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Too_Many_Tools
07-14-2010, 01:08 PM
Considering that every shop has a number of smaller hand operated/powered machines (punch, bender, brake, grinder, drill, saw, filer, etc.) that are used on a bench and then returned to their storage locations, I am looking for ideas for an "universal" stand that would serve as a base for these machines that would free up bench space.

I would like to SEE what others have built and use for this function.

It would seem to be an excellent project for all those interesting bits and pieces (drawers, scrap plate, legs, barrels, pipe, angle iron, casters) that we see in the local junk yards.

Thanks for whatever you might contribute.

TMT

Hal
07-14-2010, 02:35 PM
TMT

I been thinking about this universal mount for a while now.
I glad you posted this question.
I was going to weld a piece of square tubing to the underside of my welding table, like a receiver hitch.
I'll wait and see what other people come up with.


Hal

Too_Many_Tools
07-14-2010, 03:02 PM
I too have been mulling this idea around for awhile. My shop along with many others I see tend to use a random collection of "what's available" to mount machines and to use valuable workbench space...which all leads to poor usage of the limited space that most HSM shops have.

In industry considerable thought is spent on using valuable floor space...because it really does matters.

This is one big reason why I like to see other HSM shops...I always see an idea or two of how I can improve my own work space...and hopefully by starting this discussion to exchange ideas as to how to efficiently use space for all those little machines that end up taking a lot of floor space we all will gain a few more square footage.

I do note that shops in Great Britian and Europe tend to use their space much more efficiently since they have less space to start with.

TMT

Mcgyver
07-14-2010, 03:11 PM
my brilliant (if i do say so meself) unbuilt idea on the matter is a vertical carousel. shelves may 16 deep and 3 or 4' wide....about 8 or 10 in total hanging form chains at each end that form a continuous loop about sprockets at top and bottom. arms extending at bench height allow the machine to be pulled out of its 'garage' onto a work surface.

here, these guys copied my idea - a do it yourself version of

http://www.verticalcarousel.biz/Images/Vertical%20Carousel.jpg

BadDog
07-14-2010, 06:35 PM
I've been doing this for 10 years. Mine is based on standard 2" receiver tubing. I have several around my main welding/fab table, one free-standing floor mount (for high torque and/or large work), 2 on my heavy portable grinding table, 2 on my K5, 1 on my 2500HD, and had one on my trailer I sold some time back. On these I have options for 3 different vises, a heavy tube (roll cage) bender, small brake, 1 and 2 ton arbor presses, Hossfeld type bender, bead roller, light beating "anvil", 12V 9600 lb winch, and several different work/fixture tables. And, I also made extensions and 90s that let me get clearance or convert horizontal/vertical as needed, and adjustable "steps" used front/rear on my K5 4x4 (MUCH easier to work under the hood). I've even used the steps mounted on the fab bench with a 90* adapter for access to the top of large weldments while working. EVERYTHIHNG fits in a standard 2" receiver tube, and new mounts are as simple as welding an appropriate adapter on the end of a few inches of scrap 2" square tubing. I have no idea why this isn't done in most every small shop...

TriHonu
07-14-2010, 06:38 PM
Here are a few pictures of my tripod stands. They are just over size jack stands that have replaceable heads. Three legs insures they will always sit stable and not rock whether on the slab or in the yard. I put anchor pots in my floor when I poured it. The load binders allow me to lock down the stand when I need to get after something.

http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61192&d=1274703048

Small welding table top.
http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61193&d=1274703048


Weld positioner (Lazy Susan) that you can rotate with your feet.
http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61194&d=1274703048

Too_Many_Tools
07-14-2010, 06:59 PM
I've been doing this for 10 years. Mine is based on standard 2" receiver tubing. I have several around my main welding/fab table, one free-standing floor mount (for high torque and/or large work), 2 on my heavy portable grinding table, 2 on my K5, 1 on my 2500HD, and had one on my trailer I sold some time back. On these I have options for 3 different vises, a heavy tube (roll cage) bender, small brake, 1 and 2 ton arbor presses, Hossfeld type bender, bead roller, light beating "anvil", 12V 9600 lb winch, and several different work/fixture tables. And, I also made extensions and 90s that let me get clearance or convert horizontal/vertical as needed, and adjustable "steps" used front/rear on my K5 4x4 (MUCH easier to work under the hood). I've even used the steps mounted on the fab bench with a 90* adapter for access to the top of large weldments while working. EVERYTHIHNG fits in a standard 2" receiver tube, and new mounts are as simple as welding an appropriate adapter on the end of a few inches of scrap 2" square tubing. I have no idea why this isn't done in most every small shop...

Sounds very interesting...got pictures?

I think many of us would like to see them.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
07-14-2010, 07:01 PM
Here are a few pictures of my tripod stands. They are just over size jack stands that have replaceable heads. Three legs insures they will always sit stable and not rock whether on the slab or in the yard. I put anchor pots in my floor when I poured it. The load binders allow me to lock down the stand when I need to get after something.

http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61192&d=1274703048

Small welding table top.
http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61193&d=1274703048


Weld positioner (Lazy Susan) that you can rotate with your feet.
http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61194&d=1274703048

Very impressive...some great ideas here.

Thanks for posting.

TMT

rmancini
07-14-2010, 07:07 PM
"Weld positioner (Lazy Susan) that you can rotate with your feet"

TriHonu - that is slicker'n snot on a doorknob! Undoubtedly, that will be my next project. Great job on your other stands also.
Rich

Too_Many_Tools
07-14-2010, 07:09 PM
A couple more questions...

Could you show us closeups of the anchor pots?

How do you ground the lazy susan...is through the rotary joint?

Is the rotary joint a bearing or a bushing?

TMT

BadDog
07-14-2010, 07:23 PM
Oh, and I forgot, I also have 2 bench grinders with 2" receiver mounts.

As for pics, I'm terrible at getting pics, but here are a few where that feature happened to be caught in other pics (some quite old).

The first shows one of the receivers that usually holds a bench grinder peaking out from the side of a gear tester.

Second shows one of the mounts on my welding table, at that moment fitted with a junky Wilton Vise (<$10) used for welding/cutting/harsh duty. That table has 4 mounts like that, each with a 1/2" locking bolt to keep the tool from rocking. And with the tooling removed, nothing extends above the table top, so I can work with large overhangs if required.

The third show the table with the front mounts (usually vises) removed for working on a suspension upgrade for my old buggy, but you can see the bead roller in the rear mount. Wow, how things have changed in my shop since then! That was before I got my first lathe!

Click for larger image:
http://img4.pixa.us/427/14582440_th.jpg (http://baddog.pixa.us/images/14582440/)

http://www.members.cox.net/darthtruggy/junk/table.jpg

http://www.members.cox.net/darthtruggy/rearlink/tubejig.jpg

http://www.members.cox.net/darthtruggy/rearlink/plates2.jpg

TriHonu
07-14-2010, 09:00 PM
Could you show us closeups of the anchor pots?

TMT

The anchor pots are just a square of plate with a piece of 3/8" chain welded to it. Next a piece of pipe was welded upright on the plate with the chain inside. The pipe has 4 short pieces of 1/2" bar stock welded on the inside of the pipe just below the top of the pipe to support the cap that is welded to the other end of the chain. This allows the cap to rest inside the pipe and flush with the top of the pipe.

I made 16 anchor pots and spaced them in 4 rows of 4 in the 24' x 24' shop I built on the back of my garage. The pots were set in position before the slab was poured around them.

The drill in pots (http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_382411_382411) are more expensive and you have to use a core drill to drill into the slab to install them. I could not justify the cost for the pots and installation. However, at the time the 16 pots only cost me some time and about $70 in materials. Being able to chain things to the floor has been very beneficial. That combined with a couple 10 ton Porto Power sets lets you put the force where needed.

I was going to embed a couple pieces of I-beam in the floor so I could temporarily weld things to them for support. I got talked out of it since the consensus was the heat transfer could cause moisture in concrete to turn to steam and blow chunks of concrete at me. I have since found someone who had the same idea and has them in his slab. He used some heavy I-beam and has had no problems. He stated the thick beams absorb enough heat that the concrete doesn't get too hot.


How do you ground the lazy susan...is through the rotary joint?

Is the rotary joint a bearing or a bushing?

TMT
I used some 1/2 in bar stock to make up a teeter-totter to hold a scrap EDM electrode. I slotted the hole where the electrode sits and beveled the plate. As the electrode wears, it can tilt and continue to ride flat on the bottom of the table.

http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61336&d=1274926183

The guys at SFT pointed out that I would still have some current passing through the bearings. One of the guys pointed out a quick fix was to change the pivot shaft to something nonconductive. I made a tapered fiberglass shaft and plastic washers. This will help insure the current gets routed from table to ground with out passing through the bearings. I just have to make sure the ground clamp does not swing over and touch the tripod.

http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61365&d=1274969414

Mcgyver
07-14-2010, 09:25 PM
that floor anchor with a binder is brilliant....BD not too shabby either!

rockrat
07-15-2010, 09:51 AM
Here are a few pictures of my tripod stands.

I like the chain pots in the floor. Did you make them or did you purchase them?

I was looking at installing a set in my floor and after seeing your use for them I now have pushed that plan higher on my list of things to do.

rock~

TriHonu
07-15-2010, 10:26 AM
I like the chain pots in the floor. Did you make them or did you purchase them?

rock~

I made them. The pipe is 3.5" OD and the base plate is 6" x 6" x 3/8". I cut the caps with a circle burner and cleaned up the edges with a grinder.

The base plate sits on the compacted base. I drilled two holes in the corners of the plate so I could drive a couple of pole barn spikes in to the Class 5 to hold them in place when we poured the concrete.

My slab is 6" thick with rebar reinforcement. It is the most immovable object on the property. I figured it may as well be put to use other than to give me a flat place to work...

I'm glad I took the time to build them before I poured the shop floor. By now if I hadn't, I would be spending the $1000+ to buy the commercial ones and install them.

Jim Stabe
07-15-2010, 11:41 AM
Trihonu (sorry I don't have your name)

That rotary positioner is about the most clever piece of design work I have seen on this site. I plan to copy it shamelessly and the only thing I will add is some sort of moveable rest so I can support my hand / torch. If this site had a design award, I would nominate you for it.

Jim

TriHonu
07-19-2010, 02:06 PM
...the only thing I will add is some sort of moveable rest so I can support my hand / torch.
Jim

I have a temporary rest and have a plan for an articulated arm that I haven't gotten to build yet.

I can't take all the credit for the Lazy Susan design. I have a couple in the shop I use for painting and was giving some thought about one for welding. I was thinking about a motorized drive or bicycle pedal drive with a 90 degree gearbox to control rotation.

I saw a picture of Bill Maguire's [Maguire's Welding] (http://www.maguireswelding.com/) rotating welding stand in the Haynes Techbook Welding Manual. He used a round plate near the floor to rotate the table. I thought that was a easy and effective solution to control rotation.

I may someday get a motor drive built for mine. I've already built three pulse width modulators to control the speed of DC electric motors. The first will be used to add power feed to my mill.

An interesting side story on mine is that the bearing/supports and shaft are also a line boring rig. ;) If you look closely at the 1st photo you will see the end of the shaft is turned down to 1/2" and has triangulated flats.

http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=61199&d=1274703675

digr
07-21-2010, 11:40 AM
my brilliant (if i do say so meself) unbuilt idea on the matter is a vertical carousel. shelves may 16 deep and 3 or 4' wide....about 8 or 10 in total hanging form chains at each end that form a continuous loop about sprockets at top and bottom. arms extending at bench height allow the machine to be pulled out of its 'garage' onto a work surface.

here, these guys copied my idea - a do it yourself version of

http://www.verticalcarousel.biz/Images/Vertical%20Carousel.jpg

What site did you get the drawning from?

Too_Many_Tools
07-21-2010, 12:03 PM
Thanks to everyone who has contributed...

Does anyone have stands that have STORAGE contained in them?

Many of our machines have tooling, vises and other accessories that need to live somewhere.

TMT

Black_Moons
07-21-2010, 02:10 PM
Iv seen of those carousels in person.. Epic 2 story high machine. went for $100,000 at auction or something. And they had to bring in people to disassemble it to get it outta the shop and into the new shop :)

One thing I don't really understand in that digram is how the shelfs keep from dumping upside down as they go over the top/bottom..

Hal
07-21-2010, 05:00 PM
Is it built a long the lines of a Ferris Wheel.

Hal