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nitsuj
11-21-2007, 07:27 PM
Hello. I'm new here, great forum, you guys seem to know your stuff. That said, no sense in just having a stupid introduction thread without having some stupid questions to ask as well, so here me go.

I'm in the market for a small-ish mill. Not super small like a mill/drill, but a home sized mill. Right now, there is a Cinci with a Bridgeport head for sale near me. It brings up questions in my mind. Questions like, it's it desirable to have one head mounted on another machine? What I mean is, would someone WANT to mount a Bridgeport head on a CInci mill, or would they only do it because they needed a new head and found a BP one cheap?

Is this type of machine one to consider, or should it be run form? I haven't seen it in person yet to actually know how good of shape it's in, so right now, I'm only going on a vauge description.

Thanks for any help.

jdunmyer
11-21-2007, 08:04 PM
I'd have a look at it to see if the installation is workmanlike. If so, I don't know that I'd be afraid of it.

A genuine B'Port is nice because EVERYBODY makes/sells accessories for them. Other makes, even many that are arguably "better" aren't a B'Port and may or may not have the parts/accessories support.

But, you have to start somewhere....

lane
11-21-2007, 08:25 PM
IT would not be bad if the head is mounted right. But for a first mill may be to large . we had a #2 Cincinnati mill at work with a nice BP head and was handy for some things and could also be used as a Horizontal when needed. But would be a heavy piece of machinery. and not small like you want. When you say small I think a 6x26 import a Rockwell vertical or a little Clausing. Regular size being A Bridgeport or a BP clone of some type. May be this might get you to thinking. Check out E-Bay to get an idea for size and type you are looking for. Do some research.

SGW
11-21-2007, 08:28 PM
I'd agree -- if the installation is well done, I wouldn't worry. Maybe the original head didn't have power downfeed or something, and the Bridgeport head got added to get it.

Though I can't imagine any Cincinnati mill I'd describe as "small-ish." Maybe there are some.

Have you looked at the Jet JVM-836? It's about 2/3 to 3/4 the size of a Bridgeport, more or less. I don't think it has power downfeed, but it has something like an 8" x 36" table and has an R8 spindle.

As far as mounting one manufacturer's head on another brand of mill: Clausing built a run of their small milling machines with Bridgeport M heads on them, from the factory.

nitsuj
11-21-2007, 08:40 PM
I thank you guys for the info. Don't get me wrong, this isn't spur of the moment, and I have done research. I've also been around mills, in another life, I was a tool and die maker. I said small-ish, because I'm looking for something along the lines of a Bridgeport J head, 9x42 or 9x48. Maybe a little smaller, but not much.

I didn't think they made small Cincinatti's either, until the saw the picture of this one. It's tough to get scale from a picture, but it's in front of a garage door, and it doesn't look to be a much larger machine than a 9x48 Bridgeport.

But since we got on to the topi of imports, if I decided to go that route, vs older American machines, what is getting good feedback from owners?

Bill Pace
11-21-2007, 08:47 PM
Since its a bit vague on the size you are needing, I think Lane has a good way to research the size mill youre talking about --- put "mill" in the search field on ebay and get an idea of size.

I would also class this type mill as a regular size, not in the "smallish" class. I would think the mill-drill size falls into the smallish sizes. Course, maybe the Bridgeport size is what you want....

nitsuj
11-21-2007, 09:31 PM
Bridgeport sized is what I want. A 9x48 Bridgeport is small-ish in my eyes. I said small-ish becuse I've seem mills the size of a small house. I don't want one of those. I've played with mill/drills, they won't work. Not rigid enough, not enough oomph. A Bridgeport is what I'd prefer, my question was about the mounting of a Bridgeport head to a Cincinatti mill. I'd never seen that before.

That said, I've not seen any "Bridgeport clones", is there one that is generally accepted to be of high quality while also being much lower in cost?

mechanicalmagic
11-21-2007, 09:56 PM
Where are you located?
I heard a rumor of a couple Bridgeports in San Jose, CA.

lane
11-21-2007, 10:14 PM
I have a Birmingham vertical BP type very nice . I am Pretty familiar with all of them . My list in order of Best Good.
BEST Sharp ,Accra, Birmingham ,MSC Vetrax , Acer , Clausing ,Legume

Good YCI super-max ,Enco JET.
As far as a Cincinnati with BP head must be a tool room mill I was at first thinking of a Horizontal with BP head adapted. Cin. made some verticals have seen some Heavier than BP and with a BP head should be nice I liked the BP head better than Cincinatti any way more user friendly. But new verse old I would go for new my self.

nitsuj
11-21-2007, 11:20 PM
I'm in PA. I'm lucky enough to be in an area where used mills aren't that hard to find. Steel City, baby! Looking at this Cincinatti, it does kind of look like it was a horizontal mill. Maybe thats why the owner added the BP head, to make it vertical. Does that sound plausible or possible?

crrmeyer
11-22-2007, 12:08 AM
Bridgeport sized is what I want. A 9x48 Bridgeport is small-ish in my eyes. I said small-ish becuse I've seem mills the size of a small house. I don't want one of those. I've played with mill/drills, they won't work. Not rigid enough, not enough oomph. A Bridgeport is what I'd prefer, my question was about the mounting of a Bridgeport head to a Cincinatti mill. I'd never seen that before.

That said, I've not seen any "Bridgeport clones", is there one that is generally accepted to be of high quality while also being much lower in cost?

You might also consider a Wells Index. They are US made (except for the 837 model) and the company is still around and can supply parts on mills they have built since the 1940's. The early ones (like a model 40) were smaller than a BP but most of them are BP size. I have used the current Wells Index mills in the past and have been quite happy with them.

One nice thing is they are less known than a Bridgeport and thus tend to sell for less money.

Here is a photo of a Bridgeport (I believe) on the left and a Wells Index 747 with a 9x49" table on the right at a machinery dealer a while back. They wanted $2500 for the Wells Index. It has the original paint as shown in the photo & was purchased new in the 70's for a garage machinist.

http://members.cox.net/crmeyer/INDEX-BP.jpg

Peter N
11-22-2007, 12:30 AM
Quite a few people have converted horizontal mills by adding a Bridgeport head, as you can then get the best of both worlds.
Charles Ping has a Victoria horizontal converted this way, and the picture below is one that I went to look at 2 years ago. It's a K&T milwaukee with a J-head on the ram.
It was going very cheap indeed, but was just a bit too big for my small workshop.


http://www.btinternet.com/~p.neill/KearneyBridgy.jpeg

Peter

nitsuj
11-22-2007, 11:50 AM
Wow. You guys are great with sharing info! I'm glad I found ths forum. I originally found another forum, I won't be going back to it. This place rocks.

Anyhow, I thought for giggles, I'd attach a pic of the mill I'm talking about. Seller says Cincinatti with Bridgeport head. Unfortunatley it belonge to his father who passed away, so I can't really get info as to why he did the conversion. It does look in the pic like it used to be a horizontal machine. And like many of you, I never saw a Cinci this small. Of course, being from Pittsburgh, it will pain me to have a tool made by "Cincinatti" in my shop. I guess it could be worse. It could be a "Cleveland". ;) I may have to paint it black and gold, just to be safe.

Heres the pic (I hope)
http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee285/nitsujcbr/mill.jpg