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View Full Version : OT: Stupid Government Regs



KJ1I
07-10-2014, 05:34 PM
With all the discussion on 2 cycle mixes - (I have 3: chain saw(2012), leaf blower(2005), and micro tiller (1998). All run on the recommended 40:1. Seems that there is no rhyme nor reason to the recommendations.) Anyway, I just got back in from doing a bunch yard work. I had to refuel the chainsaw, leaf blower, and tractor. The gas is in newer 2 and 5 gallon jugs, all with the government mandated "no-spill" spout. I got to say, I've spilled more gas out of a "no-spill" spout than I ever did with the plain old vented can and straight pipe. Trying to control a 30 pound can, keeping the spout shut-off open, bending down over the small opening in the blower, and controlling the flow -- its just inviting a spill. I guess I'm going to have to pop for an aftermarket spout and swap it from can to can.

Thanks for letting me vent (pun intended).

atomarc
07-10-2014, 06:23 PM
Kevin,

I don't think the intent of those spouts is 'no-spill' but rather 'no-vent' to atmosphere. They also, as you noted, close automatically when pulled from the filler hole. This supposeldy seal them in case of a fire while fueling. I agree, the really suck to say the least.

If you think those are stupid try taking a look at AHC...affordable health care, otherwise known as Obama-care. That is a government deal gone awry for sure, especially in California. It's a real shame and a real sham!

Stuart

lynnl
07-10-2014, 07:04 PM
(See my entry #37 in my water heater thread! I won't repeat here.)

flylo
07-10-2014, 07:13 PM
I bought a plastic 14 gal tank on wheels for $50 from a boater then installed an valve stem in the top & put about 10 psi of air & use the hose & nozzle with the shut off & it works great. Later I bought a 32 gal steel & did the same thing. Works well for me.

lakeside53
07-10-2014, 08:42 PM
I hate the "new" plastic gas cans. I have a bunch of old 5 gallon steel bitz "jerry cans". Not a great design either (stupid vent hole in the fill lid), but better than the new "three hands required to pour" types. They are getting new relief vents welded in and quality flex spouts.

As for the OP "no rhyme or reason" for the mix ratios - that not what the EPA regulates - that's up to the individual manf based on host of parameters of which emissions is only one.

sasquatch
07-10-2014, 08:55 PM
I still have my old style cans, and buy up any others i find at yard/garage sales.
Stupid designers, never fails!

darryl
07-10-2014, 09:01 PM
Bought one of those no spill gas containers when down south- once we got to the point where we weren't going to need it, we tried to empty it into the gas tank of the car. Couldn't make it work, couldn't pour the gas through it- ended up making a make-shift funnel from a pop bottle and emptying it that way. Then tossed it into the trash- now it's going to create more bio-hazard than it would have otherwise. :(

We 'need' all these regulations why- all because of the rarity of common sense in the general public. Beam me up, Scotty.

Black_Moons
07-10-2014, 09:50 PM
Agreed that those 'no spill' cans with the shutoff valves are utterly retarded.

The ones with the dual hose nozzles and no shutoff valve are acceptable in 1 and 2 gallon, but 5 gallon would be too slow. they do sell 'military style' (they call em 4WD style) ones here however that DO have a separate vent. http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/4wd-gas-can-20l-0283056p.html No idea what the spout in them looks like but I think its going to either be normal, or the dual hose type (and that should work fine with the separate vent)

I spent 5 minutes with one of those no spill valve types trying to get it to open in the store, couldn't figure it out without putting enough pressure on it to risk damage, decided it was a bad idea and ignored them ever since.

Might I suggest you grab some next time you are in Canada for those close to the boarder?

the 1 and 2 gallons in dual hose are nice however, once the gas level reaches the level of the nozzle the flow stops automatically so you don't even have to pay attention while filling, just insert the nozzle to the depth you want the tank to fill and wait for the sound to stop. They are not so heavy as to be too awkward for the extra time they take and the wrap around handle is really nice (At least in 1 gallon, it does not wrap around enough in 2 gallon)

Cuttings
07-10-2014, 10:08 PM
I have a rig that looks like a gas pump nozzle, all made of plastic, that has a pump built into it.
You just keep squeezing the handle and pump the gas in. Works great to fill those small tanks and fits right into the older vented red plastic fuel containers.
Don't know how long it will last, but I have used mine for several years.
Now it just sides in the shop because I don't have any small engines to fill.

J Tiers
07-10-2014, 10:40 PM
To be fair, the regs usually specify the *performance*, and not the *detail design*. I expect that is true here also.

If the popular design is stupid, then it is up to someone to exercise their good old American ingenuity and design a better one that has the performance but not the problems.

In other words, don't just complain and wait for someone else to fix it..... In case you didn't realize it, as you complain about big guv'mint messing up your gas cans, you are just sitting on your hands waiting around for assistance, for someone else to fix it for you, just the same as folks claim welfare recipients do....

If you are a red-blooded american, and not a "wait for assistance" type, you should invent a better can that still is per the law.

dp
07-10-2014, 10:47 PM
I just bought two of them not realizing they were pretty much sealed containers. As the fuel warmed up from the below-ground tank temperature at the gas station to the 95+ air temp at my shadeless house, they started to pressurize. I tipped up the first one to fuel my mower and a jet of fuel spewed all over me, the mower, the lawn, and the deck. I'll be putting a bleed hole in it before thinking about using it again.

Black_Moons
07-11-2014, 12:54 AM
I just bought two of them not realizing they were pretty much sealed containers. As the fuel warmed up from the below-ground tank temperature at the gas station to the 95+ air temp at my shadeless house, they started to pressurize. I tipped up the first one to fuel my mower and a jet of fuel spewed all over me, the mower, the lawn, and the deck. I'll be putting a bleed hole in it before thinking about using it again.

Funny you mention that. A fully filled dual tube one will do the same thing if the seal between the plug and the spout is broken before the seal between the spout and the can as you open the cap. There is no way to control what seal opens first. A bleeder valve like gas cans used to have would solve that problem. However usually its the seal between the can and spout that opens first.

I have seen them pressurize quite a bit.. Worse is I accidentally let the pressure off of one (1/4 filled) a few times while it was in the sun, It collapsed and lost 1/3rd its capacity at night in the shade.. going to have to put some gas in it and leave it in the sun!

That all said, I wonder how much better gasoline stores when in a properly sealed container that can't let the lighter fractions vaporize off and water in. As disturbing as those gasoline cans look when all bulged up, I remember hooking them up to water hoses as a kid (and releasing the neck valve and watching them shoot off like bottle rockets. 25L cans are awesome) and I never managed to blow myself up, so I suspect those gas cans can withstand quiet a lot of pressure.

adatesman
07-11-2014, 10:16 AM
Can't say I've ever had a problem with them in any size.

jep24601
07-11-2014, 11:47 AM
Kevin,
If you think those are stupid try taking a look at AHC...affordable health care, otherwise known as Obama-care. That is a government deal gone awry for sure, especially in California. It's a real shame and a real sham!

Interesting, it's been a real help to my family members. Under the old system every one of my family members got rejected for one reason or another at various times. Personally I think the old Republicans were right in their support for a universal system.