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Too_Many_Tools
08-17-2010, 02:30 PM
Over the years I have watched several people try to downsize their shops because of age, different interests, divorce, economic reasons, etc. with varying success.

And now I see this article discussing the "Simpler Life"...

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/110275/but-will-it-make-you-happy#mwpphu-container

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?

In my case while I have a number of machines, I still find myself frequently reaching for the Big Old Hammer to accomplish many a task.

TMT

garagemark
08-17-2010, 02:38 PM
I suspect that when I am FORCED to downsize my shop, it will be because I can no longer get around at all to use it, Therefore, I will probably liquidate virtually everything, as in maybe a complete auction.

Otherwise... it ain't gonna happen.

Falcon67
08-17-2010, 02:42 PM
Downsize my azz! The goal for retirement - such as it is - is to finish fixing up our old house and EXPAND the shop by another 400 sq/ft to handle more machines and work. The main thing is to have it all paid for if the time comes that "regular work" changes might occur.

KIMFAB
08-17-2010, 03:54 PM
If I were to downsize it would remove the greatest threat I have for my son.

Whenever he gives me grief I point to all the stuff and tell him "someday this will all be yours"

KINGWELD
08-17-2010, 03:57 PM
We're still UPSIZING around here.
So I'd have to say that downsizing is a word that doesn't exist.:D

BWS
08-17-2010, 04:28 PM
We have two distinct shops.........the "traveling show" and then the home version.If and when theres any downsizing on the menu,I'm like....pick one?The only real notable difference would be in metrology.And seeing as that don't take up all that much space,even it ain't a biggy.

We have been blessed beyond words in a style and sq footage sort of way here at the estate....but as my Dad always used to say...."If you built it once,don't fall in love with it 'cause it can always be built again".So downsize,upsize.....same chit,different day.BW

Doc Nickel
08-17-2010, 04:44 PM
See, those people in that article were caught up in the "keeping up with the Joneses" thing, and a lot of it was pointless frills.

Me, I'm trying to keep up with my expanding skillset, and as such, I'm always in need of a new tool or fixture or cutter or machine.

I'm also allowed, since my house, property, cars and machines are all paid for, and have been for years. :D

Doc.

Forestgnome
08-17-2010, 05:59 PM
Well first I'll die. then my wife will probably give what she can away. Then she'll sell the rest. That's my downsizing plan.

Too_Many_Tools
08-17-2010, 06:33 PM
Years ago with a fully stocked shop at my disposal, I was forced to work with only what would fit in two 5 gallon pails.

To my considerable surprise, the vast majority of the work that needed to be done was accomplished by what could fit in those two pails.

It reminded me of when I was just starting out and had next to nothing for tools...and still got the work done with what was available.

TMT

oldtiffie
08-17-2010, 06:43 PM
Down-size your ego and machismo and and up-size a bit of humility and the rest will be easy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego#Ego

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machismo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humility

Giving up on the testosterone boost-replacement pills will (may???) help too.

lost_cause
08-17-2010, 07:45 PM
i think that the downsizing because of the economy trend is for a slightly different audience than the masses who congregate here. you bought your house in a trendy subdivision with inflated prices and homeowners with an inflated sense of self-worth. you owe $10,000 more on your car than it is worth. you had to spend $30 on a book written by someone who went broke in order to see the light and realize that you shouldn't spend more than you can afford.

i know there are some in a bind due to no real fault of their own, but the sharp person here is probably trying to upsize and cash in on a deal to be had in this economy.

Too_Many_Tools
08-17-2010, 09:40 PM
i think that the downsizing because of the economy trend is for a slightly different audience than the masses who congregate here. you bought your house in a trendy subdivision with inflated prices and homeowners with an inflated sense of self-worth. you owe $10,000 more on your car than it is worth. you had to spend $30 on a book written by someone who went broke in order to see the light and realize that you shouldn't spend more than you can afford.

i know there are some in a bind due to no real fault of their own, but the sharp person here is probably trying to upsize and cash in on a deal to be had in this economy.

Well said.

I am rather amused by the comments by companies in the article I included.

They sound a bit worried that consumers may figure out that they are not needed.

TMT

PeteF
08-18-2010, 01:54 AM
What! :eek: I've been working on the assumption that the guy who dies with the most tools wins!

oldtiffie
08-18-2010, 04:32 AM
Here is the OP:


Over the years I have watched several people try to downsize their shops because of age, different interests, divorce, economic reasons, etc. with varying success.

And now I see this article discussing the "Simpler Life"...

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/110275/but-will-it-make-you-happy#mwpphu-container

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?
In my case while I have a number of machines, I still find myself frequently reaching for the Big Old Hammer to accomplish many a task.

TMT

The thread seems to have (been?) diverted from this somewhat.

That you have to down-size your shop may not necessarily be either your decision or under your control - or to your liking.

If you are in a position where you cannot make decisions for yourself, or if an "Attorney" (under a "Power of Attorney" that you authorised) or a court-appointed Attorney are authorised to conduct your affairs on your behalf you may well find that your shop - and a lot of other "interests" - may be severely restricted or banned or eliminated "on your behalf" and "in your best interests".

A "stroke" (aka "Brain attack") is but one cause. A severe medical, physical, psychological or intellectual impairment may be another.

A medical implant (think" "Pacemaker", "defibrillator" etc.) may severely limit any electic welding or some other electrical operations.

Having to move into a smaller residence, Retirement Home/Village etc. will almost certainly limit the size, use, space and power etc.

Many here - for a whole variety of reasons - will be approaching or in the "zone/s" for these events.

Black Forest
08-18-2010, 06:51 AM
If I was forced to downsize.....hmm....give it all away....because I will be dead!

My dad is 86 and still buying tools he might need in the future!

As long as my mind works I will work. I might not have to work for monetary reasons but I will be productive in some manner. Even if I can't move a muscle I will work as long as the mind is functioning. Maybe that mental attitude is why at 58 years old I am more fit than most 30 year olds!

demerrill
08-18-2010, 08:28 AM
http://www.marcusthomasartist.com/_about.php

David Merrill

gary350
08-18-2010, 08:39 AM
I am retired the only thing I do in the shop is play. I want to build all the fun projects I never had time to build. Life is short so I am buying tools that will make the job faster and easier. My shop will never get smaller it will get larger. If I am not camping, traveling, working in the garden I will be in the shop.

loose nut
08-18-2010, 08:53 AM
I spent the last 20 years collecting tools so that in my retirement, if I live that long, I will have everything that I need in the shop. I have reequipped with new equipment and have enough lathe and drill bits, endmills to last a lifetime, why would I ever give it up.

In this economy when everyone is downsizing who is going to buy it any way.

Greg Parent
08-18-2010, 09:27 AM
I went from living in a very large house on a huge lot with an 25x40 shop to living in a 700 square foot condo with no shop ,one rented parking spot and no storage space (don't ask).

I gave/perma-lent away all the big stuff to friends and family. This way if I really need to use any of it I still can.

What I did keep is all my hand tools, measuring devices and my small portable bench sander. Its amazing what I have been able to do with the 1 inch belt and the 4 inch disk. I also went out a picked up one of those expandable rolling tool boxes. Mine opens up so that the top is a standard tool box for your hand tools, the middle is compartments for smaller things and the bottom is a big drawer/ bin for oversized objects.

What I find now is I spend more time on the design of the things I want to make and farm out the roughing out of the parts. I can finish the details with the tools I kept. Its not a perfect setup but it works for me.

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 12:56 PM
Here is the OP:



The thread seems to have (been?) diverted from this somewhat.

That you have to down-size your shop may not necessarily be either your decision or under your control - or to your liking.

If you are in a position where you cannot make decisions for yourself, or if an "Attorney" (under a "Power of Attorney" that you authorised) or a court-appointed Attorney are authorised to conduct your affairs on your behalf you may well find that your shop - and a lot of other "interests" - may be severely restricted or banned or eliminated "on your behalf" and "in your best interests".

A "stroke" (aka "Brain attack") is but one cause. A severe medical, physical, psychological or intellectual impairment may be another.

A medical implant (think" "Pacemaker", "defibrillator" etc.) may severely limit any electic welding or some other electrical operations.

Having to move into a smaller residence, Retirement Home/Village etc. will almost certainly limit the size, use, space and power etc.

Many here - for a whole variety of reasons - will be approaching or in the "zone/s" for these events.


I would agree with you...I see lots of denial on this site about facing what the future holds for many of us.

In the past, I have purchased a number of my older machine tools from widows/estate sales where the owner died suddenly...and left the heirs in a terrible situation dealing with the disposal of the assets while working with their grief. More than one family member has used the term "selfish" in reference to the deceased when describing his hesitation to downsize as his health declined.

In my opinion, an orderly downsizing by the user/owner is much better than a sudden "we have to get rid of it tomorrow" by heirs who see the assets as a great emotional burden.

TMT

Black Forest
08-18-2010, 01:27 PM
We are not in denial at all. TMT you said downsizing. I will never downsize. I have prepared all my "affairs" so in the event of a quicker than desired departure everything is handled. But until then I am going to upsize! Prepare for the worse but expect the best that is my motto.

cybor462
08-18-2010, 01:47 PM
I know I am risking expulsion and maybe my liberties here but I read this thread and I have to ask. Here goes I have my armor on.......

After a few years at making a few bucks using my hobby shop and being totaled trashed by a motorcycle accident leaving me unable to work it any longer and being financially devastated in the process I find myself forced to downsize completely to the bare walls. We will be moving to an area that we can afford to retire in in a few months. Except for craigslist I do not know where to try to sell my equipment (not at auction or ebay) but try to get a fair price for it. My first thought was to come here and post what I had and quickly saw all the NO FOR SALE POSTS or you will be exterminated warnings.

I understand how for sale sections might get overrun by commercial posters but where would I go to post what I have on a forum?

My stuff would be best used by home shop types and I am at a loss why these are not allowed by home shop guys who are trying to sell there own equipment.

I hope I do not spark any heated replies because I am just asking a question. I have been a member here for quite some time and except for the last year or so after the wreck, my life no longer allowed for my hobby and I needed to look at other things and I went in another direction.

Any suggestions on where I can list them for little to no cost and not ebay or craigslist I would appreciate the suggestions.

Thanks for a long term of fellowship and good conversation. I learned much here and appreciate everybody who was always willing to help.

Thanks

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 02:13 PM
I know I am risking expulsion and maybe my liberties here but I read this thread and I have to ask. Here goes I have my armor on.......

After a few years at making a few bucks using my hobby shop and being totaled trashed by a motorcycle accident leaving me unable to work it any longer and being financially devastated in the process I find myself forced to downsize completely to the bare walls. We will be moving to an area that we can afford to retire in in a few months. Except for craigslist I do not know where to try to sell my equipment (not at auction or ebay) but try to get a fair price for it. My first thought was to come here and post what I had and quickly saw all the NO FOR SALE POSTS or you will be exterminated warnings.

I understand how for sale sections might get overrun by commercial posters but where would I go to post what I have on a forum?

My stuff would be best used by home shop types and I am at a loss why these are not allowed by home shop guys who are trying to sell there own equipment.

I hope I do not spark any heated replies because I am just asking a question. I have been a member here for quite some time and except for the last year or so after the wreck, my life no longer allowed for my hobby and I needed to look at other things and I went in another direction.

Any suggestions on where I can list them for little to no cost and not ebay or craigslist I would appreciate the suggestions.

Thanks for a long term of fellowship and good conversation. I learned much here and appreciate everybody who was always willing to help.

Thanks

I suspect the NO SALE policy is because commercial guys posing as home shop guys will ruin it...they always seem to. When I was actively looking for tools for my shop, I would soon see the same buyers at sales/auctions and then see them later as they were trying to flip their purchases. I have little patience for their type and see them as vultures of any hobby. I go to great lengths to not buy from that type of person.

I can also see the shadow of liability that any buy/sell activity casts on a website.

If I ran a website, there would be NO buy/sell.

As for listing your stuff, the local paper is the only other low cost alternative.

Craigslist is the best low cost venue.

With either you will get many tire kickers.

If you want to be done with it quickly, have an auction.

Considering what else you have on your plate, I would get it over with and move on. Your family will thank you for it. I have known people trying to get top dollar for stuff for years...and they still have it. The time and effort they have wasted far outweighs any additional profit they might think they are making. Ebay "Buy It Never"s are an excellent example of this type of shortsightedness.

Good luck with your efforts.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 02:26 PM
We are not in denial at all. TMT you said downsizing. I will never downsize. I have prepared all my "affairs" so in the event of a quicker than desired departure everything is handled. But until then I am going to upsize! Prepare for the worse but expect the best that is my motto.

I respectfully disagree...my experiences at estate/widow sales has shown me otherwise.

Whenever I have purchased a machine for my private shops, I have taken the time to seek out and learn from the survivors the story of the owner and the machine I am buying...it adds value for me to know its history. From the widow and other family members, you soon learn lessons that reach far beyond the immediate machine itself. One consistent lesson is that most owners never thought they would die...and never planned for the disaster they dumped into their grieving family's lap.

Another lesson that seems to arise that some of us think that by writing down our wishes they will be carried out....which is far unlikely. When a family is grieving, they want the pain to be gone...and many times dishonest people (including auctioneers, relatives and friends) will take advantage of this to get your assets for nothing. I have lost count of the times I have helped strangers determine the true value of a tool and recommended how they should sell it...just to head off the vultures that circle any grieving family.

If you want value for your assets, the best approach is to sell them while you still are alive and able to conduct the transaction.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 02:29 PM
Over the years I have watched several people try to downsize their shops because of age, different interests, divorce, economic reasons, etc. with varying success.

And now I see this article discussing the "Simpler Life"...

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/110275/but-will-it-make-you-happy#mwpphu-container

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?

In my case while I have a number of machines, I still find myself frequently reaching for the Big Old Hammer to accomplish many a task.

TMT


FWIW...a common suggestion is whatever you have not used in six months is a candidate for downsizing.

So what tools haven't you used in the last six months?

TMT

Black Forest
08-18-2010, 03:19 PM
I have lots of tools I haven't used in six months but I would never think of getting rid of them.

As to my family being taken advantage of, I don't think so! We are all business people! I would almost feel sorry for someone thinking they would waltz in here and try to pull the wool over my families eyes. Nope, ain't gonna happen. That is what preparation is all about. As to my family disposing of my stuff in a way that would go against my wishes. That also isn't going to happen. Because I don't have any wishes. Suggestions sure and advice sure. My shop equipment is the least of my concerns after I am gone as I am sure it is the least of my families concerns. I am sure my youngest daughter will keep evey tool I have. I have to run her out of the shop all of the time.

cybor462
08-18-2010, 03:21 PM
I suspect the NO SALE policy is because commercial guys posing as home shop guys will ruin it...they always seem to. When I was actively looking for tools for my shop, I would soon see the same buyers at sales/auctions and then see them later as they were trying to flip their purchases. I have little patience for their type and see them as vultures of any hobby. I go to great lengths to not buy from that type of person.

I can also see the shadow of liability that any buy/sell activity casts on a website.

If I ran a website, there would be NO buy/sell.

As for listing your stuff, the local paper is the only other low cost alternative.

Craigslist is the best low cost venue.

With either you will get many tire kickers.

If you want to be done with it quickly, have an auction.

Considering what else you have on your plate, I would get it over with and move on. Your family will thank you for it. I have known people trying to get top dollar for stuff for years...and they still have it. The time and effort they have wasted far outweighs any additional profit they might think they are making. Ebay "Buy It Never"s are an excellent example of this type of shortsightedness.

Good luck with your efforts.

TMT

Thanks TMT I here you. I was just hoping to get more than 5 cents on a dollar for the stuff. Much of what I have had just been bought and is unused and so far on craigslist all I get are tire kickers or those who want a brand new Starrett level I paid $180 for and say they will give $25. This is what I find on craigslist. I do want and need to get this past me but I hope to at least get a little return on the zillions I spent on all of it.

I guess I may try the local paper. Just does not seem to be the place to offer things for sale anymore. The web kinda trumps everything today.

Thanks

Sorry for highjacking the thread.

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 03:33 PM
Thanks TMT I here you. I was just hoping to get more than 5 cents on a dollar for the stuff. Much of what I have had just been bought and is unused and so far on craigslist all I get are tire kickers or those who want a brand new Starrett level I paid $180 for and say they will give $25. This is what I find on craigslist. I do want and need to get this past me but I hope to at least get a little return on the zillions I spent on all of it.

I guess I may try the local paper. Just does not seem to be the place to offer things for sale anymore. The web kinda trumps everything today.

Thanks

Sorry for highjacking the thread.

No problem...I think it is very much on topic.

Everyone of us who has a tool will need to sell it sometime in the future...or our family will.

Craigslist is great for low cost advertising...and for "value oriented" (read cheap ;<) ) buyers to surf. There is a subset of society that does nothing but surf Craigslist 24/7...and will attempt to lowball you on anything.

I have found if you place a decent price on a quality tool, you will get it.

If you place a retail price on it, you likely will not...remember we are in a deep, deep recession.

If you have an auction, the auctioneer will take his cut...but it will be gone.

Most of the auction websites take the same cut and you do the work.

Again if you do have good tools, they will sell themselves at fair prices.

One approach is to sell your machines and hold the small high price stuff so you can sell it later when you have more time....good tools depreciate little.

Good luck with your efforts.

TMT

DannyW
08-18-2010, 04:16 PM
FWIW...a common suggestion is whatever you have not used in six months is a candidate for downsizing.

So what tools haven't you used in the last six months?

TMT

TMT, that is a business slogan I hope no HSM will heed!
It just takes a darn long time to find and acquire tools from the few Ä that are left, so this is a moot slogan for us.
Especially for someone who is gearing op for this "hobby" and trying to build up on tooling.

Most of us put their heart in their tooling and machines resulting from the hardship it has cost them to acquire it all, that once in possession, it will never leave. Nay never!

The easier it is financially to acquire stuff the quicker it is tossed out when "in the way". It takes all kinds of people I guess.

I have seen Millions of Ä in tooling land in the scrap bin, because it was not used in 6 months in an effort to beautify the bottom line. Even if it means that if a machine breaks down, they have to wait days and days for a replacement part to be available. It just gets my blood boiling!
The tooling is paid for and in stock, so they say let's toss it all out and call that cost reduction????


Danny

Doc Nickel
08-18-2010, 05:22 PM
FWIW...a common suggestion is whatever you have not used in six months is a candidate for downsizing.

So what tools haven't you used in the last six months?

-While that might be a credible method for things like clothes (save, of course, for occasional-wear items like fancy dress suits or wedding dresses) or paperback novels, it's silly- bordering on stupid- for tools.

I have countless tools that may not see use for years on end, but become crucial when a tricky job shows up.

Items like rotary tables or indexers might go years between uses, depending on your shop. I have surface grinder fixtures I have yet to use even once. ('Course, I've only had a surface grinder for less than a year, but still...) I have literally hundreds of cutters and drills I've never used- should I sell off my complete set of gear-tooth cutters just because I won't use them within the next six months?

Doc.

oldtiffie
08-18-2010, 05:46 PM
Again - here is the OP:


Over the years I have watched several people try to downsize their shops because of age, different interests, divorce, economic reasons, etc. with varying success.

And now I see this article discussing the "Simpler Life"...

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/110275/but-will-it-make-you-happy#mwpphu-container

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?

In my case while I have a number of machines, I still find myself frequently reaching for the Big Old Hammer to accomplish many a task.

TMT

This paragraph suggests that the choice may always be yours to make and to implement. It may not be:

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?

As you get older and/or as "things get tougher" you will soon see how regular an event it is for others in your cohort or age-group etc.

There may be no "good" choices or options - just a choice of the least worst - if you have a choice at all.

If you are (to be) "wound up" as part of a bankruptcy or the receivers are called in by a creditor as part of a debt resolution procedure, and if you have to "move on" and "make do" with very little - or anything at all - you, or those representing you, may have some hard decisions to make as to either how you are to be "down-sized" or if you will have any choice at all.

Your "down-sizing" may not be limited to "tools" but may well include boats, bikes, vehicles etc.

So far many seem to have assumed that any down-sizing will either never happen, or in the event that it does that it will be in the shop you have now.

If that "down-sizing" is a result of having to move house etc. just what can you afford to take with you, what can you fit into the space etc. in any new shop that you may have? Can you afford to re-fit out the shop the way you'd like or need it?

The OP was with regard to having to down-sizing - not whether you have or will have an option of it not or never happening.

Black Forest
08-18-2010, 06:33 PM
"The OP was with regard to having to down-sizing - not whether you have or will have an option of it not or never happening."


Then the OP should have said, if. He implied that we all will have to someday.
Not all of us will have to.

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 07:54 PM
"The OP was with regard to having to down-sizing - not whether you have or will have an option of it not or never happening."


Then the OP should have said, if. He implied that we all will have to someday.
Not all of us will have to.

We all sooner or later sell....if not us, our heirs.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 07:59 PM
Again - here is the OP:



This paragraph suggests that the choice may always be yours to make and to implement. It may not be:


As you get older and/or as "things get tougher" you will soon see how regular an event it is for others in your cohort or age-group etc.

There may be no "good" choices or options - just a choice of the least worst - if you have a choice at all.

If you are (to be) "wound up" as part of a bankruptcy or the receivers are called in by a creditor as part of a debt resolution procedure, and if you have to "move on" and "make do" with very little - or anything at all - you, or those representing you, may have some hard decisions to make as to either how you are to be "down-sized" or if you will have any choice at all.

Your "down-sizing" may not be limited to "tools" but may well include boats, bikes, vehicles etc.

So far many seem to have assumed that any down-sizing will either never happen, or in the event that it does that it will be in the shop you have now.

If that "down-sizing" is a result of having to move house etc. just what can you afford to take with you, what can you fit into the space etc. in any new shop that you may have? Can you afford to re-fit out the shop the way you'd like or need it?

The OP was with regard to having to down-sizing - not whether you have or will have an option of it not or never happening.


Agreed.

Most people are in the acquistion mode..out of habit.

The article I included discusses the advantages of downsizing...voluntary or otherwise.

Earlier I did a discussion on SMALL shops...and noticed how few people contributed.

That tells us something about the mindset here.

I know of a local guy who has over 10,000 hammers.

His family nagged at him until he put a tiny sign out front saying "hammers for sale"...one can say his heart isn't in his attempt to downsize.

When his estate sale happens, I will go to it simply for the lesson it will teach.

TMT

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 08:02 PM
-While that might be a credible method for things like clothes (save, of course, for occasional-wear items like fancy dress suits or wedding dresses) or paperback novels, it's silly- bordering on stupid- for tools.

I have countless tools that may not see use for years on end, but become crucial when a tricky job shows up.

Items like rotary tables or indexers might go years between uses, depending on your shop. I have surface grinder fixtures I have yet to use even once. ('Course, I've only had a surface grinder for less than a year, but still...) I have literally hundreds of cutters and drills I've never used- should I sell off my complete set of gear-tooth cutters just because I won't use them within the next six months?

Doc.

If not six months then how long?

I agree that the six month recommendation doesn't make sense in terms of tools.

TMT

ieezitin
08-18-2010, 08:32 PM
Im 50, young by most standards but going through the life change. Two kids who have there life and are doing good, got me a plan to retire by 55 and I am on track, the wife has her horses Great!!!!!!!!!!!!, I hate them but thatís her thing, im in selfish mode right now, I told the wife how much everything is worth in the shop, and the will reflects that. The rest I donít care, god can take me now I would not batt an eye!.

Anthony

Doc Nickel
08-18-2010, 09:46 PM
If not six months then how long?

-I bought a sine bar at a garage sale about five years ago. I didn't need it then, but knew I'd need it eventually.

I finally used it for the first time about a month ago.

Doc.

oldtiffie
08-18-2010, 11:26 PM
OK - again.

Now the OP - again.


Over the years I have watched several people try to downsize their shops because of age, different interests, divorce, economic reasons, etc. with varying success.

And now I see this article discussing the "Simpler Life"...

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/110275/but-will-it-make-you-happy#mwpphu-container

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?
In my case while I have a number of machines, I still find myself frequently reaching for the Big Old Hammer to accomplish many a task.

TMT

Here is the operative part - again:

When your time comes to where you will downsize your shop, how will you do it and what will stay...what will go?

So - if you are sure that you won't have to downsize in your life-time, which may well turn out that way, and, like it or not, that there is a good chance that it will or may happen anyway, what contingency plans do you have in case they are needed to be put into effect, perhaps by you, or perhaps by others at short notice to ensure that your wants and needs are met?

Too_Many_Tools
08-18-2010, 11:37 PM
Maybe nobody has a plan?

TMT

oldtiffie
08-19-2010, 12:33 AM
You are probably right TMT.

Some seem to think that they are "bullet-proof" or indestructible and will always "be in charge" and "able to cope (control?)".

Perhaps its similar to some people being too superstitious (afraid?) to have a Will and to keep it up to date in case they "bring it on".

Its an old axiom but a good and true one: "Failing to plan is planning to fail".

loose nut
08-19-2010, 09:54 AM
A member of our local ME club was killed in a car accident.

He had a 18" lathe in the garage and someone told his mother, only living kin, that it was worth $13000. It may have been at one time but she will never be able to sell it for that, maybe 3 or 4 thou, but she now refuses to sell for less then 13 grand so it sits there rusting.

Make sure your relatives have a realistic understanding of the value of your shop.

Black Forest
08-19-2010, 10:35 AM
OldTiffe, You should thingk before you start talking down to anybody because they are being polite and not arrogant. You only look at things from your own context. Maybe some of us have better plans and have better organization skills. Maybe some of us are in a position that even after our death or incapacitation, that what we built will go on for generations. Maybe some of our families are not idiots. Maybe some of us have the resources to do what we want and provide for all contingencies.

Roy Andrews
08-19-2010, 12:03 PM
5 years ago i became disabled due to a rare disease. even though i had good insurance it has taken all this time to get them to pay and then i have to give a lawyer 1/3. in the time i waited i had to live on SS. a little over a 100k a year cut. 3 million in medical bills wiped out my savings and bankruptcy took what was left. i did get to keep my tools. but we lost our big house and now i have a very small 1 car garage as a shop. my old shop was 3600 sqft. i have a lot of stuff at my brothers house and after a couple years of moving machines back and forth have my shop down to a workable arrangement with limited tools. if i had to make the decision on little notice it would have been a disaster. keeping all the tools and seeing what i needed over time was the answer. now i have to decide what i am going to do with all the other tools.

on a side note after a little modification we have even come to like our 900 sqft house. which is about 1/3 of our old house. we would like a bigger yard but we have done fine here. it amazing what you can live without if you have to.

Doc Nickel
08-19-2010, 04:35 PM
Some seem to think that they are "bullet-proof" or indestructible and will always "be in charge" and "able to cope (control?)"

-Nope. What I've got is a solid family.

If I were to die or somehow be incapacitated tomorrow, they would have no problem dealing with my shop. (Well, apart from the sheer volume of scrap metal and other useful junk I've collected. :D )

They know how to sell that kind of thing and get a fair price for it, and I know that, were I incapacitated rather than dead, the money from the sales would undoubtedly go to my care.

I also know that one or two members of my family would also want certain machines for themselves- in which case, they're welcome to 'em.

So at least in the short term, I have no worries. Leaving it behind one way or the other would be a relatively minor burden- actually, considering the house and property is paid for, they could simply close the door and turn off the lights. As long as somebody pays the property taxes and keeps the heat on, (and feeds my cats :D ) it could sit for years 'til somebody decides to do something with it all.

In the long term is not so clear cut, because we don't know what's going to happen. My entire family could be wiped out in a tragic zeppelin accident ten years from now, in which case I'd have to make more permanent arrangements for my gear.

But apart from that, really, I have no "set plan" because I know it's pretty well taken care of at the moment.

Doc.

BWS
08-19-2010, 06:05 PM
Zeppelin's scare me almost as much as airplanes.Its that whole,"If God had wanted"...........thing.BW

Black Forest
08-20-2010, 02:51 AM
My situation is maybe different from most on here. My shop is not the end in itself. It is used for support on our horse farm here in the Black Forest. The farm will go on so the shop must go on.

oldtiffie
08-20-2010, 03:57 AM
"Down-sizing" - pretty well by definition - can be anywhere between "zero/nil" and "full/all" as regards contents and any time between immediately or gradually over time.

Most here would hope and perhaps plan, confident that they will either do it themselves at a scale and timing of their own choosing or determine or control and how, when and by whom it will be done in the event that they cannot (will not?).

The probability is that the down-sizing of different people's shops will be a mix of the above.

It is then a matter of "weighting" the above to try and determine the chances of each occurring (or not occurring) and taking whatever - if any - preventative or confirming actions are needed to have the best chance of your preferences being met as required.

Its just a matter of risk-appraisal.

Risk can be reduced considerably, but it is not always possible or practical to eliminate entirely.

oldtiffie
08-20-2010, 04:02 AM
My situation is maybe different from most on here. My shop is not the end in itself. It is used for support on our horse farm here in the Black Forest. The farm will go on so the shop must go on.

BF.

It seems that your shop is integral with and part and parcel with the enterprise ie the farm. One goes with the other.

With many others the HSM shop is not part of any enterprise and merely occupies space in a commercial or home environment.

My comments were with regard - mainly - to the non-enterprise/commercial "hobby" HSM shop.

Black Forest
08-20-2010, 05:19 AM
My wife might disagree with you OldTiffe! She thinks I spend too much time in my shop building things that are lets just say, not really necessary to the ongoing operation of the farm. She might argue that it is more of a pastime than a necessity but she loves me so she smiles and at the appropriate time when I show her something I built she makes the "ooh, ah, wow" rolls her eyes and goes back to doing something important.

The Artful Bodger
08-20-2010, 05:34 AM
....... so she smiles and at the appropriate time when I show her something I built she makes the "ooh, ah, wow" rolls her eyes and goes back to doing something important.

Arrrrr, isnt it nice when they do that?:) :) :) :)

oldtiffie
08-20-2010, 05:47 AM
My wife might disagree with you OldTiffe! She thinks I spend too much time in my shop building things that are lets just say, not really necessary to the ongoing operation of the farm. She might argue that it is more of a pastime than a necessity but she loves me so she smiles and at the appropriate time when I show her something I built she makes the "ooh, ah, wow" rolls her eyes and goes back to doing something important.

BF.

As long as she wants you back with her - you are good to go.

But, as I suspect is often the case elsewhere, many wives would want to know why their husbands are either not still in or not back in the shop and why they left it without being invited!! Many many wives may well regard the cost of the shop as cheap at double the price!!! And only the wives know it!! I can guess why the husbands don't.

If she tosses him out it will be a toss-up as to which goes first in a very close race - him or his shop.

If she does that the matter of "down-sizing" the shop (and its resident in its denizen - cave??) will be solved once and for all in very short order!!!