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View Full Version : From Grizzly to this and more info.



Chief Ben
01-20-2011, 05:34 PM
I posted this on about the 18 th.
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I have a index milling machine to large about 2000 LBS or over and can not put it in my new small wood floor shop,
so I want to buy a smaller milling machine for the new shop.
thinking about a Grizzly one like this, If anyone can give me some advice on this it would be Great, Pros & Cons if you own one. Thank You.
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So I ordered a Milling Machine from Quality machine tools # PM-25MV
for $ 1,295.00 it should be here on around 20 Feb. 2011
I think it will do what I want to do in the new shop.
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u3/DaveBentz/PM-30MVSide-210x432.jpg
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Now for the best part the old Index has some history.
I called Wells index about the old machine and they were Great People to talk to and Gave me a lot of help, they said send them the numbers and they could give me some Info. on it, Boy they keep good records::
this is what they sent me and a Old Sales Poster on it from the 40's ...
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INDEX MILLING MACHINE # 402171 H Cost New was $ 1,291.00
Was shipped on 20 November 1944
To: Paramount Die Casting Company St. Joseph, Michigan.
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u3/DaveBentz/IndexBrochure-1.jpg

hitandmissman
01-20-2011, 06:08 PM
Glad ya found out more on the Index. Looks like a very nice old mill. Now about the new one you ordered. I have been looking at that one also and Grizzly's which looks to me to be almost the same. I wasn't sure about the 2" spindle travel tho. PM also has a larger one coming out(of course more money). When you get this mill please post something as to what you think of it. Are you going to put power feed on it or a DRO? Keep us posted.

Arthur.Marks
01-20-2011, 06:31 PM
That's rather hilarious! :D
1944 Index original price - $1291.00
2011 PM-25MV price - $1295.00

Tony Ennis
01-20-2011, 06:37 PM
The 1944 version would be $15,000 or so in today's money.

Chief Ben
01-20-2011, 06:50 PM
I will keep you all informed on the new mill when I get it.

firbikrhd1
01-20-2011, 06:58 PM
I have that same Index Mill and am going through it right now replacing the lead nuts, paint and general tune up. Since I like old tools and in particular the design of that mill for a home shop I can't wait to put it to work. It appears to be pretty rigid by design, perhaps more so that some of the newer mid sized mills offered.

mototed
01-20-2011, 07:02 PM
Now Wells Index. They did the same thing for me for my 1965 Index model 645. They are great people. Gave me the date it left the factory and original paint color. ( I've not repainted it yet, too busy playing with it. It has been painted over the years in that "productive" puke green color) When I strike it rich, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a new machine from them while they are rebuilding my old one.
Too late to reinforce the floor?

sasquatch
01-20-2011, 07:12 PM
Interesting topic and good photos and info.
Waiting to hear about your,e new mill, as i,m considering purchasing the same model, here in canada, they,re sold by "Busy Bee Tools, and just about the same price,, Interesting. Thanks again.

Chief Ben
01-20-2011, 08:51 PM
I will Keep everyone posted on the new Mill as soon as I get it, I don't do a lot of big jobs, just small things, Hobby things most of all. I needed a Light machine to put in my new wood shead, I want to cool it and heat it at a low price, so this is where all my new thing will be,
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u3/DaveBentz/newshop013.jpgThis is the Big Shop.
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u3/DaveBentz/shopdoor004.jpg
My moving work Bench in the Big Shop, with the Watch Dog, Keeping An Eye On The Tools, MR. Jerry Lea.
http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u3/DaveBentz/WorkBench5010.jpg

Chief Ben
01-20-2011, 10:01 PM
Jerry Does not like the new Shop, to small I guess

gzig5
01-21-2011, 12:58 AM
I think you are overestimating the weight of that Index Model 40 milling machine. The weight of that mill is 1250 pounds with both power feeds, or about 1100 pounds without feeds. I doubt your new mill is going to be significantly lighter. That sales brochure copy was given to Wells Index by me. I know it's mine because the two tears on the bottom match. The back page has some specifications of the machine and the weight is listed as I stated. The previous owner of my Model 40 completely re-scraped it and retrofitted a Tree UVR head because the original head had bad bearings. I had most of the head parts but sold them off a couple years ago. For it's weight, I think it is a pretty rigid machine. There really isn't that much meat on the base, but the knee is pretty beefy. I really like my machine.
Good luck.
Greg

This is my machine when I got it home. No open space there any more.
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/gzig5/Index.jpg

Here is the back page of the brochure.
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/gzig5/Index40back_1.jpg

photomankc
01-21-2011, 10:34 AM
His new mill will be less than half that. They are just shy of 300lbs for the machine and less than 100 for the stand.

I have the PM25-MV and it's a nice mill overall with a few niggles. I have issues with the Z gib. It's not right and when I locked it using the gib locks it rocks a little no matter how tight you make the gib. And mine gets fairly tight as you approach the edges of the X travel.

Overall though its a good machine. I can take pretty substantial cuts in Al and with a rougher I can take pretty beefy cuts in steel as well. It will flex a bit and it's not going to outclass a 1000lb machine but it's a big step up from the mini-mills.

gnm109
01-21-2011, 10:42 AM
I'd find a way to accomodate the Wells Index machine. It's a quality unit. I wish I could have found one of those. I have a Webb that weighs 3,500 pounds. I have the room for it but it's sure big. I'm 6' tall and I have to stand on my toes to change collets.

Assuming that I had the room and the choice was between the Wells unit and anything from Grizzly, the choice would be clear for me at least.

Forgetting who built the machine, a 300# mill is pretty lightweight. JMO.

Arthur.Marks
01-21-2011, 11:13 AM
Hmm... were there two designs of the same model or something? It looks in the literature that the vertical head is connected with an arching section from the main body. The picture of the one with the Tree head looks more like there is a large diameter shaft that connects by a bore through the top of the body casting. Perhaps we are talking of the same model... but two different versions?

In any case, I am sure you'll be satisfied with the new mill, and I LOVE the door to your new shop! :D
[EDIT:] Oh, wait... I guess it was the old shop. :( Missed that at first.

roundrocktom
01-21-2011, 11:38 AM
Nice doggy!

Index is a nice mill. My 555 was built in the 1960's. Reground for R8 tooling, and is a nice heavy workhorse. Power X & Y table feeds, and the quill also has a power Z down (super nice for boring operations, set a supper fine speed while doing lathe work...).

If your old Index needs a new home.... :)

Tom

macona
01-21-2011, 12:11 PM
The 1944 version would be $15,000 or so in today's money.

Sadly its getting closer to $16k.

http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=1291&year1=1944&year2=2010

Chief Ben
01-21-2011, 01:13 PM
I was thinking about selling the Index, but after what all you guys have told me on here and after the wife got done reading all of this she said we are going to keep it and fix it up, so we ordered the book on it, and this summer it will get a face lift, and try to bring it as new as we can get it.
and thanks for the info on the new one I ordered,

photomankc
01-21-2011, 01:26 PM
You will of course be posting lots of pictures yes?!? I have to live vicariously through other people's big machines.

Chief Ben
01-21-2011, 05:35 PM
Yes i will be posting pictures when i the index all cleaned up, Thanks for asking