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View Full Version : Computer stuff: getting what you pay for.



Forrest Addy
03-01-2011, 12:02 AM
This is a tale of utterly unremarkable success.

A year ago I bought a really cheap replacement keyboard and mouse ($16 for a Box-o-Stuff) from the local computer hole-in-the-wall store. It worked OK but the "s" "i" and a couple of others took a little more effort to make a character appear on the screen. Then the key legends started wearing off and the mouse got squirrely. Finally the keyboard was almost bare of character legends and the mouse was running wild: Sunday, I had enough and went out to Costco where I spent $70 on a Logitech wireless keyboard and mouse.

I put the CD in the tray and loaded the software clicking on the "I accept" and "continue" button and that was it. Then I plugged in the little USB receiver goodie and the keyboard and mouse came alive. The batterys are advertised to last 3 to 4 years.

And that was about it. It works boringly well. I spent the money and immediately reaped the benefit with no hassles.

So why do I remark on it? Today's market place is filled with dubious products and selecting one that not only works but does what it was supposed to do without fuss or bother is no longer commonplace. Sometimes you do get what you paid for and that IS remarkable.

Ken_Shea
03-01-2011, 12:40 AM
Same here on keyboards, they last me about two months, then can't read the letters, which for some of you is no problem, but I am not a typist. The one now was found at Goodwill for I believe $3, a Labtech, still going strong with the letters and it's about 4 months now.
I use a Logitech wireless mouse, the AA battery last about a month here, the ones I have used never lasted much longer but do get pretty heavy use and are never shut off which may shorten the battery life.

mickeyf
03-01-2011, 01:24 AM
Ah, but the first one lasted (sorta) a year, and you've only had this one for one day. Waaay to early to make a judgment! Let us know how it's working in 4.375 years.....:D

I have a collection of genuine original IBM keyboards (the ones that actually click when you type, rather than squoosh) 'cause I loathe those spongy things they sell now-a-days. The one I'm using now is still plugging away after 20+ years, and if it goes I have replacements on hand.

BillB
03-01-2011, 02:38 AM
This is why some of us buy Macs to start with.

RB211
03-01-2011, 03:14 AM
This is why some of us buy Macs to start with.
MAC = over priced sub par performance PC

Circlip
03-01-2011, 04:33 AM
I have a collection of genuine original IBM keyboards (the ones that actually click when you type, rather than squoosh)

So it's YOU that's cornered the "M" series market Mickeyf????? :(

Regards Ian.

DougC_582
03-01-2011, 06:27 AM
The old classic-style IBM keyboards used buckle springs for the keys.

You can still find used ones on eBay now and then for very little. What condition they are in can be something of a crap-shoot tho'.

If you want a brand-new one, the keyboard manufacturing rights for IBM were bought up by a company named Unicomp, who still sells them today through their website (used to be pckeyboard.com, now they use a yahoo storefront)-

http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/keyboards.html

I prefer the ergo keyboards myself.
I've had good luck with the original Microsoft Natural ones, but they're pretty hard to find now at a decent price. Last time I bought keyboards, I think I bought three for $20 each. That was about eight years ago, and I think I'm on my last one....

SGW
03-01-2011, 08:29 AM
Does anybody know how the quality of the keyboards from http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/keyboards.html compare with these?
http://elitekeyboards.com/

Ken_Shea
03-01-2011, 08:35 AM
This is why some of us buy Macs to start with.

Not many, but some :D

Rustybolt
03-01-2011, 10:09 AM
MAC = over priced sub par performance PC


Yes. But if you do any sort of desk-top-publishing, either written or photo. macs are the standard.

topct
03-01-2011, 11:12 AM
I thought I was saving some money by buying a cheap wireless mouse. After installing it I tried to use it. It works like an old ball type of mouse with dirty rollers. There doesn't seem to be any setting that makes it work smoothly, I consider it totally unusable.

Has Microsofts name on it.

justanengineer
03-01-2011, 12:25 PM
MAC = over priced sub par performance PC

Not to renew a 30 yr old dispute....but....

Having used both macs and pcs at several local universities I can attest to the fact that if you do a lot of 3d/solid modeling or advanced simulation then macs are the way to go. Comparing equal priced units in the $1500-$2000 range the macs win everytime. When I have several large models open in 2 or 3 different programs running simultaneously the mac is the only one that can keep up with demand on the processor and graphics. Keep in mind this coming from a guy who grew up on macs, used pcs for the last ten or so years with little issue, and just bought another mac for professional purposes. Plainly said...I need a lot of computer and for the money, the mac is the only one capable of getting the amount of work done I want. If I only needed to surf the net, email, and use the ms office suite...I would buy a cheap pc, but a $1500 pc isnt equal to a $1500 mac and comparing a $500 pc to a $1500 mac like most do is apples and oranges.

toyjeep73
03-01-2011, 02:12 PM
Same here on keyboards, they last me about two months, then can't read the letters, which for some of you is no problem, but I am not a typist.

I just have to ask .... how much typing does it take to wear the letters off keys in two months? I have keyboards that are years old and get gummed up with spilt drinks long before the keys are illegible.

bmc
03-01-2011, 02:16 PM
I picked up several IBM model M keyboards at the local recycle center 4 or 5 yrs back. They work great for a non touch typist .... course they can't spell worth a damn, but they sure are better than the new ones.

bob

Plainville, MA

DougC_582
03-01-2011, 02:18 PM
I thought I was saving some money by buying a cheap wireless mouse. After installing it I tried to use it. It works like an old ball type of mouse with dirty rollers. There doesn't seem to be any setting that makes it work smoothly, I consider it totally unusable.

Has Microsofts name on it.
MS stuff usually works basically good. Check that there is not a piece of hair or anything else in the LED/laser area. Even one tiny hair will make optical mice go screwy.

----


Not to renew a 30 yr old dispute....but....

Having used both macs and pcs at several local universities I can attest to the fact that if you do a lot of 3d/solid modeling or advanced simulation then macs are the way to go. Comparing equal priced units in the $1500-$2000 range the macs win everytime. ...
I never do 3-D modeling, and never owned a Mac...
but,,,,
back in the PPC days it was a lively debate which computer was better. Now that Macs are PCs, there's not much argument left. You can just do straight-up hardware comparisons.

PPC's never really came into their prime, IMO.
They were capable of running relatively huge amounts of RAM, but back then RAM was too expensive for most people to buy very much of.

Alistair Hosie
03-01-2011, 02:36 PM
I returned to university in *1991 and did a 4 year degree in psychology with maths/stats biology German etc thrown in a bsc hon's. Anyway at that time I knew nothing about computers and wanted to remain so for the rest of my days if I could possibly get away with it.
I was dramatically forced to re-think my ideas and eventually bough a mac that was the start of computer life for me it took me a while to get used to it , and my two older suffering sons were constantly called to sort out the most mean little error I managed to procure from the damned machine almost it seemed a hundred times daily .
I stuck with macs and renewed them buying several more over a few years.I suppose being afraid to turn to a standard pc as it was pre widows days, and I assumed it would mean learning all1 over again. Now I would not go back to the mac as everything is so much easier to have repaired with off the shelf parts etc cost is way down and quite easy to use.I am afraid that's why you have to put up with my inane drivell almost daily :D poor souls as I really enjoy my computer. Take it easy guys lot's of brotherly L :DAlistair

topct
03-01-2011, 05:48 PM
MS stuff usually works basically good. Check that there is not a piece of hair or anything else in the LED/laser area. Even one tiny hair will make optical mice go screwy.

I use a tablet of paper for a mouse pad so I can jot down notes on it. Thought it might be because of the writing on the pad and it was. So I flipped a page to a clean sheet and the lines on it will also disrupt the mouse arrow. For kicks I put an ink dot on a piece of clean printer paper. The crazy thing jumps the arrow going across the dot.

But now I have another haywire device. A brand new out the box HP all in one printer, scanner, etc. that when you go to scan and copy creates a solid very black and very wet page.

lazlo
03-01-2011, 06:25 PM
Having used both macs and pcs at several local universities I can attest to the fact that if you do a lot of 3d/solid modeling or advanced simulation then macs are the way to go. Comparing equal priced units in the $1500-$2000 range the macs win everytime.

Do you realize that Macs are PC's with a different OS?

What solid modeller runs on Mac?

Peter N
03-01-2011, 06:30 PM
Not to renew a 30 yr old dispute....but....

Having used both macs and pcs at several local universities I can attest to the fact that if you do a lot of 3d/solid modeling or advanced simulation then macs are the way to go. Comparing equal priced units in the $1500-$2000 range the macs win everytime. When I have several large models open in 2 or 3 different programs running simultaneously the mac is the only one that can keep up with demand on the processor and graphics. Keep in mind this coming from a guy who grew up on macs, used pcs for the last ten or so years with little issue, and just bought another mac for professional purposes. Plainly said...I need a lot of computer and for the money, the mac is the only one capable of getting the amount of work done I want. If I only needed to surf the net, email, and use the ms office suite...I would buy a cheap pc, but a $1500 pc isnt equal to a $1500 mac and comparing a $500 pc to a $1500 mac like most do is apples and oranges.


And just which mainstream MCAD/3D Solid modellers run native on a Mac (not under Parallel Desktop which is Windows-on-a-Mac)?
Apart from support for Alias I don't think I know of any that do, so I'd be interested in just where that comparison came from.

I do *Lots* of solid modelling with large & pretty complex assemblies everyday, running on a Dell Precision T7400 workstation with a single Xeon processor. The only time I ever have a problem is when I'm doing photo-realistic rendering using Photoworks on large assemblies. Under Photoworks the processor does most of the work rather than the GPU, so it is often 100% loaded for long periods of time, so I think adding a 2nd Xeon processor may help this.
Other than that it's very, very fast. Stress analysis using Cosmos works and flow simulations are equally very fast.

If a Mac can run mainstream MCAD *and* give a major performance improvement, then it would be a no-brainer to buy one for my business, but I've yet to see anything other than anecdotal comments to persuade me.
So I'm all Ears.


Peter

Peter N
03-01-2011, 06:31 PM
Do you realize that Macs are PC's with a different OS?

What solid modeller runs on Mac?


Ya beat me to it Robert :D

airsmith282
03-01-2011, 06:48 PM
This is why some of us buy Macs to start with.


no to put insult but my father wears out keyboards and mice faster then you can say fire in the hole

and yes he is a Macintosh user , so so much for that ,, apple is not the quaility they use to be i was a mac fan at one time and no more thanks ill keep my PC and i can play games with out lag surf and watch videos with no lag, macs have their place and thats not in my house anymore, expecially sence the QC when to the birds on them..

have a nice day

did i mention i was also an apple certified tech and i have run apple products sence 1982 and stoped in 2000 due to the QC going to crap and they fact that games and surfing on them sucks and so does many other apps,

and yes people macs can get a virus sence OS X the mac has gone even further down hill.

sometimes you can pay a bundel and still get junk,

alanganes
03-01-2011, 07:05 PM
OH NO!

The PC vs Mac debate!

I thought discussing one's religious views was a violation of this forums policy.

mike os
03-02-2011, 02:07 PM
OH NO!

I thought discussing one's religious views was a violation of this forums policy.
:D

as to the op... logitech keyboards easily last 3-4 years ime......usually the mouse dies after about 3 years ( left click microswitch failure rather than mousy bits):rolleyes:

Circlip
03-02-2011, 03:28 PM
My Logiteck Optical tracker ball is on its second USB cable.

Regards Ian.

DougC_582
03-02-2011, 06:33 PM
OH NO!

The PC vs Mac debate!

I thought discussing one's religious views was a violation of this forums policy.
Yes but,,,,, Macs are the devil's idle undershorts. Or something.

The problem with arguing is that not many people have really used both extensively, and (if you use much expensive software) changing to the other becomes rather unlikely since to do that you'd have to pay to replace not only the computer itself, but also all the software you have.

Back in the day, when you bought a program it would have both the PC and Mac versions on it, if both were available. At some point everybody figured out they could make more money by charging for both separately. :rolleyes:

------

Another thing I noticed a ways ago..... back when Macs went to the PC platform, and hackers figured out how to make the Mac OS run on a regular PC. So you could download this disk image and install it (various ways) and have the Mac operating system running on a regular PC.

I know a lot of people online did it, and I even considered doing it myself. Both Mac owners (who had a PC around) and PC owners did it, mostly out of curiosity I suppose, but from what I saw posted online,,,,,, I doubt that many people in either group really found it useful over the long term. The Mac people preferred using their real Macs (that they had anyway) and the PC people were used to Windows and had the software problem I mentioned above.

So even though that you can run a pirated Mac OS on a PC now, most computer owners of either type still don't bother.

mike os
03-03-2011, 07:08 AM
thats because the current mac os( which is "apple linux") runs on a pc in an apple box;)

these days there is little to choose IMO...& the SW penalty on mac is not that great over the life of the machine.... now that they have sorted most of their 3rd party hardware issues.;)
That said last time I bought a pc I looked at a mac...went to the apple store & they had 3 machines on display.... all crashed & unable to get restarted, put me right off

airsmith282
03-03-2011, 09:43 AM
the largest issue on pc and mac is the pc can not even come close to the mac in the graphic printing area at all, PCs are just not up for it even using the same version of photoshop with the same printer the PC still is not up for the task where the mac kicks its A** all over the place, other then that the pc is just as supuior if not more,

so really there is no arguement here PC rules macs Drule

its nice to see apple get a taste of their own medican for a change sence os X and the QC going on apple products life is getting to be better and macs are still way over priced even for the home users,