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View Full Version : Belt Skiving Machine - Usage Advice Please



aboard_epsilon
08-14-2014, 02:05 PM
I bought a belt skiving machine a while back

A Siegling ESM5

As shown in the pictures here

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=siegling+ESM5&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=nfXsU-f1GaWq0QWPjYDgAQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAw&biw=1280&bih=551#imgdii=_

I have it bolted to the bed of my southbend and it's being driven off the chuck.

Has anyone used a similar machine ?

I cant seem to get the hang of it, the belt gets clogged with rubber ...does one joint perfectly ...then it seems that the abrasive is worn out ..and I have to choose another position on the drum to grind from.

I've tried it on all speeds ..different feed rates different amounts of infeed.

Could be doing with seeing a video of someone using one ..so that i can maybe see what I'm doing wrong (I'VE SEARCHED HIGH AND LOW )
at the moment the coupling is bust ..because excessive back torque when the drum got clogged with rubber.

It seems that the abrasive gets worn quickly, once that happens grinding does not happen - only melting ..and it's all downhill from there on

The first cut on a new piece of drum works well...... after doing only four ends of belts ..im going to have to re-cover the drum.

the belt I'm using is 2 inch polyimide - backed each side with rubber.
I'm not having any trouble with the joining gluing - vulcanising - heat process. That I seem to have mastered.

The drum; I have now taken the abrasive off it ready for new, its down to the aluminium.
It did have coil of emery cloth rapped around it , cricket bat/ tennis racket handle style, which was fixed on with double sided tape

all the best.markj

aboard_epsilon
08-14-2014, 03:47 PM
I've re-worded it - to make more sense.

all the best.markj

Rosco-P
08-14-2014, 04:02 PM
Looked at what appear to be the company website, maker of synthetic conveyor and power transmission belting. I found no mention of the ESMS skiving machine anywhere. Conveyor belting is usually joined with clipper lacing. Are you sure the machine you bought was made for synthetic belting and not leather? It came with no operating information?

aboard_epsilon
08-14-2014, 04:26 PM
Yes it was made for synthetic belt.
I phoned the company up, "forbo siegling" they use them out in the field.
no one there to give the correct advice though.

they call it a belt grinding tool

I put skiving down because that's the American word for what we would call scarfing

there is mention of it

http://www.forbo-siegling.com/pages/products/tools/toolfinder/preparation/download/B001-fms_grinding-tool.pdf


all the best.markj

Mcostello
08-14-2014, 09:20 PM
Tell me what picture to look at, busy right now. 12 years fabbing belts. Found the second link. It seems like the grinding wheel is vertical or close to it behind the clamp. see a small circle, and the clamp seems to rotate a shaft down towards it. Real pictures would help.

boslab
08-14-2014, 10:12 PM
Having never done any belt making but i have ground rubber pinch rolls for extruders, cooling the rubber as cold as a witches tit helps considerably, in the winter the rollers were chucked outside overnite, in warm weather a cold hose over them for half an hour, they were 8 foot long so wouldent fit in the fridge!
Bag of ice over the bit to be ground might help, the abrasive might be too fine too, we ground the rolls with silly course wheels like 30 grit, looked like concrete not a grinding wheel!
Mark

Black_Moons
08-14-2014, 10:53 PM
Consider trying creep rubber blocks to renew the abrasive? works wonders at unclogging sandpaper and you get a very large block for $10~20 so chewing some off to clean your abrasives does not cost too much.

aboard_epsilon
08-15-2014, 06:45 AM
this picture best describes how it works , imagine the motor is the south bend lathe

http://www.erdos-gmbh.de/b2013/14755siegling/10.JPG

there isn't any vertical element in the machine

as you can see there is a rotating abrasive "horizontal" roller and the belt is attached to a shaped "cammed" surface that rotates through a 90 degrees quadrant, this results in the belt having a flat faced "wedge" ground into it, the furthest lever in the picture works in exactly the same way as a south bend back gear engagement cam, it moves the whole quadrant closer to the drum.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v190/aboard_epsilon/smart%20and%20brown/wedge_zpsb402f882.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/aboard_epsilon/media/smart%20and%20brown/wedge_zpsb402f882.jpg.html)

once the two ends are skived they are joined like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJCzho8_9vA&list=PLJxvV3byWHgndOiJVX_w9K83FeWV2fllv



all the best.markj

aboard_epsilon
08-15-2014, 06:51 AM
creep rubber ? what's that .


all the best.markj

Rosco-P
08-15-2014, 09:36 AM
Maybe Boslab is on the right track a coarse abrasive paper like a 36 grit. Larger grains, more open, less clogging? Black_Moons had a good suggestion as well a crape rubber cleaning stick to get the loose particles off the abrasive.

aboard_epsilon
08-15-2014, 11:05 AM
Right.
Is this it, known as latex rubber ?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Latex-Rubber-Sanding-Belt-Cleaning-Block-For-Belt-Sanders-150-x-25-x-25mm224688-/151256527597?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item23379772ed


Been all along the North Wales coast today, cant find emery type strip, at anything under 80 grit
I say emery ..but the stuff on the machine was paper backed.

I have a couple of more places to look.

all the best markj

RWO
08-15-2014, 01:17 PM
One more time: it's spelled "crepe" rubber.

RWO

cameron
08-15-2014, 05:07 PM
And pronounced "crape".

Black_Moons
08-15-2014, 07:55 PM
Right.
Is this it, known as latex rubber ?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Latex-Rubber-Sanding-Belt-Cleaning-Block-For-Belt-Sanders-150-x-25-x-25mm224688-/151256527597?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item23379772ed

Been all along the North Wales coast today, cant find emery type strip, at anything under 80 grit
I say emery ..but the stuff on the machine was paper backed.
I have a couple of more places to look.
all the best markj

Not sure, never seen em called latex rubber, this is what the one I have looks like, works like a hot damn.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sand-Paper-Sanding-Belt-Abrasive-Cleaner-Sticks-1-5-x-1-5-x-8-inch-or-18-CUI-/111045517584?pt=Sanders_Sandblasters&hash=item19dad42110

You can see how clean its getting that belt sander in the photo.

soon as the belt hits it, bits get ripped off and turns into a 'goo' that is highly self adhesive and sticks to debris but does not stick to the belt at all, it literally will make sandpaper clean as new almost instantly. Can be used on sheets of sandpaper or right on belt sanders/etc. Don't need to use very much to clean the paper either.

boslab
08-15-2014, 10:12 PM
I had a thought, i was at the local builders merchants this morning (jewsons) and remember seeing they hire floor sanders, and the big abrasive sheets for the drum sanders, assd grits but big enough to do the roller perhaps?
Mark

aboard_epsilon
08-16-2014, 08:37 AM
I managed to get a roll of 40 grit this morning ..we'll see how I manage with that .

as for the crepe sticks ....the builders merchants / diy shops have no knowledge of the things

I remember a long time back these things being demonstrated by the "furniture guys" Joe and Ed

think I'm going to be watching those shows again ..they were very informative .

all the best..markj

boslab
08-16-2014, 07:41 PM
Discovered them in the local screwfix hardware store
http://www.screwfix.com/p/belt-cleaner-76mm/16277
Mark

aboard_epsilon
08-16-2014, 09:55 PM
A professional woodworking friend tells me, that bin bags screwed up into a ball and pushed against the abrasive does a better job than the rubber crepe stuff.

all the best...markj

Black_Moons
08-17-2014, 11:44 AM
as for the crepe sticks ....the builders merchants / diy shops have no knowledge of the things
all the best..markj

Grab one off ebay or other online sources if you have to. they REALLY work wonders.