad habit. You need to change the dog's association of loud noise = bad thing. A little conditioning can go a long way. Buy an environmental sounds recording that includes a thunderstorm and start it off low in the background while giving attention and feeding a treat. Use the thunderstorm recording as the attention time/treats signal by playing it for a few minutes in advance. Gradually turn up the volume after several days and keep it there for a few days more, then turn it up a bit more.

If a real thunderstorm should happen use it the same way, as a signal for play/treat time. In a few weeks the dog will have a new association of thunder=good thing.

Scatterplot
06-27-2007, 10:56 AM
Recently he has stopped eating all dog foods, only human food will do.. he can go days with dog food in the bowl (tough love)

I've always had the philosophy that when he gets hungry enough, he'll eat anything.

Although my girlfriend gave me a good suggestion- get some boullion (sp?) cubes and melt one in some warm water, then pour it over the dry dogfood. Cheap way to get them to eat it!

dewat
06-27-2007, 12:14 PM
It could be what you're feeding your dog, yes they will eat anything, but like with humans just because its called food doesn't mean that it is.

Food Intolerance in Animals and Man

http://dogtorj.tripod.com/id1.html

J Tiers
06-27-2007, 12:22 PM
Animals are funny in associations of taste, smell etc with good and bad things. That's how they survive in the wild...... "that smell means a bear"........ "That taste made me sick once"


We have a cat who now needs thyroid stuff.... got really skinny. He LOVES tuna oil, which we rarely have. He'll basically break down doors to get it, or try to.

But, I once tried mixing the thyroid stuff, which is in oil, with tuna oil to get him to eat it without a hassle. No-go.... wouldn't eat it.

But the funny thing is now he WILL NOT TRY any tuna oil, unless there is an obvious can being opened, so he knows its fresh and not "contaminated".

Dawai
06-27-2007, 12:23 PM
Personally? I think since the dog watches the evening news with me, He knows about the dog food scare recently and stays clear of it. He is a very intelligent dog that makes choices of his own.

Alpo, meat chunks.. sausage gravy poured over it, no help, cheese worked for a day or two, then he just turns his nose up. A plain pringles potato chip he "piiitoo uies" out onto the floor, he prefers doritos cheese flavor. His dog "dry food" he will eat as long as you pitch it to him one piece at a time. My elbow will never be the same again. It can lay in the dish for days.

He is spoiled. I got a daughter just about like him. She picks at her plate of food then demands treats later. I was hungry as a kid, I ate everything, squirrel brains with eggs, squirrel dumplings, yard salad, polk salad, black berries, pine cone soup and numerous other things you would not approve of. I am a excellent shot because I learned not to waste meat.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/LexDavid12-06.jpg
Looks pretty darned spoiled to me..
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/DSCN0065.jpg
Trying to eat a cup of Yogurt, mobbed by the cat, then the dog for a taste.

Your Old Dog
06-27-2007, 02:01 PM
If my old bird dog (yellow lab) would have been that afraid of lightening I'd have put in an automatic door for him. Much too good of a friend to keep him from his goal when he's scared. Mine (earlier black lab) used to shovel the shoes out of the closet when a storm came. What I wouldn't give to be able to pick up after him again.

Evan
06-27-2007, 02:40 PM
My Beardog ignores lightning/thunder although she was once startled by a very close strike that really rattled the windows. Any loud noise that resembles a gunshot is her favorite sound and she goes hyper trying to find out who is hunting and what it is. Even a gunshot on TV has fooled her once or twice. Wife goes hunting squirrels and when Beardog hears the pistol go pop she goes crazy. Wife is a good shot too and Lika knows it. Lika will crouch down and hold perfectly still so you can take a shot off her back as a rest, good as any sandbag until you fire. Then she leaps up to see if you got it.

The 180 lb Giant Alaskan Malamute is a different story. He can hear a thunder storm an hour before we can. He hates thunder and starts to whine and complain under his breath. He can't bark, doesn't know how, but makes a variety of sounds that closely resemble a wookie on Star Trek. The closer the storm comes the more pitiful he sounds as he hides in his dog house. He is nothing but a 180 lb marshmallow, not a mean bone in his body.

Joel
06-27-2007, 03:40 PM
A Wookie on Star Trek? It has been awhile since you've seen Star Trek or Star Wars. ;)

Lee in Texas
06-27-2007, 04:01 PM
Sorta off-topic as far as the OP is concerned...I make liver gravy to put over Lady's food. It's really simple. Just boil a small tub of chicken livers in 2 cups of water, then pour the whole pan into a blender after it cools down a bit. Add a little corn starch to thicken it up. The little tubs of liver go for 99cents to $1.30 or so.

I put two tablespoons over her dry food and she just loves it. I also give her the occasional egg and can of tuna. She has the most beautiful, shiny coat. Strangers compliment her on that.

Evan
06-27-2007, 05:00 PM
A Wookie on Star Trek?

Yeah, I tend to mix the two names up quite often. I liked both. Stargate too, especially the movie. Also Alias and Nikita until she cut her hair. :(

I don't watch movies or TV anymore. Not interesting and I have other things to do.

topct
06-27-2007, 05:21 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/DSCN0065.jpg

:D:D:D

speedy
06-27-2007, 06:57 PM
Personally? I think since the dog watches the evening news with me, He knows about the dog food scare recently and stays clear of it. He is a very intelligent dog that makes choices of his own.

Alpo, meat chunks.. sausage gravy poured over it, no help, cheese worked for a day or two, then he just turns his nose up. A plain pringles potato chip he "piiitoo uies" out onto the floor, he prefers doritos cheese flavor. His dog "dry food" he will eat as long as you pitch it to him one piece at a time. My elbow will never be the same again. It can lay in the dish for days.

He is spoiled. I got a daughter just about like him. She picks at her plate of food then demands treats later. I was hungry as a kid, I ate everything, squirrel brains with eggs, squirrel dumplings, yard salad, polk salad, black berries, pine cone soup and numerous other things you would not approve of. I am a excellent shot because I learned not to waste meat.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/LexDavid12-06.jpgLooks pretty darned spoiled to me..

Not cold enough. Just a One dog night:D

madman
06-27-2007, 07:16 PM
Really ? You ate Squirrel Brains with Eggs???

jacampb2
06-27-2007, 07:52 PM
Just a suggestion, and maybe mentioned earlier, I just skimmed the thread. But, why not get your dog a crate, cover the top of it w/ rugs so it is nice and dark, leave the front door to it uncovered so she can see.

Dogs are naturaly den animals. It seems cruel to put them in a crate while you are away, but my 5 yr old dane will happily sleep in here 4x3x3 crate the whole time I have to leave her. Granted, she doesn't spend very much time at all in it, typically she goes with me, or is out in the house with us. She is a very protective dog, and while out in the house she will aggresively gaurd her territory against and squeak, creak or loud noise, but if we put her in her crate, even if we are home, we never hear a peep out of her. She feels safe there.

Later,
Jason

A.K. Boomer
06-28-2007, 09:00 AM
Jason, Thats why im kinda thinking of building the girls thier little duplex, I was going to have them stacked so one is more secluded, with my stinky clothes in there it might give her that safe haven she's trying to find up-stairs, you cant underestimate the den animal thing as its hard wired into them --- but damn, they already got a full basement - perhaps too big to give them that "den feeling",
I think getting them used to loud sounds also makes allot of sense and is actually an even more basic solution, Its a tough act to sell right now because of this time of year (the fourth) people are already popping crackers off and every other day we have an afternoon thunderstorm threaten the area (actually very nice for the greenery),,, either way --- this boards sugestions are a wise aproach instead of blaming the dog, I have to admit that my first knee jerk reaction is to "force change" A few futile attempts and i realize now that the pendulum will never swing in that direction, About two weeks ago I spent a thunderstorm in the basement with her, just calming her down, she went from a full panic attack to sleeping though it just because I was sitting next to her, thats when I knew it wasnt her fault...

I thought of coating the door handle with something un-palatable but I have to use it all the time and I think she would focus on other area's to tear up if she cant use the handle, plus it would do nothing for her comfort through all this, Its really a pathetic site to see her going through so much trauma, she is my one dog that really has her act together and could be dropped off anywhere and make it on her own, She's a pound puppy, when I got her she was only an est. couple months old, they said at the pound that they picked her up off the street --- she was making a stand against two adult dogs over a bag of garbage...

platypus2020
06-28-2007, 09:54 AM
I have 2 Akita/Spitz mix dogs, a male (2yrs) and a female (5yrs), and both are crate trained, most of the time we don't even shut the doors, they spend all night and a large part of the day in the crates, by their own choice. The crates are side by side and covered. The German Shepard, I had was very destructive, and we started the use of a crate. As I'm writing this both are asleep in their "houses". Neither dog is what I would consider "highly intelligent", but are very good natured, non- destructive and great with the grandkids.

Jack

Dawai
06-28-2007, 10:08 AM
Highly intelligent dogs, if you don't mess with them a long time each day, they are like a kid that has been neglected. Never reaching thier full potential.

My dog, I thought he was a rocket scientist.. really.. Then the other night, My wife (mama) was sitting on the couch, I looked at Lex and told him.. Mama's home.. he shot out the dog door, ran to the fence looking for the Honda to pull in the driveway. It was sitting there already, he looked really confused..

Evan
06-28-2007, 12:13 PM
Our Beardog has a kennel crate in the mud room. That is her safe place. She will never be reprimanded or scolded when in there. We don't punish our dogs physically with the sole exception of aversion conditioning for doing something dangerous, to them or others. They are spoken to, sometimes sternly, for making a mistake or failing to follow instructions. This is very effective with the Beardog. She has been snapped on the nose with a lightly rolled newspaper twice in her life and both times she sulked in her crate until the next day.

She knows when she has misbehaved, such as barking when she promised not to. She then will come inside when called and on her own go to her crate for a while to punish herself. During the day if she is home with me she will often sleep in the crate rather than in the rest of the house.

The key to using a kennel crate is that the dog be absolutely assured that it is their safe place. They should never be physically removed from the crate or otherwise threatened when in it. As much as possible they should be free to come and go in the crate.