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View Full Version : Wearing gloves when working on a mill/lathe NOT!



MuellerNick
04-08-2010, 05:41 PM
Hi!

Only a dummy was hurt ...
Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoVQ8g1NV64)


Nick

The Fixer
04-08-2010, 06:35 PM
that goes for the bench grinder too!!! Seen a few that got sucked in and ground thru the thumbnail to the bone as a 1st aider. Appears to hurt like hell too! lol

jugs
04-08-2010, 07:03 PM
Some mths ago, while writing a workshop safety guide, I was in conversation with the british Health & Safety Executive (HSE), trying to find a link to public domain safety info- injury photos, to be told that yes they had them, but they now actively prevent any access to them “in case someone is upset” and they prefer to prosecute after the event rather than prevent it in an upsetting way.

I find it strange that I can download, from any number of disreputable “ghoul sites”, pictures of -Beheadings, babies stuck on spikes, people being dismembered, beatings, live mutilation, stabbing, burning, disembowelling, the results of massacres, for ‘entertainment.’
But can’t view, a hand caught in a saw, an eye with a splinter in it or a burn from a welder, to be used for Health & Safety educational use. WHY NOT?

Where are the training films / photos I was shown as an apprentice, the remembrance of which, have kept me safe in a lifetime in industry.

John Stevenson
04-08-2010, 07:33 PM
John,
Just for you, a blast from the past of Evans most famous safety thread.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/evans%20saw2.jpg

Really needs amending to say Cord contains no actual copper conductors.


:D ;)

jugs
04-08-2010, 08:01 PM
Chinese transfer press

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_YnaHNcISw&feature=related

Note, no safety glasses, someone could have an eye injury.

Your Old Dog
04-08-2010, 08:27 PM
When the new free health care takes place I hear they are going to tax gloves out of existence as threat to humanity.

jugs
04-08-2010, 08:44 PM
John,
Just for you, a blast from the past of Evans most famous safety thread.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/evans%20saw2.jpg

Really needs amending to say Cord contains no actual copper conductors.


:D ;)

Hi john, couldnt use that around here, the mice would eat the cheese :D

Spin Doctor
04-08-2010, 08:54 PM
I have to ask. Just who the sam hill is going to run a 3" shell mill into their hand. Glove or no glove. I understand the point of the demonstration. That machinery can and will wrap up articles of clothing. The same thing can happen with a long sleeve garment. I wore gloves and long sleeves around machinery for years. But not all the time and only in certain situations. Mostly for parts handling or because of hot 6's shooting off of the tooling. Never near a running spindle or shaft.

aboard_epsilon
04-08-2010, 09:06 PM
Some mths ago, while writing a workshop safety guide, I was in conversation with the british Health & Safety Executive (HSE), trying to find a link to public domain safety info- injury photos, to be told that yes they had them, but they now actively prevent any access to them “in case someone is upset” and they prefer to prosecute after the event rather than prevent it in an upsetting way.

I find it strange that I can download, from any number of disreputable “ghoul sites”, pictures of -Beheadings, babies stuck on spikes, people being dismembered, beatings, live mutilation, stabbing, burning, disembowelling, the results of massacres, for ‘entertainment.’
But can’t view, a hand caught in a saw, an eye with a splinter in it or a burn from a welder, to be used for Health & Safety educational use. WHY NOT?

Where are the training films / photos I was shown as an apprentice, the remembrance of which, have kept me safe in a lifetime in industry.

You got Brunstrom to thank for that.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-492665/Mad-Mullah-police-chief-caused-profound-distress-showing-photo-headless-crash-victim.html


all the best.markj

38_Cal
04-09-2010, 01:17 AM
I can still remember training films on carrier deck safety from boot camp in 1968...guys walking into props and arresting gear cables parting legs from torsos. Also the USS Forrestal fire caused by a rocket firing from a plane on deck. And I ended up in Naval Aviation units at NAS North Island and never set foot on a ship...:D

David

dr pepper
04-09-2010, 02:39 AM
The operator of that machine in my opinion was at risk with that test, a smack round the legs with that dummy would hurt nearly as much, dont think I'd stand that close.
I wear latex gloves because I'm prone to dermatitis, but I dont think the risk is the same.
Oh and that chinese power press has the clutch brake welded so it runs constant just to make sure the workers get out of the way in time.

jugs
04-09-2010, 06:15 AM
You got Brunstrom to thank for that.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-492665/Mad-Mullah-police-chief-caused-profound-distress-showing-photo-headless-crash-victim.html


all the best.markj

Yes, the man was a complete A- hole, openly disliked by many of his cuntstables who felt he gave policing a bad name. His "Arrive Alive" initiative turned out to be a well disguised income stream with a high profit margin.


I think the idea of using shocking photos was good, BUT while he was legally entitled to use the pics, he should have got permission from the family, who, if he had asked them giving good reason, may well have agreed, so at least their loved-one wouldn't have died in vain.

The man was a typical blinkered zealot, to busy pursuing his own twisted agenda regardless of others, to see the big picture.

Good riddance, shame about the police / public antipathy he left behind.

Davo J
04-09-2010, 07:06 AM
Only a dummy would get that close to a spinning cutter.:D

Seriously though, too many young blokes would laugh at that dummy,because it is a dummy. You need real life situations like has been said, it would sink in more and make them think, to see a real person getting hurt.
Dave

Spin Doctor
04-09-2010, 07:34 AM
My old job for years the nurses stations had pictures in profile of this guy from a Cadillac plant. From one side he had his freak flag lfying. From the other it was torn right out by the roots

Your Old Dog
04-09-2010, 08:26 AM
I have to ask. Just who the sam hill is going to run a 3" shell mill into their hand. Glove or no glove. I understand the point of the demonstration. That machinery can and will wrap up articles of clothing. The same thing can happen with a long sleeve garment. I wore gloves and long sleeves around machinery for years. But not all the time and only in certain situations. Mostly for parts handling or because of hot 6's shooting off of the tooling. Never near a running spindle or shaft.

Spin, I'm with you on this one. I have gotten in more trouble by flinching when something unexpected happens like a hot 6 between the fingers. I don't wear gloves when polishing on the lathe. If people can't stay focused on what they are doing or where they are then they would be well advised to work in the nude? What makes sense for one person may not for another where gloves are concerned. My gloves are loose fitting so that I can fling them off when I pick up something hot and the steam burn starts coming through the leather. I don't care if others prefer to work without gloves, it's okay with me.
!!

wierdscience
04-09-2010, 10:08 AM
I never wear gloves or long sleeve shirts when running rotating machinery.They can turn a lost finger into a lost arm or life.

krutch
04-09-2010, 01:51 PM
I remember being shown a film in drivers ed class. It was a collection of photos and film clips of highway accidents. Signal 30 is the Iowa State Police code for traffic death. It was a very explicit showing meant to impress us kids with the need for careful driving. The girls in the class were sickened by the film, but us boys were fascinated by it. I don't think it could be shown to todays kids, mostly because of the lawsuit industry. I wont relate the scenes here, but they were not censured in any way. I am not the least bit convenced the film had the intended resaults on us kids. We still chucked trannys, rear ends, and tires.
Krutch


MCAPTWandering.

Peter.
04-09-2010, 02:22 PM
I sometimes wear gloves when using my lathe though it hasn't the power to wind me in like the larger machines. I also wear gloves at work using rotating equipment all day long - it's mandatory on many Uk building sites. I've never had an incident whilst wearing gloves but I have seen a guy who was using a hand-held rotary percussion drill who squeezed the trigger whils having hold of the bit and dislocated three of his fingers.

saltmine
04-09-2010, 02:50 PM
My last job, before I retired, they decided everybody in the shop should be required to wear steel-toed shoes, safety glasses, hard hats, back braces, and rubber gloves. No, we weren't handling nuclear waste, or hydrochloric acid.....We were fixing and maintaining cars.

Despite my protests, we were ordered to use the gear provided, and soon several of the guys (myself included) started having neck compression injuries, trip-&-fall accidents, minor burns, numerous other problems due to restricted vision, restricted movement, and allergies to latex, etc.

Ever try to put a carburator or a valve body together wearing rubber gloves? It's like doing surgery wearing boxing gloves.

After watching me go through a whole box of rubber gloves, the supervisor decided being "safe" was going to be too costly. I would have a pair of gloves in shreds in as little as five minutes. One guy developed an allergy to the latex, and lost a couple of days' to recover.

I still have neck compression problems two years after I retired from being forced to wear the hard hat under cars...

I've heard of "killing with kindness" before, but never realized you could kill somebody with safey, too...They almost did.

rohart
04-09-2010, 06:52 PM
Pepper: Re the latex gloves, you'll no doubt win the battle when the drill press decides your fingers should have a closer relationship with the drill bit, but you'll need to brace yourself, and be alert.

It took about three or four seconds for my latex glove to split in two, half wrapped up round the drill, and half left on my hand, when it happened. I sort of knew the odds were in my favour, but I was pulling quite hard for a while !

Maybe latex gloves should be given a pre-cut, a little nick in a non-stress area, that won't encourage them to split in normal wear, somewhere like in the thumb joint. Then they'll split more easily when they gloves are off, to coin a phrase.

MuellerNick
04-10-2010, 05:16 AM
Here in Germany, it simply isn't allowed to work with gloves on mills, drills, lathes etc.
If someone says that he knows what he's doing, the answer is simple: Accidents don't happen with knowledge, they happen by chance. For example, your caliper starts to fall down, you try to catch it, but instead the drill bit catches your glove.
It always are situations where you do make a stupid move out of an reflex.
I prefer having a scratch or a cut on my hand over losing a hand or an arm.


Nick

Dr Stan
04-10-2010, 11:31 AM
Having worked in the military and industry for several years as a machinist & tool maker it was hammered into me "Thou shall not wear gloves or long sleeves". I did the same while teaching lab classes at a vo-tech and in higher education. The only time I had a student injured that required medical attention was when one kept on a pair of welding gloves to knock off some slag from a small piece of plate using a pedestal grinder.

Its simple. Do not wear gloves, long sleeves, leave shirt tails out, jewelry of any kind, and restrain long hair while working on rotating machinery. Period end of story.

I also banned man made fibers or blends from my hot labs. I had an uncle severely burned when he caught on fire in a steel mill and was wearing polyester thermal underwear. Approx 50% 2nd degree and 50% 3rd degree. By all rights he should have died, but somehow survived. To say he was a mess is an understatement.

oneeyedmac
04-10-2010, 06:24 PM
[QUOTE=jugs]
[FONT=Arial]I find it strange that I can download, from any number of disreputable “ghoul sites”, pictures of -Beheadings, babies stuck on spikes, people being dismembered, beatings, live mutilation, stabbing, burning, disembowelling, the results of massacres, for ‘entertainment.’
But can’t view, a hand caught in a saw, an eye with a splinter in it or a burn from a welder, to be used for Health & Safety educational use. [SIZE=3]WHY NOT?

][FONT=Arial][SIZE=3]

Dude, where are you hanging out on the web? I thought porno was bad....



I also banned man made fibers or blends from my hot labs. I had an uncle severely burned when he caught on fire in a steel mill and was wearing polyester thermal underwear. Approx 50% 2nd degree and 50% 3rd degree. By all rights he should have died, but somehow survived. To say he was a mess is an understatement.

I have a small gunsmith shop on my property and my 18 year old son broght a friend over one evening. I wasn't doing any machine work just removing a barrel from a receiver. When it get very cold out I use a kerosene torpedo heater to help keep it warm out there as the building's insulation isn't great. I had mentioned to the young man to steer clear as it got hot. He was wearing cotton pants and stood too close to it and his pants leg caught fire. No serious burns thank God but if it had been nylon it could've been much worse.

jugs
04-10-2010, 06:50 PM
Dude, where are you hanging out on the web? I thought porno was bad....

Google, when you search for ligitimate stuff you can be linked to some very strange "legal" sites.:eek:

clutch
04-10-2010, 07:14 PM
Deleted double post

clutch
04-10-2010, 07:16 PM
My mind still remembers that man that got wrapped around his lathe that went around a year or so ago.

My shop is only maintained at 52F while I'm not in it but since it is small, it heats up quickly. I tend to focus on putting things away and sweeping until I can take my coat off when the temperature is a bit warmer.

Those pictures of that guy are always in my head when around a spindle. He died but he saved lives. I'm sure of it.

At work, we have a policy of no gloves around spindles. The policy was created after someone got wrapped up in a reamer in a drill press. Lucky for them, someone was near by and the belt wasn't all that tight.

Clutch

jugs
04-10-2010, 09:05 PM
My mind still remembers that man that got wrapped around his lathe that went around a year or so ago.

My shop is only maintained at 52F while I'm not in it but since it is small, it heats up quickly. I tend to focus on putting things away and sweeping until I can take my coat off when the temperature is a bit warmer.

Those pictures of that guy are always in my head when around a spindle. He died but he saved lives. I'm sure of it.

At work, we have a policy of no gloves around spindles. The policy was created after someone got wrapped up in a reamer in a drill press. Lucky for them, someone was near by and the belt wasn't all that tight.

Clutch

Those pics should be in every workshop. At least it was quick for him.

I never wear Y fronts since I witnessed a toolmaker carrying a heavy tool block put it on to a bench trapping his bits, bad crush ind jury, he lost one testicle & 90% of his penis.

Same shop, another toolmaker lost a finger after it got slightly squeezed, not enough to hurt, but enough to make his gold ring reduce the blood supply, by the time he realized something was wrong it was to late.

I could go on.....

Then you get the insane - bloke wouldn't wear glasses ("they make me look old") working with wire wheel, BANG, loses eye. Year later same bloke, same job, still wont wear glasses (they make me look old & anyway lightning never strikes twice") it did !!
At least now, the HSE rules would get him sacked.

Pete F
04-10-2010, 09:31 PM
I never wear Y fronts

What's a Y front? I want to make sure I don't wear any either :eek:

-Pete

spope14
04-10-2010, 11:27 PM
Gloves, loose clothing, watches, rings around rotating machines - NFW. Machines and manuals have this all listed, OHSA has the rules about it, decades and more say this as well.

Maybe because it is simply SAFE PRACTICE, but hey, this is Ametrica, any fool can argue as they may for or against and live and work as you choose. This said, when you DO get hurt, lawyersfor your employer or health insurance company will cite safety practice, machine manuals, years of practice and OHSA rules and you will lose.

I hurt my hand some years back, ran it against a grinding wheel when sharpening tools, slipped off a handle. Pure chance accident. Went to the hospital to get stitched, it was workers comp. 24 stitches, but the first thing the Dr. asked, knowing it was Workers Comp was "are those the glasses (personal prescription) you were wearing in the shop?". I said yes, he checked them for the Z87 stamp. This noted, this was to be sure that I followed basic safety policy, had they not been, then all would have been suspect.

As or nostalgia about safety videos, did anyone ever have the "Primative Pete" videos or filmstrips? I used these for year to teach wood shop.

Peter.
04-11-2010, 03:08 AM
As or nostalgia about safety videos, did anyone ever have the "Primative Pete" videos or filmstrips? I used these for year to teach wood shop.

This is my favourite safety vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjzFUmeyQ5k


[Edited link]

jugs
04-11-2010, 04:18 AM
What's a Y front? I want to make sure I don't wear any either :eek:

-Pete

See -> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ley-4XL-Y-Front-Underpants-White-100-Cotton-49-51-NEW_W0QQitemZ200457741086QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMen_s_ Clothes?hash=item2eac36631e

Clearly shows the reason for accident

john

jugs
04-11-2010, 06:19 AM
My mind still remembers that man that got wrapped around his lathe that went around a year or so ago.

My shop is only maintained at 52F while I'm not in it but since it is small, it heats up quickly. I tend to focus on putting things away and sweeping until I can take my coat off when the temperature is a bit warmer.

Those pictures of that guy are always in my head when around a spindle. He died but he saved lives. I'm sure of it.

At work, we have a policy of no gloves around spindles. The policy was created after someone got wrapped up in a reamer in a drill press. Lucky for them, someone was near by and the belt wasn't all that tight.

Clutch


clutch

Just found the link to those pics,

Notes,
1.Graphic pics, you may not want to eat while viewing !!

http://www.b0g.org/wsnm/articles/This+Is+Twisted

2. You navigate the other weird links on that site at your own risk
There are some very strange people out there

john