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gramps
10-27-2003, 10:15 AM
I know this isn't machining but we all have to eat,and I for one have often used the microwave to prepare food.
A recent study showed that up to 97%
of the vitamins were destroyed when cooking
broccoli in a microwave??
A search came up with some studies done about 10 yrs ago showing that the blood cells in a small group of test subjects
were altered by eating food prepared in a microwave oven. The effect was similar
to early signs of the presence of cancer.
I wonder if anyone has seen any good studies
on this subject?
There have always been scaremongers who love to get everybody in a turmoil and I have learned not to pay much attention to
most of the stuff on the evening news, but
since all my kids and grandkids and friends
use the microwave all the time I would like to follow up on this.
It would be hard to find a group with a more
wide range of interests than this bunch,
So I hope some answers can be found.
gramps

JCHannum
10-27-2003, 10:26 AM
Now if you could find a way to destroy 97% of the broccoli, that would be something worthwhile. I hate that stuff.
I also have heard that if you put a cat in the microwave it comes out much the worse for wear.
Bad things microwave ovens, even manufacturing microwave popcorn is bad for you.

Dr. Rob
10-27-2003, 10:35 AM
Well yeah, but that's because the cat ate the broccoli.


Seriously, I think boiling it ruins all the vitamins as well, so that isn't all too strange. Don't know about blood cells. (Except that JCH's probably change into the Incredible Hulk's, when you feed him broccoli... http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif )

wato
10-27-2003, 10:54 AM
Lightly steamed broccoli with a bit of butter. Absolutely beautiful. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

Evan
10-27-2003, 12:02 PM
The only vegetables I don't like are turnips and eggplant. As far as vitamins go, the microwave is boiling the food same as a pot of water does. It's the temperature that does the dirty deed, not the microwaves themselves.

gramps
10-27-2003, 02:16 PM
Yes boiling vegetables leaches most of the vitamins out,and the best way to avoid vitamin loss is to steam them...and don't
overcook.
The cooking process is not exactly the same
in the microwave as boiling in a pot of water nor is it the same as frying in a pan
or baking in a conventional oven.
I tried toasting a slice of frozen bread
in the microwave and it did not toast the outside like a toaster,and it was only slightly better than an old sneaker to eat.
I read an article about heating cold milk,
for a baby's bottle, and it stated that it
was dangerous because there could be small pockets in the middle of the milk that could be boiling while the ouside was just warm to the touch.

Well I will do some more studying. If I find anything worth reporting I will post again.

gramps

Evan
10-27-2003, 04:04 PM
Gramps,

It's true the process is not the same as boiling water. A microwave uses 2.4 GHZ radiation to "jiggle" the water molecules which then heats them.

The bit about the baby bottle is also true but is easily avoided by giving it a shake after heating and then testing on back of hand.

The really dangerous thing about a microwave is the potential for burns when heating water or reheating coffee. It is possible for the liquid to become superheated to well above the boiling point without actually boiling. When disturbed, say by dumping in a spoon of sugar the entire cup of liquid can explode into steam causing possible severe burns. One should be very careful about re-heating liquids in the microwave. The more pure the liquid is the more likely this is to happen. One absolute rule is to never re-heat water that has been previously boiled as this makes superheating much more likely due to the removal of dissolved gases when first boiled.



[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 10-27-2003).]

darryl
10-27-2003, 04:36 PM
Interesting. Steaming veggies on the stove there's no potential to overheat the steam, thus the veggies, but in the nuker, the steam that's produced rises and expands to try to fill the oven cavity. In doing so, it's in the way of the microwaves, and can't help but absorb the energy, raising the temperature of it without any normal limitations. I think that heating food in a nuker is as safe as any other method, until steam is starting to be produced. Because of the differing water content in the various areas of the food, and the uneven dispersal of energy within the oven, there's no way of knowing if you're getting hot spots within the food, but it's a safe assumption that there has to be, so I'm going to assume the answer is yes, the nuker does damage the food more than boiling or steaming. Steaming is the only way to keep from leaching goodies out of the food, while preventing overheating. The best one can do when using the microwave is to keep the steam produced as close to the food as possible, with a saran wrap, or use a plate or glass cover right over the food, so any extra heat in the steam will be evened out as quickly as possible by absorbtion into the cover. Of course, now you need more heating time, so the food touching the cover doesn't stay as cold as the cover. You need the cover to be at steam temperature, as well.
Maybe an improvement in microwaving would be to heat the food from below.

Betterhalf
10-27-2003, 05:48 PM
Be carefull what you cover your food with in the microwave unless it says mircowave safe it can leach cemicals into the food. Some Saran wrap is not microwave safe there was a warning out sometime ago about certain cancer causing stuff coming out of Saran wrap when microwaved.

BC21OSH
10-27-2003, 08:42 PM
A neighbor back home who happened to be a shop guy, but lived a little on the frugal side didn't own a micro wave. His wife's sisters kept insisting he and his wife needed a micro wave. Finally outnumbered and half heartedly convinced he bought one. Well, she was, due to her health not as mobile as he was, so he did a lot of the cooking. He put his usual meal on a plate and tossed it into the micro wave. Well that piece of meat just didn't cook like he expected. After several tries, he contacted his wife's sisters. They informed him the micro wave wasn't for normal meal cooking, it was great for warming up leftovers, heating snack food, etc. He told me, if I would have known that I'd have bought an acetylene torch instead.

That's right, put those veggies, any except parsnips, I don't like them, in a micro wave safe dish, don't need much water, cover and steam until tender crisp, cover with butter and enjoy.

We steam Salmon fillets in the micro wave in a special micro wave steamer. Just smear the top with butter and sprinkle a little lemon pepper over it and steam for about six minutes depending on thickness. Turns out great.

Bernard

Arcane
10-27-2003, 10:02 PM
I've heard that the nipple on a baby's bottle can be heated to a much higher temperature than the milk in the bottle if microwaved. Apparently you are never supposed to leave the top on when nuking it.

jfsmith
10-27-2003, 11:04 PM
I use a microwave in my shop to kill what ever is inside small pieces of wood that I pickup in the forest,

The Germans in WW II used microwaves to harden the lining in cannon barrels.

The Russians used low energy microwaves focused at the American Emabassy to make people sick.

The Radar Range is a piece of American Technological history, I think they have been around for 50 years or so.

A cartoon a few years ago had this line:

"Microwaves will frizz your heirs"

Don't use a microwave in the house very often and don't own a cell phone, so I may be safe for now.

Jerry

Gerryrig
10-28-2003, 12:03 AM
We have three microwaves in our kitchen and sometimes wish for a fourth. They make excellent bacon while the eggs are frying. One thing I tried with one really surprised me. We had an infestation of fruit flies so I put a piece of squash in the microwave with the door open over night. The next morning many of the flies were in the microwave, as I expected, so I closed the door, turned it on, and cooked the squash until it was mostly hard. Open the door and many of those fruit flies flew out. I can't explain it but that is what happened so .........?
Gerry

wato
10-28-2003, 12:13 AM
But did the flies breed normaly or are there now mutant fruit flies. Waiting to attack http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//eek.gif

darryl
10-28-2003, 04:30 AM
Good warning about the saran wrap. I haven't had a problem with it, at least not that I know of. I can sure see the potential, though.
Turnips I don't mind, parsnips, yecch! Mutant fruit fly meat loaf, I don't think I'm willing to try that.

Ragarsed Raglan
10-28-2003, 03:27 PM
Jerry,

The cavity magnatron which led to the discovery of microwave was never used by the Germans until the last stages of WWII. The 'microwave hardening' of gun barrels is almost certainly a mis-quoted reference to high frequency electric induction furnaces for hardening processes.

Sir Robert Watson - Watt discovered Radar and demonstrated it in February 1935. Centimetric radar (which required the cavity magnatron to produce the UHF signal) was first used by the Allies against the U-Boat menace in the North Atlantic from 1943 onwards. It was then used as a ground defining radar in RAF bombers from 1944 onwards. The radar used was designated H2s, this was identical to the radar used by the USAAF in their daylight bombing missions and was called BTO (an acronym for 'Bombing Through Overcast'). BTO equipped B-17's could be identified by the radar dome in place of the ball turret under the belly of the plane.

The discovery and development of radar was the single most important weapon for the Allies during the 5 1/2 years of the Second World War. The pooling of resources in development between the UK's Radio Research Establishment in Slough and the US Navy Radio Research Station in Washington D.C led to rapid developments in radar technology. Some 300 variants in airbourne, land, and sea bourne radar ensued.

Check this site for further info:-

http://www.radarpages.co.uk/people/watson-watt/watson-watt.htm

And for an interesting read on the development of radar try to find this book:-
"Radar - A Wartime Miracle" by C.Latham & A.Stobbs.

RR

Hellbender
10-28-2003, 08:57 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Gerryrig:
We have three microwaves in our kitchen and sometimes wish for a fourth. They make excellent bacon while the eggs are frying. One thing I tried with one really surprised me. We had an infestation of fruit flies so I put a piece of squash in the microwave with the door open over night. The next morning many of the flies were in the microwave, as I expected, so I closed the door, turned it on, and cooked the squash until it was mostly hard. Open the door and many of those fruit flies flew out. I can't explain it but that is what happened so .........?
Gerry</font>

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//Forum1/HTML/003955.html

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif
HB

Sprocket
10-29-2003, 11:33 PM
Ah, but if we try to get back to a metalworking subject, try this http://home.c2i.net/metaphor/mvpage.html

darryl
10-29-2003, 11:43 PM
Very interesting read.

Evan
10-30-2003, 01:22 AM
Don't try this at home....

http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/weird/microexp.html