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View Full Version : OT: Plugging the Guatamalan sinkhole...



Doc Nickel
06-01-2010, 04:17 AM
It seems yet another sinkhole (http://cellar.org/iotd.php) has collapsed in Guatamala, to go along with the one that fell in back in 2007 (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17303991/).

What I've never been able to find out, however, is how do they fix something like that?

The comments on one of those pages suggested that's 60,000 cubic yards of dirt- I haven't done the math since none of the articles suggest a diameter, but that sounds low to me.

Do they, in fact, just hire a bunch of dumptrucks to run countless thousands and thousands of loads of dirt, fill and gravel into the hole? Do the Guatemalan police just add some "do not cross" tapes and go about their business, knowing that the shantytown will have the hole filled with household garbage, trash and the occasional body within a few months? Does an opportunistic supervillain sneak in in the dead of night, construct a new "roof" over the hole, and then build a massive underground lair to hide the stolen Russian nuclear missile he plans to threaten the UN with?

Seriously, though, I presume they fill it in? They can't just leave it to keep collapsing, so it's either abandon a big chunk of downtown, or hire 200 dumptrucks to run nonstop for a year and a half...

Anyone know?
Doc.

jugs
06-01-2010, 06:20 AM
if thats the hole, just wait for the golf-ball !!
:D

Davek0974
06-01-2010, 08:12 AM
Is that real or photoshop??

Where has all the dirt gone?

I suppose it could be Graboids - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graboid

:)

MuellerNick
06-01-2010, 08:37 AM
That extact and staight hole looks so unreal to me.
Many years ago, we had a much smaller hole in Munich. It happend during building the subway. A bus with passengers was sunk in it. The hole was completely irregular.
An other similar accident a few years ago on Cologne (?) also looked completly different.

I can't imagine how the hole can come out cylindrical from bottom to top, 100m long. I can't see considerable doming in the photos.


Nick

Benta
06-01-2010, 08:59 AM
Cool! 1200" tapered reamer. :eek:
But where are all the chips? :D

Evan
06-01-2010, 09:10 AM
They are real. They are all over Central America. The Mayans used them as sacrifice pits. It's hard to see them from overhead usually because of the tropical vegetation but the ones in shallow water stand out nicely.

http://ixian.ca/pics7/bluehole.jpg

Mark K
06-01-2010, 09:20 AM
We may the first ever to have actually seen sock heaven.

Mark

lazlo
06-01-2010, 09:47 AM
Man, it looks photoshopped, but this one from 2007 doesn't. 330 feet deep!

http://cellar.org/2007/guatsinkhole.jpg

If you look down in the hole, are there are bunch of lawyers down there? :)
Abandon Hope, All Ye' Who Enter Here...

wierdscience
06-01-2010, 09:56 AM
Dunno about the sink holes,but building levees takes a lot of dirt,Local outfit is just finishing a 750,000 yard job for the Army Corp.150 26yd trucks making an average of 192 give or take loads of clay each and it goes pretty quick:)

Bigger question is,where do you get all the dirt from?:D

lazlo
06-01-2010, 09:59 AM
Bigger question is,where do you get all the dirt from?:D

LOL Darin! Has the Corps of Engineers been digging in Guatemala?

Carld
06-01-2010, 10:21 AM
I'd like to see how big the cave is under all those sink holes.

Rex
06-01-2010, 12:59 PM
That would sure solve some landfill problems around here.
Reckon they'd sell it?

Black_Moons
06-01-2010, 01:13 PM
Actualy, you don't hire dumptrucks to deposit fill
Dumptrucks pay *YOU* for somewhere to put the fill!
Unfortualy this means assholes on quite roads get orders for 50,000 cubic yards and have dumptrucks running down the road non stop once every 5 mins for 6+ months, like they did at my old place, just to make a couple bucks as they raise thier entire yard up 6' for no damn reason.

Carld
06-01-2010, 01:30 PM
Black Moons, Maybe they wanted to live on a hill or maybe they are in a flood plain and you don't know it. Have you thought about asking them about it?

saltmine
06-01-2010, 01:37 PM
I got it! They could throw all of the illegal aliens the Border Patrol rounds up here into the hole....It would be filled up in no time.

Maybe even toss in a few of the "immigration civil rights" protesters in too.


Yes, it was my understanding that you have to be a "CITIZEN" of the USA to have "civil rights"

s7hss
06-01-2010, 01:45 PM
In these parts, sinkholes are not uncommon due to karst terrain i.e. lots of underground limestone caverns. When they do appear, it often means pumping lots of concrete to stabilize them, followed by backfilling. If I had to hazard a guess (and I'm not a geologist), their depth is probably up to 80 feet.

One of my colleagues had such a sinkhole under her house, folllowed by major settling and structural damage. The house was 18 months and 440 yards of concrete in getting fixed. Never been involved in the repairs, but there's not a hell of a lot you can do for a hole 300+ feet deep.

Dang termites....

reggie_obe
06-01-2010, 03:02 PM
Turn it into a local attraction for thrill seekers and prop up the local economy. Perfect for base jumping.

Carld
06-01-2010, 05:03 PM
Hmm, do I have sink hole insurance coverage?

jugs
06-01-2010, 05:16 PM
In these parts, sinkholes are not uncommon due to karst terrain i.e. lots of underground limestone caverns. When they do appear, it often means pumping lots of concrete to stabilize them, followed by backfilling. If I had to hazard a guess (and I'm not a geologist), their depth is probably up to 80 feet.

One of my colleagues had such a sinkhole under her house, folllowed by major settling and structural damage. The house was 18 months and 440 yards of concrete in getting fixed. Never been involved in the repairs, but there's not a hell of a lot you can do for a hole 300+ feet deep.

Dang termites....

Here you go -
http://plants.ifas.ufl.edu/guide/sinkholes.html

Davek0974
06-01-2010, 05:27 PM
I got it! They could throw all of the illegal aliens the Border Patrol rounds up here into the hole....It would be filled up in no time.

Maybe even toss in a few of the "immigration civil rights" protesters in too.


Yes, it was my understanding that you have to be a "CITIZEN" of the USA to have "civil rights"


We could fill several that way, trouble is, we dont get them over here:mad:

Tony Ennis
06-01-2010, 05:36 PM
Yes, it was my understanding that you have to be a "CITIZEN" of the USA to have "civil rights"


I take your quip in the spirit in which it was intended, but nope, that's not true :D

oil mac
06-01-2010, 08:01 PM
Always thought that Guatamala, would be alright for a holiday :D By the look of that township, i dont think you would get very far wearing your best diamond studded Cartiere wrist watch:eek:
In the parish in which i was born in Lanarkshire, near my home, there used to be some small sinks, most of them old, &filled with water, in which us kids used to fish for frogs etc, These were the by product of old long abandoned coalmines
However sadly as has been proved about a year ago, 25 miles from where i live, At a scene of a tragic accident, near the outskirts of the town of Galston, a long abandoned vertical pitshaft, of the old Goat mine suddenly slumped down about 50 feet during the night, The following morning a young lady lawyer going for her morning newspaper fell down it in the fog,
She was lying at the bottom injured, cold but crying for help, The fire &rescue unit was sent for O.K. guys one would think we would be on to a winning streak to rescue the unfortunate victim, Not so Health & Safety rules etc. cut in, A paramedic was lowered down by a rope to stay with her, But after about five &a half hours later, during which time everyone stood around the top discussing why the rules did not allow equipment used to rescue a fire officer could not be used for a civilian casualty, & fire officers pleading to be allowed to go down &bring her up, The young lady deteriorated, and when common sense kicked in they eventually brought her up she died at the scene. Later one senior officer gave some statement in the press after the Sherriffs enquiry "It was a successfull excercise"
Hope the good folk of Guatamala, do not have safety regulations !

andy_b
06-01-2010, 08:16 PM
When I first saw the story on the sinkhole all I kept thinking was that it was two months late for April Fools. It looks totally Photoshopped! No wonder the Mayans used them for sacrifices, they don't look like any other normal hole in the ground.

andy b.

AD5MB
06-01-2010, 08:19 PM
one of those in the gulf could be a good thing.

John Stevenson
06-01-2010, 08:20 PM
Mac, they probably left her there so she couldn't sue them.

Seriously has anyone lowered a light and camera down one of these holes ? It must be a vast cavern for all that spoil to has disappeared and why are they always circular and so perfect

.

dfw5914
06-01-2010, 08:23 PM
I'm glad I did not know about sinkholes when I was a child, talk about some serious nightmare fodder:eek:

snowman
06-01-2010, 09:47 PM
Mebbe you could make a deal with em john. You could ship all the stuff on the floor and bench space in your shop over there and fill that hole right up. All they have to do is pay the shipping.

Might be a good place to store your bridgeport too

vpt
06-01-2010, 10:14 PM
I'd like to have my own sink hole.

The Artful Bodger
06-01-2010, 10:39 PM
We used to dig our own sink holes on the farm. If the hole is deep enough you can throw dead sheep down there forever and the hole never fills!

gwilson
06-01-2010, 10:54 PM
That round sinkhole was shown on the ABC news tonight. It is 300' deep,and took a whole building with it. It is unreal looking,being so round.

wierdscience
06-01-2010, 11:02 PM
IIRC the ground in that region is mostly compacted layers of volcanic ash.That ash now sits on top of underground rivers that cut through volcanic ash like a hot razor blade through melted butter.

It would be interesting to see how many more sink holes are about to open.Talk about real estate being a risky investment.

Astronowanabe
06-02-2010, 01:31 AM
well gee, we have all this excess oil that needs to go somewhere ...
3.14 x 30' x 30' * 300' * 7.5 gal. = 6,358,500

hmmm ... we are going to need at least a half dozen more sink holes
if the gulf leak gets plugged today

darryl
06-02-2010, 01:33 AM
No excavating required- line the hole with concrete and build an underground apartment building. As it sinks, add more storeys. Or- use it as a garbage repository. No decayables-

A bit more seriously, these sinkholes- can they be picked up by SAR? Seems in this day and age we should be able to find pretty much all of them with remote sensing of some type or another.

beanbag
06-02-2010, 06:33 AM
I vaguely remember reading a National Geographic article about these underground caverns and rivers.

lost_cause
06-02-2010, 09:31 AM
makes me glad i live in the north. black flies, mosquitoes, and 4 months of cold wet winter seem pretty minor compared to a lot of places. sinkholes, tornadoes, hurricanes, snakes, spiders, scorpions, alligators... the list goes on and on.

andy_b
06-02-2010, 09:59 AM
makes me glad i live in the north. black flies, mosquitoes, and 4 months of cold wet winter seem pretty minor compared to a lot of places. sinkholes, tornadoes, hurricanes, snakes, spiders, scorpions, alligators... the list goes on and on.

You forgot big blobs of oil washing up on your shore. :)

andy b.

Boucher
06-02-2010, 10:18 AM
There was an oil rig drilling on a lake in LA that drilled into a cavity in a salt dome. They lost the rig the lake and some real estate before the flow stopped. Salt domes in East Texas are used to store/stockpile LPG.

I talked with a waterwell driller in Florida that was drilling for a home and drilled into a cavity. When the sink hole began forming they jumped into a 4 wheel drive jeep and just barely got out as the ground surface became steeper as the collapse progressed. He lost the drilling rig, water truck, and support equipment. The house which appeared to be around 3000 sq ft was tilted into the rim of the hole like a toy.