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View Full Version : G Sipp boiler? Stuart Engine?



J Tiers
07-10-2008, 11:42 PM
One of our clients has obtained a small steam engine and boiler as a small demonstration unit. (They are making burnable gas from waste wood, leaves, etc.)

I don't know what they expect to do with it, but for some reason they wanted to use it. I saw the setup in their lab recently, and took a good look at it, naturally.

Boiler is a vertical,about 6" or 8" diameter, around 0.7 meter tall. Firebox door says "G Sipp". US made, I think Paterson NJ.

Engine is a vertical single cylinder, probably double-acting, With what appears to ba a "D" valve, with only a large "S" on the valve cover. About 2" bore, about 0.4 meter tall.

I don't know anything about "G Sipp", but it occurred to me that the engine might be a large "Stuart".

Anyone know about these names?

BTW, first thing I saw was that some moronic cretin had replaced th water gage glass with copper tube....... Good thing it has three gage cocks as well........ so it can be at least used until the glass is replaced

oldtiffie
07-10-2008, 11:57 PM
One of our clients has obtained a small steam engine and boiler as a small demonstration unit. (They are making burnable gas from waste wood, leaves, etc.)


Thanks JT.

I can't help with the boiler etc.

What did catch my attention was the "...making burnable gas from waste wood, leaves, etc."

Could this be along the principles of char-coal where after "burning-down" sticks, trees etc. (cellulose?) the residue (charcoal) was a fuel in itself for many uses over many years in many countries. It is still used in some of the "developing" countries for cooking and industrial uses.

We had many "wood/charcoal burners" (and "Lime-burners" too) here in the "early years" apparently.

I can recall char-coal burning "gas-producers" on cars during WW2 as "gas" ("petrol" here) was for "emergency use only". Cars were a luxury. Needless to say the local Doctors had gas-producers on their cars.

I thought the following link might be of interest to you. I found it to be a very good read indeed:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charcoal

J Tiers
07-11-2008, 12:14 AM
The way they do it, there isn't much left....... it all comes out as gas eventually.

I have NOT been nosy about that, they are a client for custom motor drives and generator controllers, it "isn't done" to get too far outside the envelope. But their lab guys know I have a shop, so they showed me the engine setup.

oldtiffie
07-11-2008, 12:30 AM
Thanks again JT.

I can appreciate your position exactly.

It does seem to be quite efficient doesn't it?

My other interest was that I live in a "leafy" area and the amount of cellulose (trees, leaves, twigs etc.) that goes to the dumps for "chipping" where it is homogenised/sterilised at high tempoeratures (to get rid of pathogens and to kill all plant life and for use as garden compost) is incredible. That is beside the amount that is chipped by tree-removal contractors and still some where it is pushed up into win-rows and burned on site (rural areas).

I thought that process you described might have been a good use for it as gaseous fuel for some automotive or industrial processes.

Perhaps others who reads this thread will "chip-in" and advise us further.

J Tiers
07-11-2008, 12:37 AM
Thanks again JT.

I can appreciate your position exactly.

It does seem to be quite efficient doesn't it?

My other interest was that I live in a "leafy" area and the amount of cellulose (trees, leaves, twigs etc.) that goes to the dumps for "chipping" where it is homogenised/sterilised at high tempoeratures (to get rid of pathogens and to kill all plant life and for use as garden compost) is incredible. That is beside the amount that is chipped by tree-removal contractors and still some where it is pushed up into win-rows and burned on site (rural areas).

I thought that process you described might have been a good use for it as gaseous fuel for some automotive or industrial processes.

Perhaps others who reads this thread will "chip-in" and advise us further.

Their plan is to make the gas, and run a gas turbine or other IC engine plant with it to generate power.

oldtiffie
07-11-2008, 01:22 AM
Interesting JT.

Some of the more recent gas-turbine driven main power distribution generators here are fueled by Natural Gas. It seems that they are very efficient compared to comparatively older-technology coal-fired boilers that drive steam turbines. I don't know if some gas-fired boiler steam turbines are used though - possibly are.

The gas-turbine generators are or seem to be used for stand-by and high-load power at short notice. They do not have the "heat-up" and "cool-down" requirements for out coal-fired boilers for steam turbines. Needless to say our "coal" (brown - not black) power stations are very high polluters and generators of "green-house gases" and have very high carbon "foot-prints" and discharge to atmosphere.

Needless to say with the current and projected to continue lack of water/rain-fall here the "hydro-electric" (dammed water) options are a lot less viable or reliable.

I was wondering if some could not only give you the details you require in your OP but to perhaps enlighten me at least as to what useful purposes it could be put to in terms of its gaseous (fuel??) output.

It seems quite intriguing.

Tel
07-11-2008, 06:21 AM
some info here;
http://highforest.tripod.com/woodgas/woodgas.html

Tel
07-11-2008, 06:26 AM
... and, for the price, this could be worth looking at
http://www.ploughbooksales.com.au/007437.htm

JCHannum
07-11-2008, 08:28 AM
I can't help with the boiler, but here are some of the larger Stuart engines.

http://secure.enginemodels.com/cgi-bin/store/perlshop.cgi?action=thispage&thispage=engines3.shtml&order_id=540583

Also look at the 5A on the next page. Assuming it is a vertical, it is probably either the No. 1, 4 or 5A.

oldtiffie
07-11-2008, 08:51 AM
Many thanks to all for the effort and time in posting those good links and info.

Here are some others on gas-producers:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_producer

http://www.woodgas.net/

http://car.pege.org/2005-wood/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=Gas+producer&fulltext=Search

http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&q=gas+producer&btnG=Google+Search&meta=

J Tiers
07-11-2008, 09:10 AM
The engine is almost certainly a Stuart 5A.

Thank you. I had thought that Stuart was long gone. Apparently not, although at those prices, I won't be bothering them any....... Some of the kits cost more than my larger machine tools.

The "G Sipp" boiler is still a mystery.

I am sorry I don't have pictures, but I don't bring cameras into the client's lab............. If we need a picture, they take the picture. It's part of the deal.......

Hupp31
07-11-2008, 09:39 AM
Prepared for FEMA by DOE...

http://www.gengas.nu/byggbes/index.shtml

JCHannum
07-11-2008, 10:56 AM
Stuart kits have always been on the expensive side, but a few years ago, they either were bought out or reorganized and the prices went even higher. I think they are trading on the name.

While no castings are what you might consider cheap anymore, Tiny Power is a source of good steam engine kits at a more reasonable cost. Most of the kits have been around for a while and the bugs are pretty well worked out. They also have hooked up with Clarence Myers, and sell his casting kits as well.

http://www.tinypower.com/

Their engines range from models to engines suitable for full size marine or power plant applications.

Mcgyver
07-11-2008, 12:13 PM
I've never come across nicer castings than the Stuart. I agree thought that they are expensive, too expensive. I paid i think $400 for the triple castings years ago, seems like a deal today. Although, its been such a big project that cost per hour of shop time is very low. I wonder if they've optimized profits or hurt them; i.e. maybe selling more at a lower price might create a large profit. Maybe we'll have to wait for the Chinese to develop a model engineer fraternity - can you imagine trying to follow along the build articles written in Chinglish?

JCHannum
07-11-2008, 12:28 PM
The older Stuart castings were very good. I seem to recall reading that the recent ones are not up to the quality of the previous, and some are not dimensionally what they should be. I think is was on the home model site.

I do have a Beam Engine kit in the wings that I will possibly get to this winter.

Chinglish casting kits would be a challenge. My last engine was a John Deere with no instructions and the wrong drawings, but I managed to prevail.

http://members.aol.com/jchannum/deere