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View Full Version : OT: A new way of chainsaw sharpening, on the job.



DannyW
08-02-2011, 03:30 PM
.


Will this innovation alleviate a lot of dread in chainsaw sharpening?
A sharp saw in seconds.
Would you buy one? Request for comments.

Youtube link 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HonJ4aMGBiA&feature=related). Link 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w1LmEn67M4&feature=related).


Regards,

Danny

Black_Moons
08-02-2011, 04:05 PM
I'll buy one when evan tells me his wife has gone outta business selling chains and chain files to the professional loggers. :P

Abner
08-02-2011, 04:43 PM
Does it require special chains? Otherwise you are just grinding the top down making the top thinner, which I would think isn't good for chain life.

Forestgnome
08-02-2011, 04:47 PM
Looks pretty good, but for limited applications. I'm surprised the starter kits are pretty cheap. When I say limited applications, only to 18" bar length, no skip tooth.

vpt
08-02-2011, 05:10 PM
Does it require special chains? Otherwise you are just grinding the top down making the top thinner, which I would think isn't good for chain life.



Yup. I could see this making chains unsafe as well when the cutters get thin and start flying off.

slim_jim
08-02-2011, 05:17 PM
Yes, the video in link 1 shows that you need a special chain as well as a special bar.

SteveF
08-02-2011, 05:58 PM
Well, I spent a good part of Sunday sharpening cutting teeth with a hand held grinder and then a die grinder to get the depth gauges down to spec; so this looks interesting to me. I wish the demo in link 2 showed a close up of the chips to see how large they were.

For a while I had my chains "professionally" sharpened until I got two chains back with the teeth turned blue and the leading edge of the cutter melted back because the idiot was in a hurry.

Some of you guys need to watch the first video again, it's a special chain with a completely different cutter geometry.

Steve

ed_h
08-02-2011, 06:32 PM
I have one of these, given to me by a guy on whose property they filmed a commercial. They gave it to him as a freebie.

I've looked at it, but not used it. It does take a special chain--the teeth are sharpened on the top surface rather than from the gullet side.

I saw them yesterday at Home Depot on the Clearance shelf.

lynnl
08-02-2011, 06:48 PM
This is not really new. I recall some 25 -25 years ago there were saws that incorporated a sharpening feature, using special chains that were ground on top like that. There was a name for those type cutters/chains - seems like they were called "barracuda", or something like that.

With those saws, the sharpener was in the powerhead.

I remember one of my neighbors at the time had one.

Black_Moons
08-02-2011, 06:54 PM
I found the diamond dressing tooth rather funny.

How about diamond coated chainsaw blades :) Sure would keep it from getting dulled on rocks/metal.

Duffy
08-02-2011, 07:14 PM
This SHOULD be described as "a new way to sell chains, bars and sharpeners."
Does it cut any BETTER? Any FASTER? Any SAFER? No, it just locks you into a specialty bar, chain and sharpening attachment. You can bet that the chains will ALWAYS be premium priced since the volume will be so low.
Anyone who has used a chainsaw more than a little bit will agree that it pays to keep it out of the dirt. Sure, everyone has an OOOPS, but if you have more than a few, you are either careless or sloppy. I learned to sharpen my own chains. I can do it freehand, but being a southpaw, they tend to get a bit of a skew to the tooth angles on one side. Every few sharpenings, I get out the filing jig to straighten things out. I have used a file, a stone or a diamond in a Dremel Tool, but I think that a file does the best job and that the Swiss files are better than Nicholson, (I know, application for US citizenship will be summarily denied!:D )
Short story:- I was into Woss Camp, the north central logging camp on Vancouver Island, owned by Canadian Forrest Products. In the mid 70s this camp shipped 1,000,000 sbf of logs every working day. They had forty-some fallers and their saws were supplied and maintained under contract by a resident saw mechanic. I talked with him and he explained that each faller took a saw and one extra chain into the bush each day. In the evening they brought the saws to him for service, if needed. He would either repair or supply a replacement, but he only had about a dozen spares. He did have LOTS of chain and spare bars.
The point is, these guys made their living, (and it was a Damned good one!) and only used , at most, two chains in a cutting day. the secret was that they kept them out of the dirt!
These fallers were on wages, but a few years earlier they had been on piece-work. At that time there were only 25-30 fallers in the camp, but a top faller, in a good stand could drop 100,000 sbf of logs in a day. Which, by the way, was 6 1/2 hours including travel to and from the work site. When the piece-work incentive went, they had to hire more fallers.
The saws were, IIRC, Husquavarnas, but that was just who won the contract.

TGTool
08-02-2011, 07:41 PM
I was amused at the repeated "three to five seconds to sharpen a chain." Yeah, not counting the time it took to stop the saw, install the sharpener, [sharpen for 3 - 5 seconds], stop the saw, remove the sharpener, toss the sharpener, and re-start the saw. It's still fast, I'll grant that, but their few second theme was really stretching it.

SteveF
08-02-2011, 07:44 PM
I found the diamond dressing tooth rather funny.

How about diamond coated chainsaw blades :) Sure would keep it from getting dulled on rocks/metal.

Don't think you can get a diamond coated one but they do make chain with carbide teeth. I priced one about 5 years ago and it was $130 (18" bar) and needed a diamond coated wheel to resharpen.

Steve

justanengineer
08-02-2011, 08:30 PM
Well, I spent a good part of Sunday sharpening cutting teeth with a hand held grinder and then a die grinder to get the depth gauges down to spec; so this looks interesting to me. I wish the demo in link 2 showed a close up of the chips to see how large they were.


I would suggest you learn to sharpen a chain properly with a file, or spend the $8 and buy another chain. Ive sharpened quite a few, having learned as a teenager in the sawmill, and rescued quite a few that were basically destroyed for customers. It never took more than 40 minutes with a file.

I love power sharpeners. Growing up around professional woodsmen I noticed that the guys with sharpeners were always homeowners, and usually had a bar that was far from flat.

Peter.
08-02-2011, 08:36 PM
Don't think you can get a diamond coated one but they do make chain with carbide teeth. I priced one about 5 years ago and it was $130 (18" bar) and needed a diamond coated wheel to resharpen.

Steve

I first used a diamond coated chainsaw about 15 years ago to cut some stone columns. Our company has a couple of them right now, don't get used much as they have a short HAV exposure limit and the chains are expensive too.

SteveF
08-02-2011, 08:47 PM
I would suggest you learn to sharpen a chain properly with a file, or spend the $8 and buy another chain. Ive sharpened quite a few, having learned as a teenager in the sawmill, and rescued quite a few that were basically destroyed for customers. It never took more than 40 minutes with a file.

I love power sharpeners. Growing up around professional woodsmen I noticed that the guys with sharpeners were always homeowners, and usually had a bar that was far from flat.

I know how to sharpen chains and was sharpening a pile of them. In far less time than 40 minutes each.

Obviously it's been a heck of long time since you did this since you think you can buy a new chain for $8.

Steve

sasquatch
08-02-2011, 09:03 PM
My new 18inch bar chains were around $25.00.

I never cut commercially, just firewood, but used to enjoy filing my chains, it was a good feeling to rip into a hardwood log and see the bar drop through quickly spitting out lots of sawdust chips.

Just an off topic note:

Back in the 60.s Mcullogh used to sell an electric start chainsaw,(battery pack was inside the lower handle,) for a few years,,, with all the battery powered tools now wonder if there any made at present?

lynnl
08-02-2011, 09:06 PM
I've never used, or even seen for that matter, one of the power sharpeners.
I did buy one of the little holders for the files, that has angle guide lines on it to supposedly help you maintain the correct angle.
But I found I could do just as well holding the file freehand. I'd guess it takes me about 8-10 minutes ordinarily to sharpen one (16" bar).

I'm sure a professional would do it a lot better than me. But mine always cut a lot better afterward, which is my sole objective.

Like they say, "it ain't rocket surgery."

bruto
08-02-2011, 09:27 PM
This is not really new. I recall some 25 -25 years ago there were saws that incorporated a sharpening feature, using special chains that were ground on top like that. There was a name for those type cutters/chains - seems like they were called "barracuda", or something like that.

With those saws, the sharpener was in the powerhead.

I remember one of my neighbors at the time had one.Sears used to sell saws with the Barracuda system, also known as "power sharp," I think. I'm not sure, but I think that was an Oregon setup as well. The top surface of the tooth came up at an angle, so that the stone would grind a bevel off it. Pretty clever, but I gather it was never really all that effective, and the chains were more expensive. I don't know how the automatic system handled the depth gauges, but I'm guessing that hitting the chain at the proper curvature allowed the stone to do both.

Considering how easy and cheap it is to sharpen a conventional chain, and how much easier and not much less cheap it is simply to own two chains, it seems like one of those useless inventions like automatic shift on a bicycle.

Scottike
08-02-2011, 10:04 PM
It's just another gimmick to enable the folks that can't or won't learn how to file their own chains. Filing your own chain is when I take a few moments to examine the rest of saw as well .. look for cracked or missing pieces, make sure the chain is tensioned properly, the oiler is full and pumping, and clean out the chips and generally look everything over . I would venture a guess that saw owners using that system will be sending their saws to the shop a lot more often. But then again, they probably already do.

doctor demo
08-02-2011, 10:24 PM
I found the diamond dressing tooth rather funny.

How about diamond coated chainsaw blades :) Sure would keep it from getting dulled on rocks/metal.

Here ya go.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_CBpJNxdag


Steve

justanengineer
08-03-2011, 12:55 AM
I know how to sharpen chains and was sharpening a pile of them. In far less time than 40 minutes each.

Obviously it's been a heck of long time since you did this since you think you can buy a new chain for $8.

Steve

40 minutes was for a horribly dull chain that I was volunteered to sharpen. On a saw that was properly maintained and not abused, I can sharpen a chain by hand in 10 minutes. Not sure why anyone would be sharpening a "pile" of chains. Everybody I know who does any serious cutting simply has a spare saw and a felling saw. With three saws, you should never need a pile of chains. Use them, maintain them, toss them.

Regarding how long since I bought a chain, I bought two of them from the Stihl dealer back in NY in December. Stihl brand, I have one of the smaller professional saws (MS 360) and use a very aggressive chain, $8 each chain on special, $11 each regularly for a chain to fit a 25" bar. I would say you have a bit to learn if youre paying significantly more than that.

jackary
08-03-2011, 06:48 AM
When I sharpen a chainsaw I generally get good results but I have had a couple of instances where the the saw has a bias to one side, I have reversed the chainbar but the problem prevails. I cannot see the error in the blade but it must be there -what am I doing wrong? When this has happened I have just replaced the chain and the problem goes away.
Alan

Black Forest
08-03-2011, 07:20 AM
Jackery check to make sure the chain is tight enough and when they start to cut on a slant you need to resharpen the chain. Make sure if you use a file to count how many strokes you make and do the same number on each edge.

bruto
08-03-2011, 11:11 AM
I've always had pretty good luck with files, but after many years of filing I got one of those little 12 volt grinders with a little cylindrical stone, and I must say that I really like that option. It's always a bit awkward filing both sides of a chain evenly, simply because my right-handed bias favors one direction over the other, and because the chain tends to deflect a little on the bar unless it's so tight it's uncomfortable to rotate. Anyway, if you find filing a bit tedious, you might consider the grinder.

Krunch
08-03-2011, 12:50 PM
I sharpen by hand with a file. It's a lot faster, easier and more effective than I ever expected it to be.