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View Full Version : Seeking Opinions on new Grizzly lathe



Krunch
01-18-2013, 08:41 AM
Hello, all,

I am in the market for my first metal lathe. (I've never used one before.) I had ben considering, for a long time, the Grizzly G4003G, but when I got my 2013 Grizzly catalog, I discovered they offer a new "version" of it with an enclosed gearbox.

I went to the Grizzly website and compared specs on the two machines, and they are largely the same, with a few differences, mainly in threading capabilities, tailstock and lowest speed.

Can anyone compare the specs (below) and tell me whether there are any major drawbacks on the newer model? As I said, I'm completely new to machining – so new that I feel that I don't know enough to buy a used lathe – but I sure don't want to end up kicking myself for buying the wrong machine, either.

Thank you in advance for any advice.

P.S. It looks like the Grizzly website got things confused...the G0750G is the one with the enclosed gearbox, not the G4003G ... I don't know whether the other specs are "flopped" as well or not!

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/543/grizzlylathecomparison.jpg

loose nut
01-18-2013, 09:59 AM
I went to their website and I can't find any reference to a G0750g model lathe. Could be my bad eyes though.

Looking at the sheets, as I see it the main difference is in the threading/feed selection. To get the enclosed feed box you pay for it with a lose in the threading range and feed range. The cross slide travel and tail stock travel is also less. To me the G4003g looks to be a better machine for that size.

Don't worry about the Norton (open) style gearbox, they have been a standard for about 100 years are fairly quiet, if maintained and work fine. The enclosed type may shift faster but that doesn't offset what you loose.

Krunch
01-18-2013, 10:14 AM
Thank you, Loose Nut.

Here are links to the two lathes in question:

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Gunsmith-s-Bench-Top-Lathe-with-Stand/G4003G

http://www.grizzly.com/products/12-x-36-Gunsmithing-Lathe/G0750G

tlfamm
01-18-2013, 12:31 PM
Ignoring the QC gearboxes, the lathes are quite similar - and it seems unlikely from a marketing point of view that both lathes will continue to be offered.

Will the newer G0750G replace the older G4003G?


Something to think about, because Grizzly's support for discontinued products may not be consistent with the image of themselves as a paragon of parts availability.

(As indicated by the slim-to-none support of the discontinued G0484 RF45 mill.)

Guido
01-18-2013, 12:51 PM
tlfamm X 2, or 6, or 8, or--------

--G

Ohio Mike
01-18-2013, 05:01 PM
If you're considering purchase soon, you should check with Grizzly to verify available stock. They don't order these everyday, they come by the container full and anything "new" may not even be in the states yet.

Jess13
01-18-2013, 09:07 PM
Something else the bed width of the G4003G is wider than the newer version. The newer version looks like the old standby casting of the Harberfieght,ENCO and other imports that used to be sold.


Now in all honesty it is very hard to even begin to know if one is better than the other until you can get you hands on the new one to see. One thing we do know is the G4003G style machine has been doing good for many people. They have two other models of this same casting (G4002 and G4003) that are very popular so I dont know if they would disscontinue the G4003G version. The only way to know is call and ask. If they are goign to keep both version G lathes then no harm in waiting to see results of the newer one. But IMHO its the same ole gearbox of old and nothing new unless changes have been made. It may be inclosed, but I am not sure if I would call it better.



Jess

Dr Stan
01-18-2013, 10:38 PM
You can get virtually the same machine from Enco for less http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INSRAR2&PMAKA=510-2584&PMPXNO=9033434 or here: http://www.blueridgemachinery.com/machinery/shop_fox/m1112_gunsmithing_lathe_12%22_x_36%22.html or here: http://www.harborfreight.com/12-inch-x-36-inch-heavy-duty-geared-head-precision-gap-bed-metalworking-lathe-65044.html

They're all pretty much the same, all Chinese imports. With Horror Freight you can at least go to a store and look at their machinery to get an idea as to what you're getting.

Ohio Mike
01-19-2013, 10:52 AM
With Horror Freight you can at least go to a store and look at their machinery to get an idea as to what you're getting.

That's a crap shoot. Locally here the stores don't stock lathes or milling machines. What each store does stock seems to vary widely. For instance when HF still sold the knock off Baldor carbide grinder one of the Columbus stores stocked it and the other didn't. So if you want to see something and your store doesn't have it you may want to check nearby stores assuming there are any.

oxford
01-19-2013, 10:59 AM
You may also be able to use a discount coupon for the harbor freight as well.

tdkkart
01-19-2013, 11:07 AM
That's a crap shoot. Locally here the stores don't stock lathes or milling machines. What each store does stock seems to vary widely. For instance when HF still sold the knock off Baldor carbide grinder one of the Columbus stores stocked it and the other didn't. So if you want to see something and your store doesn't have it you may want to check nearby stores assuming there are any.

Quite true, our local store doesn't seem to carry anything that would take more than 1 or 2 people to pick up. The last time I was in there they didn't even have any of the now infamous large toolboxes on the floor. I saw something the other day that made me think HF wasn't selling the metal working stuff at all anymore??

Dr Stan
01-19-2013, 11:24 AM
That's a crap shoot. Locally here the stores don't stock lathes or milling machines.

If you bother to actually read my post I said machinery, not lathes or mills. That way one an get an impression of the HF quality, or lack thereof.

Krunch
01-19-2013, 03:57 PM
Thank you for all the replies.

Are these Grizzly lathes really as junky as some of the other HFT machinery? I've never seen any of the HF lathes, but some of their other stuff doesn't impress me as being all that great. (Though I do buy a lot of their stuff.)

GKman
01-19-2013, 06:07 PM
Thank you for all the replies.

Are these Grizzly lathes really as junky as some of the other HFT machinery? I've never seen any of the HF lathes, but some of their other stuff doesn't impress me as being all that great. (Though I do buy a lot of their stuff.)

No. Many satisfied users on this board, including me.

Ron of Va
01-19-2013, 06:17 PM
When people talk bad about Chinese stuff, this is the kind of stuff they mean.

I opened up the headstock of my Grizzly G4003G lathe I purchased in August 2008. I found that the power shaft from the pulley has a bearing on the far end of it and is installed in a casting in the back center of the headstock.

The bearing is not fully supported by the casting. It seems like the shaft is ˝”-3/4” too short. See the photo.

I contacted Grizzly by email, and sent them this photo. They called me on the telephone and told me that all the G4003G lathes were like that. He said he even pulled the cover off the one he had there. (I don’t know why they didn’t want to put it in writing in a return email.) I like the lathe, I just don’t like Shiite like this.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/GrizzlyBearingProblem.jpg

rock_breaker
01-19-2013, 08:33 PM
I have a similar opinion as Ron of VA, On my 9092G lathe the degree marks for rotating the compund are on top of the cross slide requiring the use of a compass to get the 29-1/2 degree setting for threading. There are other "shortcuts on the 9092G but it is not of the same class to start with. The G0750G motor is rated 3.5 amps more current draw which relates in round figures here to about $0.11 more per hour. The G0750G runs slower in most if not all functions so with the heavier motor does that mean it has more torque?

If I were able to do so I would change to the G0750G.

Enjoy your new lathe and hobby.

Ray

huntinguy
01-20-2013, 12:00 PM
http://www.harborfreight.com/12-inch-x-36-inch-heavy-duty-geared-head-precision-gap-bed-metalworking-lathe-65044.html

I have that one. It is not as heavy as some of the earlier Taiwanese lathes that I have had. I would say it is equivalent to the old Atlas 10 inch lathes as far as power and performance.

Seems to me like there was a very good write up in the Homeshop Machinist magazine last year about these lathes. Might want to check the archives.

dian
01-20-2013, 12:32 PM
the 750 seems to have a cast iron stand. (really?)

the question is, how are you going to machine small parts with a speed of 1400 rpm?

tlfamm
01-20-2013, 02:39 PM
@Ron of Va

I just popped the lid on my G4003G headstock (purchased June, 2010):

The shaft & bearing in question look just like yours. I'd like the bearing set 1/4" further into the boss, centering it (or 3/8" further in, flush with the right side of the boss). And the shaft would be lengthened to suit.

I guess over a run of 100 lathes, $25 was saved in raw materials: brilliant economy (not).

Toolguy
01-20-2013, 02:51 PM
the 750 seems to have a cast iron stand. (really?)

the question is, how are you going to machine small parts with a speed of 1400 rpm?

You can make all the parts you want at 1400 RPM. My lathe only goes to 1500 and I seldom go over 1200. Cutting tools still cut at lower RPM. I make a lot of parts that are 1/8" or less diam.

tlfamm
01-20-2013, 03:07 PM
the 750 seems to have a cast iron stand. (really?)

the question is, how are you going to machine small parts with a speed of 1400 rpm?

The G4003G definitely has a cast iron stand - maybe they offer the same stand for the G0750G? *

He could get somewhat higher speed (1800 RPM) in a lathe similar to the G0750G here:

http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1236.html

(Note the D1-4 versus D1-5 spindle).



* Edit: the stands are not the same. So the new G0750G is similar (but not identical) to the G4003G, and they have similar (but not identical) stands, and (I presume): similar, but not identical parts inventories. This is retail madness, unless the new product is intended to replace the old.

Rosco-P
01-20-2013, 03:57 PM
You may also be able to use a discount coupon for the harbor freight as well.

Does using one of Horror Freight's 20% coupons make you 20% less disappointed with the quality of the chinee junk they sell?

Dr Stan
01-20-2013, 08:10 PM
Does using one of Horror Freight's 20% coupons make you 20% less disappointed with the quality of the chinee junk they sell?

Careful Rosco, you'll be accused of being xenophobic like I have been.:p

michigan doug
01-21-2013, 04:06 PM
I got the 14 x 40 grizzly lathe. Overall, I am highly satisfied with it and think that it had a very good cost/benefit ratio.

If I could have found the same performance for the same money in an american made lathe, I would have. I looked for a long time and never found that magic combination.

Different strokes, different folks.

doug

jmarkwolf
01-21-2013, 08:43 PM
Congratulations Doug!

Michigan Mark.

J Tiers
01-21-2013, 09:22 PM
Borrowing from my post in a different thread, I might mention that in common with ALL the "chasian" lathes, back gears are missing...... So the slowest speed of the machine is rather faster than one would like, both for coarse threading, and, more importantly, for large diameter work approaching the max swing.

The slowest speed for that machine at max diameter is almost 200 feet per minute, or double the speed for HSS tooling and ordinary CRS material. For alloy and tool steels, it is about 4x the "good" speed. And the machine doesn't have the power to use carbide effectively, although carbide would be OK at speeds like that.

Fine if your work is no larger than 3 to 4 inches diameter. And that machine actually has a good minimum speed, comparatively, it is 60 rpm. Some others in the size class have 150rpm minimum, leading to a max diameter fpm of 430 (!).

I just discovered that the "Precision Mathews" brand has as low as 25 rpm in certain of their 14" machines, with the "V" option. That is pretty decent.

Krunch
01-22-2013, 10:14 AM
Thank you all, again, for the helpful replies.

Unfortunately, not having ever even used a lathe, I don't even know what questions to ask, but I'm getting somewhat of an education by reading between the lines.

I appreciate you all taking the time and trouble to try to help me.