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View Full Version : Mill arrival day Part 1



Sleazey
08-28-2009, 09:17 PM
My JET JVM-386-3 from Tool Zone arrived Wednesday 2009/08/26. I had it sent to a local rigging company (C&H Rigging, Houston, TX, and I highly recommend them).

The owner/ceo himself came out to do the site inspection yesterday, and the truck brought it out today, Friday.
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6kgfQdbI/AAAAAAAAAsY/4nQILhMSR3Y/s800/P8280001.JPG

Easy boys, easy!
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6m6nEttI/AAAAAAAAAtI/O965F9nVesU/s800/P8280004.JPG

There really is a JET something in that big crate!
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6oZQsprI/AAAAAAAAAtY/DwYU1giig7k/s800/P8280006.JPG

To be continued.

The long drive up the drive way
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6pE4L-HI/AAAAAAAAAtg/hcIbH_Ta8wU/s800/P8280007.JPG

Sleazey
08-28-2009, 09:18 PM
Honey, I'm home!
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6rhsWeyI/AAAAAAAAAuI/PQINpFEu84o/s800/P8280011.JPG

Ta-da!
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6sW3EPhI/AAAAAAAAAuc/8x5hG4db7_g/s800/P8280013.JPG

Mcgyver
08-28-2009, 09:41 PM
haha, another perfectly normal guy goes mental, welcome to the club. I've just done a deal to add my 3rd full size mill in a similar sized garage.... better get the little woman in the habit of parking outside. congrats

A.K. Boomer
08-28-2009, 09:46 PM
Check your wiring in the little motor panel and make sure its sound --- tons of little bugs to take care of but once your done it should be a very solid little machine, you might have a run capacitor to replace within the first half hour of using --- then it might be smooth sailing for years.



http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r249/AK_Boomer/Cnv0001.jpg

A.K. Boomer
08-28-2009, 09:51 PM
better get the little woman in the habit of parking outside. congrats


Mcgyver, I always thought you had a good grasp on your priorities!

If you want to be a nice guy about it get her an ice scraper for the winter time (you can pass it off as a X-mas gift if you have a mild late fall for cold temps):D

rockrat
08-28-2009, 10:21 PM
Ha, let the little woman park outside for a year. After that, she will beg you to build a shop so that she can have the garage back.

Congrats, now for the real money output, TOOLING! :)

rock~

MickeyD
08-28-2009, 10:34 PM
Sleazey, I hope that you got them to take it off of the pallet for you. I always found that getting something narrow and tall off of a pallet was worse than getting the pallet off of the trailer and into the shop. I just got an 1800 pound saw (400mm Kaltenbach) that is very top heavy and tall and ramping it down from the trailer and off the pallet was not the most fun thing that I did all week.

Sleazey
08-28-2009, 10:57 PM
Uh, no, I asked them to leave it on the pallet. I am going to be disassembling it quite a bit for thorough cleaning and lubing.

I do have an engine hoist. I may have to remove part of the pallet to get the hoist close enough, just the parts that don't have any weight on them.

I hope I don't regret not getting them to remove the pallet.

Bill Pace
08-28-2009, 11:10 PM
Getting it off the pallet can be a booger ---- One thing I've found (and I got this from another HSM'er:D) break out the saw - skil/sabre/bayonet, whatever, and whittle the pallet down to a manageable size -- some times you can just slip it off the side -- once it dont have a side anymore

Mcgyver
08-28-2009, 11:38 PM
If you want to be a nice guy about it get her an ice scraper for the winter time (you can pass it off as a X-mas gift if you have a mild late fall for cold temps):D

you're the man, thats xmas '09 taken care of. hehe, I once gave a car vac, yeah sure some short term pain, but i got admitted into the cave man hall of fame :D

Jim Shaper
08-29-2009, 12:47 AM
Ha, let the little woman park outside for a year. After that, she will beg you to build a shop so that she can have the garage back.

Congrats, now for the real money output, TOOLING! :)

rock~

Funny, I just put in a sub panel for my welders in the garage (which had been living at my parents house) and informed the mrs that spatter would make a mess of her new car's paint: and low and behold I got full support for the shop addition. :p

The shop's been finished two years now, and she still ain't parking in "her garage" yet. :D

Highpower
08-29-2009, 12:53 AM
I hope I don't regret not getting them to remove the pallet.
Yeah, I made that mistake too..... :o

Ken_Shea
08-29-2009, 08:08 AM
That had to be an exciting day, bet the neighbors all had their curtains drawn back :D

A.K. Boomer
08-29-2009, 09:28 AM
I once gave a car vac, yeah sure some short term pain, but i got admitted into the cave man hall of fame :D

(you wanna see a girl come uncorked get her a toaster)

Realistically car vacs and ice scrapers are just fine as long as there's another package under the tree, doesn't have to be a big one, but it should contain a substance that's capable of sharpening your carbide tooling.

A.K. Boomer
08-29-2009, 10:36 AM
[QUOTE=Sleazey]
Easy boys, easy!
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6m6nEttI/AAAAAAAAAtI/O965F9nVesU/s800/P8280004.JPG


Boy you said it!, in my opinion that was a high risk move, their lucky that crates been updated from the way mine was but its still no guarantee --- my mill was of course bolted to the base but the outer base planks were not bolted the way yours are - they were only nailed (they must have lost a few mills in shipping)

Looking at the pic on the truck that's quite an angle, that one strap is just an illusion as its only wrapped around the cardboard box and I think is just holding the hand lift,
The mill is 1550lbs and almost as tall as the big boys with only a 18" base sideways, the way its sitting on the truck is not fore and aft but sideways:eek:
This means that the plank bolts are not a safety backup as much as they are counting on them, that's wrong...
Now take note of his last pic in the other post - the one with the machine minus the cardboard and you will see the outer plank bolts, im assuming there's a plank bolt under the pink slip?
im also assuming the plank is cracked down the center?

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/Sph6sW3EPhI/AAAAAAAAAuc/8x5hG4db7_g/s800/P8280013.JPG




you can see how stuff happens

Anyways, Sleazy --- one of the main things I found that was totally hack on my mill was the X and Y lead adjusters --- an adequate set up with piss poor follow through, they are large bronze lead adjusters that fit in a nice boss - they have elongated slots for adjusting the lash, they used very poor quality allen head screws minus any washers - they sink into the elongated slots and spread them out (right from the factory:rolleyes: )
I went and got some high quality allens with hardened washers and fiber malleted my slots back to size and filed down the boogers, took care of it nice,
more critical info on adjusters;
they had them loaded the incorrect way, you have a choice on how your going to "load" your lead threads to take up the adjusting slack ( clock wise or CCW) and this equates directly to how the leads load their drive boss or adjuster screws -- in one method you load the lead screw mounting and adjusting nuts to move the table (you don't want this) the other method presses the bronze leads nuts directly into the table drive boss, this is what you want, this takes all loads off the screw nuts adjusters and simply leaves them and their elongated slots for what they were designed for - adjusting.

One last note on leads; once you get inside to inspect these you will find that all you have to do to convert them into mini-gearboxes that actually hold fluid is a couple O-rings for each the X and the Y,
there is a massive chamfer in the lead drive boss that allows for this,
you still of course keep your one shot filling them up all the time but instead of it just spitting on the lead screws and then leaking out it fills the drive boss and the only place the fluid can escape is between the lead screw and its bronze nuts, I went through mine right from the start and havent had to adjust them since.

Maybe they corrected these problems by now, take a flashlight and shine under the table and look at lead nut adjuster allens -- do they have washers on them now? or are they half sunk into the elongated slot and spreading it out?

Let me know if I can help --- I disassembled my entire machine and went through it before I ran it and am glad I did --- there was casting sand in the knee drive bevel gears.

John Stevenson
08-29-2009, 11:03 AM
Why didn't they drive up and back off? use gravity to your own advantage ?

Ken_Shea
08-29-2009, 11:17 AM
Why didn't they drive up and back off? use gravity to your own advantage ?

Weight loading on trailer.

John Stevenson
08-29-2009, 11:37 AM
Weight loading on trailer.

???

Six wheel truck or what we know as one, we only count wheels as one.
Over here that would be rated at 26 tonnes or 58,000# in your parlence, nowhere near what a roll back body and fork truck weighs.

Ken_Shea
08-29-2009, 11:47 AM
Not how much John, but where it's loaded.

That fork lift weighs likely (guestimated by the size and looks) about 12K and would be mostly aft of the wheels if loaded as you mentioned.

.

John Stevenson
08-29-2009, 11:58 AM
Hyster XL2 weighs 16, 643#
That truck will have an axle loading of 8 ton front and 9 tons per rear, so rear axle loading will be 18 ton or 40,000# approx
Less the unladen weight and plus the Jet it will still have bags over no matter where the load is situated.

Ken_Shea
08-29-2009, 12:10 PM
You asked a question John, I gave an answer, that answer has not changed with your figures, it's not important to me that you agree, you load it your way and I'll load mine. My opinion is, they loaded correctly, there is more to safe loading then meeting legal weight limits. Personally, I would not want all that weight hanging out the back for no other reason but handling in emergency situations.

Now back to Sleazey's post :D

John Stevenson
08-29-2009, 05:55 PM
You didn't give an answer, you hazarded a guess and even got the truck mixed up for a trailer.
No matter what way it's loaded it will still be in legal limits and when backed off their is no way the load can run away.

As as for having all that weight hanging out back what happens when you have to load a truck to max legal limits.
Do you tell your gaffer I don't want to load this right to the rear because it might not handle correctly.

OK you load it your way, I'll load it mine which I do and I am responsible for driving it, all the way up to 44 tonnes gross weight or 98,560 # in your parlance which is what my license is for.

As an aside I would never move a machine on one of those see saws any way, too top heavy and has the ability to tip at the slighest change.
I always sling and hang when doing a move, short of a sling breaking which should never happen if you use rated slings when hanging it's impossible to tip, use gravity to your advantage.

Here's one I did earlier.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/first_delivery%201.jpg

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/first_delivery%202.jpg

That's 3 tonnes of machine being lowered over the phone line.
Carried on a small 14 tonne 4 wheel truck with 10 tonne Hiab.

.

Sleazey
08-29-2009, 06:38 PM
Boomer, that's a nice tip on the O-rings.

I'll particularly examine those details once I get it disassembled. I can't quite visualize what you are describing, but looking at it should make it all plain.

[EDIT]
I decided to go look, and then realized my little point-'n-shoot could give me a better image than my eyes could. It took several tries, but these show plainly what you were talking about.

This is from the left end (as the operator faces the table) of the lead nut and the lead screw:
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/SpmxwoQIptI/AAAAAAAACTw/6QPAzFa-Dj0/s800/P8290005.JPG

From the right side; you can see the slots and the allen screws. Don't see any washers though.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_pwdtJMC2EjY/SpmxzgHFiTI/AAAAAAAACT0/2oh7YJupWWM/s800/P8290013.JPG

gnm109
08-29-2009, 09:11 PM
Perhaps it just the angle of the photo but those screws look like the more rounded ones for ball screws. Does your machine have ball screws?

As far as cleaning and lubricating, you shouldn't have too much cleaning to do. Perhaps more lubricating and checking than cleaning.

At 1,500 pounds, you shouldn't have too much trouble holding it up with an engine hoist while you remove the pallet. It only needs to go up a little. That's how I got my Enco lathe off the back of my truck some years ago. I just lifted it a bit, then had the truck driven away and quickly lowered the lathe to the floor.

It looks like a nice machine. :)

Sleazey
08-29-2009, 10:39 PM
No it's just the angle of the shot, combined with the flash and the focus depth. They are definitely acme style threads.

A.K. Boomer
08-29-2009, 11:35 PM
Sleazey, you have the identical set-up but your leads were assembled by a much better worker, imagine those allens tightened to the point of being countersunk about a third of the way and spreading the thin outer flange out, i would still put nice hardened washers on them and make damn sure they are adjusted in the direction of loading the lead nut threads into the boss - not into the adjuster screws - world of difference for rigidity.

I know Iv covered many of the quirks but once you get them out you should be very impressed with this little 2/3rds scale turret knee mill --- the heavy hitters are pretty solid --- like the table, i cant get .0002" of deviation on my table from one end to the other, that's awesome,
The mill head is lacking the fore and aft head knuckle and I had to stone in my heads side to side pivot to get it to tram to my specs,
other than that Im glad I got it, it really is the perfect size for the HSM'er.

Congrats on your new baby.

Sleazey
08-30-2009, 02:45 AM
They had them loaded the incorrect way, you have a choice on how your going to "load" your lead threads to take up the adjusting slack ( clock wise or CCW) and this equates directly to how the leads load their drive boss or adjuster screws -- in one method you load the lead screw mounting and adjusting nuts to move the table (you don't want this) the other method presses the bronze leads nuts directly into the table drive boss, this is what you want, this takes all loads off the screw nuts adjusters and simply leaves them and their elongated slots for what they were designed for - adjusting.


Ok, I've been trying to figure out from first principles, which way you would turn the screw nut adjusters to "load" the lead threads as you say.

Do you turn the adjusting nuts CW to screw them out toward the viewer (further from the lead nut), or CCW to screw them in tighter onto the nut?

It seems like in one of the two directions of table movement the adjusting nuts will always bear the load of moving the table.

I think my problem is because I don't know how the table boss, the adjusting nuts, and the lead nut are arranged inside.

Highpower
08-30-2009, 03:38 AM
In my line of thinking, you want the tension of the two adjusting nuts pulling TOWARD each other - do you not? :confused:

A.K. Boomer
08-30-2009, 07:56 AM
It is somewhat strange to think about, Highpower's description is right as you want the outer sides of the lead nuts threads being the ones used to move the table,


Here's another description That might be helpful and it will answer your cw/ccw question as all you will have to do to figure that out is look at your lead screw in comparison to your lead screw adjusting nut;

Imagine turning the lead screw nut in the direction that try's to stretch (not compress) the lead screws threads that are inbetween the two nuts (the solid mount lead screw nut and the adjustable)

This will ensure that when a lead is used to move the table it gets pushed into the solid mount instead of trying to get pulled away from it and counting on its little adjuster screws.

keep in mind due to the nature of the loose cut acme threads - the required free play and the adjustable method being used that either way you turn the adjuster nut (cw/ccw) results in only one lead nut being utilized to move the table when the lead screw handle is cranked --- that's why its so critical to get the load direction correct, remember - when one nut gets loaded in this situation the other gets to totally relax.

Also keep in mind that im not a machinist --- but that doesn't matter because were talking about a machine and im a mechanic;) -- this is what I do.

Isn't it amazing how one little detail can be so critical?
Not only did they over tighten my lead nut adjuster holder screws and pump them almost half way through the elongated flange they also had the nut loaded in the wrong direction so the little already compromised holder screws were being used to drive the table... real nice.

By the way you took some excellent pics of the situation.

platypus2020
08-30-2009, 09:13 AM
All of these photos and info, I had to go check my JVM 836-1, my unit has the washers on the adjusting screws from the factory. I've been very happy with my mill, I did add power feeds on the X, Y and Z axis, and a 4" riser block, to gain more room under the quill.

jack

A.K. Boomer
08-30-2009, 09:57 AM
All of these photos and info, I had to go check my JVM 836-1, my unit has the washers on the adjusting screws from the factory. I've been very happy with my mill, I did add power feeds on the X, Y and Z axis, and a 4" riser block, to gain more room under the quill.

jack


Platy, I bet you got one of the early ones --- Taiwan,

before I final ordered mine I wanted to verify that they still were being built there and they said absolutely - I then said OK, but added if something changed and they found out it switched to china "Don't Ship"

They shipped and it was china:mad:

I raised the mother of all stinks and refused to unpack and accept the mill,
it was verified by a girl I talked to about me stating not to ship if it was china,
They dragged their feet for a month and I gave them 3 options -- either find me a taiwan, or come pick up the mill and give me my money back - or discount the mill to the tune of $650.00 (that's after already getting it at a very low price) they chose the latter and I bought a nice DRO and R/Table with the surplus.

When I see how Sleazey's leads were assembled it makes me think my mill may have been the worst of both worlds --- caught in the transition stage and on the china end of it.

platypus2020
08-30-2009, 11:02 AM
Yes, my unit says Taiwan, the JDP-20EVS/230 drill press I have is also from Taiwan, I guess I just lucked out. I thought that Jet was still sourcing from Taiwan, I hadn't realized it gone to China.

The 4" riser block, I got from Grizzly, its meant for their G6760 mill, a carbon copy of the Jet, the block part # is H8107.

jack

Alistair Hosie
08-30-2009, 01:26 PM
I have an idea a stupid one but an idea why not pour gasoline around the pallet and burn it from under the mill ?What do you mean get lost Mr Hosie!! It was just a thought :D:D seriously you have a lovely home and nice big shop space please have years of fun enjoying your new machine or toy as it might become:DAlistair

Black_Moons
08-30-2009, 01:54 PM
Cut as much of the pallet away with a recipicateing saw as you can, then lift your mill up with a cherry picker and pull the remains of the pallet out, simple :) (cuting rest of pallet away lets cherry picker legs get in there)