Thanks HSM hydraulic guys!!!

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  • torker
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2003
    • 6048

    Thanks HSM hydraulic guys!!!

    I got the tractor working. Bought a new splined coupler (Thanks Patch) ,,turned the old one off(it was silver slodered on)...bored out the new one, welded it on, then trim to OD and length...put tractor back together...thing works flawlessly(except the steering).
    The lil rubber bushings for the drive hub are SHOT! Got new ones coming tomorrow.
    Geez...it feels good to swing a hoe again. Haven't operated one since the mid seventies when I ran them full time.
    And that ol Yamaha sled that's been in my way for months...iis now a crushed up ball of junk!!! LOL! Damm that was fun!!!!
    One more question...I'd really like to take the hoe off for now.
    Two hoses run the the back for the hoe...one pressure and the other return (duh). These do not have quick couplers.
    Can I just plug off both hoses or do I need to join them together to form a "loop"?
    I bought plugs for all four ends today but then got thinking...what "if".. I shouldn't block the hoses off.
    Might seem stupid but I'm NOT a hydraulic guy.. I just wreck machinery...err...I mean run it..
    Russ
    I have tools I don't even know I own...
  • wierdscience
    Senior Member
    • Jan 2003
    • 22085

    #2
    If the hoses run to a control valve then yes they need to loop.The control valve is open center meaning it flows oil in a loop until it's redirected to perform work by blocking the return path and directing it to a cylinder instead.

    You taking the hoe off to work on it,or?If your wanting to use the machine as an endloader remember you will need weight on the rear once it's off.
    I just need one more tool,just one!

    Comment

    • kennyd4110
      Senior Member
      • Dec 2006
      • 204

      #3
      You definitely need to couple the line back together or you system will go into "relief" and the fluid can overheat and/or pump damage will occur. What you have is called a "PowerBeyond" loop.

      Comment


      • #4
        Depends on how the secondary valve(aux) is plummed.
        From the main front hyd. pump charged oil is first sent to the loader valve -----unless----- someone has equiped your tractor with a 3 function
        priority valve. This valve is just a small block (5"x5"x3) with a lever on it to select which implement you choose to use. In lever position #1 it could be solely for the loader. In lever position #2 it could be for the back-hoe attachment and the loader. Lever position #3 is generally used to control 3-point hyd.
        This aux valve is used on many tractors with attachable implements such as yours and in most cases a factory installed unit when the tractor was sold.
        Others may not have this capability, yours perhaps.

        Such the case, the loader valve has priority of the pump. From this valve, (the loader), to any other valve (back-hoe attachment).
        Charge oil from the loader valve is sent as charged oil to the next valve (BH valve) then returns to the sump.
        It is a closed series system.
        You will need to plug off the charge line at the loader valve the services the aux valve (BH). At the loader valve you will then need to route from the return port of the loader valve back to sump.
        It is important to use the loader valve return port for back-to-sump discharge oil. It's a bit hard to explain in a few sentances. But, to put it mildly, the loader valve will not function if you just connect the two lines together that you took loose from the BH valve due to the internal structure and operation of the loader valve.
        --You need to use the loader valve return oil port.--

        -------------------

        Now 10 reasons not to take the back-hoe attachment off:

        #1- You will loose the ass-end weight. The tractor will be so light given the power of the traction your wheels will spin when trying to use the loader for any heavy loader work.

        #2- You woll need to purchase and install 500# rear wheel weights. One to each side of drive wheels. (something I did because I had them)

        #3- Even with wheel weights, thats a 1000#'s, the wheels will still spin and loose traction. (I later bought 2 new climate cabs and had them installed for additional comfort and added weight).

        #4- Changing a front flat is simple due to the loader bucket. Lower the loader bucket which raises the front axel assem. and change out the tire.
        But, when the time comes to remove a rear wheel, wow, another story.
        Given the fact also that you installed the additional wheel weights for traction reasons, removing the BH attachment makes changing a tire a real job.
        With the BH attachment in place, simply lower one of the outriggers which raises the flat side and tire change is easy.
        Just wait until without the BH you get a flat and need to use a hyd. jack to lift the rear end. What a pain in the arse.

        #5- Steam cleaning or pressure washing is so much easier with the BH on the unit. Drop the front bucket, lower the outriggers, and the tractor takes notice of the increased height making it so nice to clean.

        #6- Lets say you later want to paint your tractor. Without the BH you drive the tractor up on blocks for height to clean, then after all this mess you are ready to paint it but, you need to remove the wheels to do a rightly good job.
        Once again, get that damn hyd jack out and fight with blocks to somewhere
        support the tractor. With the BH on simply lower the outriggers.

        #7- It is not just a 5 minute job to remove the BH and rehook everything up.
        Better pack a lunch because it will be a bit of time.

        #8- Due to #7, with the BH off you just tell yourself it's a pain in the arse so you just let the BH attachment sit in the yard gathering dirt and rust and it becomes a totally neglected item that takes up space.

        #9- Later, you decide to install a set of forks to the front loader bucket.
        The weight of the BH makes it easy to lift heavier loads without the ass-end
        raising and loosing traction.
        Believe me, you will notice. The fork addition really extends the center of gravity over the front wheels reducing the lifting capacity. Makes the tractor a bit dangerous too.
        There has been many a time I have fully extended the BH boom and dipperstick as I have used the forks. It adds ground stability and a whole
        lot of addition weight behind the center of gravity when lifting heavy items.
        There have been other times when I needed to cherry-pick something between many items in the way. The BH boom sure makes this easy and with it on it is always ready to do this chore.

        #10- Without the BH on, your out doing something in the dirt. The tractor high centers, the front wheels are at a oblique angle in the dirt which the strength of the steering system can't handle, and the cutting brakes have no effect to stall one wheel to free yourself and YOU ARE JUST STUCK.
        Now, if the BH was on, just crab your way out of this whole mess.

        ---------------

        Now a few reasons to take the BH off.

        #1- The boom is to high to use the tractor in the shop and under a canapy.
        "Just lower the boom" jeese, how hard is it to think of this?

        #2- Well hell, I cannot think of any other good reasons to remove it.

        ---------------


        Have fun, yea, you can laugh at all the above. I did.


        Patch

        Comment

        • torker
          Senior Member
          • Dec 2003
          • 6048

          #5
          LOL! Thanks guys! I really need to take the BH off for a little while. I need to clean up a whole mess of sleds in my yard. It is VERY tight around there. I smashed a $150 sled hood today cuz I ran out of room. The hoe just makes it too cumbersome.
          I also have a lot of welding to do on the hoe mounting points. They are broke out really bad...to the point where the hoe isn't real usable right now anyway. I was going to work on it at nights.. and do yard cleanup with the FEL during the daylight hours.
          Actually this hoe has two big pinch bolts that hold the works together. Undo them...wiggle the hoe up and back and presto..it'll be off.
          I'm going to have to track the lines tomorrow. The supply (charge?) line comes from the back of the FEL valve bank...goes to the hoe...then "somewere there...the return line comes back to the tank... I "think".... I'll have to check it better. BTW..there is no selector lever for what you operate. You can operate the FEL and the hoe all at once.
          Thanks again!
          Russ
          I have tools I don't even know I own...

          Comment

          • torker
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2003
            • 6048

            #6
            BTW.. Patch...this has a cab.. I have to go pick it up tomorrow. Needs a bunch of work. The kids smashed the windows out of it and it's bent up a bit but is fully fixable. Sure will be nice come winter.
            Dang...soon as I get some spare cash after this.. I gotta buy a new camera. Sure will make it easier to explain things!
            Russ
            I have tools I don't even know I own...

            Comment


            • #7
              Good show Russ,

              Yes, the cabs are nice to have.

              I haven't owned a camera in over 35 years. Just never had a good reason to get one. I am not the sentimental type that looks back on things as they once were I guess. Who knows? Perhaps one day. (maybe)


              All the best,

              Patch

              Comment

              • M_C
                Senior Member
                • Jan 2008
                • 130

                #8
                Easy way to find out how the BH is plumbed, is disconnect the hoses, and loop the feed back round to the return.
                If the FEL then doesn't work, then swap the looped hose for a couple blanking plugs.

                Provided the two hoses attaching the BH on are the same, or you have a suitable adapter handy, it's far easier to try looping than trying to find out what sort of system(s) is used.

                Comment

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