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gr8life
11-21-2009, 01:01 AM
I just got a Lagun FTV 1S and have a few questions
First I hauled it home on a trailer w/ the head inverted and all the oil came out (seemed like a good idea at the time)
Any particular oil for the head?
The oil ran into the base but I can not find a drain. Now that oil from the head is mixed w/ whatever was in the coolant tank. Is there a way to empty it out without using the pump?
It is stamped SE-19447 on the machine in front of the Y axis control. Is this the serial number and if so can I find out the date made?
I found a manual for a FTV 2 on line. Could I use this as a manual or do I have to get one from Lagun for $$$$$$$$$$$
Looks like a gr8 machine & can not wait to crank it up, just waiting for a VFD to come next week.
Thanks for any help,
ed

gr8life
11-21-2009, 01:19 AM
Thought I would show a pix of my new machine
ed
http://i461.photobucket.com/albums/qq336/gr8lifeLV/NewLagunNov172009004Small.jpg

MickeyD
11-21-2009, 09:44 AM
Laguns are terrific machines and are a major improvement in rigidity over a Bridgeport. As you have discovered they do leak a lot of oil when you tip the head, and if I remember correctly, somewhere around a cup. Lagun is still in business and offers good phone support, so I would call them on Monday if you cannot find a manual online and ask for their advise.

strider
11-21-2009, 11:17 AM
Ed,
I also am the happy owner of a Lagun, mine is an FT-1. Yes that is the serial number you are looking at. I can't remember exactly when mine was made, sometime in the 80's but it's serial number is in the 15's so yours is either late 80's or early 90's. If you call Lagun their tech guy can tell you when it was made, he's very knowledgeable, but doesn't always listen real well to what you are telling him as he moves real fast.
As for spindle oil. I use Mobil Velocite #6 spindle oil. Priced reasonably at Enco, especially when on sale. When I queried Lagun on the oil I was told any spindle oil would be fine. I run Mobil Vactra #2 in the oiler for the ways.
I agree that the cost is, in my opinion, high for the manual. I have yet to find a source for a copy or even find someone that has a manual that I could get a peek at. Mine came out of a school, so it's missing a couple of items and had a couple of broken parts, I still have to make some. Watch out for the shipping, they will send you a part that costs just a few dollars then charge you $16 to send it in a little envelope via UPS.

gnm109
11-21-2009, 12:12 PM
That machine is similar to my Webb. There is no oil reservoir in the head. There are oil cups arranged around the head. The front and rear ones on my machine are for light oil, 10 wt.. The one on the left is for a periodic shot of Lubriplate to reach in and lubricate the bevel gears for the downfeed train.

On my Webb, it had been used with flood coolant when it was CNC controlled. I run it manually so I removed the two drain grills in the base and covered them with metal plates that lock in with bolts and gaskets.

I opened the rear and side covers on the base and discovered that there was about an inch of semi-dried coolant and oil in the base. It took me a couple of days to get it all out by scraping and soaking it up with paper towels and newspapers.

Once I got it out, I put in a layer of oil dry to soak the rest of it. In another few months, I plan on opening it up again and vacuuming out the oil dry pellets.

Manual prices are usually very high. I had to buy the one from Webb and it cost me $50. It was worth it, however, since I needed to replace the parts that were removed when it was running CNC. The Webb manual has all of the parts numbers and blowup drawings and all of the parts are available.

Good luck. Lagun is an excellent brand.

gr8life
11-21-2009, 03:21 PM
Strider thanks for the reply. Is yours a variable speed?
ed

strider
11-22-2009, 10:50 AM
Ed,
Nope, it's the step pulley version, which is OK with me. I feel that when you have more parts you have more that can fail, of course if this thing had the variable I'd have taken it anyway. It's tough to find decent machines in this area, so you can't be too picky. All of the Bridgeport that I looked at here were beat to death, then I found the Lagun, snagged it fast.
Also, run to a discount store and get a turkey baster. If you have nothing else to get the coolant out of the sump with, the baster will work well for sucking up that stuff. It's a little slow, but faster than towels and paper.
Art

EVguru
11-23-2009, 06:20 AM
The sump on all these Bridgeport style machines is a complete pain to clean. A steam clean with the collumn stripped is probably the best way. Mine was stuffed with congealed swarf and was mostly dug out with a trowel.

I think that if I go to flood coolant, I'll make a swarf/coolant tray that goes between the collumn casting and the base of the knee jack. This could either be plummed to an external tank (or in the collumn), or act as the coolant tank direct.

gr8life
11-24-2009, 12:49 AM
Just a a follow up to this thread. Between the answers here and the 2 phone conversations I had today, one with a member from another board who lives about 60 miles away and one w/ Carmen at Lagun I got all my initial questions answered.
thanks
ed
EVguru I just noticed you are from Luton. The first,last and only time I was in your fair city I scored the best lot of Jaguar spare parts I could ever hope for. It made the trip gr8 and the parts helped me win a national first in class.

tattoomike68
11-24-2009, 02:03 AM
get a shop vac and suck the crap out, its that simple.

Lagun is a good solid mill I used to take a 3 inch face mill, sock it in 1/2" deep in aluminum, rev it up to 4,000 rpm and rapid traverse it into the work and throw chips everywhere.

I hated that mill but no matter what I did it just kept going (I wanted a newer mill, it was 10 years). No go, that machine let me horse the piss out of it time and time again and did not care. I stalled the spindle 100 times and it would keep going once I backed the feed off.

We ran it balls out redline for weeks doing some rework that a $800,000 hydromat did not do and had to drill 14,000 .043" holes in stressproof.

I hoped that would make it melt down but no, it kept going. 2 weeks later it drilled 14,000 .043" holes.

My main bitch about that mill was I had to spend a day in an inspection lab with jewlers files to get my stainless wire edm fixtures within .0002" It was also 30 taper and I had to use crappy ER collets. I stole endmill holders from the CNC guys so I would not have to use crappy ER collets. I would not give $.02 for 10,000 ER collets.

Looking back it was a great mill, Iv run some real crap and it was strong and accurate by comparison.

You got good mill IMHO. If its 30 taper buy endmill holders. that way you can get work done.

EVguru
11-24-2009, 05:18 AM
EVguru I just noticed you are from Luton. The first,last and only time I was in your fair city I scored the best lot of Jaguar spare parts I could ever hope for. It made the trip gr8 and the parts helped me win a national first in class.

Fair!?

City!?

Nope, don't recognise the place.


Actually Luton Town isn't too bad these days, but then I almost never go into the centre. There's just no need.

YankeeMetallic
11-25-2009, 01:40 AM
Congratulations on a nice machine! LAGUN's are very sturdy and accurate machines. They are also about 500 pounds heavier than a comparably sized Bridgeport.
I had an older LAGUN I purchased and used about 10 years ago. The coolant sump was also full of swarf, and some serious muck. I removed the coolant pump first. To clean out the sump I had to use a paint scraper and shop vac to get the big chunks out of the sump. Then I filled the sump with a sodium hydroxide based cleaner, 409, Super Clean, etc mixed with liquid DAWN dishwashing soap. I let that sit for about a week. I used an extension nylon bristle brush to scrub the bottom and sides of the sump. I sucked that out with a pond pump (Shop Vac will work just as well). Then I boiled water and poured it into the sump at the drain. I pumped the water mixture out and repeated about a dozen times. When the mixture cleared up I added some more cleaner (without the dishwashing soap due to the suds) and pumped it out through the coolant system and original pump. It was a lot of work but it did the trick.
I don't know if you are using your LAGUN for home shop or to make money.
I tried using a static phase converter to get 3 phase since 3 phase is not available to where I live in the sticks. I never realized how much power I was losing with the Static PC untic I built a rotary PC for my new LAGUN mentioned next.
I needed higher tolerances for making gun and scientific components so...
I bought a new, from LAGUN, FTV-1, in June 2005. It has been a nice, sturdy, reliable machine.

While I am happy with the machine, I can't say I have been too happy with LAGUN. About a year after purchasing the machine and picking it up in Carson, CA (L.A.) I got a letter telling me that they forgot to charge me for tax and that I owed $900 + . I ignored them until they threatened to send a letter to the Board of Equalization which would have gotten my business audited. The out-the-door price I negotiated with the salesman failed to disclose the price was so good because he never added the tax. Of course the salesman I dealt with no longer worked at LAGUN when I tried to dispute the additional purchase price. I was in the process of purchasing a large Republic Lathe from them until I go the bad news, and cancelled the order after dealing with the added TAX issue.
After purchasing the NEW LAGUN I immediately purchased SERVO powerfeeds X & Y, and an Accurite 200S DRO. I bought the SERVO powerfeeds from MSC because they were on sale. I assumed since the SERVO PF's were listed for Bridgeport Type Mills they would work on the LAGUN. That is not the case. The LAGUN Table & Cross-main screws are larger than a Bridgeport resulting in a larger diameter hole in the manual feed screw cranks. I called MSC and they told me that SERVO powerfeeds for Brisgeport machines do not fit LAGUN machines. I called SERVO and they told me that they could not sell me the SERVO powerfeeds for LAGUN because they have an agreement with Republic LAGUN that only Republic LAGUN can sell the SERVO feeds for LAGUN machines. I called LAGUN and they confirmed that sales agreement with SERVO. I was unhappy to say the least since the SERVO's were about $180 more, EACH, through LAGUN than through MSC. I bit the bullet, bought the parts through LAGUN, and then wrote them, and SERVO a nasty letter.
My next surprise came with my Accurite DRO, X, Y, Z scales. It was on sale through J&L but when I received it, it also would not fit my LAGUN. I had to purchase special adapters to make the DRO work on the LAGUN. The first adapter kit sent by ACCURITE did not fit, so I spent a good amount of time on the phone with Accurite to get everything figured out. The ACCURITE customer service was outstanding!
I recently added a KURT power drawbar (R8) which is a HUGE time and back saver. I had to order the model specifically for the LAGUN and it installed without a problem.
One last thing that is simple is that the quill lever gets obstructed by the direct / back gear, High / Low lever when power feeding the quill downward. It was a simple fix bu removing the gear drive lever, heating it and bending it enough so the quill lever can pass it without tripping the auto-depth stop on the quill.
The fasteners are English and Metric FYI, since the LAGUN is designed in the USA and assembled in the USA and Spain.
As far as the Instruction Manual, I would just buy a new or used one and consider that part of the cost of the machine. I have a manual, but it would be a pain to copy, or scan due to the fold out pages. It is also spiral bound.
If you just need a few pages, let me know and I can send them to you via e-mail.
If you ever would like to see how I have mine set up just let me know and I'll send some pics of the area you are interested in.
Preventive maintenance, and routine lubrication keep the machine running quietly.
Although there were some surprises in adding accessories, I am very happy with the machine and would recommend them to other machinists, with the accessory warnings.

DUKE

GKman
11-25-2009, 08:09 PM
I just got a Lagun FTV 1S and have a few questions
First I hauled it home on a trailer w/ the head inverted and all the oil came out (seemed like a good idea at the time)
Any particular oil for the head?
The oil ran into the base but I can not find a drain. Now that oil from the head is mixed w/ whatever was in the coolant tank. Is there a way to empty it out without using the pump?
It is stamped SE-19447 on the machine in front of the Y axis control. Is this the serial number and if so can I find out the date made?
I found a manual for a FTV 2 on line. Could I use this as a manual or do I have to get one from Lagun for $$$$$$$$$$$
Looks like a gr8 machine & can not wait to crank it up, just waiting for a VFD to come next week.
Thanks for any help,
ed

Upside down oil - I did the same.
Manual and exorbitant shipping not worth much. Manual has lots of beautiful mechanical dwgs of unit and parts but not much else. I won't copy it. You want to own a machine they sell for $15K, it's not a surprise the manual is expensive.
Lubrication per manual:
Top of spindle Mobile DTE 25 monthly ( I think just a squirt for splined drive into spindle).
Oil cup and ball fitting on left side of head Mobile DTE 25 monthly
One shot oiler as needed Mobilegear 629.

My serial number 21008 = 1987 Same model as yours.

I removed the coolant pump from the sump and closed it up with about 3" of sludge for the next owner. Made an external tank from an old 40# propane tank.

Congratulations and good luck.

hansw3
11-30-2009, 10:51 AM
I just bought a Lagun Mill FTV-1. Is there a parts store on the internet? I can't find one.

YankeeMetallic
11-30-2009, 03:13 PM
I just bought a Lagun Mill FTV-1. Is there a parts store on the internet? I can't find one.

Hans- The last time I needed a part, I had to get the part from the manual diagram, call Lagun and give the part #. They will tell you the price and availability. It was a bit archaic. That was a few years ago. Things may have improved since.

JTToner
12-21-2009, 01:04 PM
The manual is available on eBay from a seller that goes by the name of Ozark Woodwork or something like that. His manuals are repros, but clear and readable. Manuals from Lagun are very pricey. BTW, someone mentioned serial #SE-19447 as being from the 1980's - makes me wonder about my Lagun, its serial number is SE-1079. It must be older than dirt, almost as old as I. But, the machine runs great. I've had no problems with it. Last month I added two axis DRO. I did have to make a new drawbar because the Chicom drawbar it came with was worthless - too short, wobbled, and banged on something that made me think I had a bad gear. My home made draw bar solved the problem. Some day I will have to replace the clock spring for the manual quill feed lever. It was broken when I got the mill. Not a difficult repair, just that I know Lagun is going to want an arm and a leg for that bloody spring.

Johnny

gr8life
12-22-2009, 01:05 AM
On my new to me Lagun there is one ball oiler on the head, I hate ball oilers. With them you can never be sure you have gotten the correct amount of oil in the hole. I have replaced almost all of them on my other machines w/ oil hole covers. Is there any reason I can not replace this one with the same?
thanks
ed

http://i461.photobucket.com/albums/qq336/gr8lifeLV/Lagun001Small.jpg

gr8life
12-22-2009, 01:23 AM
Duke thanks for the long reply. I have decided to leave the muck in the base till warmer weather returns, I use mist & have no need for flood. I use my machines for both hobby & business. The mill came w/ a very old but accurate Sony Magnescale DRO. I am trying to find out if I can leave the scales & buy a new 3 axis head for it. If that does not work out I will put a Newall or Accurite on it. If you have pix of the DRO mounting I would love to see them. My only real concern is the ball oiler on the head I really stink at oiling them and have replaced them on all my other machines(see other post) lubrication is very important to me. So far I have only used the Lagun a few hours but I like what I have seen so far. Strong, powerful, rigid and fairly quiet. Only downside is tool change but I don’t have enough room for power drawbar.
Thanks again
ed
p.s. From reading your location I can assume you are one of the few in your state who is not a commie?

JTToner
12-22-2009, 01:04 PM
Gr8life,
I too have a question about the Lagun lube system. On the left side of the head there is a ball oiler like yours, just below it is a grease fitting. Guys from another forum warned me not to use grease. A tech at Lagun told me to use Vactra 20 everywhere. So, I replaced the grease fitting with an oil cup like you have, and filed it with oil. It takes about two minutes for all the oil to drain out and begin to drip from the quill. The quill doesn't seem to be loose, so I wonder if I have over filled the thing. I have a Lagun manual but its useless regarding lubrication. The placard on the machine calls out for some sort of unknown lube, maybe Spanish or such. Maybe I should take a look inside, but that doesn't look like much fun. My machine runs great. No gear noise, negligible spindle run out. I'm lost, any help or suggestions will be appreciated. BTW, the machine is a FT-1 , serial #SE-1079, probably has Franco's autograph somewhere on it.

Thanks,
Johnny (the other non-commie from that state)

gr8life
12-22-2009, 02:36 PM
Johnny I am happy that there at least 2 non commies in your state. From talking w/ Carmen @ Lagun it is normal for the oil to drip out the spindle and he says use an moly coat grease as the aim is to have the grease stick to the gears. My grease fitting is on the rear of the head and can see no problem w/ it. I still can see no reason not to replace the ball oiler w/ a cup oiler but will wait till I hear from someone who is wiser than I am.

JTToner
12-23-2009, 12:03 AM
Gr8life,

I have that grease fitting on the back as well and have left it in place. I believe is for the low speed/reverse gearing. I don't think I've been using moly grease, I'll have to check, but if not I'll probably use what I have then replace it with a moly cartridge. You think I'm ok using oil in the lower fitting on the left side? Also, as for oil, are you using light stuff like Vactra 20 or heavier stuff like gear oil? Recently, for the lower left fitting, the one that was a grease fitting, I've been using 90 wt gear oil. All the machines I've seen, except for mine, have an oil cup there and not the grease fitting.

And yes, I'm down here in So. Kalif., hoping the Governator doesn't outlaw home shops. Don't laugh, it bloody well could happen.

Johnny

gr8life
12-23-2009, 12:38 AM
JT do you have the manual that is on line?
http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Lagun_FTV-2_Manual.pdf
It has a lube chart. I am a little confused about where you have this changed oil/ grease fitting.
ed

gnm109
12-23-2009, 01:22 AM
My Webb has three cup oilers on the head, the type with a spring cap. They thread into the head with pipe threads. The one on the left should really be a grease fitting since it's used to get Lubriplate into the downfeed bevel gear on the end of the worm cradle according to the manual. Since the Lagun is also a BP style mill, I presume that it should have grease in the left side. My Webb has no grease fitting for the downfeed gear on the rear of the head but when I didassembled the head to replace a broken downfeed bevel that was there when I got it, there was plenty of grease in there.

They say to "use light oil" in the spindle bearings in the manual. That really pins it down. LOL. I guess some oil is better than no oil.

The Lagun appears to be a heavy machine. My Webb is the next to the largest. I'd estimate that the Lagun in the picture is similar in weight, at least 3,500 pounds. They are sure rigid!

JTToner
12-23-2009, 11:41 AM
gnm109,

They are heavy. I got mine for free last year when its owner was going to sell it for scrap. I paid a machine mover $500 to move t five miles from the former owner's shop to my house where he had agreed to install it into my "shop" (in reality nothing but an 8'x12' shed). When the mover got to my place, he said it was impossible to place the machine inside my shop and just left it in the street. Well, a neighbor and I moved that beast and got it inside the shop. We had no tools other that some 3/4" pipes, a crowbar, and one of those cheapo HF cranes. My neighbor is 65 years old and I admit to being 70. Somehow, we got the job done. Its a great machine. In the past I had a choice between running a Lagun or a BP. I chose the BP and never touched a Lagun til I got mine. I write this because I've seen people reluctant to by one and hold out for a BP. This is understandable since the BP is the defacto standard for this class of mill. If I needed another, I would buy a Lagun in a New York minute.

Johnny

rkepler
12-23-2009, 01:15 PM
I too have a question about the Lagun lube system. On the left side of the head there is a ball oiler like yours, just below it is a grease fitting. Guys from another forum warned me not to use grease. A tech at Lagun told me to use Vactra 20 everywhere. So, I replaced the grease fitting with an oil cup like you have, and filed it with oil. It takes about two minutes for all the oil to drain out and begin to drip from the quill.

I'm pretty sure that the cup that's supposed to be there has a pigtail to direct the oil to the spindle bearings, and if the oil gets to the bearings it'll take a day or more to come out. Call the parts folks and ask about the cup - it's part 341 or 493 on page 17 of the manual .pdf posted (hey! that looks to be an OCR of my mill's manual! same serial number and all).

As for oil - I use Vactra #2 way oil for the ways and Vactra Light on the spindle and other head oiling points.