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View Full Version : i need help to make an inside coilspring compressor



airsmith282
08-22-2010, 09:12 PM
ok here is the deal both my rear coil springs snaped yesterday man life sucks any how i need a simple design to make an inside coil compressor tool as i can not afford to go and buy one ..i have a lathe and mill , i just need some demensions and a good thread size that i should use and so on,

GKman
08-22-2010, 09:15 PM
On your bike, your car, in your underpants.....?

airsmith282
08-22-2010, 09:32 PM
car sorry sould have mention that and its a 2006 G5 has seperate coil and seperate shock in the back and its the back coils both snapped same place same time kinda freakie really

saltmine
08-22-2010, 10:09 PM
I really don't see why you would need a spring compressor. If you jack the car up, put it on jack-stands, and put the floor jack under the suspension(where the spring is). You should ba able to unbolt the shock, and gently let that side of the suspension down far enough to allow you to remove the spring without compressing it. (Oh, that's right, you said they're both broke.)

Letting the suspension down as described will allow enough room to install the new springs too. Just jack the suspension back into place and re-connect the shock when the spring is in place.

BTW, What the heck is a G5?

chipmaker4130
08-22-2010, 10:18 PM
You'll probably need to undo a brake hose or cable too.

airsmith282
08-22-2010, 10:52 PM
id like to avoid messing with the brake lines , so ya a compressor is the best idea for this , and alot less hassel to..

A G5 is also known as the pontiac pursuit, it has a 2.2 eco tec thats on steroieds 140 MPH top end full sport suspension sweet car ,

Willy
08-22-2010, 10:57 PM
As saltmine said once the suspension is relaxed no spring compression is required to remove and replace the coils on your Pontiac G5.

airsmith282
08-22-2010, 11:15 PM
i under stand that i just dont want to destrub the brake lines

Dr Stan
08-22-2010, 11:19 PM
i under stand that i just dont want to destrub the brake lines

Why? Bleeding brakes (if necessary) is usually an easy job. What's so special about these brake lines?

Pics would help us understand the issues.

saltmine
08-23-2010, 12:23 AM
Guys....I've changed hundreds of springs, both front and rear, and never had to touch the brake lines.

KIMFAB
08-23-2010, 01:52 AM
If you are friendly with your local parts man and you are buying the parts from him he will usually allow you to borrow or rent a compressor.

ADGO_Racing
08-23-2010, 02:29 AM
Still no reason to use a spring compressor. As for messing with brake lines, remove the entire caliper,just take some wire and hang the caliper from the frame or body someplace. No need to remove the brake line. I too wonder what the problem is removing the line and bleeding it upon re-installation???? It is a simple process, I do it here at least a few times a week, as well as clutches.

Arcane
08-23-2010, 02:59 AM
I went looking for G5 suspension information and found this:
"The Pontiac G5 is a rebadged Chevrolet Cobalt compact car that was marketed by the Pontiac division of General Motors. It was first introduced in 2004 for the 2005 model year. For 2005 and early 2006, this car was known as the Pontiac Pursuit in the Canadian market, and G5 Pursuit during mid-2006. It was also known as the Pontiac G4 in Mexico from 2005-2006. It was released to the U.S. market in August 2006 as a 2007 model.The G5 and Cobalt are built upon the GM Delta platform and is available as a sedan in Canada and Mexico. In the United States, the G5 is only available as a coupe."

Later on I found "Delta uses an independent suspension in front and torsion bar type in the rear. "

Another site had this to say:
"The vehicle uses a MacPherson strut-type front suspension, semi-independent torsion beam rear suspension, and front and rear stabilizer bars for more exact body roll control."

This information would lead me to believe there are no coil springs in the rear, but internet information is often wrong. Question is, is it wrong in this case?

Willy
08-23-2010, 03:20 AM
Arcane, the info I have says the same as what you have found.
Would be interesting to see a picture of the affected components.
Very unusual to have one coil spring break on such a new car presumably driven on pavement only, never mind two in one day.
Especially on a car that isn't supposed to have rear coils.

doctor demo
08-23-2010, 03:54 AM
Arcane, the info I have says the same as what you have found.
Would be interesting to see a picture of the affected components.
Very unusual to have one coil spring break on such a new car presumably driven on pavement only, never mind two in one day.
Especially on a car that isn't supposed to have rear coils.
You Guys do know who you're dealing with ,right? This is the same car builder that put pontiac engines in oldsmobiles and all sorts of other subs.
To make things worse the O.P. has been known to stretch the truth a little.

Steve

winchman
08-23-2010, 04:14 AM
Your post about it being a G5 raised my interest on two counts. First, there's also an Infiniti G5, which shares components with the Nissan 350Z, one of which is sitting in my garage. Second, I had looked into and taken a test drive in a Pontiac G5 before getting the 350Z, so I was pretty sure it had torsion bar rear suspension.

So, there's something wierd here. Was the car modified with aftermarket components? That might explain the unusual failure(s), since aftermarket stuff is often pretty bad.

But I just found this picture of a Cobalt rear suspension showing coil springs AND a torsion bar from here: http://www.cars.com/chevrolet/cobalt/2005/reviews/:

http://www.cars.com/crp/vp/images/05chevrolet_cobalt/rearsusp.jpg

I suppose the rear drum brakes would make it difficult to remove the calipers.

Arcane
08-23-2010, 06:04 AM
Hmmm. I would call that a full coil suspension with the swiss cheese structure between the control arms being a stabilizer bar. My definition of a torsion beam rear suspension is one that would support body weight, the one shown in the picture would drop the body until the shock absorbers were fully compressed if the coils were removed.

Oh well....looks like changing the coils out is a piece of cake.

winchman
08-23-2010, 07:28 AM
I changed the struts on an Escort once using a spring compressor made from flat bar and threaded rod. It was unwieldy and probably unsafe, but it worked OK.

For an inside job, I'd use 1/4"x2" flat bar with little tabs (maybe 1/4" bolts would do) on the ends to keep it from slipping off the coils. I'd go with two 1/2" threaded rods out near the ends to make it more stable and easier to get to the nuts.

I'd only try to compress one coil, since you've got to leave room for the rod that extends through the flat bar as you tighten it. Hopefully that'll be enough to get the spring in place.


Can you unbolt the clip that holds the brake line in place on the body of the car? That might let the hard line come down enough so you wouldn't have to disconnect the hose from the cylinder.

airsmith282
08-23-2010, 09:06 AM
Your post about it being a G5 raised my interest on two counts. First, there's also an Infiniti G5, which shares components with the Nissan 350Z, one of which is sitting in my garage. Second, I had looked into and taken a test drive in a Pontiac G5 before getting the 350Z, so I was pretty sure it had torsion bar rear suspension.

So, there's something wierd here. Was the car modified with aftermarket components? That might explain the unusual failure(s), since aftermarket stuff is often pretty bad.

But I just found this picture of a Cobalt rear suspension showing coil springs AND a torsion bar from here: http://www.cars.com/chevrolet/cobalt/2005/reviews/:

http://www.cars.com/crp/vp/images/05chevrolet_cobalt/rearsusp.jpg

I suppose the rear drum brakes would make it difficult to remove the calipers.


that would be the type of setup i have on the rear,an to answer the other question its all stock suspension on this thing, and yes its driven on roads , if you want to call them that, so much construction on our roads this year its amazing i still have a car at all. i my self have never busted a coil spring in any car untill this one, and to have 2 go at the same time in almost the exact same place makes me wounder what else is next to brake.
want another messed up one , the ower ship for my car says G5 the car it self has the logo that say pursuit only, but it does have the sport suspension on it, this one was activated in O5 but is an 06 according to the ower ship. the first owner kept it for a year and he was hard on the car and even did alot of burn outs you can tell this form the balled drivers side tire, so when we bought the car we got the dealer to put on all new tires amoge other work i got them to do and it was all done , up untill now its been a great car but now , i have 2 busted coil springs in the rear, both fornt stabilzers are screwed and the brake s fornt and rear drums and rotors are all fried infact when the 2 springs let go at thesame time the front inside drivers sied brake pad sheared off it mounting plate to what a mess, and people wounder why i dont trust other mechanics to work on my car,

GKman
08-23-2010, 10:15 AM
... i have 2 busted coil springs in the rear, both fornt stabilzers are screwed and the brake s fornt and rear drums and rotors are all fried....

Now I know what "full sport suspension" is.

airsmith282
08-23-2010, 10:19 AM
Now I know what "full sport suspension" is.


yup total junk on canadain roads..

Mcgyver
08-23-2010, 10:24 AM
Very unusual to have one coil spring break on such a new car presumably driven on pavement only, never mind two in one day.
.


depends what you do with it :D ....were any bridgeports involved?

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b201/michael0100/bigload.jpg

bruto
08-23-2010, 12:10 PM
I've done coil springs on a couple of old Mercedes, which require an internal compressor, and I'd go to almost any length, including opening brake lines, to avoid having to do this. Unless the compressor is just right, it's a loaded catapult ready to launch. Granted, these springs may not be as nasty as those on the Merc, but if you can relax the suspension enough to need no compressor, I'd do it that way. Bleeding brakes is trivial.

ADGO_Racing
08-23-2010, 12:19 PM
Again, what exactly is the problem. Most of the race cars we work on have coilover shocks, no special tools involved, a 3/4 socket, 3/4 combination wrench, and a jack. As mentioned earlier just let the suspension hang, the spring(s) will fall out, especially the broken spring(s). Are you sure it is the spring that is broke and not the spring perches. This will be another whole can of worms, but removal and installation of the spring is still going to be the same.

Also I seriously doubt, that the brake problem is related to the broken springs. Broken spring(s) will make handling go to crap, but won't affect the brakes, other than possibly increase your stopping distance.

This thread just isn't adding up, right now.

aboard_epsilon
08-23-2010, 12:41 PM
i bought some coil spring compressors years back ..after about 5-6 uses ..the threads are getting very worn ..

there is a lot of force exerted on those threads when you use them

if i were to make my own ..i would use high tensile threaded rods.

all the best.markj

aboard_epsilon
08-23-2010, 12:46 PM
ever since the late 90's coil springs have been crap ...

my brother a few friends all had them snap on them ..


it seems that the car manufacturers are farming the work out now to third world country's ..

before the late nineties i had never heard of a coil spring snapping.

all the best.markj

Willy
08-23-2010, 01:15 PM
Well I'm sure Airsmith knows a broken coil when he's looking at one, or two.

Aside from the PIA of replacement it shouldn't be all that much dollar-wise if you shop around for replacements. Still it does suck.

Other than disassembling a MacPherson strut assembly, I've never had to use a spring compressor in order to replace coil springs, front or back.
Any chance you could post a photo? It would give us all a better handle on what you are dealing with.

Interesting photo that Mcgyver posted!
At least he used good "string" in order to secure his load.
Who gave him his DL.
I suppose when he eventually gets that load where he is taking it he will cobble up some sort of shelter and start breeding!:eek:

dave5605
08-23-2010, 01:38 PM
Just do a google search for 'coil spring compressor' and you will see all kinds of pictures. They are all about the same design though and price is between $35 and $100 based on where you get them. My experience with them is that they don't work as easily as expected. Particularly on full sized front coil springs. Its like trying to put 10# of crap in a 5# bag. They also don't particularly like the high angle of the rear coils and tend to slip around a bit.

The auto parts stores around here either rent them for about $10 a day or free if you buy the springs there.

I have to agree with the others though in that if you disconnect the shock (and maybe the brake line) they will fall right out.

ADGO_Racing
08-23-2010, 01:50 PM
I have to agree with the others though in that if you disconnect the shock (and maybe the brake line) they will fall right out.

Especially on the rear axle. Front end independent lowers can sometimes trap them. But you can still just remove the two rear pivot bolts and/or ball joint from the spindle.

airsmith282
08-23-2010, 09:43 PM
ok guys i got all my parts now, and i went and just bought the compressor so wish me luck i think iam going to need it, but it shoouldbe pretty straight forward , i managed to get a set of like new springs form the wrecker today for 40.00 for the pair so that save me over 160.00 there , i hate the dealer, but ya both springs are broken in almost the same place , and i know they have noting to do withthe brake pad fly out but it all went at once on me was interesting, what iam dealing with for the rear end is in the pic that was posted off the cobalt , same rear end , i have to bleed my brakes any how seeing as iam replacing pads shoes roters and drums and both combie kits as well. but i still want to try the compressoer before distrubign the the brake line even thought it would likley be eaiser my car is up on 4 jacks so i dont have a 5th one to lift the rear end back up and i kinda want to rip it all apart and reaplince all at once and be done with it. ill defently post pics of the broken junk once it all out tomorrow..

next project after this one is done is to replace all 4 tires , does it ever end lol iam thinking nope ..

ADGO_Racing
08-23-2010, 09:47 PM
You have the vehicle on 4 jacks and you are working on it like that?!?!? :eek: :eek: :eek:

airsmith282
08-23-2010, 10:18 PM
You have the vehicle on 4 jacks and you are working on it like that?!?!? :eek: :eek: :eek:

yup and i got jack stands as well. you do what you have to do to get the job done, i cant afford a hoist yet , lot eaiser to bleed the brakes to when you can have the car in the air,same thing with my step sons monte carlo as well , totaly safe when you got decen jacks and jack stands as well.

TGTool
08-23-2010, 10:23 PM
You have the vehicle on 4 jacks and you are working on it like that?!?!? :eek: :eek: :eek:

I think nature may be planning a little change to the gene pool. :D

dave5605
08-24-2010, 01:10 PM
We need a picture of the car on the 4 jacks and the 4 jack stands.

I understand 4 jack stands by themselves. Just can't picture the combo or the need for the combo. Having the 4 jacks hold the weight is just plain dangerous.
Set it on the jack stands and get the jacks out of the way. That way you will have 4 jacks for the rear end.:cool:

Does anybody else (other than me) have this picture of a car up on 4 bottle jacks?:p

Black_Moons
08-24-2010, 02:03 PM
and yes its driven on roads , if you want to call them that
i have 2 busted coil springs in the rear, both fornt stabilzers are screwed and the brake s fornt and rear drums and rotors are all fried infact when the 2 springs let go at thesame time the front inside drivers sied brake pad sheared off it mounting plate to what a mess, and people wounder why i dont trust other mechanics to work on my car,

How airsmith really broke his car:
http://users.telenet.be/roadmaster/doh_cars_gl_trainjump.jpg

Mcgyver
08-24-2010, 02:38 PM
Having the 4 jacks hold the weight is just plain dangerous.


so it's not a good idea to work under the lathe like this? :rolleyes:

http://i785.photobucket.com/albums/yy132/michael01000/shop%20may%2010/th_DSC_3954Large.jpg (http://s785.photobucket.com/albums/yy132/michael01000/shop%20may%2010/?action=view&current=DSC_3954Large.jpg)

if you missed the orignal post, this was done by the delivery guys while i proceeded to have kittens in the driverway watching it.

Guido
08-24-2010, 02:47 PM
Burnnin rubber will causse them there springs to break everytime. Good welder could weld them back togethar agin?

------GG

saltmine
08-24-2010, 03:26 PM
See that guy sitting there, on the forklift?

That's me.

I spent a lot of time out there on the "Dukes of Hazard" sets..

We destroyed almost all of the Dodge Chargers in Southern California....They were good for one jump.

If you look real close, you can see the bent railroad track "skids" running from front to rear on the "General Lee"

airsmith282
08-24-2010, 09:53 PM
Burnnin rubber will causse them there springs to break everytime. Good welder could weld them back togethar agin?

------GG

at 20 bucks a pop at the wrecker for like new springs its not worth the attempt to weld them, and i dont burn rubber and that does blow rear springs anyhow...

turns out all the colbalts and pursuits and G5s all have bad coil springs in the rear so called known problem but will the dealer do anything hell no just sell you new springs and change a forturne to install them ..

anyhow so far we got the front brakes and roters and the stabalizers replaced , next is the rear end once i get another nice day with no rain. next 2 days supposed to rain kinda sucks oh well.

TGTool
08-24-2010, 10:49 PM
That sounds like a no win situation. All the springs installed on those models are bad. So you got a pair from the junkyard. So you know those are going to fail too because everything installed was bad. That might be time to find an alternate supplier or maybe the ones the dealer sells now are re-engineered not to fail like the originals. Good luck in any case.

airsmith282
08-25-2010, 01:56 AM
That sounds like a no win situation. All the springs installed on those models are bad. So you got a pair from the junkyard. So you know those are going to fail too because everything installed was bad. That might be time to find an alternate supplier or maybe the ones the dealer sells now are re-engineered not to fail like the originals. Good luck in any case.

dealer has not made any improvments at all to the suspension, and no aftermarket parts yet are available for these cars for the springs, so untill there is i can count on replacing springs in the back end every 2 to 3 years ,but the ones i picked up use came off a brand new pursuit that got smashed up so there is very little miliage on them, and at 20 bucks each i dont mind dropping springs in form time to time, dealer price new is 107.25 each spring not including install, but then again they will never get their hands on my car again, good thing for me i worked as a mechanic for a few years , other wise this stuff would cost me a bundel ,

the new sway bar links are after market top of the line ones and they seem to be alot better made then the originals i guess in time will see for sure...

Willy
08-25-2010, 02:03 AM
We destroyed almost all of the Dodge Chargers in Southern California....They were good for one jump.


By the sounds of it, thats one more than you'd get out of a Chevy.:D

ADGO_Racing
08-25-2010, 02:08 AM
I think nature may be planning a little change to the gene pool. :D

Darwin was right!:rolleyes:

Hey, I think I may see an award in this guys future...:D

Willy
08-25-2010, 02:10 AM
Airsmith, if it happenens agian try a set of Moog springs, or if you're going to keep it, mayby a set of Eibachs.
Sorry to see you had a bad day...honest.

airsmith282
08-25-2010, 09:04 AM
Airsmith, if it happenens agian try a set of Moog springs, or if you're going to keep it, mayby a set of Eibachs.
Sorry to see you had a bad day...honest.

belive me if i could have gotten some good after market springs i would have , and once i can find some good heavy duty ones they will be going on it, i gota get 15 years out of this car before i can scrap it...i still have another 3 years of payments on it to.. but after shes paid off iam buying me a truck..

well its off to the auto wrecker for me , gota pick up some abs parts for my step sons monte carlo and a horn for my tractor, more mods to go on it lol

ill let yous know wen the car is back in one peice again, and show off thoes nice busted springs ...

airsmith282
08-26-2010, 08:14 PM
ok well its all back togeter again , i had to drop the rear end so off came the flex lines and steel line and i used my torinjack and i had to drop the top of the shocks and down she came life could not have been made more better, now the broken springs i gota surprize now both springs on the bottom were busted inthe exact same place, and the left rear was broken on the bottom and on the top now that is freaking weird, anyhow new springs installed all new brakes and drums and rotros, and it rides like new again ,

Until the next thing that goes wornge, and i got my oil chainge all done to and new filter,

now its onto my dads saturn the y pipes form the header to the first main are well done rotted gone no more history , oh well ,

then it back to the monte to install new ABS sensors, god what fun,

saltmine
08-26-2010, 08:37 PM
Funny you should mention Chevies in my reference to jumping them, Willy.

The people I worked for got a contract for filming a TV commercial. GM was picking up the tab for it, and the script called for a Chevy pickup to jump across a stream (about 40 feet) and land on the other side, in one piece. Now, remember, this was before they could use CGI to make it appear several Dodge trucks were capable of crossing an open field, unscathed.

We built a ramp out of steel channel and plywood. But, at the time (late '70's) Chevrolet wasn't producing an engine that would get the poor thing up the ramp fast enough...My friend, from Hollyweird, had the answer....We'd install a small rocket engine in the bed of the truck, and take the tailgate off. The engine was a surplus unit, a liquid fuelled motor originally used to power a target drone of some kind. It ran on alcohol and Hydrazine (I think)
The engine would produce about 6000lbs of thrust for 25seconds.

Once the crew got all of the cameras set up, and did their light & sound checks, the stunt driver fired the truck up, and went down to the starting point, which was 1/4 mile from the ramp. The idea was to start going on the truck's engine, then, about 50yards from the ramp, fire the rocket.

They got everything right on the first take (highly unusual in the film industry)

The pickup shot up the ramp, and sailed over the stream, overshooting it's landing by at least 50 feet. When it landed, on all four wheels, the frame broke in half, right behind the cab....and the truck ground to a halt.

Unfortunately, that part was left on the cutting room floor.

It was almost as amusing as the time they filmed the "New, Improved, Ford Ranger" commercial...They dropped a brand new Ranger pickup out of a C-130. It was supposed to float down on two parachutes, and the guy inside was supposed to drive away, once he landed. Fortunately, they used a dressed dummy for the first drop....the parachutes failed. The Ranger landed squarely on all four wheels. When the dust cleared, no part of that Ford was more than a foot high...it looked like a roach somebody had stepped on.

bruto
08-26-2010, 09:46 PM
I know it's a bit off the original topic, but I hope Saltmine keeps them coming.