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wierdscience
12-18-2003, 12:20 AM
Anybody notice what today was?Yep 100th anniversary of the Wright Bros. first flight.

Its amazing what we have forgot in the last 100 years,one show on the Wright flyer said that each wing of the original wieghed a scant 15 lbs,quite an achievement for muslin cloth and wood!

I am still amazed by Charles Linburg,do you realize that we went from cloth and wood to steel and aluminum and then to Titanium and the moon in his lifetime?

jfsmith
12-18-2003, 01:38 AM
They couldn't get the replica off the ground, so the Wright Brothers were in the right place at the right time, with the wright plane.

Jerry

Thrud
12-18-2003, 03:07 AM
What I think was cool was the Wright brothers made props that were 80% effecient. The very best props today are only 85% effecient using super computers and modern CNC equipment! Boy, they don't make brains like they used to... http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

wierdscience
12-18-2003, 10:15 AM
Thats why I still say the mechanics and machinists back then forgot more than we know today.

Paul Gauthier
12-18-2003, 04:39 PM
I am most awed by the fact that man first flew in 1903 and landed on the moon some 60 years later. IMHO that is truly amazing.

------------------
Paul G.

Evan
12-18-2003, 05:23 PM
Unfortunately, most of that "progress" came at the expense of many, many lives.

tonydacrow
12-18-2003, 06:45 PM
Here's what cracks me up... 100 years ago two bike mechanics piece together a little wood and canvas on a shoestring budget and figure-out powered flight. We want to recreate their aircraft today and we spend $1.2 million US to do it! This is progress?

JCHannum
12-18-2003, 09:00 PM
Uh, about that $1.2 million? It didn't work.

IOWOLF
12-18-2003, 09:24 PM
BTW the USA did both, and only 200 or so years old too. now thats progress.

Cant make wine without squishing a few grapes, Evan. not the best annalogy but it fits.

wierdscience
12-18-2003, 09:50 PM
Yes it did cost lives,but that was also one of the Wrights strong points,functioning models first for testing then climb on board,nearly all of their compition climbed in the seat for the first and most of the time final attempt.


<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Evan:
Unfortunately, most of that "progress" came at the expense of many, many lives.</font>

Evan
12-19-2003, 12:08 AM
Sorry, I didn't make it clear. The majority of aviation progress was made during the several wars. WWI, WWII, Korean, Vietnam. I wasn't talking about test pilots. Wartime drove development.

JCHannum
12-19-2003, 10:35 AM
Wartime drove development of a hell of a lot more things than aviation. It started well before the wheel if you think about it.
Nothing like ducking bullets or spears, arrows, big stones, to get the creative juices flowing.

docsteve66
12-21-2003, 01:24 PM
Yep, JC- Most people look at the dead bodies and seem to think the dead are the ones we lost. Properly utilized, each dead represents several men not dead. If it were just "count bodies" and see who wins (as the political generals did in VietNam) there would be no need of fighting- just see who has the most men and declare the winner.

In reality, It is when resolve, coupled some what with equipment are factored in that a winner emerges. Considered as a percentage of population, wars have become less bloody between soldiers, and more civilians are involved- modern warfare seems to be directed at making the civilian suffer and let the civilian demand peace.

IMHO war has resulted in saving many more people (indirectly) than war has killed. Most real progress - forging metals, canning food, continent wide transportation (be it Roman or Chinese, dirt roads or flying) are PUSHED into being by fear of losing a war or at least minimizing losses (thus having more living fighters) and maintaining "peace" (what ever peace means). Practical social changes result from wars and the effects of wars- they do not result from Utopian planners such a Marx, Hitler, and several USA presidents and UK PM and the sit-ins of the 1960's forward.

The savages to civil society made in the 60's probably did/will ultimately result in more deaths and tragedies than the small progress warrants. But the participants still think they did well and hope to do more along the same lines. They left a trail of hopeless, dispirited, uncivilized people to mark their "progress" to the present. In the name of "progress",They have erected, from little "bumps"walls that could have been/were being pounded flat, tall walls may never be over come. Only time will really tell.

BTW, Wright made the first POWERED flight and even that claim is not universally accepted. Other than getting back on the ground in one piece, the big problem with flight was POWER- as thrud says, the propeller was efficient, the engine was high HP to weight (all things considered).

I inspired by the recent failure- apparently we resisted temptation to "improve" just a little bit (thus saving face if flying conditions were less favorable on the anniversary). I am proud they replicated and failed-no one will prove they "cheated".

Evan
12-21-2003, 02:17 PM
They never would have gotten off the ground if it not for Charlie E. Taylor.

See here:

http://popularmechanics.com/science/aviation/2003/10/rev_to_glory/print.phtml

wierdscience
12-21-2003, 03:45 PM
Taylor's work would have never gotten of the ground without the Wright Balance and their experimentation,as Taylor said in an interview it was a collaboration.

Toolmaker Extrodinair
12-21-2003, 09:17 PM
No one has been able to reproduce the Wright Bros. accomplishment in the same time frame. no wonder toolmakers back then wore white shirts and ties to work and were respected like doctors.