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steve herman
03-01-2010, 04:02 AM
I am considering buying a new Quick brand cut knurler but have no idea were to find a dealer or the cost.
I did a search but no luck.
I would like to build the one in the hsm last issue but have a lot of outher projets that have to come first.

Any help would be app.

Steve new member

JCHannum
03-01-2010, 08:41 AM
MSC carries them, the prices range in the $2000.00 +- area depending on the model for the Quick line. Dorian and some other manufacturers also make cut knurl tooling that is a bit less costly but they are still serious money.

lazlo
03-01-2010, 08:47 AM
FWIW, I picked up a new in box Quick I/KF-CNC cut knurler on Ebay for $100. The -CNC suffix means it has a big rack mechanism for mounting in a CNC lathe, but that piece un-bolts.

Not a tool gloat -- they're common on Ebay.

steve herman
03-02-2010, 03:17 AM
FWIW, I picked up a new in box Quick I/KF-CNC cut knurler on Ebay for $100. The -CNC suffix means it has a big rack mechanism for mounting in a CNC lathe, but that piece un-bolts.

Not a tool gloat -- they're common on Ebay.
Thanks for your help, would you like to double your money?

steve

DR
03-02-2010, 08:38 AM
Why do you want a cut knurler?

Why not a forming knurler?

jbp
03-02-2010, 08:48 AM
In the newest Home Shop Machinist there is plans for building one. Great magazine by the way, also my first post , been lurking for some time.

Doozer
03-02-2010, 09:06 AM
Welcome Jbp.
What state are you in?

--Doozer

jbp
03-02-2010, 10:16 AM
No state, province of saskatchewan. Semi retired farmer.

steve herman
03-03-2010, 04:44 AM
Why do you want a cut knurler?

Why not a forming knurler?

I have several forming knurlers and have used them with some success but it seams to me it would be a lot faster and much easyer on the lathe to use a cut knurler. I have a large lathe, a16x40 Grizzley I bought new about 6 years ago and a new Bridgeport type mill, Grizzly also that I bought at the same time.
I put the emphasis on faster because I like to build things and see the finished project. Not that I won't spend a lot of time on machining and good looks etc but forming knurllering seems like some what of a waste of time while cut knrlering is faster and great looking.
I hope this answers ( Why do you want a cut knurler)

stevs herman

steve herman
03-03-2010, 04:53 AM
In the newest Home Shop Machinist there is plans for building one. Great magazine by the way, also my first post , been lurking for some time.
This is the article tha got me going this way.I have every issue of hsm and also p in m and mw. I agree these are great magazines.

steve

steve herman
03-03-2010, 04:54 AM
Why do you want a cut knurler?

Why not a forming knurler?

I have several forming knurlers and have used them with some success but it seams to me it would be a lot faster and much easyer on the lathe to use a cut knurler. I have a large lathe, a16x40 Grizzley I bought new about 6 years ago and a new Bridgeport type mill, Grizzly also that I bought at the same time.
I put the emphasis on faster because I like to build things and see the finished project. Not that I won't spend a lot of time on machining and good looks etc but forming knurllering seems like some what of a waste of time while cut knrlering is faster and great looking.
I hope this answers ( Why do you want a cut knurler)

stevs herman

DR
03-03-2010, 10:43 AM
I have several forming knurlers and have used them with some success but it seams to me it would be a lot faster and much easyer on the lathe to use a cut knurler. I have a large lathe, a16x40 Grizzley I bought new about 6 years ago and a new Bridgeport type mill, Grizzly also that I bought at the same time.
I put the emphasis on faster because I like to build things and see the finished project. Not that I won't spend a lot of time on machining and good looks etc but forming knurllering seems like some what of a waste of time while cut knrlering is faster and great looking.
I hope this answers ( Why do you want a cut knurler)

stevs herman

Steve,

I have a cut knurling tool. Don't like it. Bought it mistakenly thinking it was better than a form knurler. They aren't so easy to setup.

IMO, nothing is faster than form knurling. One pass at a high feed rate. And the results are better than cut knurling. Run them dry or with coolant.

Cut knurling has some real problems in material like aluminum when you color anodize it. By nature cut knurling produces a "mush" of small chips. These chips get forced into the material surface. In the anodizing process many of these will break loose leaving a spotty appearance on dark colored anodizing. Same issues apply to an extent in brass that's to be plated.

Aluminum knurling is enough of a nightmare with form knurling, cut knurling makes it worse.

In my shop we've done large quantities of knurled parts. All of my form knurling tools have opposed knurl wheels, very little force is put on the tool holders. Quick to setup.

The inexpensive "scissor" type form knurling tools do a very good job. They're a good example of an opposed wheel knurler.

My advice is save your money for something more useful.

Alistair Hosie
03-03-2010, 01:46 PM
OK OK I give in what's a cut knurler photo's or decent explanation,please! Is that the fancy one John Stevenson bought ? how does it differ from form knurling?? Obviously it cut's rather than compresses but I have never seen one or heard of it.Alistair ps please put me out of my misery.

John Stevenson
03-03-2010, 04:22 PM
PS. please put me out of my misery.

No............




.

gnm109
03-03-2010, 04:42 PM
OK OK I give in what's a cut knurler photo's or decent explanation,please! Is that the fancy one John Stevenson bought ? how does it differ from form knurling?? Obviously it cut's rather than compresses but I have never seen one or heard of it.Alistair ps please put me out of my misery.


Hi, I'll put you out of your misery. I didn't know what a cut knurler was either. A quick trip to Google found the links below. Apparently it uses hardened steel cutting teeth on an angle and cuts more than it forms. One of the links says that they aren't very common. I'll say!

Hope this helps. Remember that I helped you when J.S. didn't. LOL. :D

http://www.accu-trak.com/holders_cuttype.html

http://www.accu-trak.com/holders_cuttype/orissetup.html

Alistair Hosie
03-03-2010, 04:47 PM
Hey thanks !and to SIR John "Thanks too" I love everyone tonight feeling good even though Bronwen has abandoned me for Japan, where Ewen my youngest son is currently teaching English. So there your lordship I still love you and all here and when the time comes I'll put you well and truly out of your misery:DAlstair ps if GERTY don't do the job first:D Alistair

DR
03-03-2010, 04:54 PM
It's worth noting the text gnm109 linked to says the stock diameter must be held fairly close, .025mm, to prevent tracking problems. That's about .001" on diameter.

That, by itself should be enough to make anyone want to avoid cut knurlers.

John Stevenson
03-03-2010, 05:13 PM
Dr,
I use cut knurlers and don't even bother measuring anything let alone to a thou.

As regards tracking they have adjustment built into them so you can dial tracking in.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/longknurl1.jpg

Hows that for tracking. Cut at 500 rpm and feed somewhere near medium fast [ the numbers are missing from the plate ]

I can't get a form knurl to be this straight because I can't control it.

.

Alistair Hosie
03-03-2010, 05:53 PM
How does it do this it cannot be revolving surely are you merely compressing the flutes but then it's su[pposed to cut I don't get it:confused: :confused: Grandpa AL

lazlo
03-04-2010, 12:50 PM
How does it do this it cannot be revolving surely are you merely compressing the flutes

You adjust the tracking by setting the radial offset of the two knurl wheels (or the single wheel in John's case). The Quick knurl couples the two knurling heads with a gear mechanism so they're symmetric. You can see the internals of that mechanism in McGyver's version.

If you set the knurling wheels to the wrong circumference, you get the same mistracking issues you get with a mash knurler.

There's no compression going on with a cut knurl -- the knurls are sharp, and cut the workpiece instead of mashing it.

Mcgyver
03-04-2010, 04:07 PM
my experience has differed rather a lot from DR's, i find mush knurling a bit hit and miss and have never measured and OD to get the cut knurler working and find it very quick/easy to set up...then again i've only ever used one. :) ymmv. The main argument for is the knurls you get....here's a small fuel tank for a fire eater i made....the knurl is very crisp. i didn't have a scissor knurl and don't like how hard a conventional is on the machine...knurling seems to be a subject ripe with opposing opinions which is fine, the cut knurling tool does it for me.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b201/michael0100/fire%20eater%20engine/finishedtank.jpg


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b201/michael0100/fire%20eater%20engine/closeupknurls.jpg