PDA

View Full Version : I went to an auction today..



The Artful Bodger
06-16-2012, 01:55 AM
So-called 'surplus' sale of various stuff including a lot of workshop equipment along with commercial kitchen, entertaining and general household goods. Mostly new but a bit marked up maybe from having been on display for some time.

I even put a bid in for an engine crane, $150, the same crane sells retails for $300 or so. Bidding started at $250 and it went for retail price, more or less.

So why do people bother? I would always buy retail before paying the same for the same goods at an auction where there is no support, not even assurance that the goods are complete even.

Daft!:rolleyes:

oldtiffie
06-16-2012, 02:05 AM
It can be pretty much the same here at times as there is keener bidding for the item you want - it is with me anyway. A lot of auctions/"sales" have been picked over as well prior to the sale.

I never see anything like as big or as often as there seems to be in the USA and the UK and Canada too.

mike4
06-16-2012, 02:31 AM
It can be pretty much the same here at times as there is keener bidding for the item you want - it is with me anyway. A lot of auctions/"sales" have been picked over as well prior to the sale.

I never see anything like as big or as often as there seems to be in the USA and the UK and Canada too.
Keep an eye out for end of project or mine site sales they do have bargains at times particularly if in a remote area , usually just serious bidders are willing to travel and arrange for freight .
Michael

Carld
06-16-2012, 11:02 AM
When it sells for near new price or more it's usually because the bidders don't know the actual retail price or want that article real bad.

When I go to auctions I try to know what I want and what it's worth and I put a limit on it and stop there.

On ebay I decide what my top bid is and make that bid and let the site do my bidding up to my max and I am out if it goes higher. I just don't understand the logic of waiting to the last minute and bidding. Either you know what you will pay or you don't and you just like to bid.

Lu47Dan
06-16-2012, 11:36 AM
Yep, knowing the new price for an item at an auction sale, inventory reduction sale or the local flea market can save you money.
At an auction sale, I take into account the wear and tear on an item and deduct for it. I may not win but I have at times push someone into a bidding war on a piece that pushed it above new price. Then I would drop out, I did that once and then bought the same item six months later at about 1/3 of what they paid for it. :eek:
At an inventory reduction sale, I will try not to bid until I study the crowd a little, sometimes it is not even worth hanging around to bid as people will bid everything up to prices the company wanted in the store. :confused:
Flea markets are sometimes the best when it comes to deals, but you need to be able to dicker with the owners to get what you are willing to pay.
I dickered on a piece for a friends car at a flea market one time, he had set a budget on what he was willing to pay and the owner of the part wanted twice that, I found it and made an offer on it the owner laughed at me, I told him see you later, and he would be hauling the part home, I stopped at his stand at the end of the last day and got it for what my friend was willing to pay. :D I can not blame the guy for wanting to hold out for a higher price then I was willing to pay, but he was not bullheaded enough to stick to his price when I was the only person to make an offer on the part over the whole weekend.
Dan.

KIMFAB
06-16-2012, 11:40 AM
Go to a police auction if you want to see real ridiculous prices for stuff.

Bikes and guns often go for more than retail.

flylo
06-16-2012, 11:45 AM
When it sells for near new price or more it's usually because the bidders don't know the actual retail price or want that article real bad.

When I go to auctions I try to know what I want and what it's worth and I put a limit on it and stop there.

On ebay I decide what my top bid is and make that bid and let the site do my bidding up to my max and I am out if it goes higher. I just don't understand the logic of waiting to the last minute and bidding. Either you know what you will pay or you don't and you just like to bid.

I snipe on ebay because you wouldn't believe how many people just bid the opening amount. I as you do bid the most I'll pay, I just do it in the last seconds so as not to get in a bidding war like a live auction.

lazlo
06-16-2012, 11:57 AM
On ebay I decide what my top bid is and make that bid and let the site do my bidding up to my max and I am out if it goes higher. I just don't understand the logic of waiting to the last minute and bidding.

Because you're playing poker with all your cards showing. If you throw a bid in early in an Ebay auction, I can pretty much guarantee you're not going to win, not matter what your bid is :p
Human nature dictates that other bidders will nip at your high bid, trying to figure out how much you actually bid on it. That's why Ebay's motto, quoted by countless sellers, is:
"Bid early, bid often!"

Then there's the issue that many auctions, both live and Ebay, are not completely fair and honest. Shills, "buyback" deals with the auction house, ...

lakeside53
06-16-2012, 12:00 PM
I snipe on ebay because you wouldn't believe how many people just bid the opening amount. I as you do bid the most I'll pay, I just do it in the last seconds so as not to get in a bidding war like a live auction.


I also snipe everything because of what you said, and... because there are other snipers;)

toolmaker76
06-16-2012, 12:04 PM
I was at an estate auction not too long ago, everything went for new price or more. Could not imagine that the people buying this stuff knew what they were doing.

In order to be a good deal for me, it has to be well BELOW retail. If I am going to get above half, then I am going to figure it would be better to buy new instead.

danlb
06-16-2012, 12:05 PM
On ebay I decide what my top bid is and make that bid and let the site do my bidding up to my max and I am out if it goes higher. I just don't understand the logic of waiting to the last minute and bidding. Either you know what you will pay or you don't and you just like to bid.


That is a VERY smart way to do it. If it is worth $10 to you, then that should be your maximum bid, not a penny more or less. Auctions depend on the second guessing that happens when there is competition. When you are outbid the normal reaction is to try to "win" by bidding a little higher.

The last moment bid works very well. It lets you offer what YOU think is a good price without triggering the "I have to win" reaction in your competition.

eBay does not like sniping. It tends to keep the purchase price down. That impacts their cut of the action.

Dan

lazlo
06-16-2012, 12:15 PM
Auctions depend on the second guessing that happens when there is competition. When you are outbid the normal reaction is to try to "win" by bidding a little higher.

Game Theory -- equally applicable to nuclear war and auction bidding ;). Google "the Prisoner's Dilemma" -- it's a great explanation of sniping.


eBay does not like sniping. It tends to keep the purchase price down. That impacts their cut of the action.

Where do you work again Dan? :D :p

lakeside53
06-16-2012, 12:53 PM
Ebay says "big early and big high". LOL...

danlb
06-16-2012, 03:51 PM
Game Theory -- equally applicable to nuclear war and auction bidding ;). Google "the Prisoner's Dilemma" -- it's a great explanation of sniping.



Where do you work again Dan? :D :p


Yes, you almost caught me, but as of yesterday, I'm FREEEEEEEEE.

Ebay had changed a bit too much for my tastes, so I got out.

I don't think that the prisoner's dilemma matches sniping. Sniping is the practice where you CAN decide on your price without regard for what you think others will bid. You don't have a chance to place a second bid and neither does your competition. That means you are not tempted to outbid them.


Dan

lazlo
06-16-2012, 04:07 PM
I don't think that the prisoner's dilemma matches sniping.


Shubik's Dollar Auction (http://www.heretical.com/pound/dollar.html)


"Shubik's dollar auction demonstrates the difficulty of using von Neumann and Morgenstern's game theory in certain situations. The dollar auction game is conceptually simple and contains no surprise features or hidden information. It ought to be a "textbook case" of game theory.

It ought to be a profitable game, too. The game dangles a potential profit of up to a dollar in front of the bidders, and that profit is no illusion. Besides, no one is forced to make a bid. Surely a rational player can't lose. The players who bid up a dollar to many times its value must be acting "irrationally."

It is more difficult to decide where they go wrong. Maybe the problem is that there is no obvious place to draw the line between a rational bid and an irrational one. Shubik wrote of the dollar auction that "a game theory analysis alone will probably never be adequate to explain such a process."

William Poundstone, Prisoner's Dilemma, Doubleday, NY 1992, pp. 280-282."

The Artful Bodger
06-16-2012, 05:28 PM
I never buy on Ebay, our local auction is Trade Me where sniping is not effective. It works pretty much like a live auctioneer and bidding does not close until two minutes have passed with no bids.

ulav8r
06-16-2012, 08:26 PM
Check your competition closely at a live auction. I was bidding on a table at an estate auction years ago. The person I was first bidding against dropped out but someone else was then bidding. After bidding it up several more times, the auctioneer and I realized that I was bidding against my wife. Luckily, the auctioneer let us have it at my last bid that caused the original competition to back out.

The Artful Bodger
06-16-2012, 09:45 PM
Sometimes at a live auction you can wind up bidding against an imaginary bidder at the back of the room.

If you realise this is the case just suddenly stop, if the auctioneer tries to get you to take it just say, "Nah, give it to the guy at the back of the room", that usually gets a good laugh and he probably wont try that with you again.

CCWKen
06-16-2012, 10:01 PM
I never buy on Ebay, our local auction is Trade Me where sniping is not effective. It works pretty much like a live auctioneer and bidding does not close until two minutes have passed with no bids.
It's the same here with a near-local online auction site but it's five minutes. The newbies think they're snipping by waiting to bid but they catch on. :rolleyes:

You do have to be aware of prices. Much of the stuff here also goes for new prices or above. I go in with a price in mind and have a maximum. If it goes over, I pass. I've watched two or more bidders take an item well over what a brand new one would cost. I guess they just get caught-up in the frenzy and need to win.

The Artful Bodger
06-16-2012, 10:26 PM
Our local on-line auction has an auto-bid function. Supposing I am willing to go to $100 but the bidding is currently at $20. I put in my auto bid and the system wil 'bid' $21 on my behalf right until it reaches my maximum.

So, if I see something I like in an auction closing next week I can put in an auto bid without betraying my hand to other bidders.

Boostinjdm
06-16-2012, 11:22 PM
I went to an estate auction today. Got outbid on some measuring tools. One of them was a mitutoyo set of mics from 0-6" good to a tenth with standards in fitted box. I quit bidding at what I thought was reasonable. Somebody else picked up the bid and beat out my competition. A few minutes later one of my customers walked up and gave them to me. They are on more or less permanent loan. If I move away I have to return them. If he dies I get to keep them.
I must be doing something right to have customers buying me tools. I think the final bid was about $175. My Enco catalog says the set goes new for $812.

lazlo
06-17-2012, 12:48 AM
It's the same here with a near-local online auction site but it's five minutes. The newbies think they're snipping by waiting to bid but they catch on. :rolleyes:

Gunbroker has a 15 minute rule, but everyone snipes anyway :) Seriously, on a 6 day auction, everyone waits 'till 15 minutes before the auction end, and puts in their bids. Then they look and see if the high bid was higher than what they're willing to pay, and then there's a second round of bidding, and then the auction dies out after 15 minutes. I've never seen an extended bidding duel on GB.

Bidspotter does the same thing.

Hopefuldave
06-17-2012, 08:08 AM
I think you have to bid up to *your* valuation and no more - otherwise you'll only win because you're paying more than anyone else thinks it's worth... It works for me ;)

Dave H. (the other one)

SteveF
06-17-2012, 10:08 AM
I don't go to live auctions any more but when I did I always took along some catalogs so I could look up the retail prices and KNOW what an item was worth. Today an Ipad or smart phone would suffice. Yes, I also saw items in very good condition sell for more than retail.

Steve