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Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 12:46 PM
I would like to hear what others have on hand to move that piece of machinery that comes their way.

Rollers, jacks, straps, cranes...the list goes on...let's hear what you use.


And a specific question...in the past I have used random pieces of pipe to move a machine. Well now I have a nice piece of pipe that I would like to cut to have a set of machine moving rollers. The question...how long should I cut the pieces?

Thanks

TMT

Alistair Hosie
04-14-2010, 01:05 PM
MY favourites are an old skateboard for the front of machines smaller ones and two large pieces of scaffold pipe I use for moving heavier stuff.Alistair Ps oh that and bulging biceps and pecks somewhere under all the blubber:D oh I nearly forgot a half ton electric winch very handy and a car jack.

saltmine
04-14-2010, 01:07 PM
fourteen pounds of C-4 and a couple of blasting caps

Abner
04-14-2010, 01:07 PM
I just moved two small pieces. A BP clone mill and a SB heavy 10 lathe.
1/2" pipe was used. Having them long enough to fit completely from side to side when at an angle in relationship to the length was a must - to move them diagonally, which I needed to do both times. minimum 3 pcs. more is better.
Multiple pry bars.

MichaelP
04-14-2010, 01:11 PM
I have 1/2" pipe pieces (4' long), a 2-ton engine crane, a couple of 6' prylever bars (one is just a 1"x 1" x 72" steel bar with a bevel at the business end, the other one is similar to this: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200387624_200387624 ). I also had an electric winch attached to the wall that helped dragging some of the pieces, but it was really optional.

This was sufficient to unload and position everything (smaller lathe, Bridgeport, large vertical saw, mill-drill, etc.), except for a large (17") lathe. The latter required use of a forklift, hydraulic jacks and rollers.

rockrat
04-14-2010, 01:18 PM
What do I have on hand? Well....... Anything in the shop is fair game. I have used one Bridgeport as an anchor point to pull something different out away from a wall. :) I know that was not exactly what you were looking for.

The list,
1) Chain all lengths - I buy it at every auction. No one really bids on the stuff.
2) Clevis hooks, grab hooks any that I can pin a chain to
3) Rope, cable, twine, etc
4) Pipe in all sizes and lengths
5) Wood blocking / dunnage
6) GLOVES!
7) Cable come-along
8) Chain come-along
9) Webbing / straps with ratchets
10) Binders, screw and lever.
11) Tie wire
12) Electrical tape
13) Pry bars
14) Small bucket of double clevis links, lifting rings, forged eye hooks, shackles

There is more, its all in the corner and I put everything from the corner in the truck when I run out to a move. Staging it in the corner lets me get everything at once. A full socket set is a nice addition. A little tool box with the basics is good.

All of these things were bought over the years as needed or as they came up in auction. Buy decent stuff and have it handy.

But the best thing to do is study rigging and moving texts. Always think about the machine and the weight that you are in control of. Safety information is a priceless tool.

So what are you moving?
rock~

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 01:33 PM
Nothing to move at the moment...

The post started as this nice piece of 2" pipe that I came across and considering what to do with it.

I too have used 1/2" pipe that I have picked up along the way..random pieces of various lengths. I have found that 1/2" can be too small since it can hang up on any little pebble or crack so I wanted a bit larger diameter of rollers. And since this 2" piece of pipe is one piece, I am fielding what lengths I should cut it.

But of course all this now makes me want to put together a kit of moving materials/tools so I am actually ready for the next acquistion...so the broader question that should be of interest to anyone chasing their next machine.

TMT

snowman
04-14-2010, 01:38 PM
I am a big fan of gary's trucks made from scrap bearings.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/ghart3/Tools/Steertruck.jpg

I have moved all of my machines with a comealong, a harbor freight winch (the cheapest one they sell), a couple nylon lifting straps, some crowbars and pipe. Along with a small selection of 1/8-1/4-1/2" shims to get machines onto 2x4's or tall enough to get the pipe under it. I don't move them often enough to need much more, though I have a working design for a hydraulic lift that will help me get things from the back of a trailer to the floor. That's always the trickiest part.

TriHonu
04-14-2010, 02:04 PM
I got tired of the fight. I picked up some very heavy duty casters at an auction. I used four of them to make a straddle dolly.

http://home.comcast.net/~trihonu/07_Mill.jpg

It is made of two sizes of square tubing that fit snugly inside one another.

http://home.comcast.net/~trihonu/08_Mill.jpg

Part 1 - is a 6" piece of the larger size tube welded to a piece of plate with a caster bolted to it.
Part 2 - is a 4" piece of the larger size tube with a gusseted ear welded to it.
Part 3 - is two 6" pieces of the larger tubing welded at a 90 degree angle.

The frame is made of 4 pieces of the smaller (2" OD) tube. You can adjust the frame to any size. The frame is just held in place by friction with the load on it. Best of all, when not in use the bits all fit in a small duffel bag and the frame tubes stand in the corner.

To move a Bridgeport, we just used a pry bar to pick it up an inch or so and set it on blocks, assembled the straddle dolly, slid 4 bolts up through the anchor holes and through the ears, hand tighten the nuts and remove the blocks.

One guy can roll the mill with minimal effort. I've used it to move lathes and mills. I also use it when working on equipment in the shop. I can move stuff outside to grind, sandblast, pressure wash or paint.

I also have all the usual chains, binders, lifting straps, engine cranes, jacks and a couple 10 ton PortoPower sets with attachments.

Black_Moons
04-14-2010, 02:05 PM
I bought REAL lifting straps from some rigging store.. only to find out I bought one too long and needed to use the 'tree recovery strap' I got from PA... rated like 5+ tons or something and looks strong enough with some newspaper packed in to keep it off any sharp corners. (And by newspaper I mean like an entire days newspaper wraped around 1 corner without wrinkleing it up)

KIMFAB
04-14-2010, 02:34 PM
I keep about 8 pieces of 1/2" pipe alongside my Lagun mill. A 5" pry bar made from an old axle and several other bars works for the manual stuff.
Getting too old now for most moving so I recently acquired a small fork lift.

Most of the small, heavy, often moved stuff is on casters.
Don't forget to have at least 2 super heavy ratcheting hold downs and a half dozen heavy ones.

quasi
04-14-2010, 02:43 PM
Trihonu, that is a very interesting rig. Have you ever moved a lathe with it?

Bruce Griffing
04-14-2010, 03:29 PM
I bought GKS Perfekt transport trolleys F3 and L3:

http://www.gks-perfekt.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=174

Also a Northern Hydraulic toe jack, Horror Freight Hydraulic Jack and a Heavy Pry Bar:

http://www.marshalltown.com/productDetail.aspx?prodID=16595

This combination is very good for the size machines I move.

fahnoe
04-14-2010, 04:23 PM
TriHonu,

Very nice indeed! Looks like a very handy set to keep on hand, thanks for taking the time to diagram and explain. I would wonder about the height as it seems like different thicknesses of bases would potentially be challenging. Thinking about something that has fairly thin feet vs. something like the mill shown with the thick base. I suppose you have some adjustment by placing the side tubes on top of or underneath the main tubes though.

--Larry

spope14
04-14-2010, 04:37 PM
Pretty much all the things listed, but add a few friends and some pizzas and beer for afterwards.

Dr Stan
04-14-2010, 05:36 PM
Find some old canvas fire hose to put between the chains and your machine.

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 05:42 PM
Good responses so far.

What equipment to move machines over soft ground? The world is not paved with concrete.

And how about handling those little steps that life puts between the machine and our destination?

Any special items for when you work alone?

And about those pipe rollers...how long should I cut them? ;<)

TMT

snowman
04-14-2010, 05:46 PM
Any special items for when you work alone?


I'll do a lot by myself. I will not move machines without at least my wife sitting watching me. Someone needs to be able to call 911.

The Artful Bodger
04-14-2010, 05:52 PM
If I want to move something over soft ground I put a couple of planks under it and drag it. I have a 20' shipping container half full of 'stuff' which I can move over the ground using some round wooden fence posts and dragging it with a chain block, if the ground is really soft I could put a couple of planks down for the rollers to run on.

The secret to dragging stuff is having an effective means of setting a 'dead man' (anchor point), lots of chain and generous use of pulley blocks etc.

If the Egyptians could drag all those blocks to the pyramids we can surely move a few thousand pounds of old iron.

I drag things with a chain block, wire strainers or a truck or tractor if there is room and there is one available.

My father and I dragged a 3 bedroom house 5 miles over farmland using skids and two tractors and not even one window broke!

The Artful Bodger
04-14-2010, 05:58 PM
And how about handling those little steps that life puts between the machine and our destination?

If the load is being dragged it is probably easiest to make some sort of ramp.


Any special items for when you work alone?
Just take extra care and plan every detail so you are not caught with something vital being out of reach and you unable to let go of what you are holding.

gwilson
04-14-2010, 06:13 PM
Did anyone mention Johnson bars? I think they are called pry bar dollies,or some such. They have 2 wheels,and a shovel scoop on their front ends,and long oak handles. The long ones are supposed to lift 5000 #. With 2 guys and 2 of these,it is easy to scoot a bridgeport across the smooth concrete floor.

I also have an old come along with a 2" web strap. I try to not damage the paint on my machines. Also,an old railroad jack that has a very low nose to get under machinery bases.

Getting them onto a trailer,or off,is a different matter. I get my friend with a very low trailer,steel rods to roll on,ramps,and several friends. My heaviest machine isn't over 3000#.

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 06:40 PM
A question...is a car strap as good as a regular rigging strap for lifting machines?

Several times in the past I have had to make do with what was available.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 06:43 PM
Another issue to mention...several times I have had to retrieve machines from an area with a dirt floor...several times in a shed and once in a basement. It makes for a difficult move.

What do you use in that case?

TMT

The Artful Bodger
04-14-2010, 06:47 PM
Another issue to mention...several times I have had to retrieve machines from an area with a dirt floor...several times in a shed and once in a basement. It makes for a difficult move.

What do you use in that case?

TMT

Rollers for hard floors, skids for soft ground. Skids also for going up or down stairs but allow for any tendency to tip.

If you have a polished floor use carpet, upside down, under skids.

Fasttrack
04-14-2010, 07:04 PM
And about those pipe rollers...how long should I cut them? ;<)

TMT


Depends on what you move. I've got some 2" pipe "rollers" that are 3-4' long. I've got a whole pallet of them and I throw a whole bunch in the truck when I know I'm going to have to retrieve a machine from a shop/garage myself. Then you just roll the thing "Egyptian" style. I needed wide ones for my shaper, which has a pretty enormous foot print. If you are only going to be looking at modestly sized machines - BP and medium duty lathes, you could probably get away with 2' or so. You want them long enough to span the footprint of the machine.

Fasttrack
04-14-2010, 07:08 PM
A question...is a car strap as good as a regular rigging strap for lifting machines?

Several times in the past I have had to make do with what was available.

TMT

No. I think you can de-rate a tow strap for lifting, but it's probably not a good idea. I'm not saying it doesn't work in a pinch, but for 80 bucks you can get a proper lifting strap with a very large capacity. It's a relatively small price to pay if you will be moving a lot of heavy machinery - the last thing you want is for a strap to brake and the machine to smash to the floor (especially if your toes are under it... :eek:)


Clarification: An 8 ton tow strap is not meant for lifting, vertically, 8 tons. It might be good for 1 ton or something like that. That's what I meant by de-rating.

Black_Moons
04-14-2010, 07:16 PM
For moving across dirt, try using 2X4's layed down flat as rails, with 4 of them you can allow some overlap for seamless trade off beween the rails.
(use in conjunction with pipes)
I had no problem moving 1000lb equipment on soft dirt with this method. maybe use more rails in parallel for 2000+lb equipment however.

camdigger
04-14-2010, 07:55 PM
My rigging list to move big stuff...

Skid material 2x8 or 2 x 10
4 - 2"x10"x10' fir planks
2 pcs 2' x 4' 3/4" plywood for ramp
2 or 4 pcs 6-8' 4x4s
20 oz framing hammer
3 1/2" framing nails
hand saw
16' carhauler trailer 16" deck height c/w 4' ramps
2T comealong
3 - 16' transport grade chains 2 - 5/16", 1 - 1/4"
Assorted load binders sized to chains
4' 2" fibreglass pipe snipe
Assorted nylon slings 3', 6', 10', and 16'
4 ratchet straps 5t or so
12 - 2" pipe scraps 14 - 24" long
36" gooseneck bar
30" prybar
1", 2", 4" nominal thickness blocking
2 full sheets 3/8" OSB cutinto assorted pieces
4 Clevises 5T minimum
Baling or rebar tie wire
Electrical tape

Available, but rarely used, 2 -36" hi-lift mechanical jacks, 1 - 20T hyd jack, 1 20T stubby hyd jack, 1 transmission jack, 8 T hyd jack, shop built hyd engine crane, knockdown gantry, 2 4T chainfalls, 2 - 2T 12vdc winches.

IMHO, pipe smaller than 1" is useless, rod is worse. 2" pipe is best as it is cheaper (for me), rolls better, and is easily steered with either the gooseneck bar or the prybar.

Moving across soft surfaces is a matter of laying down plywood and cycling the pieces ahead of the load. Works well if the overlap is run in the direction of travel. On firmer surfaces, it works well butting up the plywood and adding extra rollers.

Instead of plywood, pro riggers often use 1/16" plates roughly 18" square.

I work best alone. Double line lots. One line is live, the other has minimal slack 6 - 12" and moves go 4 - 10" at a time on any slope or incline and a foot or two on the flat so the rollers can be repositioned. Sounds slow, but the most time is spent on the 4" - 6" vertical at either end of the move.
When prying stuff off the floor lift 3/4" maximum and block up constantly.

.RC.
04-14-2010, 08:06 PM
Six women from a Russian tractor factory..

Ohio Mike
04-14-2010, 08:11 PM
Anyone used any of Northern Tool's equipment skates?

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/category_material-handling+dollies-movers+machinery-movers-accessories

wierdscience
04-14-2010, 08:22 PM
Cable slings inside hoses,nylon straps also inside hoses if wear edge isn't availible.I avoid chains unless they are system 8.

Come-alongs and electric winches along with a few heel bars.

Then it's off to a 5 and 10k# forklift, 25ton crane and for those special sales an 80 ton on standby.God made hydraulic cylinders for a reason:)

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 08:31 PM
My rigging list to move big stuff...

Skid material 2x8 or 2 x 10
4 - 2"x10"x10' fir planks
2 pcs 2' x 4' 3/4" plywood for ramp
2 or 4 pcs 6-8' 4x4s
20 oz framing hammer
3 1/2" framing nails
hand saw
16' carhauler trailer 16" deck height c/w 4' ramps
2T comealong
3 - 16' transport grade chains 2 - 5/16", 1 - 1/4"
Assorted load binders sized to chains
4' 2" fibreglass pipe snipe
Assorted nylon slings 3', 6', 10', and 16'
4 ratchet straps 5t or so
12 - 2" pipe scraps 14 - 24" long
36" gooseneck bar
30" prybar
1", 2", 4" nominal thickness blocking
2 full sheets 3/8" OSB cutinto assorted pieces
4 Clevises 5T minimum
Baling or rebar tie wire
Electrical tape

Available, but rarely used, 2 -36" hi-lift mechanical jacks, 1 - 20T hyd jack, 1 20T stubby hyd jack, 1 transmission jack, 8 T hyd jack, shop built hyd engine crane, knockdown gantry, 2 4T chainfalls, 2 - 2T 12vdc winches.

IMHO, pipe smaller than 1" is useless, rod is worse. 2" pipe is best as it is cheaper (for me), rolls better, and is easily steered with either the gooseneck bar or the prybar.

Moving across soft surfaces is a matter of laying down plywood and cycling the pieces ahead of the load. Works well if the overlap is run in the direction of travel. On firmer surfaces, it works well butting up the plywood and adding extra rollers.

Instead of plywood, pro riggers often use 1/16" plates roughly 18" square.

I work best alone. Double line lots. One line is live, the other has minimal slack 6 - 12" and moves go 4 - 10" at a time on any slope or incline and a foot or two on the flat so the rollers can be repositioned. Sounds slow, but the most time is spent on the 4" - 6" vertical at either end of the move.
When prying stuff off the floor lift 3/4" maximum and block up constantly.


Got pictures of that knockdown gantry crane?

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 08:33 PM
My rigging list to move big stuff...

Skid material 2x8 or 2 x 10
4 - 2"x10"x10' fir planks
2 pcs 2' x 4' 3/4" plywood for ramp
2 or 4 pcs 6-8' 4x4s
20 oz framing hammer
3 1/2" framing nails
hand saw
16' carhauler trailer 16" deck height c/w 4' ramps
2T comealong
3 - 16' transport grade chains 2 - 5/16", 1 - 1/4"
Assorted load binders sized to chains
4' 2" fibreglass pipe snipe
Assorted nylon slings 3', 6', 10', and 16'
4 ratchet straps 5t or so
12 - 2" pipe scraps 14 - 24" long
36" gooseneck bar
30" prybar
1", 2", 4" nominal thickness blocking
2 full sheets 3/8" OSB cutinto assorted pieces
4 Clevises 5T minimum
Baling or rebar tie wire
Electrical tape

Available, but rarely used, 2 -36" hi-lift mechanical jacks, 1 - 20T hyd jack, 1 20T stubby hyd jack, 1 transmission jack, 8 T hyd jack, shop built hyd engine crane, knockdown gantry, 2 4T chainfalls, 2 - 2T 12vdc winches.

IMHO, pipe smaller than 1" is useless, rod is worse. 2" pipe is best as it is cheaper (for me), rolls better, and is easily steered with either the gooseneck bar or the prybar.

Moving across soft surfaces is a matter of laying down plywood and cycling the pieces ahead of the load. Works well if the overlap is run in the direction of travel. On firmer surfaces, it works well butting up the plywood and adding extra rollers.

Instead of plywood, pro riggers often use 1/16" plates roughly 18" square.

I work best alone. Double line lots. One line is live, the other has minimal slack 6 - 12" and moves go 4 - 10" at a time on any slope or incline and a foot or two on the flat so the rollers can be repositioned. Sounds slow, but the most time is spent on the 4" - 6" vertical at either end of the move.
When prying stuff off the floor lift 3/4" maximum and block up constantly.

Good points about the plates.

I picked up some surplus tempered stainless steel sheets (2'x3') years ago...and they work very well for moving machines over soft ground.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
04-14-2010, 08:35 PM
Six women from a Russian tractor factory..

Or six tractors from a Russian women's factory...

TMT

Saratoga Bill
04-14-2010, 09:30 PM
My pipes for rollers are 3/4 inch and cut to 3 foot lengths. When I have to do an angle move they do get just a whisker short so my next set will be 42inches.
There is one other thing I keep very handy and that's the phone number of my friend with the tow truck and roll back. Best ever taking a 16 inch South Bend out of a half heighth cellar.

Bill

TriHonu
04-15-2010, 12:48 AM
Trihonu, that is a very interesting rig. Have you ever moved a lathe with it?

Yes, it works well. With a narrow tall load, I have used longer frame members so the casters sit farther apart creating a more stable base.


TriHonu,
Very nice indeed! Looks like a very handy set to keep on hand, thanks for taking the time to diagram and explain. I would wonder about the height as it seems like different thicknesses of bases would potentially be challenging. Thinking about something that has fairly thin feet vs. something like the mill shown with the thick base. I suppose you have some adjustment by placing the side tubes on top of or underneath the main tubes though.
--Larry

Exactly right on the two positions of the main tubes! There have been many times that the dolly is set-up and then additional steel beams are placed on top to support an item. (i.e. a temp support post welded to a piece of channel that was bolted to the item and set on top of the frame.

I have not needed them yet, but I have extra tube that I could make some support ears that were on "risers" to adjust for that. With it being modular, I can add custom pieces as needed.

NzOldun
04-15-2010, 05:26 AM
[QUOTE=Ohio Mike]Anyone used any of Northern Tool's equipment skates?

Looking at their 3300 lb, 4 wheel skate, each wheel is taking 825 lb.

On a concrete floor the contact area for each wheel would be the width of the wheel by about 1/8" - and this is generous!!

Assuming 1 7/8" for the wheel width, this gives a stress, to the concrete, of just over 3700 p.s.i.

You'd better have a very good floor!

:cool:

Malc-Y
04-15-2010, 06:15 AM
A few years ago I was in a scrap yard owned by a friend and saw six 12" lengths of steel 1 1/2" diameter and asked if I could have them as I thought that they may come in handy. I thought that they were ordinary mild steel but when I came to try and turn one in the lathe I found that no lathe tool that I had would even scratch them. Imentioned this to the owner of the scrap yard next time I was there and he told me that they were 'needle' rollers from the bearings of a steel rolling mill at the local steel works! I have since used them on many occasions for moving machinery including my Bridgeport, my Colchester lathe, a 5cwt anvil and other heavy euipment. Over the years I have accumulated an assortment of wooden packing, mostly 3" x 4" x 12", various lengths of chain and assorted shackles, a 25 ton Tangye hydraulic jack that can be used upright or on it's side, two 1 ton and one half ton chain hoists, a 7" x 4" RSJ in the workshop roof with a girder trolley, various crowbars, pry bars, slings and other bits and pieces that most workshops accumulate over the years. I have never, so far, been unable to move anything or unload my trailer single-handedly although another pair of hands is always welcome.

Malc. :cool:

Evan
04-15-2010, 08:32 AM
The most important thing to have on hand is a plan. Every move and the position of every piece of moving equipment should be thought out in advance and the items placed where they can be easily reached as required.

The second most important thing is to have an emergency backup plan. Equipment required to prevent a disaster should also be ready at hand at all times during the move. Beams, chains, props and chocks should all be available so that when the caster breaks off on a bump and the machine begins to tip you can quickly reach over for the 2x4 you laid on the mill table and use it to steady the machine.

The last but equally important thing to have is the complete agreement in advance from any helpers that you are the boss. No improvisations will be allowed except in a developing emergency. If halt is called then every one secures their position and waits for orders. There can only be one boss on a moving job.

BTW, I moved machines up to two tons for over two decades. I never had one get away.

bpsbtoolman
04-15-2010, 09:16 AM
After 3 homes with basements I had a hard time getting machines down into them.
So the house I built recently on a sloping lot has a walkout basement with a 5 foot patio door. Just outside the door I have an I beam 8 foot span with a 2 ton capability.At a yard sale I bought a Yale 2 ton pallet truck for $ 100. built a 4 foot span take apart 7 foot high A frame that lifts 1 ton.
I slide the A frame over say my 1 ton Bridgeport, lift it about 4 inches, slide the pallet truck under it and drop it. By hand pull it out the door to under the beam and lift it high enough for a truck or trailer to back under it.
I have hauled 2,13 inch and a heavy ten SB lathes and a 1400 lb, Sheldon 12 inch shaper and a 1000 lb Sheldon H mill.
With lots of chains and a 0ne ton and a 1-1/2 ton come along , and a 3 ton chain hoist its an easy safe job.
Took me till I am 86 to do this, Slow learner I guess.
Walt

Too_Many_Tools
04-15-2010, 10:10 AM
After 3 homes with basements I had a hard time getting machines down into them.
So the house I built recently on a sloping lot has a walkout basement with a 5 foot patio door. Just outside the door I have an I beam 8 foot span with a 2 ton capability.At a yard sale I bought a Yale 2 ton pallet truck for $ 100. built a 4 foot span take apart 7 foot high A frame that lifts 1 ton.
I slide the A frame over say my 1 ton Bridgeport, lift it about 4 inches, slide the pallet truck under it and drop it. By hand pull it out the door to under the beam and lift it high enough for a truck or trailer to back under it.
I have hauled 2,13 inch and a heavy ten SB lathes and a 1400 lb, Sheldon 12 inch shaper and a 1000 lb Sheldon H mill.
With lots of chains and a 0ne ton and a 1-1/2 ton come along , and a 3 ton chain hoist its an easy safe job.
Took me till I am 86 to do this, Slow learner I guess.
Walt

Got pictures of that crane?

TMT

JoeLee
04-15-2010, 11:04 AM
I have a couple 4 x 10 ft. x 1/8" pieces of sheet metal I keep around for moving stuff on soft ground. Works out very well. One has a slot in it where I can slip a chain hook in and pull it with my lawn tractor or truck so I can skid it on the lawn. When I was sandblasting and painting my machine bases I would lay the sheets out from the garage door out into the yard and roll the bases in and out on my dolly.


TriHonu, I like your idea, you have the right idea for moving stuff around the shop. I have a sketch of a similar thing I designed to move my KO Lee grinders but haven't got around to building it yet. The problem is all I can get under the base of these grinders is about 5/8", there are no outside holes like in the mill.
Another thing that works really well is to have some anchor pots in the floor where you can hook a chain to and pull the machine close to where you want it. I also have some port a power equipment I use to lift things.
I had some extra anchor pots from when I had my body shop, I used them for chaining down cars when I had to pull the frames around.

JL..............

TriHonu
04-15-2010, 02:58 PM
TriHonu, I like your idea, you have the right idea for moving stuff around the shop. I have a sketch of a similar thing I designed to move my KO Lee grinders but haven't got around to building it yet. The problem is all I can get under the base of these grinders is about 5/8", there are no outside holes like in the mill.

Another thing that works really well is to have some anchor pots in the floor where you can hook a chain to and pull the machine close to where you want it.
JL

I would think you could make some 5/8 tight angles (flat bar hooks) to slide under the machine with a take up bolt welded to it. Then it could be attached to the ears.

Amen on the anchor pots. I put them in my shop floor every four feet. They are very handy to have.

Tinkerer
04-15-2010, 03:08 PM
Well I have a 45' crane to pick up about anything. Made some skates (shop built tools post #204) to get stuff from inside to the truck. Hand trucks... carts... pipe... blocking... ect. and a good woman to help. ;)

Too_Many_Tools
04-16-2010, 01:51 PM
It was brought up in another discussion of the usefulness of pallet trucks...so what ones work best for moving machines?

TMT

JoeLee
04-17-2010, 04:17 PM
I would think you could make some 5/8 tight angles (flat bar hooks) to slide under the machine with a take up bolt welded to it. Then it could be attached to the ears.

Amen on the anchor pots. I put them in my shop floor every four feet. They are very handy to have.

I had thought of flat hooks made out of angle iron with a threaded rod design to lift each hook but the more I toyed with the idea the more complicated it started to get. The design you have for your mill is simple, just thread the rod into the base of the machine and turn the nut to raise.
With the flat hook design there would have to be some type of guide to keep the hook from moving side to side as it hangs off the threaded rod. If I have a flat bar with a threaded hole in each end I can acomplish the same thing, slide the bars under the base and use the threadded rod and nut to lift using the same frame design as you have with the ear welded to the square tube. I could also easily use it on my mill as well.
My original design was a frame that I would bolt togather around the base of the machine.

JL................

Too_Many_Tools
04-17-2010, 05:04 PM
I had thought of flat hooks made out of angle iron with a threaded rod design to lift each hook but the more I toyed with the idea the more complicated it started to get. The design you have for your mill is simple, just thread the rod into the base of the machine and turn the nut to raise.
With the flat hook design there would have to be some type of guide to keep the hook from moving side to side as it hangs off the threaded rod. If I have a flat bar with a threaded hole in each end I can acomplish the same thing, slide the bars under the base and use the threadded rod and nut to lift using the same frame design as you have with the ear welded to the square tube. I could also easily use it on my mill as well.
My original design was a frame that I would bolt togather around the base of the machine.

JL................

Your design is still a good idea.

Check around your shop and see how many machines have holes in their bases that you could lift from..not a lot in my experience.

FWIW...it drives me crazy that machine manufacturers don't provide better lifting points on their machines.

TMT

oil mac
04-17-2010, 05:05 PM
The equipmet i have used in the past for general millwright duties, is---- A) a 15 cwt. capacity Tirfor (rope winch)
B) a 30 cwt, Yale chain lift (to you guys a come-along.
C) a 5ton capacity Duff Norton toe jack (I never trust a hydraulic jack)
D) a quantity of 6"x6"x 18" long wood blocks
E) apropriate slings &chains. +shackles.
F) steel plates about9"x 4ft. long x3/8" thick.

I am getting too long in the tooth for this machine shuffling lark, the most important thing is a couple of good volunteers On occasions i have had occasions to move tall machines in a closed and crampted environment, It is a worry if you have not a lot of room To run to, To escape a machine coming over, In this case i use the steel plates, as skid pads, with a little smear of grease on the top surface, Your machine has not a large depth to overbalance, & come over, I once saw a radial drill come over with a man, doing the wrong thing, It gave me the heebies !
One task, i recall was shifting a small slotting machine for a man, It was about 7foot tall, sitting on top of a concrete plinth, about 12" up from the floor, Fortunately we were able to obtain three length of H girder, By lifting the machine up by pinchbars about 1/2" above the base, Still keeping her tie bolts in we slipped lengths of plate under her, Burned off the bolts, Built a ramp, with our girders & wood packing & pulled her down the ramp, which, had a slow slope Everyone at a safe distance, got her onto the floor
There was no lifting capacity from the weak roof above her.

JoeLee
04-17-2010, 06:30 PM
The only machine in my shop that has holes in the base are the Bridgeport. My lathe has adjustable leveling pads that couild be easily adapted to lifting with this design but the lathe has two bases so I would have to make two rigs, well maybe not I could just lift the tail stock end and balance it. Fortunatly I don't have to move it or the mill.
What I have to move around are the two KO Lee grinders and there are no holes in the bases, I can just slip a 5/8" flat bar under them without having to jack them up.

JL...............

andy_b
04-18-2010, 11:11 AM
I agree with your list and especially like this part. It is the same as I do.




I work best alone. Double line lots. One line is live, the other has minimal slack 6 - 12" and moves go 4 - 10" at a time on any slope or incline and a foot or two on the flat so the rollers can be repositioned. Sounds slow, but the most time is spent on the 4" - 6" vertical at either end of the move.
When prying stuff off the floor lift 3/4" maximum and block up constantly.


I use 1" black pipe as the diameter is slightly less than the thickness of a standard 2x4. That way you can get the machine on pieces of 2x4, slide the black pipe under it where needed, and then easily lower it onto the pipe. I have pieces of pipe from 12" to 48" long and it all comes in handy.

andy b.

Paul Alciatore
04-18-2010, 01:27 PM
I moved my SB9 last night. It is on a welded steel table and has a lot of tooling on shelves and drawers attached to the table so the weight is at least twice the lathe's. After using a pry bar to pop the steel pads off the floor, they were well glued down with oil, etc, I used a hammer and some wood blocks to gently (wham, wham, WHAM) inch it along for all of two inches.

It was and still is positioned directly across from my new mill and the isle between them was just a bit too narrow. It is amazing how much difference two inches can make in a tight situation.

metalmagpie
04-18-2010, 05:03 PM
Something like this goes a real long ways when moving machinery:
http://www.tinyisland.com/images/temp/ihstand.jpg

But if you don't have that, then a bucket of 1' pieces of 3/4" pipe work OK too. You'll also need a couple of wedges (to stop the machine from rolling back after you pick up the back, put it on pipes, then start prying up the front) and a long prybar.

I welded up a 2 ton gantry on 8" casters. The gantry is height-adjustable so it goes down low enough to roll completely inside my shop if I need it to, or tall enough so I can pick up a Bridgeport and put it into a pickup. A shop crane like a 2-ton engine hoist is very useful but the usefulness is limited by what you can span with the legs.

Rolling skates are great too, see my buddy's design:
http://www.dogpatch.com/bobp/shop/mover.htm

The cool thing about those is that you only have to lift the machine 3/4" off the floor. No matter what happens it can only fall 3/4". I made up some of those once, wound up selling them to a university who needed some.

MM

JeffG
04-19-2010, 05:05 PM
Nose bars - from Eastern Rigging Supply -

http://www.easternrigging.com/prybar.htm

I have a 5' flare and a 6' straight toe. You can "walk" a machine pretty much anywhere there's clearance for the bar. But its a lot easier when the machine has notches in the base. Also useful for the initial lift when you're blocking up the machine.

Schwartzer
03-23-2015, 11:12 AM
I got tired of the fight. I picked up some very heavy duty casters at an auction. I used four of them to make a straddle dolly.

http://home.comcast.net/~trihonu/07_Mill.jpg

It is made of two sizes of square tubing that fit snugly inside one another.

http://home.comcast.net/~trihonu/08_Mill.jpg

Part 1 - is a 6" piece of the larger size tube welded to a piece of plate with a caster bolted to it.
Part 2 - is a 4" piece of the larger size tube with a gusseted ear welded to it.
Part 3 - is two 6" pieces of the larger tubing welded at a 90 degree angle.

The frame is made of 4 pieces of the smaller (2" OD) tube. You can adjust the frame to any size. The frame is just held in place by friction with the load on it. Best of all, when not in use the bits all fit in a small duffel bag and the frame tubes stand in the corner.

To move a Bridgeport, we just used a pry bar to pick it up an inch or so and set it on blocks, assembled the straddle dolly, slid 4 bolts up through the anchor holes and through the ears, hand tighten the nuts and remove the blocks.

One guy can roll the mill with minimal effort. I've used it to move lathes and mills. I also use it when working on equipment in the shop. I can move stuff outside to grind, sandblast, pressure wash or paint.

I also have all the usual chains, binders, lifting straps, engine cranes, jacks and a couple 10 ton PortoPower sets with attachments.

TriHonu I am going to build this, really like the design. What thickness tube/pipe did you use? Are those casters 4" or 5"?

Carm
03-23-2015, 11:36 AM
Schwartzer
TriHonu hasn't posted on this board in ages.
A B'port weighs about 1900# stripped, no vise, riser or power feed etc.
Always a good idea to flip the head 180 and drop the knee since they're top heavy.
That build looks like a mix of eighth and quarter wall

gudlife
03-23-2015, 02:34 PM
That straddle dolly looks slick for sure!

I just used a combination of a cherry picker w/ straps and some movers dollies to move my shear in.

As much as I would like to have everything on wheels...they are expensive for good ones and lots of things need a more stable base. All of my benches/tables are fabbed up from square or rect tube...learned a while back that adding a rail a couple inches off the ground all around is a good thing. If you are already building it the extra time and material is next to nothing. Makes the tables nice and rigid and you can drop a shelf on it if you like. The trick for me is being able to roll my pallet jack into the shop. I can pick up and move anything by myself with ease. Even top heavy stuff like my mill/drill is no problem since I can jack it up just enough to move it without it getting tippy. I've got a low door that makes it tough to utilize a gantry or a forklift in the building and being able to use my jack has saved my bacon a bunch of times.

Paul Alciatore
03-23-2015, 03:27 PM
My son and me.

boslab
03-23-2015, 03:55 PM
I moved my SB9 last night. It is on a welded steel table and has a lot of tooling on shelves and drawers attached to the table so the weight is at least twice the lathe's. After using a pry bar to pop the steel pads off the floor, they were well glued down with oil, etc, I used a hammer and some wood blocks to gently (wham, wham, WHAM) inch it along for all of two inches.

It was and still is positioned directly across from my new mill and the isle between them was just a bit too narrow. It is amazing how much difference two inches can make in a tight situation.
I laughed till I cried, love it
I use an excavator and front loader myself, occasional forklift, getting lazy!
Pipes and plates tend to be inside kit, I got fed up with struggling and ran a 6x6x1/2" girder through the middle of the shop, it has a girder monkey and hoist, vital!
Mark

TriHonu
03-23-2015, 11:56 PM
TriHonu I am going to build this, really like the design. What thickness tube/pipe did you use? Are those casters 4" or 5"?

My brother borrowed it about a year ago when he was re-arranging his shop and I have not got it back yet. The outer tubes are 2-1/4" with a wall thickness a little less than 1/8" (12 gauge).

The casters are 3-1/2" or 4". I bought them at an auction. They have needle bearings on the axles and balls on the swivels and are much stronger than what is required for this application.

Finding square tube that nests together can be challenging. My local supplier only stocks 2-1/4" in 16 gauge now. At the time I built it, my supplier had samples available of all sizes that fit together. I did find Totten Tubes (http://www.tottentubes.com/tubing-pipe-products/square-steel-tubing) still has 2-1/4" in 5 wall thicknesses, so it is available if you search around.

metalmagpie made a similar dolly that is much heavier. He posted his write up HERE (http://www.nwnative.us/Grant/shop%20articles/mtd/projectWebPage.html).

Schwartzer
06-24-2015, 01:49 AM
TriHonu:
Thanks I built my similar to yours and moved my Bridgeport mill and lathe.
The outer tube was 2.5" od and 2" id. Inner tube was 2" od and 1.75" id square.
I had to clean up the welds on the inside for it to slide.
.5" bolts 5" long. 4" steel casters. Moved it on a drop lift trailer. Worked great. Now I need to find an easier way to lift it other than a prybar.
Thanks again.
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/268/19207885766_20bfce4e60_b.jpg
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/519/19046393068_c419dd4023_b.jpg
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/489/18613410843_4f7484e05d_b.jpg
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/391/18613416793_266f878c8f_b.jpg

rock_breaker
06-24-2015, 03:25 AM
fourteen pounds of C-4 and a couple of blasting caps
Most guys want it to come down ib the same zip code.

I use aN A frame and heavy duty dolley.

Ray