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ligito
06-12-2009, 10:58 PM
I have started on my black iron pipe install and have been looking for a new compressor.

I got a couple of posters warning me about the Ingersoll Rand single stage
SS5L5 5 HP, single phase, vertical 60 Gal. compressor.

My pocket book would prefer a single stage and I don't know if I will ever require higher pressures again.

Is the Ingersoll Rand 2340L5 2 stage a better, or good choice?

What do you suggest?

Robo
06-12-2009, 11:33 PM
If you go with the ir get the 2475 pump its bigger and will run slower on a 5hp motor. I would try to get an older 2 stage unit were it me.

ligito
06-12-2009, 11:42 PM
If you go with the ir get the 2475 pump its bigger and will run slower on a 5hp motor. I would try to get an older 2 stage unit were it me.

What model compressor uses the 2475 pump?

gnm109
06-13-2009, 01:25 AM
I don't know the pump numbers but I wouldn't want anything except an 80 gallon two stage with a five hp rated motor.. WIth a setup like that you can get up to 20 SCFM at 90 psi. Sure, they're expensive but you'll probably never need another one. An air compressor is something that you might want to pony up for.

I have a vertical since I didn't have room for a horizontal. Either one is fine if you have the room. I think a vertical may be easier to drain but that's another issue.

A single stage 60 gallon will always be cycling while you're running your bead blast cabinet or some other heavy air usage. JMO. YMMV.

.

radkins
06-13-2009, 01:57 AM
Even a two stage piston pump will not make 20 CFM@90 PSI on only 5 HP, 16 maybe and of course the tank will have nothing to do with CFM. Actually the difference between a 60 gallon and an 80 gallon tank is going to be very little and will make no difference in performance, it will however have fewer start/run (but longer) cycles during any given work period. An 80 gallon tank vs a 60 gallon does have a VERY slight advantage in reducing the number of cycles during a work period but not enough advantage to warrant spending much money on so look for the most SCFM and a quality motor rather than the size of the tank, a big tank does not make a big compressor.


When looking at the motor power the AMP rating on the data plate is a much better indicator of actual power than the HP rating.

PTSideshow
06-13-2009, 07:44 AM
Something else to consider when looking for a compressor. Atlas-Copco a large Company that seems to be buying up compressor brands world-wide Assembles 8 brands in the US. From parts from the US and other.

What complicates the mater more is some brands use more than one maker for their compressors.
A lot of Husky's are assemble in the same plant as Campbell-Hausfelds,Kobalt's, Wall Mart and some Craftsman.

Harbor Freight USA, Chicago Pneumatic,and some other Craftsman are made by Atlas-Copco in Rock Hill NC

Most of the Stamped tanks are manufactured in Va or Indiana.
If there is a VH stamped on the pump or tag for the compressor unit, It means that the pump unit was assembled in China.(Husky,C-H,Kobalt,Wal Mart)

The electric motors can be assembled from any where. no matter what name is on them.

Emerson or Dorr motors can be from Mexico, US, Canada or all points between. Dorr Electric motor company is owned by Granger's but they don't sell their own brand in house.

Whether it is Baldor, Emerson,Dorr, WEG most are assembled in Mexico. Cheaper shipping

The Emerson's on the IR's @ Tractor Supply where from Mexico.

The tanks, guards, hardware, plumbing items,some controls are sourced from US companies but can be of foreign origin.
So that adds another layer to the made in the USA.

In case you are wondering If you see North America, North American or made in North America. It is a pretty good bet that it is made in Mexico.

The Louisville ladder line and company along with a number of the smaller ladder companies are now owned by a Mexican company. They don't like selling parts other than the safety related one mandated by the feds here and in Canada.
The lady at the call service center told me my ladder (aluminum) 1999 was told old and to by a new one for a plastic rail cap that broke over the winter!

PTSideshow
06-13-2009, 08:08 AM
Duplicate post

Robo
06-13-2009, 10:13 AM
What model compressor uses the 2475 pump?

Off hand not sure but grainger sells them so you can look it up there.

Robo
06-13-2009, 10:20 AM
Something else I noticed not long ago at HF was they have a pump on their gas powered air compressors that looks very much like the inline 2 stage pump Eaton sells (which is a copy of a saylor beale). I did not see it on an 80 gallon tank with an electric motor but believe it might be available.

radkins
06-13-2009, 11:14 AM
I have a buddy who has the HF US General two stage and it is a darn good compressor! This thing has been used in his auto body shop for well over a year now and sees very heavy use, it runs relatively quiet, is very efficient (recharges quickly) does not get hot and the motor does not seem to be overloaded at shut-off like some compressors. I would buy one of these WAY before I would buy the over priced and over hyped Ingersoll.

jkilroy
06-13-2009, 11:41 AM
I've got a two stage Eaton that I have been very happy with, price was great, shipping was so cheap as to be hard to believe. I got the three phase version of this with a horizontal tank.

http://www.eatoncompressor.com/catalog/item/504747/6980263.htm

I see they have upgraded to an baldor motor and the price is the same as two years ago.

PTSideshow
06-13-2009, 01:12 PM
Something else I noticed not long ago at HF was they have a pump on their gas powered air compressors that looks very much like the inline 2 stage pump Eaton sells (which is a copy of a saylor beale). I did not see it on an 80 gallon tank with an electric motor but believe it might be available.
HF pumps are made by Atlas-Copco, They own pump and compressor companies in most countries and most of the made (or assembled in the USA HF compressors) are their pumps gas or electric which might be the same pump as the saylor beale. Which they might own along with Eaton now a days they are an Italian construction and mining equipment company. They current pumps where being shipped in from Italy.
:)

Fasttrack
06-13-2009, 01:28 PM
Check out Gardner-Denver ... how would 2032 acfm at 125 psi suite your needs? :D (They do make smaller models, but I expect they are pricey. But just think what you could do with 2032 acfm ... lol)

John Stevenson
06-13-2009, 01:36 PM
Both mine are Hydrovane 15 cfm's run that quiet you can have a conversation on the phone at the side of one and stand you cup on one whist it's running.

This is same as mine but tank mounted.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/hydrovane-15-compressor_W0QQitemZ330336061074

ligito
06-13-2009, 01:40 PM
I need a 5 HP, single phase, single, or 2 stage, 60 Gal vertical tank 230 Volt.
I found an Ingersoll Rand SS5L5 locally, for a little over $700 but a couple of posters said they had problems with them.

If the 2 stage 2340L5 IR is okay, it's around $1300.

I haven't shopped at any other local compressor stores, yet.

Quetico Bob
06-13-2009, 03:24 PM
How about 2 smaller units in tandem, just turn one off when you donít need the larger volume. I use 4 when I need to sand blast.

Cheers, Bob

Quetico Bob
06-13-2009, 04:13 PM
Ligito
Maybe someone has already metioned and I missed but.
Just be careful how the compressor you purchased is labeled. SCFM vs CFM. I do not fully understand the principles, donít think anyone does except the marketing engineers. But from what I have read and I may be wrong. SCFM is the air going into the intake and CFM is what is coming out compressed. Big difference. Actually I had never seen the term SCFM until the last few years. Might be worth looking into.

For example, I own a Hitachi 2hp twin horizontal tank. Have had it for almost 20 years. It makes more air than the 2yr old 60 gallon 5 hp el cheapo box store unit here on site. Not to mention the 3hp Porter Cableís here as well, cause, well, their not worth mentioning from my experience with them and we have 3. Quality compressors at the right price mark are hard to find.:)

Cheers, Bob

PTSideshow
06-13-2009, 04:30 PM
Here you go more info than you probably want to read
http://www.chpower.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/chCat_10051_10001_10646_-1___

Two stagehttp://air.ingersollrand.com/IS/modelComp.aspx/item/12878

Single stage http://air.ingersollrand.com/IS/modelComp.aspx/item/12885

Campbell-Hausfeldhttp://www.chpower.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/chHome_10051_10001_-1


Fed's fact sheet on compressor rating PDF http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=10&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.compressedairchallenge.org%2F library%2Ffactsheets%2Ffactsheet08.pdf&ei=S6r1Sf3YMYP0Mu2z9bEP&usg=AFQjCNEIHzNoY-xbbqdO1cdgpe7u4aQU_A

A source for info http://www.pneumatic-source.com/

Chicago Pneumatic http://www.cp.com/usen/

Air compressors direct http://www.aircompressorsdirect.com/products_new.php

The company that builds air compressors to be brand by the sellers. Including HF Assembled in the USA line.http://www.nuair.it/portal//index.php?lang=english

HF line 60 gallon http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=93274

HF 80 gallon http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=90836

http://emersonmotors.com/products/index.htm

Everything you always wanted to know about compressor motors PDF sheets for the WEG motors.http://www.wegcatalog.com/pdf-08/08-09CompressorDuty.pdf

WEG United States http://www.weg.net/us

A O Smithhttp://www.aosmithmotors.com/

Baldor motorshttp://www.baldor.com/

Leeson http://www.leeson.com/

Dorr motors the current owners (Granger's which they don't sell them in the catalog or stores) doesn't have a web site the only ones I have found was to do with the old company history.
:D

PTSideshow
06-13-2009, 04:34 PM
You want to make sure that SCFM means sustained air flow @ 70 degrees F. And not "Standard" or any of the other marketing hype. If its has ISO 1217 is the standard section number of the standards. Or "Actual" is also good.
:D

ligito
06-13-2009, 04:42 PM
I'm trying to find out about other's opinions regarding quality and personal favorites, since poor quality was mentioned about the IR single stage.

I've read specs, I want preferences related to experiences.

radkins
06-13-2009, 06:37 PM
I'm trying to find out about other's opinions regarding quality and personal favorites, since poor quality was mentioned about the IR single stage.

I've read specs, I want preferences related to experiences.


If you want a compressor that will outlast you then Quincy is the way to go! Quincy is one of the oldest manufacturers in the business and their quality is legendary. Quincy has always been a bit pricey but lately they have been getting a bit more competitive and are being sold at some of the larger outlets such as Northern tool.

How about this for around $1200, two stage cast iron and with a Baldor motor and made in USA!

www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200350475_200350475


Notice that Baldor is rated at 21 AMPS meaning that 5 HP is conservatively rated instead of exaggerated like a lot of outfits.

airsmith282
06-13-2009, 09:03 PM
is Ingersoll Rand made by them selfs stil or did they also sell out to black and decker well if they did there is the problem right there, just like dewalt delta roybi,just to name a few or lets not forget portercable sold out to B&D as well so now all thoes brands are JUNK JUNK JUNK,,

thank god i got my rigid tools before the sell out i heard they sold out to B&D as well but i could be wronge i hope i am i hate B&D JUNK its just JUNK

they cant even make a palm sander that last more then 1 hour,,

iam sure there are also of good brands out there for compressors, CH has been in the business for well over 100 years and make some really good stuff and some really crapy stuff , you get what you pay for 90% of the time.. iam looking next year ill invest in a more powerfull compressor if things take off they way iam hoping it will in my venture, if not ill keep what i got and use it till it fries,,

i do agree it does not matter how many galllons you have for the CFM but it sure does when it comes to how long the air last before the compressor starts up again..

anyhow hope you get a good deal on a nice compressor,

radkins
06-14-2009, 12:03 AM
i do agree it does not matter how many galllons you have for the CFM but it sure does when it comes to how long the air last before the compressor starts up again..



Does it, really? If you are, for instance, using a sandblaster and the compressor kicks on in about 1 minute with a 60 gallon tank it should last another 20 seconds before kicking on with an 80 gallon tank, 20 seconds and then even that is lost to the extra recharge time of the larger tank so it is a trade off and nothing is gained. If the 60 gallon tank is kicking on at an annoying rate then an extra 20 gallons of tank capacity is not going to help very much and it would still be just as annoying, extra CFM however can make all the difference in the world. The tank can not put out more air than the pump puts in and you still run out of air but more CFM is replacing the air in the tank faster, THAT makes a difference. The fact is that over any given work period, say 30 minutes for instance, you will spend exactly the same amount of time using vs waiting with an 80 gallon vs a 60 gallon if all else is equal. A bigger tank does NOT increase a compressor's performance in spite of the very common misconception, that is not the purpose of the larger tank. The larger tank will certainly change the cycle rate but the difference between a 60 gallon and an 80 gallon is not going to make much difference and the difference it does make is going to be in a SLIGHTLY lower power consumption and theoretically a bit less wear and tear. These slight advantages are of course due to fewer high load start-up cycles and this is certainly desirable but hardly worth spending a lot of money to get and DEFINITELY not worth passing up more CFM for, but that happens all the time. It is easy to find 80 gallon tank compressors with less CFM than some 60 gallon units and people will run straight to the biggest tank in the store and buy that tank instead of the CFM that would make their compressor more useful. The bottom line is get the most CFM and quality that you can afford and the larger tank is nice if you can get it for next to nothing but don't let it be the deciding factor and DON'T pass up CFM to get it!

A bigger tank DOES NOT make a bigger compressor!