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Dave Opincarne
05-12-2003, 10:42 PM
I was thinking about this today at work. With the large amount of talent collected here I was wondering what a cross section of a typical day looks like for this group. So what did you do/work on today?

The first job I tackled was to take two filler block patterns off a match board. All of our small castings get jobed out, we only do the big ones (3'-20').We knew they were made undersize because the foundry were they were being done rams up their sand very loose and it tends to compress during the pour. After taking them off the board I checked them with a rail template and found I would have to add material to both the top and bottom to get a good fit against the rail. Added material on the bottom, sanded to produce the right height for the bolt hole, worked in the right rail fit and did the same for the top. Dowled the cope sections in place, added material, trimed to the parting line. Pulled the cope off and sanded draft in down to the parting line. Paint, sand, paint. Mounted patterns back on the board, ran new leather fillets and reworked the gating. Patched and painted over the screw heads. Done with first job.

Second job. Pulled a removable section off a large pattern to be replaced with another version. The second section needed to have machine stock added in four places where it will be machined to fit the rail section where the running rail will nest into the casting. Since the machine stock varies and the surface where it needed to be added is curved I milled up stock at 3/32" and 5/32". The 5/32 material is on a small flat section of the curve so I just trimed it oversize and epoxied it in place. (Part is made out of cast urathane so I couldn't glue or tack) the thiner material was added to a tighter curve and it couldn't be applied without cracking or simply not conforming to the shape of the part. For this piece I struck groves on front and back with a marking gauge to score the surface. The peice could now be bent to the curve and held in place with tape while the epoxy kicked. After all the stock was applied the extra material was trimed, Bondo was then applied over the gaps, and faired in to produce contact 1/2" out from the tangent point of the curve and the curve was eased to keep from interfearing with the pads. This reduces machine time. Finaly bondo fillets were swept in and sanded. Got up to the fairing on the second side. I'll finish and paint tomorow then check to see if I need to deck the part for proper height on this revision and reinstall on the pattern.

So that was my day, what did you do today? Doesn't need to be as detailed if you don't want to, but what does a day look like to this group.

Thanks, Dave

CCWKen
05-12-2003, 11:05 PM
Monday is usually my day to run into the "big city" for parts, stock and supplies. Not a very glamerous task for the boss but someone with a little sense has to do it. At least, that's what they tell me. I think it's just to get me out of the shop.
Three hundred pounds of CR Sheet, a clock spring for a Ford, 10 gallons of thinner, 4 gallons of paint (in various colors), a set of tires and mags and a fender and hood.
Today was slow.

bspooh
05-12-2003, 11:08 PM
Well, where do I begin...

First of all I had to run 3 more parts on the cnc mill, then I setup for a totally different job..(which I ran all day) and meanwhile I setup the cnc lathe to drill some holes.(which i ran all day)...during this whole time, I spent hours on the phone with customers and also the wife...One pack of cigarettes later and Its time to go home...not much accomplished today, but there is always tommorow....

brent

wierdscience
05-13-2003, 12:32 AM
8:30 a.m. removed 16 broken 3/8-16 bolts from a planer cutterhead,9:15a.m.pressed sproket,off of and builtup with weld a shaft for a ditchwitch,10:15a.m.welded up a cast steel rudder support from a tug boat1:45 p.m.cut and threaded 14 pcs. of 1-1/2"s/s pipe 2:15p.m.went to lunch,3:00 p.m.placed daily bearing orders,3:30p.m.picked up tractor radiator for brother,3:45p.m.machined 1-5/8"x 12"b-7 pin for cable sheave,4:45 make a mad dash for home,5:15 p.m.go back to town to pick up grandmas pills,5:45p.m.installed crank,rods,cam,lifters,timing gears,injection pump,timing cover and front seal in brothers tractor,11:00p.m.go on-line,so all in all it was a slow day!Myabe it will get better tomorrow! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

L Webb
05-13-2003, 12:35 AM
Slow day today.
First we set up tooling in one press and blanked out some 6" circle blanks out of 3/8" HRFB.
Set up another press to chop 6" remnants off of 1/4" X 3 1/2" scrap trains from job ran last week.
Had to pull a die set apart that holds our changeable tooling and reset clearances because some idiot screwed with this die set a couple of years ago and messed it up.
Then we set up a press to punch 5/8" ID's in the 6" circle blanks.
In between doing all this I had to clean and rearrange furniture in the office and mop the floors to satisfy the other half.
A trip to the bank to make a deposit. To the post office to mail a priority letter. A trip to Savon for more furniture polish.
I also planted two more tomato plants in the garden. Pulled some weeds out of the rose bed and watered all the garden.
Loaded the cans of completed parts to deliver to customer on the way in tomorrow.
Finally left the shop about 6PM.
What did I say about a slow day?????
Les

Thrud
05-13-2003, 04:31 AM
Got up, fed Cats. Watch morons on Jerry Springer (todays topic - I hump my brother and wes gittin' married soon as the baby is born). Watch history Channel. Eat lunch. Clean shop area a little. Play Computer game. Talk to Alistair. Nap. Feed Cats. Nap. Drool on Alistair's pictures of freshly cleaned lathe - and here I am.

Geeze, how do I get it all done? http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

rbregn
05-13-2003, 07:44 PM
1) Polish a couple of seal areas on front axle shafts. .3 hr
2)Repair a water tailer that almost got pulled in half. 4.2hr
3) remove aluminum oil pan off motor that the boss dropped. cleaned ground out cleaned again and welded. planed sealing edge flat and reassembled on motor. 3.5hr

jfsmith
05-13-2003, 07:51 PM
I got up this morning and mowed the lawn. Then I watched some mindless television. Then decided to have lunch with a lady friend.

This afternoon, I cut fish shapes out of copper and aluminum. Fed the cat and did some light house work.

I won't do anything serious until 9 p.m., my off peak power rate starts at that time. Then I will work until about 2 am. If anyone is wondering, my home and workshop, both are all electric (except my forge), my electric bill averages $97 a month, because I call the electric company asked about what programs they have. One of the more worth while phone calls.

Jerry

Techtchr
05-13-2003, 08:47 PM
Maybe not what you had in mind but: arrive a school 6:30. Finished grading Digital electronics labs and submiting grades to office. Touched up a powerpoint presentation on CIM. Taught DE kids to create programming on basic Stamps. Lectured on CIM. Taught kids to make tensile test samples on manual lathes. Explained to an administrator why a student deserved the generous grade of 50 for doing almost nothing all marking period. Helped a student make parts for a small CNC machine he's building. Talked to an art teacher and Math teacher. (I like artistic people and people that can use numbers. Fixed a part on the smithy lathe. Helped a student with CAD drawings for project. Discussed a possible project for the cnc mill with a 10th grade CIM student. Read a couple of chapters in a text book. Went to department meeting. Coached springboard diving at the rec center. Arrived at home 7:15. In general a very good day.

spkrman15
05-13-2003, 10:26 PM
Well my day didn`t go something like this....it went exactly like this:

Started putting boots on and have 6 faces, aren`t there supposed to be 7 look at me saying what do you want us to do today. I guess someone didn`t come in again. Try to find jobs to do that will get the waterpark open and ready despite the continous rain.

Pick jobs that i can do that won`t hold anyone up and/or i can walk away from if i get busy.

Got busy. Unload to deliveries, that come at same time. have 4 employees help me. Well 2 help and 2 to talk to each other....GRRR.

Lunch. Go back to work. Have boss ask me how the new slide is going? I don`t know i have no plans ask the general contractor.. Call engineers. Doesn`t match what builders are doing. Get revised project timetable. Oh look they are behind. Crap it is quitting time. Why haven`t my employees brought back my keys? Find KBC tools sale flyer in mail box. Cool.

Come home and plan on fixing car. Going to use the 2nd car for a couple of days as it just got back from body shop. No power door locks and the electric seats don`t move. I will have to put off fixing leaky gas tank for a little while as the 2nd car has to go back to shop.

Go grocery shopping. Get call from GF and buddy from football. Draw up some plays for football and email back the captain of the girls team i am coaching.

Still have a couple of machining jobs to do for some family and i want to make a surprise for the gf. Oh well maybe tomorrow.

Oh yeah...shoot cats that are sh$ting on lawn! (joke)

Spkrman15

j king
05-13-2003, 11:15 PM
go to work and do same boring job I have had for 6 days.Turning a 37 foot long stainless auger.Takes 2 days to cut 1 pass on flighting running 2 carriages.55" dia screw to squeeze oranges for juice.I could never be a security guard.

darryl
05-14-2003, 12:39 AM
Arose to unusual noises outside. Did the S S S routine, met friend for coffee. Returned home to find a contractor laying out a foundation too close to my property line. Did yard work so I could keep an eye on what was going on with him. Concrete pumper rolled in. Removed some u-brackets from old concrete pad. Played on the computer while my strength returned. Scooped some left-over concrete to fill the holes left by fence post brackets. Rested again, (can't seem to get rid of this flu thing). Rested some more. Still resting, while surfing this BBS. I did fix two vcr's today, also, that's the income for the day. Not much. Tomorrow will be much the same, except no yard work, just repair some things for customers, tinker with some idea that pops into my head, and continue the spring cleaning thing.

Oso
05-14-2003, 01:41 AM
Hmmm.
Got up, did local chores while the wife got ready for work, drove her to hers and continued on to mine.

Found that the subcontractor had delivered ALL the prototype (Surface mount, we don't assemble that type) electronic assemblies at once, instead of on the schedule. They were late anyway, now they are back on schedule, and I am suddenly way behind.

Checked to make sure they were what they were supposed to be (part numbers). OK, they shipped the right ones.

Now, stick all but the main one on the shelf.

Start checking it out. Have a meeting instead, sez the boss. OK. Meeting is about schedule. Boss says "they came in, right? can you check them out by lunch? I have a meeting with the owner".

No, I can't do three weeks of the pert chart in 3 hours.......

Back to work.

Hmm, right away there are two parts backwards, subcontractor can't read. Off to the SMT repair equipment to fix it.

SMT repair stuff can't heat up a 4 layer board, that is about solid copper, enough to get the parts back on....wasted 30 min on that, do it with a soldering iron in 3 min, carefully.

Where the heck is the connection harness I made and put on the shelf....? OK make another one, only take 15 min or so.

OK, low voltage test (saving the + - 85 volts for later). All the status lights are ob, thats odd, simulator says it works fine.

Spend 30 min looking at test points and parts.....Ah, there is a 9.3k resistor where a 93k one goes....off to the SMT repair equipment again....dang subcontractor

Woops lunch was an hour ago, oh well.

Hmm, lots of noise on that optocoupler, but no signal output, whats that about? Input signal is Ok,,,,,no shorts in the traces.....Better look at the data sheet for that part, something is way screwy

Oh, looks like the spec got misread on that part, the suggested base resistor graph was labeled in "K" ohms not ohms, might do better with 100K...off to the repair equipment. Yep...............that one is ours.....


And on it went.

Day before was more fun, while waiting for the proto assemblies I have been designing a new item which will make them obsolete......
Design work is fun.



[This message has been edited by Oso (edited 05-14-2003).]

Dr. Rob
05-14-2003, 01:55 AM
Read this thread. Read a hundred others too. Wrote this post; will probably write a half dozen more.

Then I went to work, but that hasn't happened yet, so I'll have to write another post later.

Stepside
05-14-2003, 10:04 AM
Got to work/school at 6:00AM.
Read E-mail--28 new items
Discussed street rod project with body shop instructor
Spent next 2 hours with Pre-engineering students designing, problem solving, Writing reports, using digital camera ect. ect. All this while having phone conversations with vendors for new equipment.
Next 3 hours in machine/metal shop 30 students per hour doing all the machining/welding/foundry things.
From 2:30-3:00 grading attendance stuff
From 3:00 until 7:00 orking with students that stay after school to work as well as visiting with ex-students and some local machinists.
3 min drive home and dinner with bride of 33 years.
8:00-9:00 reading book on the sinking of the Lousitania (sorry about spelling but it is early)
9:01 Sleep

Thrud
05-14-2003, 05:00 PM
Oso:
I am stripping some boards and need to know the best way to non-destructively remove BGA chips. I have hot air, but I am wondering if I should heat the backside of the board as well (or only).

Please help!

Oso
05-14-2003, 05:49 PM
Thrud:

I have no idea. We don't use 'em yet, still on the 100 pin quad packs. If I had not had too much work to do today, I would have visited the SMT vendor as scheduled, and then I would have at least seen what they do to attach the dang things. Missed it.

Heating the backside might work, those buggers have an awful lot of "pins" sticking them down.

Dave Opincarne
05-14-2003, 07:02 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Thrud:
I have hot air</font>

Which end is it coming out this week? http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//eek.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

Oso, I didn't follow any of that, my electronic experience is dismal but it sounds facinating. The parts about backwards and decimal points moving and schedules beeing jammed I understood perfictly well though.

Yesterday was no way near as fun. After finishing up the machine pads and decking to the new height I spent the rest of the day going through core boxes that had been sitting out in the weather for a month to be thrown out. One of the production guys was on light duty so rather than send him home they tried to find something for him to do. That something was going through our storage area and collecting the aforementioned pile as we had thrown out the patterns those boxes went with. Unfortunatly many of those boxes also worked for patterns we are still using but since one of the numbers matched out they went. Most are salvagable but some are not. Good thing the boss had me double check. Not the guys fault just didn't have the experience to know better. The remainder of the day was spent digging around trying to find boxes for patterns that were getting ready to be run. Since I made the boxes I got to go track them down. Found five boxes and a removable core print in five different locations and the core print and its box wern't the two that were together.

dvideo
05-14-2003, 07:08 PM
We use a lot of BGAs... here at Intel. I will pass on to one of the BGA repair guys and get an answer.... --jr

******
Thrud
Member posted 05-14-2003 05:00 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oso:
I am stripping some boards and need to know the best way to non-destructively remove BGA chips. I have hot air, but I am wondering if I should heat the backside of the board as well (or only).
Please help!

dvideo
05-15-2003, 04:59 PM
Someone who I think is expert had this to say:

It depends on what he is attempting to accomplish.

Will the boards or the parts be reused?

Is he attempting to save the board, the part, or both?

Does he have the ability to re-ball the part?

If not, then there shouldn’t be much to worry about concerning the part.

If he is attempting to save the board, then he also needs to know how to clean and prep the lands after the BGA has been removed.

Does he have a hot air gun, or an oven or a BGA machine?

If he has a hot air gun, heating from one side of the board is OK, typically the part side.

He needs to start the process with the gun about a foot away from the board and gradually (over about a 30 - 45 second time period) bring the gun closer to the board until the nozzle is 1 – 2 inches away from the part, then have something to gently nudge the part to determine when the solder is molten, then lift the part and remove the heat.

You might think that he could perform this with the BGA on the bottom, but the surface tension of the solder would hold the part in place so it would still need to be nudged.

If he has an oven, everything will re-flow including the BGA so removal of just the BGA could be tricky.


Heating both sides of the board also requires a means of supporting the board as well as controlling the ramp in temperature and should probably be monitored.


Bottom line, if you are just pulling a part, you can heat just one side of the board (typically component side) so long as you heat it up gradually and then don’t get the board too hot during re-flow, but yet hot enough so that all of the solder balls melt so that you don’t pull pads off the board when pulling the part off.


Jed

****************

hope this helps.....

Thrud
05-16-2003, 04:55 AM
dvideo:

Thanks for the info. Since these are functional parts I intend to recycle, the boards are a throw-away. The BGA are going into my "dead chip collection" (North and South bridge chips for computers). I also recover the LS, ALS, and F series logic, resistors, and ceramic chips for experiments.

I clean the whole board off. I have a Hakko 470 Static Safe Desoldering Station for through-hole parts. Damn, I like that Hakko!

Dave O
As a matter of fact the anti-gravity exhaust has been prodigeous in volume and quality of late... http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//rolleyes.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//eek.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif



[This message has been edited by Thrud (edited 05-16-2003).]

dvideo
05-16-2003, 05:50 AM
If you need more details on BGAs, I can get them.... The trick, if you can do it, is reballing the parts. Then you can worry about getting them off the boards right...

These parts get smaller and I see worse, every year.... I am comfortable with the 1mm pitch parts... I can see, wire, and stick holes on the boards. I saw someone else's 0.5mm pad pitch board... EEK! now I carry two magnifying glasses at work... Glasses to see the screen with, a magnifying glass to stare at board and art with... and now another glass for REALLY tiny BGAs.... Its the Cell phones that drive the size down... and they keep getting smaller....

I envy your Hakko....

Jerry

dvideo
05-16-2003, 01:34 PM
Another useful BGA site....

http://www.intel.com/design/packtech/packbook.htm


-- jerry