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old blue
03-09-2009, 07:33 PM
I have a problem I hope some one can help with. I bought a lathe last
Saturday.While it was being unload at my shop I slipped and fell on my back
and could not help the guy unload it. The guy that delivered it was unloading
it alone and tipped it over.:mad: My ? is how and what do I need to check on
it now that it has crashed? It fell onto the back side,Lucky if you can call it that.
I do not see any broken castings. It did hit part of the saddle.
It was picked up by putting a chain thru the spindle and lifting with a engine
crane, was this right or wrong?
Any help would be appreciated.

old blue

hardtail
03-09-2009, 07:42 PM
Welcome to the bb and sorry about your luck on all accounts......I would never recommend lifting it by the spindle/chuck, looks like you have to test all of it out now, check runout on the spindle, noise, run the carriage up and down the bed and lastly make a test cut on a piece of stock, was it used or any chance of it going back from shipping damage??

Lifting by the bed using tongs or slings is usually a better idea or follow the manufacturers recommendations.....depends on how heavy and stout the machine is.....

old blue
03-09-2009, 07:48 PM
The machine is heavy, it is all cast iron. When it was laying on its back
that was the only way we could stand it back up.

MickeyD
03-09-2009, 10:15 PM
What kind of lathe is it? If it is a plain bearing machine, it should be fine. A roller bearing machine should be OK too, just turn the spindle slowly by hand to make sure that something does not feel "crunchy". I would be more worried if it was an asian machine with a ball bearing spindle. You might exceed the spindle bearing load rating and cause some problems. What does the spindle feel like now?

Bill Pace
03-09-2009, 10:35 PM
Ouch!! definitely not the best way to lift it, but ... when your "back" is against the wall (or thrown out!) then you do what ya gotta do!

Just go thru the motions as already mentioned ... think about how/where there may have been high stress on parts and carefully test/check them out. Youre right, since it had to fall, twas better on the back than front, you can rip the apron plum off on a fall.

As mentioned if its got the cone type bearings, its probably (cross fingers:eek:) gonna be alright in the headstock, the apron/saddle will most probably be where any damage is--

Good luck, -- and keep us advised.

Mike of the North
03-09-2009, 10:42 PM
I live in Northern Oakland Co. where in MI are you I might be able to make time and take a look at for you, I unfortunately only know enough to get in to trouble, but a second set of eyes may help in checking it out.

old blue
03-09-2009, 11:13 PM
What kind of lathe is it? If it is a plain bearing machine, it should be fine. A roller bearing machine should be OK too, just turn the spindle slowly by hand to make sure that something does not feel "crunchy". I would be more worried if it was an asian machine with a ball bearing spindle. You might exceed the spindle bearing load rating and cause some problems. What does the spindle feel like now?

My luck only gets worse. It has a ball bearing spindle. It is 1979 KBC/Asian machine. The saddle moves freely. the spindle rolls ok no noises.
The spindle has a 2" thru hole not the smaller 1 1/2" so the bearings
are a little bigger. Is there a way to check the spindle bearings with out
taking them out? Any issues I might have with the gearing in the head?

Just to clarify, we didn't pick up the whole machine by the spindle. We just lifted it enough to stand it back up if that matters ?.

old blue
03-09-2009, 11:14 PM
I live in Northern Oakland Co. where in MI are you I might be able to make time and take a look at for you, I unfortunately only know enough to get in to trouble, but a second set of eyes may help in checking it out.


I live south of Grand Rapids.

Carld
03-09-2009, 11:27 PM
old blue, does the lathe have any protection on the back side such as a chip shield or tray under the bed?

Do you have a digital camera? If so put a photo on PhotoBucket and the copy it to here so we can see the lathe.

old blue
03-09-2009, 11:49 PM
old blue, does the lathe have any protection on the back side such as a chip shield or tray under the bed?

Do you have a digital camera? If so put a photo on PhotoBucket and the copy it to here so we can see the lathe.

No it does not. I will see if I can get some pic's.

gmatov
03-10-2009, 01:01 AM
Welcome from me as well.

What kind of surface did it land on. Grassy? Chipped drive? Concrete or asphalt?

The first would be the least liable to do damage. Chipped drive, not good, but better than a really hard surface.

I'd not have put a chain through the spindle. May have dinged that a bit. Nylon strap would have been better. Even a bar with chain looped around both ends, wrapped around the bar to "choke" it so as not to slip off and drop it again.

Take the headstock out of gear and roll it by hand, or in gear and run it under power, if you can, and feel and listen for roughness.

I don't think you will have done any major damage to it, if you haven't actually broken anything, castings, I mean. Bearings are generally chaep enough to replace.

Still, you should tell us what the lathe is, and the size, though with a 2" spindle bore, it's probably large enough to make a pretty good "thunk" when it lands on its back.

I hope you haven't suffered too much, indeed, ANY damage, to your machine.

Cheers,

George

macona
03-10-2009, 01:58 AM
Good chance you bent the spindle if you put a chain through it. Scott at Monarch told me thats the #1 cause of bent spindles.

old blue
03-10-2009, 03:53 PM
The machine is a KBC/San Yuen Grip1640.

old blue
03-12-2009, 10:24 PM
Here are some pic's.
http://i340.photobucket.com/albums/o322/oldblue75/100_0671.jpg

http://i340.photobucket.com/albums/o322/oldblue75/100_0672.jpg

http://i340.photobucket.com/albums/o322/oldblue75/100_0674.jpg

http://i340.photobucket.com/albums/o322/oldblue75/100_0673.jpg

old blue
03-12-2009, 10:35 PM
Welcome from me as well.

What kind of surface did it land on. Grassy? Chipped drive? Concrete or asphalt?

The first would be the least liable to do damage. Chipped drive, not good, but better than a really hard surface.

I'd not have put a chain through the spindle. May have dinged that a bit. Nylon strap would have been better. Even a bar with chain looped around both ends, wrapped around the bar to "choke" it so as not to slip off and drop it again.

Take the headstock out of gear and roll it by hand, or in gear and run it under power, if you can, and feel and listen for roughness.

I don't think you will have done any major damage to it, if you haven't actually broken anything, castings, I mean. Bearings are generally chaep enough to replace.

Still, you should tell us what the lathe is, and the size, though with a 2" spindle bore, it's probably large enough to make a pretty good "thunk" when it lands on its back.

I hope you haven't suffered too much, indeed, ANY damage, to your machine.

Cheers,

George


Yes as luck (bad luck) would have it it was on cement.

wierdscience
03-12-2009, 10:43 PM
Well on the bright side if there is one,it rolled on it's back,had it been the front a lot of damage could have been expected.

Looks to me like it probably isn't hurt,that lathe is fairly massive in it's construction and the cast base probably prevented any damage to the bed.

I would checkout that power cord,it could have gotten pinched and made a short.

Nice looking lathe despite the back-flip.

old blue
03-12-2009, 11:24 PM
Thanks. I did find one of the thread/feed levers was not working.
I pulled the cover on the gear box and there is a shift fork laying
on the bottom. Not sure what I will find when I pull it apart.
Not sure how that would have broken on the front,maybe it was
broken when I bought it. If so I guess I didn't look it over very well.:(

Fasttrack
03-12-2009, 11:39 PM
Enh - Don't beat yourself up over the fiascoe too much. The machine is probably fine but the only way to find out for sure is to put it through its paces. The shift fork that you mention probably popped out when the lathe did its backflip. I would guess that nothing is broken but that the shift fork just slipped out of its socket. You'll see what I mean when you do some prodding, I think. When the lathe was on its back, it likely just slid right out.

I am personally not a fan of lifting through the spindle. I'd've tried to get a sling around the headstock or around the bed webbing. BUT I've also seen/heard alot of machines being lifted by their spindles. The spindle is designed to handle a large thrust and radial load so you probably didn't damage anything. I still say it's not a good idea, but there have been discussions here before about when it is/isn't appropriate to lift by the spindle.

gmatov
03-13-2009, 01:20 AM
Blue,

Is the bed actually cast or is it made from weldments? The headstock is cast, the base is cast, the lathe itself looks to be welded up.

Odd that such a massive LOOKING machine did not have through holes in it to put a couple lifting bars through to lift with, unless the mfg had their own lifting devices to latch on somewhere.

With the size of that spindle through hole, I don't think you did any damage lifting it that way. I don't think you bent the spindle shaft with a chain, so far as bending it. Dinging it up, maybe, but you didn't ruin it.

What's the bungee cord for? To lift the brake pedal?

Cincinnati HyPro VBM had a bad habit of knocking shift forks out of place if you shifted wrong. Had to go open the gear box and pry it back into place many times. Not broken. Just out of place. Much like a clutch fork in a stick shift auto/truck tranny. Samcking don on the concrete could have dislodged that fork.

Hopefully it is dislodged, not broken.

Cheers,

George.

I don't know that machine. I'd probably remember it if I had worked on one.

wierdscience
03-13-2009, 01:44 AM
I see lifting pegs for cable slings front and back just below the headstock base casting.Only thing is where are the ones for the tailstock end?

Is that inverted V shaped piece on the front of the chip pan edge a clutch stop?Looks like a good way to prevent a crash.