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torker
01-15-2009, 02:48 PM
Could you guys look at this lathe and tell me what it is exactly and about how much it weighs?
I'm really looking for a 16X60 class lathe but I'm thinkin this is too good a deal to turn down.
Thanks!
http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/showthread.php?t=32678
Russ

Ed Tipton
01-15-2009, 04:23 PM
Russ
The Monarch in the picture is probably of the early 1940's and was more than likely made to support the war effort. I have a Monarch 16C toolroom lathe that is very similar to that lathe, and mine was made in 1943. Yours has a four-way tool post, and I also see the steady rest. Overall weight for the basic lathe is going to be close to 5000 lbs give or take. It will have a D1-6 set up for mounting the chuck...which I don't see in the pictures, and it will have the taper attachment. I strongly suggest giving it a good inspection before committing, but if everything is OK, then you're in the ball park. I might try and squeez him for another $200-300 bucks. If he has any or both chucks and they're serviceable, then he's on the money. Manuals are hard to find, and very expensive. I paid $75.00 for one with about 15 or 20 pages and it was totally generic lathe info, with no lathe specific info what-so-ever. The parts and operators manuals are harder to find, and don't expect to find them for anything under $150.00. Parts are still available, but even small parts are VERY expensive, and the larger assemblies and parts are flat out rediculous. These things were made like tanks. Almost always any damage you see is from moving them...or bumping them with a fork lift. If you've had the hood up on it, it's hard to imagine that it could be damaged by anything other than outright abuse. Some guys have changed the pully out in order to get higher speeds. That's OK, the lathe can take it, but unless you're working with a large workpiece, you still won't be at carbide speed. I use HSS tooling with mine and have had no trouble. Basicly, just keep it clean, keep it oiled, and be careful. If you do get it and it requires parts for repair, you might consider getting a junker and cannibalizing it for spare parts. Trust me, you'll be money ahead. Having said all of this, I'll end by saying that even a seventy year old Monarch that is in decent condition is light-years ahead of anything currently being made in Asia. About the only thing comparable is another piece of Old American Iron such as another Monarch, LeBlond, Lodge&Shiply, Sidney, Axelson, American Pacemaker etc. When people talk about Monarchs, they are usually talking about the 10EE. I consider mine to just be a 10EE in work clothes. Mine will hold any tolerance that I'm capeable of measuring. Good luck.

macona
01-15-2009, 04:50 PM
Ask the Monarch group over on PM. Thats the number one source of info on the internet on Monarchs. Get the serial number and give Monarch a call and they can look up the serial number and give you the model, who it was sold to, and how much.

Alistair Hosie
01-15-2009, 05:25 PM
given all this information would you not be better considerring a more modern lathe this could be trouble if it is found to be faulty in the future having said that there peobably well made in the beginning thats a big brute of a lathe the very best wishes from me best of Luck Alistair

torker
01-15-2009, 05:44 PM
Thanks guys! I just emailed him for the serial numbers.
Ummm...I don't know about this...he wants $750 just to palletize it. Then he says we got to rent a crane to load it....getting it hauled...all would add another almost $2g to the price.
Arrggghh... I wish it wasn't winter...I'd run up there in a heartbeat with my truck and trailer...but it's a 2 wd dually...hell on wheels on icey roads...pulling a trailer with it is even worse. About 1000 mile round trip...sigh...

torker
01-15-2009, 05:47 PM
Alistair...that lathe is actually cheap considering what else is available up here. A clapped out TOS like that is $6000 or more.

pcarpenter
01-15-2009, 06:25 PM
And....those are really great lathes if not clapped out. A friend has a 12CK "tool room" model with all the accessories. Don't even start it...it really does have a carriage mounted reverse and other genuine tool room niceties such as the stops on the feed dials and a "relieving attachment" that allows the compound to sort of lunge in and out for cutting relief when making a tap.

Monarch was one company who rated their lathes conservatively. The 12CK mentioned was 12" swing over the cross slide. It would actually swing 14" They also were disproportionately heavy and rigig compared to some similar lathes at the time. I thought I understood that the 12 CK with the 42" bed was close to 5K pounds so I would be surprised if that one is that light.

Paul

beckley23
01-15-2009, 07:47 PM
That lathe weighs 5000 + LBS, it has apron mounted feed reverse, looks like a taper attachment is partially visible attached to the rear of the carriage. It has 16 spindle speeds, and the top end can be increased by changing the motor pulley to about 1000 RPM max. The headstock gearing is all helical gearing, and very well constructed. The picture is my Series 60 headstock and it is very similar to what you are considering;
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/beckley23/se35.jpg
Just about all the rotating shafts on the lathe are ball, or roller, bearing mounted, you're going to be hard pressed to find a plain bearing, but there are a couple.
You can still get a manual from Monarch for approx $75.00 + shipping.
I bought my 1st Monarch, a 16"(18-1/2") CY in 1989, and it still holds some pretty good tolerances over it's 54" centers. I've added 2 more fully functional machines, and I'm working on 2 more.
Harry

quasi
01-15-2009, 07:48 PM
Torker, I bought a Monarch 14 WAA for my brother recently, made in 1946. It has 30 " between centers, came with a 10" 3 jaw, 12" 4 jaw and a steady rest. It weighed 4500 lbs on a skid, weighed on a certified scale.

Trucking was $900.00 from Niagra falls Ont. to Calgary. The skidding cost $100.00. I would think this lathe would be 5500 lb's at least.

Herb W
01-15-2009, 09:21 PM
I have a smaller version of that series of monarch. Mine's a 12" (actual swing 14.5"). They're very well built but are old enough that they can have some issues. I wouldn't sink significant dollars into one without checking it out / having it checked out carefully first. As has been said, new parts are available but tend to be prohibitively expensive. Used parts seem to be darned hard to find.

Monarch site:
http://monarchlathes.thomaswebs.net/index.html

doctor demo
01-15-2009, 11:57 PM
Thanks guys! I just emailed him for the serial numbers.
Ummm...I don't know about this...he wants $750 just to palletize it. Then he says we got to rent a crane to load it....getting it hauled...all would add another almost $2g to the price.
Arrggghh... I wish it wasn't winter...I'd run up there in a heartbeat with my truck and trailer...but it's a 2 wd dually...hell on wheels on icey roads...pulling a trailer with it is even worse. About 1000 mile round trip...sigh...
Shipping and handeling is becoming the blue collar version of stock market fraud, imo. $200 in lumber and a couple hours and it is ready to ship, the rest must be (hidden costs) :D .
Based on all My worldly exp. I would expect that lathe and accesories to be 3 tons.Fly there, buy a beater 4X4 and rent a trailer one way. When You get home sell the beater for what ever U can get.
Let the adventure begin.
If You get in a bind You can call Me , I will gladly drop every thing ! So I can give You Any advise You might want.:eek: .


Steve

torker
01-16-2009, 01:09 AM
Thanks Steve...geez..I wish you lived up here. You simplify all my problems so quick and easy...:D
The used 4X is a good idea...except it's interprovincial. The Gestapo makes you do a complete inspection and repair everything wrong before you can register said 4X here...before you can sell it with a clean bill of health.

doctor demo
01-16-2009, 01:51 AM
Thanks Steve...geez..I wish you lived up here. You simplify all my problems so quick and easy...:D
it's interprovincial. .
Well that just proves I'm not as smart as You think I am, interprovincial is not a word I toss around in front of the kids:eek: it sounds illegal.

Steve

torker
01-16-2009, 09:58 AM
CRAP...it doesn't matter...he sold it locally last night. ARRRGGGHHH! I even got hold of a machinist buddy of mine to go look at it today.
Oh well....