PDA

View Full Version : SuperBolts



johnny o
12-21-2008, 11:13 AM
I Recently worked on a couple of I/R B.F.P.'s with these superbolt nuts holding the discharge head on. Thier made up of 24 3/4-16 hardened jack bolts that you torque up to 360 ft/lbs to strech the main stud. These pumps had 12 studs each so you get to torq. 288 3/4" bolts till all are stretched even. We had to cut and or beat 6 or 7 to get them off main studs for some reason. It was a very time consuming process to use these over a heated stud growth or hytorq. nut method. We also used an air powered hy-torq torqe gun to twist the jakbolts off/on as needed, its a pretty slick gun too. They claim ease of use with only small handtools needed for these but I'll take the old calrod have a cigerett and wait stretch with castelated nuts anyday. Just wondered if anyone else has run into these superbolts and were
Thanks, John
http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm181/u001jpo/superbolt.jpg

Willy
12-21-2008, 12:23 PM
OK I'll plead ignorance here. What is a I/R B.F.P. ?

mochinist
12-21-2008, 12:29 PM
Is a super bolt kinda like a "billet" part?:p



Hey willy don't feel bad:confused::confused::confused:

milwright
12-21-2008, 12:37 PM
johnny o , the reason for these is you can apply huge torque by using small tools if you were to use a hi torque on a huge nut you end up galling theads and smearing surfaces. used them lots the are a good solution to high torque problems but can be a pain because of the many bolts.

Evan
12-21-2008, 12:55 PM
Superbolt?

Http://metalshopborealis.ca/pics/boltgrade1.jpg

Willy
12-21-2008, 01:01 PM
New on me too...Superbolt (http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.superbolt.com/images/question001.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.superbolt.com/question001.html&usg=__YVnqfNrixOXpHXZe658Sa0ycQ-4=&h=134&w=134&sz=9&hl=en&start=5&um=1&tbnid=EpuOIRSjMie7PM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=92&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsuperbolt%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26newwin dow%3D1%26safe%3Doff)

hardtail
12-21-2008, 01:16 PM
This on a compressor? Likely not too many companies around anymore that let you smoke while working, I hear rules are coming out against whistling too.......LOL

jkilroy
12-21-2008, 03:45 PM
My limited experience, one job, they were a PITA. Of course this was on smaller sized bolts, 2 1/2's. I would have much preferred regular nuts and a hydraulic wrench, much much faster.

bollie7
12-21-2008, 05:59 PM
OK I'll plead ignorance here. What is a I/R B.F.P. ?
Id take a guess and say
Ingersol Rand Boiler Feed Pump.

Sure looks like a feed pump to me but I'm only guessing on the name.

regards bollie7

bollie7
12-21-2008, 06:06 PM
Forgot to add, that looks like a B------d of a job. Glad I'm not on the tools doing this sort of work anymore. I think there would be less effort in the old "heating element up the centre of the stud" method.
I suppose the "super bolt" type shown here would mean a lower capitol investment in maint tooling for the plant owner, but in the grand scheme of things the cost of the heating elements and power supply would be minimal compared to the total project cost.

bollie7

Bruce Griffing
12-21-2008, 06:33 PM
I have some limited experience with Superbolts. The key to getting them off is the loosening pattern. The small bolts that provide tension on the nut are under lots of compressive stress. If you loosen half of them without loosening the other half, the remaining ones are under twice the compressive stress. So you have to loosen each one a little bit in a defined pattern. Just like when you tighten them. Takes some time and is a PITA.

Rich Carlstedt
12-21-2008, 06:55 PM
Evan
I believe that is a grade 8 bolt you have there.

The reason for the failure can be several.
First do you use anti-seize ? You should !
Second getting all the screws(bolts) to equal torque AND REMOVING them
is very important when it comes to procedure.
If you rush it,which is easy to do, you will failures.
Torque passes should be at least 5 times before finish pass.
When removing, the first pass should be to just break the screw then move on to the next. Failing to do this will cause the engaged screw to compress its threads and that will gaul on removal.
Putting that much torque on a 3/4-16 screw will produce almost 480,000 pounds of force.
it does not take much for threads to get screwed up at those levels

If this is a frequent job, you may need to replace the screws often.
In critical operations, screw replacement becomes manditory at each application.
Look at the time lost and compare it to replacement value?

rich

FABRICATOR
12-21-2008, 07:39 PM
Wow that is very neat! I think I will build some like that in a smaller scale for something one of these days.

Willy
12-21-2008, 09:09 PM
Evan
I believe that is a grade 8 bolt you have there.

rich

Rich, twelve radial lines with an "F" in the center should signify a grade 12 Fedalloy bolt. 180,000 PSI tensile strength.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

ohiodeere
12-21-2008, 09:24 PM
Johhny O
I know the guy that patented them.. He's so rich he forgets my name. LOL. there made in Carnegie PA. another one of those "started in the garge" ideas.

We use them all the time. in the Steel Manufacturing business these are superior over the traditional nuts. If your a mechianic you'll appreciate installing and removing them versus hauling the big wrench or torch around.

i just installed these on a Forge press. 18" od studs with a buttress thread. the torqing bolts were 1 1/4", 18 of them. we still use the calrod to preload then cool down and stress the rest of the way. prior to the super nut on there. we used a 1 1/2" cable on a pin on the diameter of a hex nut and pulled tight with a 100 ton crane, talk about tight a$$ while under load. the previous nut weighed around 1800 lbs ea...LOL.
so far we have not had any problems with them in any application. I also have made them on my shop lathe for small uses.
If you make your own make sure the backup ring the setscrews set down on is hardened.

Rich Carlstedt
12-21-2008, 09:32 PM
Thanks Willy
I am not familiar with Fedalloy, nor have I ever heard of a grade 12 bolt.
SAE goes to Grade 8.xx ( six lines)
and bolts like "SuperTanium" have 8 lines radially but meet higher standards.
I suspect that Fedalloy created the term "grade 12" as a selling technique
I am not demeaning their capability , just commenting on it.
Normally when you exceed grade 8, you become very specific because of the application.
For example there are some aircraft bolts rated at 220,000 tensile and they do not have a "grade" specification.
All the above fellows should not be confused with metric grading.
That is a completely different animal.


I found a listing of head styles and line markings...FYI
http://www.engineersedge.com/hex_bolt_identification.htm

I found no technical data on this, only sales data

Thanks for the comment Willy
Hope to hear more about them someday.
Rich

Willy
12-21-2008, 09:56 PM
Rich I believe you are right about them not technically being an actual "grade 12" bolt. More of a sales slogan than an actual standard. I suspect they coined the term to reflect the fact that most people would recognize the fact that it is a higher rated bolt than a grade 8.

I end up with quite a few in my collection at home as they are used a lot locally here in the logging and wood processing industries. Needed a bunch of 1.5" x 3/8 fine thread bolts a while back and that was all the local supplier had on hand, I don't remember how much of a premium I paid but it wasn't a big deal. Oh well, sometimes ya have to go slumming with 180,000 psi bolts on lighting brackets.:D

johnny o
12-21-2008, 10:19 PM
Thanks for the replys fellas
I see someone guessed Ingersol Rand Boiler feed Pump correct, I'm around the things so much I just asume people know these abbreviations. Our studs were only 6" so I see youre point with 18" od studs. I also think they would look good on a scale model of some sort, thier very impressive looking. I ran a pattern detorqing the bolts and either lost trac or was out of order and had to load up some bolts on both sides of one to unload it with the gun due to the pressure. I think drilling out broken bolts is more fun.
Thanks, John