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ibewgypsie
04-21-2004, 06:26 PM
US Preparing for Military Draft in Spring 2005
by Adam Stutz • Wednesday January 28, 2004 at 09:50 AM
The current agenda of the US federal government is to reinstate the draft in order to staff up for a protracted war on "terrorism." Pending legislation in the House and Senate (twin bills S 89 and HR 163) would time the program so the draft could begin at early as Spring 2005 -- conveniently just after the 2004 presidential election!

Reinstatement of the draft

Dear Friends and Family,

I urge you to read the article below on the current agenda of the federal government to reinstate the draft in order to staff up for a protracted war on "terrorism."

Pending legislation in the House and Senate (twin bills S 89 and HR 163) would time the program so the draft could begin at early as Spring 2005 -- conveniently just after the 2004 presidential election! But the administration is quietly trying to get these bills passed NOW, so our action is needed immediately. Details and links follow.

If voters who currently support U.S. aggression abroad were confronted with the possibility that their own children or grandchildren might not have a say about whether to fight, many of these same voters might have a change of mind. (Not that it should make a difference, but this plan would among other things eliminate higher education as a shelter and would not exclude women -- and Canada is no longer an option.)

Please send this on to all the parents and teachers you know, and all the aunts and uncles, grandparents, godparents.... And let your children know -- it's their future, and they can be a powerful voice for change! Please also write to your representatives to ask them why they aren't telling their constituents about these bills -- and write to newspapers and other media outlets to ask them why they're not covering this important story.

The Draft*

$28 million has been added to the 2004 Selective Service System (SSS) budget to prepare for a military draft that could start as early as June 15, 2005. SSS must report to Bush on March 31, 2005 that the system, which has lain dormant for decades, is ready for activation. Please see website: http://www.sss.gov/perfplan_fy2004.html to view the SSS Annual Performance Plan - Fiscal Year 2004.

The Pentagon has quietly begun a public campaign to fill all 10,350 draft board positions and 11,070 appeals board slots nationwide.. Though this is an unpopular election year topic, military experts and influential members of Congress are suggesting that if Rumsfeld's prediction of a "long, hard slog" in Iraq and Afghanistan [and a permanent state of war on "terrorism"] proves accurate, the U.S. may have no choice but to draft.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5146.htm

Congress brought twin bills, S. 89 and H.R. 163 forward this year, entitled the Universal National Service Act of 2003, "To provide for the common defense by requiring that all young persons [age 18--26] in the United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense and homeland security, and for other purposes." These active bills currently sit in the Committee on Armed Services.

Dodging the draft will be more difficult than those from the Vietnam era remember. College and Canada will not be options. In December 2001, Canada and the US signed a "Smart Border Declaration," which could be used to keep would-be draft dodgers in. Signed by Canada's Minister of Foreign Affairs, John Manley, and US Homeland Security Director, Gov. Tom Ridge, the declaration involves a 30-point plan which implements, among other things, a "pre-clearance agreement" of people entering and departing each country. Reforms aimed at making the draft more equitable along gender and class lines also eliminates higher education as a shelter. Underclassmen would only be able to postpone service until the end of their cur-rent semester. Seniors would have until the end of the academic year.

*This article by Adam Stutz is from the "What's Hot Off the Press" column of the newsletter of Project Censored, a media research group at Sonoma State University that tracks the news published in independent journals and newsletters. From these, Project Censored compiles an annual list (more than 20 years running) of 25 news stories of social significance that have been overlooked, under-reported, or self-censored by the country's major national news media. The mission of Project Censored is "to educate people about the role of independent journalism in a democratic society and to tell The News That Didn't Make the News and why."

"What's Hot Off the Press" includes student synopses of articles currently being investigated for inclusion in the next Project Censored report. For more info and/or to receive Project Censored's newsletter, go to http://www.projectcensored.org

Evan
04-21-2004, 06:41 PM
It's already back. Military personnel who have served their agreed term of service have had their term of service extended, like it or not, since middle of last year.

John Stevenson
04-21-2004, 07:05 PM
Well if college is out and Canada is out your not bloody coming here [ UK ] and pinching all our cheap machines.

Scotch Joch is watching the North, I'm watching the middle bit and we could care two sods about down South as it's a machinery desert.

Just to rub it in [ gloat ] here's an advert from one of todays UK groups.
BTW is about $1.65 to a UK pound.

***********************
If anyone lives in the Nottinghamshire area of England, I have some
stuff for sale that I no longer require. I used to be a centre lathe
and capstan operator years ago, and did a bit of model engineering in
my spare time.
I've only just found this newsgroup, so I apologise if I'm breaking
any rules by advertising.

I have:-

Over 600 "Model Engineering" mags from 1950's - 90's: £30

"Engineering in Miniature" in binders, vol's 1,2,3,4,7,8,9 plus 40
loose. One or two missing from vols: £20

31/2" gauge "County Carlow" part built chassis, full set of castings
and drawings, "M/E" mag construction series: £120

M&W 2-12" internal mic': £5
Starrett 12" height gauge: £5
200mm sine bar: £2
Mitutoyo 12" vernier caliper: £5
New M&W 0-25mm external mic': £5
0-19mm external pointed mic': £3
1-2" external mic': £3
2 complete 43 piece sets imperial slip gauges: £10 each
Mitutoyo 0-6" depth mic': £5
20 assorted HSS reamers to 1/2": £7

Set of 0-14 BA taps dies and drills, plus set of 16 "ME" taps dies and
drills to 1/2" (32-40 tpi): £30
**********************************

John S.

Evan
04-21-2004, 07:22 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A36979-2003Dec28?language=printer

motorworks
04-21-2004, 07:27 PM
"Just to rub it in [ gloat ] here's an advert from one of todays UK groups.
BTW is about $1.65 to a UK pound."

Lucky bast...
All we get here is a free bottle of seal oil!!
Would you like to trade,say 1 liter of seal oil for that M&W 2-12" internal mic' !!
eddie

John Stevenson
04-21-2004, 07:48 PM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by motorworks:
Would you like to trade,say 1 liter of seal oil for that M&W 2-12" internal mic' !!
eddie</font>

I didn't buy any of it - I thought it was high priced http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

John S.



[This message has been edited by John Stevenson (edited 04-21-2004).]

wierdscience
04-21-2004, 09:04 PM
You guys should use Google more often,see my other post on the subject.

CCWKen
04-21-2004, 10:25 PM
Sounds like they have Bush elected already. How else would the SSS report to Bush in May 2005? Can't blame Bush for this one. It's the Democrats that are pushing this through.

They need this so they have another excuse to raise taxes. By the way, What happened to the $1.8 trillion the Dems "saved" cutting the military seven years ago? Did you see any of it? I think too many of them got left out of the pie. The Dems just keep trying to make a bigger pie.

jfsmith
04-21-2004, 11:37 PM
Been there, done that.

Jerry

dvideo
04-22-2004, 12:12 AM
John....

You and Bill Gates... too much trouble to pick up the $1K bill that slipped out of your wallet. Life in the land of riches....

--jerry

ibewgypsie
04-22-2004, 05:04 AM
"MY" son turns 18 in November.

It means his MOM is finally off the money tit then.

Unfortunatly for him, the draft with research is coming back. Mostly still for poor people I am sure.

David

DR
04-22-2004, 06:46 AM
Oh boy, I see the anti-war protests of the sixties/seventies coming back.

The young people I know don't seem concerned with our oveseas aggression. Probably has a lot to do with the fact that they aren't faced with the military draft like my geneneration was.

L6steel
04-22-2004, 07:00 AM
Draft, hmm, I wonder if they'll let some of us old farts come back in?
Might not be able to move as fast as we used to but I guarentee you we're smarter and sharper than we ever were and a lot more level headed! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

x39
04-22-2004, 08:00 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by L6steel:
I guarentee you we're smarter and sharper than we ever were and a lot more level headed! http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif</font>

L6steel- I don't think those are qualities that are sought after in conscripts... http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//wink.gif Like ibewgypsie, I have an 18 year old son. The thought of losing him in an ill begotten scheme to save some third world **** hole from itself really gets me torqued.


[This message has been edited by x39 (edited 04-22-2004).]

metal mite
04-22-2004, 08:38 AM
Do you guys remember what happoned on 911?
That was worse than Pearl Harbor.
And we had to nuke the Japs to make them lay down.

I don't see where Mr. Bush started this.
These people had already declared war on us on Clintons watch.

Just hope the guys drafted have the right to have a beer, and vote this time.

In some states (Florida) the service mans votes weren't counted this last election.

mite

[This message has been edited by metal mite (edited 04-22-2004).]

John Stevenson
04-22-2004, 08:42 AM
So do I start turning all the junk out the old sheds ready to take on 'trainee's' ?

Could even start a working holiday camp.
Find my floor in return for being shown the quickest / most impresive way to break end mills.

Woweee, see it now, looong lines of paying guests to learn at the hands of the master, [pity I'm busy http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif]

Anyone who can't stand bad language, spitting or farting will have to talk to ower Gert about it themselves.

OK Who's first ??

John S.

wierdscience
04-22-2004, 08:52 AM
Case you guys can't figure it out,what MR Rangle is doing is two fold.

#1 He is floating a bill and producing false information in hopes of blaming it on Bush even though the bill will go NOWHERE.

#2 Its up and running and ready to run through just by some chance that Kerry should get elected,that way they can crank up the draft,turn the war over to the U.N. and we can have a Vietnam all over again.

Check out the oil for food scandal thats unraveling if you want the real reason why the U.N. wouldn't act.

jfsmith
04-22-2004, 01:43 PM
I wish they would take my son, he's 27 and lazy. Maybe they could teach him responsibility and discipline.

He is just getting by with his job as an electrician, because he has 2 kids to support. So the military would be good for him.

Jerry

canonicalman
04-22-2004, 01:57 PM
wierd, dr, gypsie

I think you almost have it correct. Rangle is pushing this to keep Bush (read that Cheney, and the chicken hawks) from engaging in any more military adventures.

Most people are not that concerned with the wars precisely because there is no draft. The upper middle class and middle class kids don't go into the military for the most part. It is poor kids that do, so the people in power don't care. By bringing back the draft, without exemptions, all people will be forced to take a hard look at our foreign policy because their sons and daughters will have to go fight.

Rangle is trying to force the middle, and upper middle, classes to deal with the war directly, instead of ignoring it as they have been doing so far. I don't mean they haven't watched the news, just that the war doesn't affect them directly so they stay disengaged and focus on their own lives.

From what I've heard, Rangle is right on target. As soon as people think their kids have to go fight, they will turn out in droves against this, and future wars.

I've posed this question to people: "would you go fight in Iraq?". Inevitably the answer is no. If I then ask: "Iraqi troops are landing on the beaches of New York and moving inland. Would you go fight them off?" In an instant, they all are heading for the front lines.

I thinks people will readily defend their homeland, but this imperial militarism doesn't hold with a free and democratic people.

DR
04-22-2004, 02:17 PM
"Do you guys remember what happoned on 911?
That was worse than Pearl Harbor.
And we had to nuke the Japs to make them lay down.
I don't see where Mr. Bush started this.
These people had already declared war on us on Clintons watch."

Mite,

I'm looking forward to your testimony before the 911 commission.

At this point it looks like you, shrub and Cheney are the only ones who know the connection between the invasion of Iraq and 911.

metal mite
04-22-2004, 04:31 PM
Hey Dr.

We had better get back on topic.
This ain't a site for this.

People are so polerised that the libs and us right wing extrenists will never see it the same way.

Save your breath and your friends here.

mite

[This message has been edited by metal mite (edited 04-22-2004).]

bikenut
04-22-2004, 04:59 PM
The draft should come back, why should all the kids who can't go to college or get a job fight our wars? Every swinging Richard who lives here and breathes the air of freedom has a stake in this fight. I'm too old and boogered up to pass the physical, but I had my congressman (Senator Grassly) try to get me back in the Army, to no avail. I ain't in that good of shape but I still know how to fire Ma Duce, and would be glad to ride shotgun on convoy detail everyday. Poeple who just sit back and let others do the dirty work make me puke. Who the hell wants to live forever with their tail tucked up between their legs?

yorgatron
04-22-2004, 05:29 PM
that's right metal mite,change the subject when you're losing.funny how many like cheney,bush etc. didn't serve when they had the chance,but are all too eager to get people killed in the wrong war.here's my question,how much money does halliburton make off this war?

Spin Doctor
04-22-2004, 05:50 PM
There's one reason this will go nowhere. There is no way we could afford the economic costs of Universal Service. Besides all of the mechanisms for resuming the draft are already in place. Or why did my 18 year old son have to register.

ibewgypsie
04-22-2004, 06:49 PM
I was raised on squirrels and rabbits. No reason why us old cuss's could not sign up with medical avoidance. ie:no responsible party other than ourselves. I think US old farts are a little more self thinking thou then a young boy.

My son got expelled from school, He probably won't have to go. His MOM allowed him out late and he stabbed a man who was trying to rob his friend. SO he said..

SO, A scholar explained to me.. The military can't get enough intelligent people to sign up. It takes a lot of smarts to run the electronic warfare.. They can't recruit anyone who can hold a job at McDonalds.. the other ones who can't/won't hold a steady job Well there are working as electrician apprentices for me.

David

wierdscience
04-22-2004, 07:56 PM
Canonicalman,not the case,first off it won't be sons and daughters,women are exepted from the draft.Totally unfair but its like most things involving affimative action,lop-sided.

Second,most of the new recruits joining the military are not poor,most are middle class.No one recieveing welfare is signing up,forget that lie,it simply isn't true.If you want proof look at the Kerry BS about the tax cut,"the Bush tax cut is helping the top 5% of the nation"If thats true,then the rich kids will only make up a maximum %5 of the armed forces.The poor which make up %15 and the middle class 80%.

As far as the rich are concerned,ask John Kerry about the wealthy getting a break,three purple hearts for things I wouldn't even use a bandaid on.Alternately you could also as Bill Clinton about being dirt poor from the south,he managed to "avoid" the draft just fine.

Finally this reminds me of a statement made by Clinton apointee Donna Shellala,she said and I qoute"in Vietnam its not like we sent our best and brightest,they were mostly from rural areas and inner cities"In plain english,just us hicks and niggers and we don't matter,its the condesending attitude of the liberal left that makes me sick,to them the military is a sub-class of human being. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//mad.gif

The libs are also always spouting that "we need approval from the UN" claptrap,well we would have never gotten it cause they were bought off by Saddam with the oil for food money,oh and thats US currency BTW,and where did they get it?Thats right you and me!