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brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 11:59 AM
My imported milling machine (Busy Bee CT129) has a provision for setting "stops" on the left/right travel of the table (shown in highlighted circles). I find them very handy, and use them a fair bit. The only problem is that the machine has no provisions made for travel stops on the Y axis of the table, front to rear. In my continuing saga of trying to keep myself occupied until I get some "real work" I have decided to design and build some "adjustable stops" for the Y axis travel of my mill.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/MILLTABLESTOPS001-MARKEDUP.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 12:00 PM
This mill is a good value for the money it cost, but it had the most mickey mouse table locks for the X axis that I have ever seen. They were a lever type made out of plastic, and were long enough that they hung down and interfered with the Y axis travel. After managing to break both of them off because of their poor design, I built a new lock "handle"out of brass and installed it in the right hand hole, but left the left hand hole empty. Whenever I add to a machine, I like to use a machined surface as my "mounting point" so I decided to use this vacant threaded hole, and add a second tapped hole below it.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/MILLTABLESTOPS003.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/MILLTABLESTOPS004.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 12:00 PM
As in all things, I decided to model it in 3D cad before I started cutting any metal. The red colored bracket is attached to the face of the Y axis slide, using the two threaded holes previously mentioned. The yellow bracket is a support which gets mounted to the front of the mill base. It supports the grey round rod (1/2" diameter). This round rod runs from the front to the rear of the base, where it is held by a second bracket. The blue "adjustable stops" are threaded 1/4"-20 and the 2" long socket head capscrews which pass though them seat in a slot which is milled in the 1/2" round rod. The rod is pinned in the yellow bracket so that it can not rotate. This serves to keep the blue "adjustable stops" at the correct angle for easy access.The red bracket doesn't actually touch the 1/2" rod----it has a 17/32" clearance hole though it. The model shown here shows the table at its maximum travel towards the operator in the Y axis. Everything clears the handwheel quite well, as I hate pinching my fingers when I am turning a handwheel.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/TABLEATMAXTRAVEL-Y-AXISOPERATORSIDE.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 12:01 PM
Here it is shown with the table at "mid travel" in the Y axis. The two "adjustable stops" are shown clamped to the grey round rod in a couple of arbitrary positions that I selected. You can see how the red bracket bolted to the face of the Y axis slide will stop when it contacts the adjustable stops. In this model you are able to see the green colored rear bracket which is mounted to the machine base as well.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/TABLEATMIDTRAVEL-Y-AXIS.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 12:01 PM
This model shows the table at its maximum travel away from the operator. The brackets supporting the rod and the length of the rod itself are designed so that when the table is at its maximum travel in either direction in the Y axis, there is still 11/16" clearance between the red plate and the brackets. The blue "adjustable stops" are 5/8" wide. I put the slot in the grey rod for two reasons----One as mentioned, to hold the "adjustable stops" at the most convenient angle, and Two--so that any burrs raised by tightening the 1/4" socket head capscrews won't mes up the outer surface of the 1/2" rod.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/TABLEATMAXTRAVEL-Y-AXISAWAYFROMOPER.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 12:02 PM
Here is a "close-up" that shows it a little better.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/closeupview.jpg

Carld
11-04-2009, 12:56 PM
Nice design brian.

Bill Pace
11-04-2009, 01:10 PM
Well, on the bright side of your 'forced retirement' -- you keep churning out all these neat designs, gadgets, gizmos, etc for the rest of us:D

John Stevenson
11-04-2009, 01:32 PM
Could have done with something like this on that crap Bridgeport the other day, took me ages to find the right length spanner to jam between the table and the column.

.

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 01:48 PM
One down--------
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/FIRSTBRACKET001.jpg

Bguns
11-04-2009, 01:53 PM
How Bridgeport did it..
Rather simple, at bottom of page:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/bridgeport/page7.html

If you did not want to cut a T slot ...2 L shaped pieces, could be screwed to a thin backplate to make fab easier...

Think I will make a profiler attachment for mine...

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 04:07 PM
Another part made-----the rear support bracket for the 1/2" round rod. I would have had the front bracket made too, except my poor old band-saw blade has gotten so dull that I could chew the bracket out of 3/4" plate faster than the saw will cut it. ----Had to phone the missus and grovel and whine so she will stop and pick up a new blade for me on the way home from work.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/REARSUPPORTBRACKET002.jpg

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 06:53 PM
These aren't going to be much use if you don't have a CT129 mill from BusyBee, but since I had to make them for myself anyways, I'll post them just in case----
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/ADJUSTABLESTOP-DRAWING.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/BRACKET-1-DRAWING.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/BRACKET-2-DRAWING.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/ROD-DRAWING.jpg

loose nut
11-04-2009, 07:03 PM
Here is a "close-up" that shows it a little better.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/closeupview.jpg

Shouldn't the red bit be a bit heavier it looks like it could bend if you run up hard against it.

John Stevenson
11-04-2009, 07:04 PM
How Bridgeport did it..
Rather simple, at bottom of page:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/bridgeport/page7.html

If you did not want to cut a T slot ...2 L shaped pieces, could be screwed to a thin backplate to make fab easier...



I like it, thanks a lot.

Some one gave me two of these stops off a surface grinder that have micro adjustment on them, can't remember who, may have been Peter Neil off this board ?

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bedstop3.jpg

The hex nut clamps the stop and the knurled nut nips the micro sdjustable bit up.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bedstop2.jpg


Would be easy to make similar items as the chances of finding another set are virtually nil. These are very rigid, when used in conjunction with the DRO they are very repeatable.

.

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 07:05 PM
That red bit is made from 1018 steel. Its not going to bend. Remember, I'm the guy turning the handwheel---the tables not going a hundred miles an hour.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/PLATE-1-DRAWING.jpg

John Stevenson
11-04-2009, 07:16 PM
If it's not going to bend at least it will flex and alter any dead setting you have.
Why not beef it up out of 1/4" or 3/8" plate, not like it's a space critical part.

.

brian Rupnow
11-04-2009, 08:01 PM
If it's not going to bend at least it will flex and alter any dead setting you have.
Why not beef it up out of 1/4" or 3/8" plate, not like it's a space critical part.

.

Because its already made!!!!

Frank Ford
11-04-2009, 09:04 PM
I have a little part I make hundreds at a time, and I need to mill off 3/16" of a 3/8" square steel piece and stop at a precise location each time. I tried using the stop on the power feed, but it just wouldn't repeat accurately enough, and virtually every clamp and block arrangement I tried would eventually move if I clunked into it enough times.

So I set on making a pair of X-axis stops that would be really rugged, and I surprised myself with how often I find uses for them.

Now, THIS stop I can hit really hard without losing a thou:

http://www.frets.com/HomeShopTech/Tooling/MillTableStop/milltablestop01.jpg

http://www.frets.com/HomeShopTech/Tooling/MillTableStop/milltablestop04.jpg

This about that:

http://www.frets.com/HomeShopTech/Tooling/MillTableStop/milltablestop.html

Doozer
11-04-2009, 09:21 PM
brian-
"Because its already made!!!!"

Seriously, scrap it and make one out of 3/8 stock.

In my travels, I have seen many a man defend a bad decision, and even spend tons of money trying to engineer a work around. Sometimes one has to change gears and proceed with a different plan. Almost always, it is money well spent. Think of the old inefficient plan as a sunk cost, and take only from it the experience of what will not work. Sometimes it is all part of the process. Don't ever be afraid to scrap an old idea for a new and better one.

--Doozer

PS- Sweet Frank!

Astronowanabe
11-04-2009, 09:36 PM
brian-
"Because its already made!!!!"

Seriously, scrap it and make one out of 3/8 stock.

In my travels, I have seen many a man defend a bad decision, and even spend tons of money trying to engineer a work around. Sometimes one has to change gears and proceed with a different plan. Almost always, it is money well spent. Think of the old inefficient plan as a sunk cost, and take only from it the experience of what will not work. Sometimes it is all part of the process. Don't ever be afraid to scrap an old idea for a new and better one.

--Doozer

PS- Sweet Frank!




I have to agree, when I saw the part made I immediately started thinking about how you might weld on some gussets to stiffen it up a bit.
heck make it out of half inch and mill just the end down if you are worried about loosing travel.
i

Davo J
11-05-2009, 03:07 AM
Hi Brian,
Great idea and I am sure it will save you alot of time. I also have to agree with the others, everything else you have made looks solid. I think you will have trouble with getting repeated results with that plate as it will flex being only 0.125" or 3.175mm.
Dave.

John Stevenson
11-05-2009, 03:48 AM
Because its already made!!!!

No you have only made the MKI

.

J Tiers
11-05-2009, 09:02 AM
Stops look good, agree with others that the best stop is the biggest and toughest.

BTW, looking at pic #1, that milling vise is interesting. It is possibly the tallest, skinniest one I have ever seen.

Is it solid despite being slightly shorter than the Sears Tower?

brian Rupnow
11-05-2009, 09:07 AM
I am pleased with my "Tilt-a-whirl" milling vice. It holds parts securely, and it does give me the option of tilt and rotate, rather than messing with the angular tram of my mill column, which will tilt but then gives a world of hurt trying to get it trammed perpendicular again. as far as the thickness of the part---I think you fellows are all wrong!!! That being said, if I find it moves, or flexes, I will post that and will post that I have made a thicker one.----Brian

brian Rupnow
11-05-2009, 11:24 AM
Bit by bit progress is being made. My lovely wife stopped and bought me a new bandsaw blade on her way home from work last night, (and then took me out for dinner!!!) . While I was waiting for her to get home I milled the slot in the 1/2" round rod, and this morning I made the front bracket and then assembled things so I could drill and tap the holes in the mill base for the bolts to hold the rear bracket in place. I had to make the front support bracket out of 2 peices, as I didn't have any 3/4" stock big enough, but that won't hurt the functionality. (In the picture, you only see one part of the front bracket----the second part will be basically a spacer. I have to run up to the hardware store now and buy a 17/32" drill and some 1/4" socket head capscrews.-----Brian
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/REARBRACKETINSTALLED001.jpg

Circlip
11-05-2009, 03:41 PM
Just shows how wrong so many can be, NO ONE on the "Other" site has had the audacity to mention they think the .125" thick plate is too thin. No matter how long one has been in "The game", how many think their baby is the ultimate answer, and resist ANY suggestion that they may have overlooked a basic problem.

Rather than make it thicker, you could always weld a stiffening rib to the front face, so that when you hit the back stop, you don't manage to deflect the plate by a few "Thou" and ruin the job.

Regards Ian

brian Rupnow
11-05-2009, 04:06 PM
Circlip--It is not my intent to go to war over the thickness of a plate. As I said in an earlier post, I THINK its okay as it is---And I did say that if I find it is too thin, I will make it thicker and let everyone know I was wrong. I do have 44 years of designing machinery and building professional quality hotrods behind me, ---and yes---I do get it wrong someimes.---But this time I don't think so.:D :D ---However---If you want to build one and use a thicker plate, then go ahead.

brian Rupnow
11-05-2009, 05:44 PM
Well boys and girls---its finished. Two days "frigging time" but it works, and it works very well. For all of you who thought my 1/8" mild steel plate was too thin----You were right!!! It worked, but it did deflect enough that I wasn't comfortable with it---so----I made another out of 1/4" plate, and it feels a lot more "solid" when the carriage hits one of the adjustable stops. I have ran the table full travel in both the X and Y axis, and nothing binds, interferes, or pinches my fingers. I think the operation was a success---Now I have to figure out something to do tomorrow-----Brian
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/FINISHED001-4.jpg

Lew Hartswick
11-05-2009, 06:45 PM
You know Brian even if the stops didn't work you should be able to put
all those fancy drawings into a top selling book. :-) My build projects
are nearly always done on loose pages of scrap paper laying around
and have many little arithmetic calculations scattered all over them.
:-)
...lew...

brian Rupnow
11-05-2009, 07:26 PM
You know Brian even if the stops didn't work you should be able to put
all those fancy drawings into a top selling book. :-) My build projects
are nearly always done on loose pages of scrap paper laying around
and have many little arithmetic calculations scattered all over them.
:-)
...lew...

Lew---I have a whole bunch of computer files on all these "projects". I save them to computer discs. I keep the 3D cad models and the digital photographs and any tech write-ups that I do. Its amazing how darn many I've accumulated over the last two years.----Brian

Circlip
11-06-2009, 04:32 AM
I do have 44 years of designing machinery and building professional quality hotrods behind me,

Wonder why it is that the old chestnuts are the best :rolleyes:

An observation by some who DON'T have your vast experience causes such embarrasment, ----Sad.

Regards Ian.

Doozer
11-06-2009, 09:33 AM
Ian- Am I supposed to bend over and worship Brians feet because he has 44 years experience?? And it is supposed to cause me embarrassment to question his design?? I don't freakin think so! Just cause someone was designing things for 44 years does not impress me. If they produce good designs and ideas, yes that is impressive. Yes, everyone has a brain fart now and then, me included. I can admit that, and I believe Brian has in this case and made his design stronger. But am I going to be embarrassed to question the design of a guy who had been doing it for 44 years? No way, I am gunna tell it like I see it. I did not see any disrespect being shown to Brian when myself and a few others suggested that he beef up his bracket. When he tried out his design, he actually did make a stronger bracket. And you are whining because a few of us questioned Brians 44 years of designing things? Well cry me a river. 44 years means nothing to me. I have worked with a few guys who had been designing for about as long, and their stuff was total trash. If they were under me, I would have fired them. Experience or not. A good working design is what counts. If the design can be tutored or mentored into a capable product, the end result is what counts. But if you are gunna play Mother Teresa and try and guilt us into feeling like we just drowned a sack of kittens in the river, you have another thing coming.
--Doozer

lynnl
11-06-2009, 09:54 AM
Uhh.., excuse me Doozer, but I think you're mis-interpreting Circlip's point (by, like maybe about 180 degrees!) :)

brian Rupnow
11-06-2009, 12:34 PM
WoW Doozer!!! Sorry you hate me!!!----I'll try to do better.----Brian

Doozer
11-06-2009, 12:39 PM
I'm sorry you think I hate you Brian, because I don't.
I hate Ian acting like the guardian of the free world.

--Doozer

Peter N
11-06-2009, 12:50 PM
I'm sorry you think I hate you Brian, because I don't.
I hate Ian acting like the guardian of the free world.

--Doozer

Surely Not!
Didn't that job belong to RavingSerf?? :D :D

Circlip
11-06-2009, 03:09 PM
You got me beat there Doozer, I don't think I wrote what you think you read.

Regards Ian.

brian Rupnow
11-06-2009, 03:16 PM
Being well known for "Not being able to leave well enough alone" I decided that since I had room for pretty knurled finger knobs, I would make some.----Thus justifying the money I spent to buy a knurler which has never been put to any practical use since I bought it! I had a piece of 3/4" "mystery metal" laying around, so I drilled it out to 5/16" diameter, turned down the heads of the 1/4" shcs. for a press fit, then silver soldered things together. I drilled the hole all the way though, so if I need to I can still tighten the shcs. with an allen wrench.
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn294/BrianRupnow/KnurledKnobs001-1.jpg

John Stevenson
11-06-2009, 05:20 PM
Why are the adjustable stops that long ?

.

brian Rupnow
11-06-2009, 05:26 PM
Why are the adjustable stops that long ?

.
Because when the table is centered instead of cranked all the way to the left, I wanted them to stick down far enough for easy access.

lynnl
11-06-2009, 05:32 PM
So what thickness did you settle on for that bracket (the controversial 'red' part)?
It looks thicker than 1/8" in that last picture.

Functionality aside, wherever space permits, a beefier part usually just looks more visually appealing to me. But that's just me. Sort of gives me a feeling of comfort or security I guess.

I do like the addition of the knurled bolt heads. I'd thought about that earlier; just the convenience.

Black_Moons
11-06-2009, 06:01 PM
Id make the whole thing as big and beefy as possable after seeing my lathe carriage able to bump my carriage stop and move it with very little effort whatsoever if your not uber careful cranking the carriage, remember your stoping a big table that glides like skaters on ice with all the same momentium

brian Rupnow
11-06-2009, 06:09 PM
So what thickness did you settle on for that bracket (the controversial 'red' part)?
It looks thicker than 1/8" in that last picture.

Functionality aside, wherever space permits, a beefier part usually just looks more visually appealing to me. But that's just me. Sort of gives me a feeling of comfort or security I guess.

I do like the addition of the knurled bolt heads. I'd thought about that earlier; just the convenience.

Obviously, you missed post #39---I remade the plate from 1/4" stock.

lynnl
11-06-2009, 06:43 PM
Obviously, you missed post #39---I remade the plate from 1/4" stock.

Hmmm. After re-reading post #39 (3 or 4 times actually), I see no mention of that piece. I just see a discussion or the knurled pieces.

Oh well, doesn't really matter. As I said it just looks thicker in that picture, but without some reference it's hard to tell, even with my carefully calibrated eyeballs.

SDL
11-06-2009, 06:47 PM
Its post 29

Steve Larner

brian Rupnow
11-06-2009, 06:54 PM
Hmmm. After re-reading post #39 (3 or 4 times actually), I see no mention of that piece. I just see a discussion or the knurled pieces.

Oh well, doesn't really matter. As I said it just looks thicker in that picture, but without some reference it's hard to tell, even with my carefully calibrated eyeballs.

I'll have to take my eyeballs in for recalibration--Steve is correct---it was post #29.---Brian

T_henry
11-06-2009, 07:08 PM
Brain thanks for the post, I have the Lathmaster LMT25 which is the same as yours and I will put in on the list of things to do.

Thanks
Tim