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darryl
01-04-2013, 12:14 AM
My grinder is starting to make noise again. I had it apart about 10 yrs ago, cleaned and lubed the bearings. It's been good since, but now I'm thinking it's time to change the setup.

I never liked the setup where the motor housing is right there between the wheels. I'd rather have more space there, so I'm considering the idea of making an arbor to mount the wheels onto, fitting ball bearings of course, and using a flat belt drive. This would give me more room to maneuver a workpiece around the wheels, which would be my main goal. The flat belt drive 'pulley' would be fairly small in diameter so it wouldn't take up much of the space I'd be gaining. Wheel guards would be in place of course. It might make sense to change the wheels at this time also- my green wheel is getting pretty small, and the other one is worn down as well. These are 6 inch wheels, and I'd probably step up to 8 inch wheels.

Of course, this gives me more options- I could space the wheels further apart, or I could even mount them separately. It's coming near time to upgrade my cutoff wheels also, so another option is to create a 'grinding center', where each type of wheel or disc can simply be raised out of the way or lowered into position, where it would automatically catch torque from the belt. If I can raise one tool, then lower another one- everything latching solidly into place- then I'd use a good motor and create a solid 'grinding station' out of it.

I often go from cutoff disc to grinding wheel to drum sander in the course of preparing a workpiece, so each change would have to be fast and trouble-free. I could use one motor with multiple pulleys- each belt would clear the driven pulley entirely when that particular wheel or disc is not being used. That's the idea anyway. My shop doesn't have any more room for machines, so if I can combine four or five 'heads' into one machine, that would be great.

Just fishing for ideas.

davidh
01-04-2013, 10:51 AM
i kicked around the idea of a carasoual type grinding center that i saw in a post somewhere. three grinders on a center post mounted turret arrangement. after careful consideration ie how long would it take to build, how often would a REALLY use it etc, i just mounted my grinders on studs on the work bench that were just slipped into pipe holders that were fixed in the bench top. i can remove each of them, pull the studs out and the edge of the bench is flatass clean. i did discover that i really didn't use my grinders enuf to justify anything outlandish. my most useful tool is the air die grinder (4 or 5 of them) with various attachments on them, and easy to change. . . .

just my humble opinion. . . . and i will be watching for what ideas others have. . . .

darryl
01-04-2013, 08:11 PM
I use my drum sander and the cutoff disc every day, several times each. I don't use the grinding stones as much, but if I lost the use of them I'd definitely be missing something.

I'm willing to put the time into building the machine since I'd see the benefit right away. There are lots of options to consider, not the least of which is how to power each tool. With the right sheet metal belt guard, as each tool is stowed in the idle position, the belt would be forced to disengage fully from its drive pulley. That's a configuration I can work out- once I have it for one tool, it could be the same for the rest of them.

My cutoff discs each have a spindle which is in two parts- they nest together with the disc between them. A bearing is placed on each side, and a drive pulley is sandwiched to one side. A fork of some kind is all that's needed to hold the bearings, so if the fork can also pivot to raise the disc into position and lock it there- well, it's not rocket science. In this machine the mountings for both spindles have some adjustment room so the belt tension can be set. I was worried that the two-piece spindle arrangement might prove to be vibration-prone or otherwise troublesome, but it has been working well for many years. I'm going to come up with a design for the 'multi-machine' which will use this same spindle concept. I think as long as the spindle can come together and mate with itself solidly, the alignment will be assured, and as far as mounting the grinding wheels, I'll make sure there's a compressible washer of some kind to secure the wheels from rotating on the spindle. Mounting a wheel without interfering with the assembly of the spindle should be a simple matter of selecting appropriate shims.

I'll continue to develop this in my head until it reaches the 'go ahead and build something' stage. Any more ideas would be welcome.

dian
01-08-2013, 01:49 PM
i kicked around the idea of a carasoual type grinding center that i saw in a post somewhere. three grinders on a center post mounted turret arrangement. after careful consideration ie how long would it take to build, how often would a REALLY use it etc, i just mounted my grinders on studs on the work bench that were just slipped into pipe holders that were fixed in the bench top. i can remove each of them, pull the studs out and the edge of the bench is flatass clean. i did discover that i really didn't use my grinders enuf to justify anything outlandish. my most useful tool is the air die grinder (4 or 5 of them) with various attachments on them, and easy to change. . . .

just my humble opinion. . . . and i will be watching for what ideas others have. . . .

would you have a Picture of that?

Ray Sidell
01-08-2013, 02:54 PM
darryl,
Take a look at this one on UK ebay right now.
Ray
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/britan-lathe-tool-grinder-/350638563119?pt=UK_BOI_Metalworking_Milling_Weldin g_Metalworking_Supplies_ET&hash=item51a3afdf2f

darryl
01-08-2013, 06:11 PM
Hmm- one thing I hadn't considered- mounting three or so wheels on a common shaft and driving it from one end. It would not be difficult to mount a few pairs of collars on the shaft, and make one collar of each pair adjustable so a wheel can be gripped. Space them anywhere along the shaft, along with bearings where desired. I'll have to give that some consideration.

Rosco-P
01-08-2013, 06:49 PM
Hmm- one thing I hadn't considered- mounting three or so wheels on a common shaft and driving it from one end. It would not be difficult to mount a few pairs of collars on the shaft, and make one collar of each pair adjustable so a wheel can be gripped. Space them anywhere along the shaft, along with bearings where desired. I'll have to give that some consideration.

What you are sort of describing in your post are the unit made (or were made) by Landis for the shoe
repair trade. One or more tiers of long horizontal spindles with multiple sanding and buffing drums on them. Might just look for one of them to adapt.

darryl
01-08-2013, 07:57 PM
Wow- there's some interesting machinery made for just about everything produced, including shoes.

Long ago we used to have a rock polishing setup. That was a line shaft with multiple drums and wheels on it, etc. I used that quite a lot in those days, and that's where I got the idea for my drum sander.

I really have no room width-wise for any such machine now. That's why I'm trying to come up with a compact unit that can spin several wheels, discs, etc. My original idea was to mount each wheel or disc on its own arbor, with a bearing on each side, and with a driving pulley on one side or the other. I might be as well served, or better served, by putting both bearings on one side with the driving pulley, then mounting the wheel onto the end as is normally done. I would have multiple spindles then, and they could actually all be driven simultaneously via a single belt. It would make for a rather large vertically oriented carousel, taking up little side to side room but probably sticking out from the wall by 3 ft or more- don't know if I can handle this, but I'll see if I can make room. Because I usually use at least two of the wheels in succession, it wouldn't be such a bad thing to have them all spinning at the same time. The unused ones would definitely have to be guarded, and the rotation of the carousel would need to be fast and secure.

Of course, only one of the wheels could be used at any time, but with just me here that's not a big deal. There would also be a slower spin-up time, but I also plan to use a somewhat more powerful motor than any of them have right now.

Ok, the carousel thing- maybe it doesn't have to be a large rotating thing- maybe it can be linear. If I mount all the spindles spaced out along a straight steel post, I could raise or lower the post to expose each wheel in turn through an opening in a sheet metal cabinet. The cabinet would be the guard, and the opening would expose whichever wheel I chose. Hmm-

Doozer
01-08-2013, 08:03 PM
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Schauer-Speed-Lathe-with-Air-Collet-Closer-5c-Nose-/00/s/NDgwWDY0MA==/$%28KGrHqF,%21q8FBIS30rZlBQhz34iV2Q%7E%7E60_3.JPG
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Crozier-Speed-Lathe-Model-30DC-for-Polishing-Deburring-5C-air-collet-variable-/01/!BnCJ6D!BGk~$%28KGrHqEH-D0EtrQGqcPOBLh1rGj4j!~~_12.JPG

Get a speed lathe. Some have 5C collet capacity.
Put your various wheels and brushes on arbors
and interchange them as needed.

--Doozer

Rosco-P
01-08-2013, 09:37 PM
No room for something like this: http://www.pilgrimshoemachine.com/new.html

darryl
01-09-2013, 01:16 AM
I have 30 inches in total for width for the machine to fit. The two grinding wheels would be fine side by side, but the cutoff discs need more room either side to handle longer stock. The drum sander need more room around it than it has now, and it's currently on it's own, except for being sandwiched into the 30 inches with the other machine. I like the common shaft idea, but it's not very workable in this situation.

I'm looking seriously now at the vertical idea. All the arbors would stick out to the right from a vertical post, each would be displaced front to back to bring the working surface of the device to about the same position as all of them. The post would carry all the arbors, idler rollers, and the motor, plus individually made rests. The complete post assembly would ride up and down on a base post and be counterweighted for easy action. One handle could turn to loosen it and serve to position it. If I do it right, I could probably use any three tools at once without having to raise or lower the assembly. I think each tool would have it's own guard, and there would be a complete rear guard box to contain swarf. Any tool lowered below usable height would drop behind a front guard, and any tool raised above a certain point would rise inside an upper front guard. I don't want what's left of my hair to get sucked into a rotating device, and I don't need any surprises in the zipper area- not in the workshop anyway :)

Each wheel or disc will have it's own guard/containment housing, and in particular the grinding wheels would have something very substantial for this.

All the wheels and discs are fairly narrow, but the sanding drum is 4 inches wide and so will determine the width of the assembly. If I can get it all within about 8 inches I'll be happy. The base will be wider of course and properly made for stability.

dian
01-09-2013, 01:07 PM
why dont you just get a motor, replace the bearings with precision ones (if at all) and make provisions for changing the wheels/discs/drumms quickly?

darryl
01-09-2013, 09:28 PM
One motor, quick-change wheels- it's a viable idea. That's the speed lathe that Doozer posted. I think I'd find that the time to change wheels would be longer than the time spent doing the grinding most of the time. I doubt that I'd be happy with that. It means storing each wheel separately, stopping the motor completely between changes, cleaning the arbor surfaces well enough each time they are exchanged, putting the workpiece down to do this then having to pick it up again and getting it re-oriented in your hands. I'm not terribly impatient, but for a quick touch-up of a drill bit on two separate wheels, it would be very inconvenient.