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View Full Version : OT-1 week till FREE IMPROVEMENT SERVICE!!!!!



madokie
06-20-2010, 12:05 AM
yes folks the free improvment service offered by the gifted and thoughtfull people of OKLAHOMA is only one week away. it called OFASTS and if you have never been to a Machine Gun Shoot, you are officially being welcomed to come on down and have the time of your life!!!:D look up their web site Oklahoma full auto.com and see the videos on u-tube, but trust me being their in person makes the videos look lame.and if you "own" a chinese machine "tool" and its needs some "improvement" well just bring it along also , we have invented a "improvement service" that will solve all your chinese "tool" problems, basically we just haul it out to the 200 yard line and after 2 days of "improvment" it wont ever give you a minutes trouble again:eek: i have shooting spot on the firing line all by myself ,so if anyone wants to bring your guns(black powder, shotgun, pistol ,sling shot, bow & arrow, Anything)and shoot off my spot you are welcome!!if you want to bring some gun or outdoor sporting goods and such and sell them it FREE to set up(fri or early sat)and you get in free.if you need more info contact me.oh and by the way the chinese word for improvement is SNAFU or is it FUBAR?

John Stevenson
06-20-2010, 05:53 AM
Do you accept POS Bridgeports ?

.

madokie
06-20-2010, 08:33 PM
well yes but since a bridgeport can't be improved and since i never used or seen a pos bridgeport ,even though i have been around machine tools since 1978,it would be snuck off to my shop instead .:p

Rattrap
06-20-2010, 08:55 PM
Can we be expecting some pictures of you in action on the firing line?

For folks closer to KY than OK, the fall machine gun shoot at Knob Creek is in October. As you said, videos don't do a MGS justice.

Dr Stan
06-20-2010, 11:41 PM
Before anyone goes to one of these shoots, you should read this:

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=6121915&page=1

Here's the title:

8-Yr-Old Boy Shoots Self at Gun Show
Christopher Bizilj Was Testing a 9 mm Micro Uzi When He Shot and Killed Himself

As a combat veteran anyone who thinks this is a good thing to do, needs some serious counseling. A machine gun has one purpose, and one purpose only, to kill other humans. The only legitimate place for one is in the military and these "shoots" should not be legal. :mad:

I do hope this thread is quickly locked so others will not be tempted to participate in this activity.

JoeFin
06-21-2010, 12:04 AM
I've been itching to build a .75 Black Powder Cannon

Dr Stan
06-21-2010, 12:08 AM
I've been itching to build a .75 Black Powder Cannon

That's a lot different than going off and shooting a machine gun. If that's what one wants to do, then go join the Marines.

The only reason these "shoots" are organized is to make money for the organizers. In other words, GREED. :mad:

Michael Edwards
06-21-2010, 12:20 AM
Dr Stan, sounds like you got yer panties cinched up a little too tight. Machine guns are a lot of fun. Next time anyone is in Las Vegas, I reccomend a trip to The gun Store, where you can rent a machine gun. :D

The Gun Store (http://www.thegunstorelasvegas.com/)

ME

3jaw
06-21-2010, 12:23 AM
This thread is dangerously close to going political! IBTL

BTW, If I could afford it I would have 5 or 6 machine guns!


The only reason these "shoots" are organized is to make money for the organizers. In other words, GREED. :mad:
Umm, no that's not the only reason they are organized. They bring like minded individuals together to share their hobby and show off their guns. Lighten up!!!

914Wilhelm
06-21-2010, 12:32 AM
Just as I wouldn't let my 8 year old shoot a machine gun I wouldn't let him run an industrial tool till I was confidant he knew the risks, alternatives and benefits and had adequate judgement and strength to do the task. The responsible monkey here is the one who put this tool in the hands of a child who had neither the strength nor judgement to handle it.

Willy
06-21-2010, 01:08 AM
Dr Stan, it is indeed a very unfortunate incident that led to this boy's death. However it is the instructor at the gun show and the father, unfortunately, that showed lack of judgment and should be accountable for the boys death...not an inanimate object.

To say that one should not be allowed to have fun with certain tools is ludicrous to say the least.
Along this line of thinking one should only use a motor vehicle strictly for transportation...no smiling or going for a an enjoyable Sunday drive.
Don't forget our home shops, these tools are strictly for production or repair functions. We wouldn't want to see anybody actually having fun in their shop.
I know these examples may sound far-fetched, but then no more than what you suggest.
Unfortunately people die everyday enjoying themselves, good judgment is not always demonstrated by those engaged in activities requiring good judgment.

John Stevenson
06-21-2010, 03:13 AM
well yes but since a bridgeport can't be improved

You jest surely ?

Graduated fine feed for the quill ?
Head that stays in tram for longer then 8 nano seconds ?
Quill gearbox that's an improvement on the one made by Timex ?
Decent taper in the quill ?
And..........

OK forget it.

oil mac
06-21-2010, 05:51 AM
John,
Bridgeports are excellent, compared to my Elliott 00 The bastard!
for a "lack of fun experience," All i need do is fire the damned thing up, wish i could afford something more civilised, Where i do not need to give myself a hernia or get my nose caught in a revolving cutter going down almost to floor level to reach its damned control switches, Reconned its designers dreamed it up in the late 60/s, after ingesting some cannabis or had a considerable liquid lunch.!
"O for a bridgeport ,a bridgeport a bridgeport to take the pain away!"

Dr Stan
06-21-2010, 10:29 AM
Dr Stan, sounds like you got yer panties cinched up a little too tight. Machine guns are a lot of fun. Next time anyone is in Las Vegas, I reccomend a trip to The gun Store, where you can rent a machine gun. :D

The Gun Store (http://www.thegunstorelasvegas.com/)

ME

Sounds like another Rambo want-a-be who has never served a day in the military.

This forum is suppose to be about machining and other manufacturing related topics. Playing Rambo has nothing to do with the forum and has no business here.

Has to having my "panties cinched up a little too tight" after you have experienced in your face combat, then you can comment. Until then, you have no right to do so.

Dr Stan
06-21-2010, 10:39 AM
Dr Stan, it is indeed a very unfortunate incident that led to this boy's death. However it is the instructor at the gun show and the father, unfortunately, that showed lack of judgment and should be accountable for the boys death...not an inanimate object.

To say that one should not be allowed to have fun with certain tools is ludicrous to say the least.

You are missing the entire point. A machine gun is a tool of war with the only purpose to kill other humans. If you had served you would know. Using a machine gun for "fun" shows a complete lack of judgment.

Willy
06-21-2010, 11:18 AM
No Dr Stan it is you sir that is missing the point.
Just because a tool is designed for a particular purpose does not mean that it can not be used for a more enjoyable pass-time.
Tools do not show judgment or discretion, it is up to us as human beings to be able to demonstrate this ability. Unfortunately it is a rare characteristic in all too many.

In addition to your presumptuous stand on what is or is not an acceptable pass-time for others, I'm also more than a little shocked by your ability to discern who has or has not served in the military.
For the record sir...Viet Nam '70- '72.
Please do not try to take away the freedoms that I fought for...even if I do not live in your country anymore.

Michael Edwards
06-21-2010, 11:18 AM
Sounds like another Rambo want-a-be who has never served a day in the military.

This forum is suppose to be about machining and other manufacturing related topics. Playing Rambo has nothing to do with the forum and has no business here.

Has to having my "panties cinched up a little too tight" after you have experienced in your face combat, then you can comment. Until then, you have no right to do so.

LMAO, more like Davy Crockett want-a-be. :rolleyes:

my smokepole (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3103/2925095479_6998356033_b.jpg)

I have never served in the military, but I respect those who have. But to imply that someone who hasn't served doesn't have the right to form an opinion on guns and their uses is a complete joke.

And if you don't think guns are related to machining and manufacturing, well then you are beyond reasoning with. Who here hasn't looked at a paticular gun and marveled at the work that was done.

ME

Evan
06-21-2010, 11:33 AM
For the record, as a former regular US Army volunteer and as a firearms instructor of 12 to 18 year old military cadets I agree with Dr. Stan.

Dr Stan
06-21-2010, 12:30 PM
For the record, as a former regular US Army volunteer and as a firearms instructor of 12 to 18 year old military cadets I agree with Dr. Stan.

Thank you Evan. Some of the responses just demonstrate those who have not been there do not have a clue.

oil mac
06-21-2010, 03:01 PM
Must confess to concurring with Evan, I have never had anything to do with heavy duty firearms, quite why someone would want to play with one eacapes me, O.K. to each his own, maybe we are pretty sad people as well, with our lathes etc, in other folks eyes
When old Hiram Maxim invented the machine gun, it was as a sophisticated man killing machine, and in the two great wars (if great be the appropriate word,) One can only be saddened as to the horror such types of firearms caused, Somehow or other nice looking guns are pretty efficiently lethal, A man i know, who was a proffessional model maker to trade worked on a model vickers heavy machine gun for the Ministry of Defence many years ago, I think it was about 1/5th scale from memory, From its photographs, which he showed me, it looked one of the finest examples of model making i have ever came across. As a work of art, wish i owned it!
Still, a real one would be handy down the Somalian coast to assist in getting the two poor little British hostages home whom everyone has forgotten. Sorry to get political.

Alistair Hosie
06-21-2010, 04:11 PM
I agree with Doctor stan too.We just had a horrific occurence here in the uk with a gun nut seperate issue in a way I know,but I am glad we tightened up gun ownership everyone here is.There there are far too many people in the states killed with guns they are idiotic things in the first place.MY 2 cents Alistair

DeereGuy
06-21-2010, 08:50 PM
I agree with Doctor stan too.We just had a horrific occurence here in the uk with a gun nut seperate issue in a way I know,but I am glad we tightened up gun ownership everyone here is.There there are far too many people in the states killed with guns they are idiotic things in the first place.MY 2 cents Alistair

I agree with DR. Stan also...but you can keep your damn gun control...

Rattrap
06-21-2010, 10:27 PM
Good grief.
Just the mention of the "g" word brings 'em out of the woodwork :(

Two of my favorite hobbies are high powered automobiles and high powered firearms. Seems natural. Both require well constructed, yes accurately machined, equipment. I appreciate both the workmanship and the resulting power.

FWIW, I don't hunt and am seldom inclined to kill even a snake. That doesn't prevent me from enjoying putting tightly grouped holes in paper, or other inanimate objects.

I know there are those on this forum who not only see no need for my sporting arms and 900 hp street car, but would argue to ban both. I've seen their posts. Just because something isn't your favorite avocation doesn't make it bad. Nor does it give you a right to restrict the legal actions of others.

Stan, I could put you in touch with a couple of guys in your hometown, superb machinists and shooters/ gun builders who could probably teach you some things on both topics.

Don't like Ebay, machine gun shoots, preachers, car salesmen, ad infinitum? Stay away and find a worthy avenue for your crusading efforts.

Evan
06-22-2010, 12:23 AM
Nobody said anything about banning guns. Well, Alistair maybe.

The gripe is about children handling weapons they shouldn't. When I was instructing the cadets the Range Safety officer was both the unit commander and an RCMP officer. Regardless of the laws against assault or otherwise making physical contact with a child it was understood clearly that I was permitted to take whatever action needed to instantly prevent a dangerous situation. It was necessary more than once. Common was to grab a cadet by the shoulder and pin him in prone position that was about to turn around from pointing down range with a loaded rifle. They only tried that once in my class. A full auto weapon is far easier to lose control of. Saying that shooting full auto weapons is just a fun pastime is like saying the same of throwing hand grenades. There are classes of weapons and for good reason.

Alistair Hosie
06-22-2010, 06:38 AM
I'm just saying how things are here re gun control.Alistair

Rattrap
06-22-2010, 07:59 AM
Nobody said anything about banning guns. Well, Alistair maybe.


Evan, you should read Stan's posts a bit more carefully before you state your agreement with him.



As a combat veteran anyone who thinks this is a good thing to do, needs some serious counseling. A machine gun has one purpose, and one purpose only, to kill other humans. The only legitimate place for one is in the military and these "shoots" should not be legal.

I do agree with you about the necessity of proper education about the handling and use of firearms. My daughter was taught repeatedly the lethal properties of firearms for years before she was allowed to use one.

It is unfortunate that some people want to take an isolated incident and use it to color an entire activity as somehow insane -Rambo? Come on.

Evan
06-22-2010, 09:03 AM
Dr. Stan said the shoots shouldn't be legal. He said nothing about banning machine guns. They are a listed and controlled weapon anyway in the US so this isn't about gun control.

I don't want to get into an argument. I am in favour of the right to own firearms that have legitimate purposes other than warfighting. It is all I have to say on this.

Alistair Hosie
06-22-2010, 10:47 AM
I agree with Evan in as much as I don't want to start an argument either.We don't want guns in the uk overwhelmingly supported here ,but in usa you must make your own minds up thats fair .Evan is also correct when he says if you are going to have guns people should be well made aware about how to use them .To be fair we have dragged this argument over and over before and I will just say what goes on in the usa is not my concern or business so please accept apologies if any misunderstanding end of story for me.Alistair

Dr Stan
06-22-2010, 10:57 AM
Stan, I could put you in touch with a couple of guys in your hometown, superb machinists and shooters/ gun builders who could probably teach you some things on both topics.

I seriously doubt that as I worked for years in industry as a machinist, tool maker, millwirght, & Industrial engineer. In addition I'm a very good shot.

If you bother to actually read my post I brought up three points:

1) Machines guns have but one purpose, to kill other humans. How do I know this? I've seen it first hand.

2) Organizing a machine gun shoot has but one purpose, to make money for the organizer. In other words GREED.

3) Therefore, these shoots have no viable legitimate purpose in a civilized society.

Just in case you're wondering I'm a disabled Vietnam combat vet with an Honorable Discharge. It's also noteworthy it is veterans who are backing me up and the clueless civilian want-a-be Rambos who have no concept of the effects of the use of a machine gun.

Bottom line, this is an issue about values and morals. Using a weapon of war for "fun" is just downright disgusting and is a good sign of a lack of sound moral judgment.

Mcgyver
06-22-2010, 11:15 AM
I
1) Machines guns have but one purpose, to kill other humans. How do I know this? I've seen it first hand..



Bottom line, this is an issue about values and morals. Using a weapon of war for "fun" is just downright disgusting and is a good sign of a lack of sound moral judgment

I've been a gun owner my adult life so am hardly anti gun. In fact I don't even see this as a gun issue; the usual rhetoric of protection or feeding the family doesn't seem applicable.... but Dr. Stan, these two points you make I have to say really resonate. I wasn't quite sure why it creeped me out but it did, kinda the way it would creep me out if someone wanted to spend their Saturday playing with guillotines or electric chairs.

Then again i enjoy air shows, and have taken my kids to them. The speed and noise of the fighter jets is exciting. One could skirt the issue and say they are used for recon and other non killing activities, but that's kinda BS...they are killing machines too. i would never take my kids to a machine gun festival or a guillotine festival but i have an airshow...because i agree its a value based decision its not immediately clear to me why I think one's acceptable and the other is not.....hmmm now i've confused myself :confused:

Dr Stan
06-22-2010, 11:31 AM
Then again i enjoy air shows, and have taken my kids to them. The speed and noise of the fighter jets is exciting. One could skirt the issue and say they are used for recon and other non killing activities, but that's kinda BS...they are killing machines too. i would never take my kids to a machine gun festival or a guillotine festival but i have an airshow...because i agree its a value based decision its not immediately clear to me why I think one's acceptable and the other is not.....hmmm now i've confused myself :confused:

I too have attended air shows, but there is a significant difference between attending an air show and a machine gun shoot. At an air show one can appreciate the technical aspects of the aircraft and the skill of the pilots. Another major difference is that they are not making strafing or bomb runs. In addition these aircraft are not available for sale to civilians unless they have been demilitarized, not so for the machine guns.

However, the biggest difference, the attendees are not allowed to get in the planes and fly them! :eek:

I have also visited Naval ships that have been turned into museums. It enabled my wife to better appreciate the living conditions for myself and her Dad (Captain USN).

I too am a gun owner and a former NRA member having participated in the NRA's Safe Hunter program many years ago. BTW, note the word former.

Rattrap
06-22-2010, 12:40 PM
Dr. Stan said the shoots shouldn't be legal. He said nothing about banning machine guns.


Sure he did:

The only legitimate place for one is in the military.

He then wants to stop the discussion of them on this forum:

I do hope this thread is quickly locked so others will not be tempted to participate in this activity.

Funny how sometimes the biggest promoters of liberty are often quick to decide what liberties others should enjoy.


I don't want to get into an argument.
Nor do I. I have never seen anyone change their opinion about politics, religion or gun rights based on what someone said on a forum.

My second post was primarily to challenge Dr Stan's sidetracking of the topic in order to express a disapproval of the activity. You'll never find me at the Sturgis MC rally, but if someone posts about it here, I won't feel compelled to question if it should be allowed to exist.


Bottom line, this is an issue about values and morals. Using a weapon of war for "fun" is just downright disgusting and is a good sign of a lack of sound moral judgment.

Stan, you are entitled to your opinions, as are the others on this forum. The OP simply made note of an event in which he participates and enjoys -and is entirely legal. For you to identify him or others as immoral or mentally deficient places you in a slightly higher position of judge than I suspect you can claim qualification.

dneufell
06-22-2010, 12:46 PM
my idea of fun is to kick dr. stan in the nuts...................

Alistair Hosie
06-22-2010, 01:39 PM
Dneufel you should reflect on whether you should be using such language threatening anyone here won't be tolerated wise up or shut up.MY" cents Alistair