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plunger
10-27-2014, 05:03 AM
I find that as I get older I have less energy to spend in the workshop. My back and tendons in my elbows (tennis elbow) are giving me problems. But a bit of pain reminds you that you are still alive. Here in Africa we may be a little isolated to world trends and I wanted to ask a question on health even though it is off topic.
We have a sports scientist called Tim Noakes who swears by the Banting diet. He has caused alot of controversy with his claims and some medical doctors have even resorted to saying that what what he says as being criminal. It has taken S Africa by storm and many people swear by it.It is simply a diet where you can pretty much eat as much as you like but no sugar and no carbs.This includes fruit juices and citrusand butternut and apples etc. Eating fat of animals is not frowned apon at all. This is where it gets interesting.Many people swear that they have lost as much as 10kg in two months and claim there cholesterol has even come down.
Its seems odd that for instance me with 8.3 cholesterol could benefit from a diet where you can eat fat when my doctor advised me to stay away from red meat if possible.Any thoughts?

oldtiffie
10-27-2014, 05:23 AM
As some will suspect from another thread, I have prostate cancer - well under control with PSA falling - but the blood tests show a marginally lower anaemia which my local Doctor (GP) and my Urologist and Radiation Oncologist all agree that red meat is the best and least expensive and most readily available remedy - but it needs to be on-going as my blood tests will show if I drop off read meat for any length of time.

I like read meat and I don't like anaemia so it all works for me.

https://www.google.com.au/?gws_rd=ssl#q=anaemia

oldtiffie
10-27-2014, 05:32 AM
I'd walk out of my shop if side or after effects of prescribed medication caused me to loose concentration at the required level.

Alcohol mixed with these medications might not help either - and neither does being over-tired or distracted.

Most medications with these possible effects warn you of the risks.

If concerned - stay away from working machines - in the shop, the house, on the property or at work or in the car - and see your Doctor.

Abaker
10-27-2014, 08:21 AM
The US variation of that is the Adkins or South Beach diet. You will lose a lot of weight fast on a low carb diet. I was about 260 lbs when I started and dropped about 15 pounds in two weeks. It slowed down after that and I continued to lose weight at the rate of about a pound a week as long as I continued the diet. If I strayed from the straight and narrow path I would immediately (24 hrs) gain 3-5 pounds. That sudden gain from eating carbs is a common occurrence. As for my cholesterol: I went for a check up after being on the diet for about 10 months. I had lost a good bit of weight, but the total and LDL numbers were very high. I changed the diet to reduce the really greasy meats and cut way down on cheese and butter which helped, but the numbers did remain somewhat elevated. It is my understanding that when you go on a low carb diet the cholesterol drop initial but can build back up depending on what you eat.

I stayed on variations of this diet for close to eight years but finally just got tired of it. It did work to drop the weight and it will keep it off as long as you stick to it. That is very, very hard to do for a lifetime.

Black Forest
10-27-2014, 09:13 AM
I am on a very strict seafood diet. I SEE Food and eat it. You all just need to be married to a German woman. She chases after me with a stick if I don't keep my behind in gear. Of course having a horse farm in the Black Forest keeps me very active both on and around the horses.

A.K. Boomer
10-27-2014, 10:38 AM
Personally I would not do the red meat thing as there's too many other things stacked against you with it,

as far as the high fat I think it's at least not as bad sounding as most people think and there is some real evidence of it helping in many a way, but get your fat from things like extra virgin olive oil, mixed nuts, flax seeds and oil, avocado's and oil

these are great fats and I eat a ton of them - sometimes just as a snack I will be eating something and tally up the USRDA of what I just ate in fat and it's something like 300% of the USRDA value just in itself ! and it's like I say just a snack and I still have lunch and dinner ahead of me lol

I have no idea what my blood work looks like as I never had it checked - all's I know is I can wheel all the younger kids in their 20's in steep climbing on my Mt. bike and have not had the big one yet - and im well over the half century mark...

I drink allot of red wine too for a thinner, I have got some pretty bad scrapes out on the trail and bleed like a stuck pig so have to be careful in that respect, but think the R.W. is a good thing too...

I don't avoid carbs though either, I eat a ton of fruit in the summer... and in a literal sense I bet very close to a half ton of watermelon,,,

but im not on any kind of a weight loss diet, and in fact its hard for me to gain no matter what I choose to eat...

while diet is huge so is exercise. but they both can drag you down no matter what if you don't get ahold of stress reduction along with it,,, it's all a balance - anotherwords if your in such a great hurry to go exercise that your having to juggle all kinds of other things to do it and it's putting you under great stress to get it done - then don't do it, skip it till it all blends in. same thing with a very strict diet, if it's making you miserable then you might want to re-think what its doing to you in other ways that are not so good...

Georgineer
10-27-2014, 10:56 AM
The only answer is to stop eating and die healthy.

George

Tim The Grim
10-27-2014, 12:09 PM
Just a thought on your elbow. Do you use a mouse a lot?
When I was doing lots of Cad/Cam, I had awful pain in my right elbow and forearm.
I made a switch from mouse to a Logitech Trackman trackball and in days my pain was gone.

Tha Atkins Diet worked for me when I was in shops doing Wire EDM / Programming but not in my current oil refinery job where I require much higher immediate energy to climb columns and turn big valves. I'm a vitamin/supplements freak and have been since the mid 70's. I literally take a handful of supplements every day. At 61 I can still give the younger guys at work a run for their money. I crank my home shop mill knee by hand too. None of that drill business for me.

mattthemuppet
10-27-2014, 12:22 PM
I'm always wary of anything labelled "xyz diet" as just the name implies that following the xyz diet will change what you couldn't change before and you'll stay changed once you're off it. It's not flashy or fashionable, but everything in moderation, lots of fruit and veg (especially dark coloured ones), plenty of exercise and a little of what you like is the way to go in my mind. It's a challenge to do that in today's high zoot, high stress lifestyle, but not impossible and I find that exercise is the best way to beat stress - helps me tune out, relaxes me and helps me sleep.

As one gets older and creakier (which will happen to me one day without doubt), exercise becomes even more important. I think swimming is just about one of the best forms of low impact all over exercise one can do, especially as joints get flaky and bones get fragile. That said, I'm hoping to keep mountainbiking until I drop dead, whenever that'll be.

justanengineer
10-27-2014, 12:34 PM
Myself and SWMBO have tried several of those diets and found they all suck pretty badly, they tend to give short-term results by recommending an unhealthy and non-maintainable balance. The best/healthiest manner of living IMHO is to exercise and eat local&fresh foods and avoid packaged&processed crap as much as possible. Also, if youre someone that makes a point of adding salt, sugar, ketchup, or "sauces" for "flavor," learn to cook. SWMBO didnt believe me when we first got together, she put a ton of salt and/or sauce on everything. A few years of my prodding, and she fully admits now that if food is fresh and well prepared its flavorful enough by itself.

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 12:56 PM
Its seems odd that for instance me with 8.3 cholesterol could benefit from a diet where you can eat fat when my doctor advised me to stay away from red meat if possible.Any thoughts?
Do yourself a favour and dont bother even thinking about your cholesterol numbers, they have been proven to be absolutely meaningless when it comes to heart disease and your health. There have been thousands of livers damaged from cholesterol treating drugs, all for nothing.
I would also recommend taking any diet advice from a medical Dr with a grain of salt, in all their years of training less than a week is spent on nutrition and diet. At least that's how it is over here in North America.
Eat meat and be merry! ;)
Cheers,
Jon

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 12:57 PM
What does the acronym SWMBO stand for? I assume your better half?
Cheers,
Jon

Black Forest
10-27-2014, 01:08 PM
What does the acronym SWMBO stand for? I assume your better half?
Cheers,
Jon

Someone who must be obeyed.

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 01:13 PM
Thanks! That makes perfect sense now!
Cheers,
Jon

Black Forest
10-27-2014, 01:14 PM
Do yourself a favour and dont bother even thinking about your cholesterol numbers, they have been proven to be absolutely meaningless when it comes to heart disease and your health. There have been thousands of livers damaged from cholesterol treating drugs, all for nothing.
I would also recommend taking any diet advice from a medical Dr with a grain of salt, in all their years of training less than a week is spent on nutrition and diet. At least that's how it is over here in North America.
Eat meat and be merry! ;)
Cheers,


Jon

Don't you think Doctors learn anything after they get their Dr. Title? The correct answer would be yes. Not all Dr. are clueless the same as just because they are a Dr. they know for sure.

Genetics play a huge role in weight and cholesterol and as such it is really hard to generalize. I eat red meat because of the seritonin which helps to stabilize my brain. No comments please!

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 01:49 PM
I was just speaking in general BF, but you certainly make a point!
I treat Dr's with the same amount of skepticism as I do my wife when she is telling me there is a problem with her truck. I listen carefully then form my own opinions and draw my own conclusions based on what I know and can see... :D
Cheers,
Jon

A.K. Boomer
10-27-2014, 02:02 PM
I very rarely eat red meat but when I do it's either elk or buffalo and it's almost totally bloody - just seared on the outside.

I look at that light pink stuff in the supermarkets and can't understand how anyone would really call that meat of any kind its so anemic looking...

JAE is right - stay away from just about anything packaged - shop the outer parameters in the grocery stores, that's generally where all the fresh produce hangs out and all the dead refined crap is in the middle...

want to stay alive ? then eat live things, food should be alive not dead, live food is loaded with enzymes - dead cooked food does not have any, we need enzymes to stay alive - even at the most basic level - if you did not have any active enzyme activity in your body you would be dead in a few seconds - it's responsible for everything from metabolism to breathing exchange, You cannot expect to keep shoveling in lifeless sludge and expect to thrive off of it, it will kill you slowly as our enzyme stores are limited and need replenishment... even proper digestion relies on copious amounts of enzymes in the food itself that your trying to digest, You actually don't need as much pro-biotics in your system if your food is raw due to the food having it's own enzymes in it to help break it down, now - if your still going to eat lifeless sludge then by all means get on the pro-biotics as simple bacteria's luv that kind of crap... and although some of them can be beneficial in some ways remember their excrement in your system is generally not and in fact can be pretty toxic,,,

When I first did my initial heath "turn around" I actually shut my gas cooking stove off for two years, just turned the gas valve behind it OFF.

I felt about 85 or 90 back then, and now about 8 years later? id say im somewhere in my mid to late 30's ---- again...

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 02:16 PM
I am very lucky to live where I do, we are surrounded by local food suppliers, we can even watch the beef we eat graze on the grass in the field across the road! :)
In the last few years there has been a lot of pressure to support our local farmers and it is really paying off with excellent markets full of local produce and meat. There is even a chain of grocery stores here (FoodLand) that try to source everything local, thats the way to go.
If I could stop being such a drunk I might even get healthy... :D
Cheers,
Jon

mattthemuppet
10-27-2014, 03:11 PM
AK - we don't get any of the enzymes we need from the food we eat, they're all made by our own cells from the nutrients we absorb from our food (in fact, the likelihood of intact proteins/ enzymes crossing our intestinal barrier and remaining functional is slim to non-existent). Vitamins and some amino acids however we can't make and we very much need to have in our diet. Actually, the best thing to eat from a biological perspective is whatever is the most similar to us, biochemically. As cannibalism is frowned upon, red meat from animals is where it's at, plus a few veggies of course!

Paul Alciatore
10-27-2014, 03:26 PM
A bit more on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/She_Who_Must_Be_Obeyed


What does the acronym SWMBO stand for? I assume your better half?
Cheers,
Jon

justanengineer
10-27-2014, 04:20 PM
Do yourself a favour and dont bother even thinking about your cholesterol numbers, they have been proven to be absolutely meaningless when it comes to heart disease and your health.

I'd suggest something slightly different based upon how my doctor handles mine. She checks it several times annually and charts the data rather than comparing it to an idealized table/chart. The goal is to maintain, not raise, lower, or worry if steady. Everybody at the VA does similar when considering my various blood "levels," even their dieticians. Purportedly it was at the suggestion of the AMA(?) a few years ago. Disclaimer: not an expert and am admittedly a medical idiot, only know what I was told.

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 04:57 PM
There have been a few studies in the last few years that prove your cholesterol level does not indicate anything related to your health, regardless if your levels rise, fall or never move. The LDL measurements are completely useless and have done nothing but generate billions of dollars in profits for pharmaceutical companies as well as damage livers and end lives...
If your considering taking cholesterol treating drugs I would highly suggest reading the available data with an objective mind.
Cheers,
Jon

A.K. Boomer
10-27-2014, 05:00 PM
AK - we don't get any of the enzymes we need from the food we eat, they're all made by our own cells from the nutrients we absorb from our food (in fact, the likelihood of intact proteins/ enzymes crossing our intestinal barrier and remaining functional is slim to non-existent). Vitamins and some amino acids however we can't make and we very much need to have in our diet. Actually, the best thing to eat from a biological perspective is whatever is the most similar to us, biochemically. As cannibalism is frowned upon, red meat from animals is where it's at, plus a few veggies of course!

If you don't get enough for proper digestion then your body will have to call on either more HCL (not good) or pancreatic and other sources, supplies are limited and if you run short your food will turn to poison inside of you as it putrefies inside you instead of digests properly - it's a vicious cycle as then it's harder to come up with proper enzyme function due to not having the proper internal building blocks to manufacture it. there are enzymes needed in the food you eat for proper digestion and there are specific enzymes needed for proper function that your body creates and yes some are also aimed at digestion...

All live food "owns" its very own specific enzyme designed to help break it down upon ingestion... dead foods don't, they have to rely heavily on other sources, HCL or secretions that we produce, or parasitic as in probiotics.


We are the only species on the planet that cooks its food before consumption - if you ever care to debate all the humanoid illnesses against any other single species on the planet that's all good too as it's not even close...

Mark Rand
10-27-2014, 05:28 PM
I hope some of you folk are better at machining than you are at biology of medicine. :mad:

QSIMDO
10-27-2014, 06:01 PM
Eating a "balanced" diet, which also means not eating everything that flies by your face, thereby ensuring you eat just enough calories to maintain a healthy weight PLUS routine exercise is really all it takes.
It's amazing how ignorant we are about how many calories we consume until you start tracking it.
Red meat, candy, cake, liquor...it's all OK... in moderation.

bollie7
10-27-2014, 07:28 PM
Heres an interesting read about cholesterol.- especially the paragraph titled "Who Decided What Cholesterol Levels Are Healthy or Harmful?" (about 2/3ds of the way down the page)
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/08/10/making-sense-of-your-cholesterol-numbers.aspx

bollie7

mattthemuppet
10-27-2014, 07:29 PM
If you don't get enough for proper digestion then your body will have to call on either more HCL (not good) or pancreatic and other sources, supplies are limited and if you run short your food will turn to poison inside of you as it putrefies inside you instead of digests properly - it's a vicious cycle as then it's harder to come up with proper enzyme function due to not having the proper internal building blocks to manufacture it. there are enzymes needed in the food you eat for proper digestion and there are specific enzymes needed for proper function that your body creates and yes some are also aimed at digestion...

All live food "owns" its very own specific enzyme designed to help break it down upon ingestion... dead foods don't, they have to rely heavily on other sources, HCL or secretions that we produce, or parasitic as in probiotics.


We are the only species on the planet that cooks its food before consumption - if you ever care to debate all the humanoid illnesses against any other single species on the planet that's all good too as it's not even close...

I dunno AK, that sounds like a load of life-style waffle that a whole bunch of enzyme companies want you to believe (like all the vitamin supplements). Any enzymes in food would have to pass through the pH2 (or lower) conditions of the stomach, which denatures all but the most amazing of proteins and living tissue (pepsin and Helicobactor pylori being the only exceptions I can think of). If an enzyme is optimised for anything but a super acidic pH (ie. almost all of them, including our own), then it simply won't work after going through the stomach. That's just biochemistry, I'm not making it up. Now, if it was encapsulated in some kind of coating to protect it from the acid in the stomach (like my daughter's lactase pills), then it's conceivable it could get to the small intestine in a state where it could do something useful. However, given that we chew our food, relying on food enzymes (why would a plant have enzymes in large quantities to break themselves down anyway? Why would those enzymes even be active at our body temperature?) would seem like a much more complicated approach than just secreting them into the intestine ourselves.

That's not to say that there aren't living creatures in our guts that help digest our food - there's a stunning variety of bacteria in our intestine that help us out, something that is only just being understood now. Mucking around with that can lead to disease, in ways we don't understand yet. Also, if cooking food was bad for us, the million or so years that we've been doing it should have provided plenty enough time for natural selection to either get rid of us (or Homo erectus) or select for mechanisms to compensate if your theory has any basis. Not to get all hoiti toity about it, but I do teach this stuff at undergraduate level.

rohart
10-27-2014, 10:37 PM
I think John Mortimer coined the phrase 'She who must be obeyed' when he had Rumpole refer to his bossy wife.

At 65 I play squash too hard - maybe five or six hours a week. I play to my limit, but I've never felt the ticker complain yet.

When my daughter conquered her anorexia I felt the duty to eat by example fade, and I lost about ten kilos. I could lose another ten, and I'd be faster on court, and I do believe the bike would gain 5 bhp into the bargain, but I like my cookies and milk too much.

I hear lots of people over this side of the pond take something called statins, but I'm not into that kind of just in case medication. Got cleared on the aneurism front, but I must find time to check up on a few other typical killer ailments that might be lurking. I seem to be living in a sort of haze, on the basis that if I work like a demon on court then diseases don't have time to grab hold. Must get real someday.

Jon Heron
10-27-2014, 10:48 PM
I climbed a 100M wind generator in Nova Scotia today, ug, I really need to get in shape.
At one point I thought my arms were going to fall right off... ;)
http://theherons.ca/album/var/resizes/Jonnys_Stuff/temp/IMG_20140619_113803.jpg?m=1414464434
Cheers,
Jon

mattthemuppet
10-27-2014, 11:59 PM
No way in hell would you ever get me climbing up that, unless it was inside of course. I get the willies climbing up a step ladder!

Jon Heron
10-28-2014, 08:13 AM
Yep, its all inside work. You can see the ladder with the track up the middle in this shot, there is a trolley that attaches to your harness that locks into the track to keep you from swan diving.
http://theherons.ca/album/var/resizes/Jonnys_Stuff/temp/IMG_20140619_121810.jpg?m=1414498242
I prefer to take the lift. :)
Cheers,
Jon

oldtiffie
10-28-2014, 08:22 AM
Here is the OP:


I find that as I get older I have less energy to spend in the workshop. My back and tendons in my elbows (tennis elbow) are giving me problems. But a bit of pain reminds you that you are still alive. Here in Africa we may be a little isolated to world trends and I wanted to ask a question on health even though it is off topic.
We have a sports scientist called Tim Noakes who swears by the Banting diet. He has caused alot of controversy with his claims and some medical doctors have even resorted to saying that what what he says as being criminal. It has taken S Africa by storm and many people swear by it.It is simply a diet where you can pretty much eat as much as you like but no sugar and no carbs.This includes fruit juices and citrusand butternut and apples etc. Eating fat of animals is not frowned apon at all. This is where it gets interesting.Many people swear that they have lost as much as 10kg in two months and claim there cholesterol has even come down.
Its seems odd that for instance me with 8.3 cholesterol could benefit from a diet where you can eat fat when my doctor advised me to stay away from red meat if possible.Any thoughts?

It is all about being fit to be in the shop - not just about cholesterol.

plunger
10-28-2014, 11:18 AM
I am hoping that by being lighter my back will have less strain on it.But also things like arthritis may be linked to a refined junk food lifestyle. I just cant see how I can lose weight by eating as much as I like of things I actually enjoy and it just sounds too good to be true that I can have a fatty steak and cheese and not drop dead from heart disease. This is why his diet is causing so much controversy and why some medical experts say he is being irresponsible .I hate excersizing but being a plumber is hard work and I am active all day.

fjk
10-28-2014, 11:40 AM
I am hoping that by being lighter my back will have less strain on it.But also things like arthritis may be linked to a refined junk food lifestyle. I just cant see how I can lose weight by eating as much as I like of things I actually enjoy and it just sounds too good to be true that I can have a fatty steak and cheese and not drop dead from heart disease. This is why his diet is causing so much controversy and why some medical experts say he is being irresponsible .I hate excersizing but being a plumber is hard work and I am active all day.

Unless you really get into it, exercising does not burn all that many calories. It does, however, help by strengthening muscles (including your heart), keeping the joints working well, and so on.
http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-living/weight-loss/in-depth/exercise/art-20050999 has some interesting numbers.

The single best easiest way to lose weight is to eat a smaller balanced diet --- fewer calories.

Assuming you have no other medical issue requiring a specialized diet, the "type" of diet is just fiddling around the margins. A low-carb diet might seem to "work better" ... but carbs have a lot of calories as compared to, say, salads. So low-carb is really just chopping out a big chunk of calories. It won't work at all if you cut out your carbs and then add 20 bacon-double-cheeseburgers to your daily diet...

justanengineer
10-28-2014, 11:49 AM
I hate excersizing but being a plumber is hard work and I am active all day.

Not to suggest you dont lead a healthy lifestyle, but I've personally known many folks who've said very similar things and missed out on the not-so-obvious, that there are two distinct sides to exercise - strength training and cardio. During our daily routines most folks get a decent amount of strength training but not nearly enough cardio, hence why many tradesmen are strong as an ox but have big beer bellies. JMO but one of the healthiest things we can do is get our heart rate up via running, biking, or other vigorous activity for an extended period. Its how we stay skinny.

lakeside53
10-28-2014, 11:59 AM
The single best easiest way to lose weight is to eat a smaller balanced diet --- fewer calories.



Absolutely. All "diets" fail over the LONG TERM unless you modify your eating habits. In the end it's simply energy in verses energy out for gain/loss. There is no magic bullet. Yes, you can argue that some foods quickly burn up and soon leave you hungry, but "hunger" is in your head (deal with the initial "blood sugar" issues...) - get a handle on that and you're good. Oh.. it's hard. I love food, but I succeeded. I cut out all junk, ate less (portion control!) and exercise more by working harder and not siting around glugging beer/TV; definitely not "gym". I'm almost 61 and in the best shape of my life. At 45 I was a blob/mess.

RichR
10-28-2014, 12:01 PM
... and it just sounds too good to be true ...
That's because it is. They are just telling people what they want to hear, "Lose weight without giving up anything and not have to work for it".

... I can have a fatty steak and cheese and not drop dead from heart disease.
Sure, but instead of a 16 oz. steak have an 8 oz. steak with some vegetables and a salad. Maybe put some lettuce and tomato on that cheese sandwich.
If you take a look at your diet, I'm sure you are smart enough to figure out some of the items you should stop consuming, or at least cut back on.

A.K. Boomer
10-28-2014, 12:07 PM
I dunno AK, that sounds like a load of life-style waffle that a whole bunch of enzyme companies want you to believe (like all the vitamin supplements).

I don't think that's the way it works - at least not with all the data iv read about it, most all were stating that the enzymes you need to help break things down are hanging out in the food you eat - so unless it's some kind of huge conspiracy to get everyone to use less cooking gas or electric im really not seeing the connection your talking about


Any enzymes in food would have to pass through the pH2 (or lower) conditions of the stomach, which denatures all but the most amazing of proteins and living tissue (pepsin and Helicobactor pylori being the only exceptions I can think of). If an enzyme is optimised for anything but a super acidic pH (ie. almost all of them, including our own), then it simply won't work after going through the stomach. That's just biochemistry, I'm not making it up. Now, if it was encapsulated in some kind of coating to protect it from the acid in the stomach (like my daughter's lactase pills), then it's conceivable it could get to the small intestine in a state where it could do something useful. However, given that we chew our food, relying on food enzymes (why would a plant have enzymes in large quantities to break themselves down anyway? Why would those enzymes even be active at our body temperature?) would seem like a much more complicated approach than just secreting them into the intestine ourselves.

that's really not accurate biochemistry and although I know your not just making things up I don't think you understand it correctly, Actually the ph of the stomach covers a fairly wide range and although generally acidic - falls into the more mildly acidic rage of 4 to 5 to the far more extreme of around 2, there is a host of things that control this acidity including if it's full or not or what you filled it with as different foods create different responses - it's actually very complex and sometimes contradicts itself depending on what we eat,

This is actually one of the strongest arguments for proper meal combining as even the best chemist in the world would admit that yes while generally we have everything needed to "get the job done" it's quite impossible to "get the job done" effectively by mixing everything in all at once and trying to use all our secretions at once as our secretions work against themselves if were not careful,
for instance - our saliva secretes Ptyalin, this is a starch cleaving enzyme that has very close to a neutral ph value which directly dilutes the HCL levels in the stomach, and this is just fine, if your meal was mostly starch and in fact your stomach can sense this and not call in the HCL pumps, but eat meat with potatoes and now the system has no choice, the emergency back-up will overide, HCL has the last say otherwise the meat will putrefy inside of you.

but this in turn will reduce the Pytalins effect on the starch, so "modern day digestion" is allot different than what really ended up getting us here in the first place - for we did not stumble through the jungle and arrive upon a huge buffet of all kinds of different proteins fats/oils and carbohydrates and scarf them down all at once - just did not happen - we "generally" focused on just one thing at a time, but now we got these things called refrigerators that contain everything and we generally eat them all at once - like I stated there are some huge contradictions going on that are just accepted as being "normal" now, again - not what got us here in the first place - and the chemistry proves it - it's simply not how were designed to function... and it takes far more then a million or two years to curb that, for that is simply again just a drop in the bucket in the time frame of what got us here. of how we evolved, and cooking was actually not adopted nowhere near as widespread as it is now, for yes they may have found evidence of it "for certain things" way back when,

but it was not until Louis Pasteur entered into the equation with his "germ theory of disease" that things really got out of control with the preparation of food and the wide scale destruction of enzymes - at the very least it needs to be viewed for what it is - a double edge sword...


However, given that we chew our food, relying on food enzymes (why would a plant have enzymes in large quantities to break themselves down anyway? Why would those enzymes even be active at our body temperature?)

I'll just address this one separately - this is a very basic site that will help explain things about how most all plants "own" the very specific enzyme to help break themselves down, I searched for apples real quick because im sure everyone is aware of an apple almost immediately turning brown right after you bite into it and expose it to oxygen - now simply imagine what the act of chewing does, the more a food is readily helping to break itself down the less harder our systems have to work, http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/experts-why-cut-apples-turn-brown/
This is an important little sentence in the link; "Heating can also be used to inactivate PPO enzymes; apples can be blanched in boiling water for four to five minutes to nearly eliminate PPO activity. "







That's not to say that there aren't living creatures in our guts that help digest our food - there's a stunning variety of bacteria in our intestine that help us out, something that is only just being understood now. Mucking around with that can lead to disease, in ways we don't understand yet. Also, if cooking food was bad for us, the million or so years that we've been doing it should have provided plenty enough time for natural selection to either get rid of us (or Homo erectus) or select for mechanisms to compensate if your theory has any basis. Not to get all hoiti toity about it, but I do teach this stuff at undergraduate level.


Like i stated earlier - the bacteria in most peoples guts is actually thriving due to it absolutely loving what it's being fed, dead sludge, and in fact it's estimated that the average american has several pounds of it clinging to the insides of the intestinal track - Yet studies on "raw foodies" who have close to the ratio of 80 to 90% raw and only 10 to 20 percent cooked confirm a level of bacteria that is measured only in ounces rather than pounds,,,
And I don't look at you getting all Hoity Toity about it - it's all good - I teach this stuff also - but it's mostly to my friends and people I know that ask me question and are interested in how I turned my life around...
I simply had no choice but to figure things out - my health was that bad,

this is another quick site that has "most stuff" right - it's at least worth a look i think - I used to have some great bookmarks but that's all on my other computer that crashed along time ago...

http://www.rawfoodexplained.com/gastrointestinal-diseases/the-gastrointestinal-tract.html

there is also some information that even when the HCL gets activated some Ptyalin "survives" for quite some time hanging out on the middle of the "food ball" inside the stomach FWIW ----- again - so many variables.

"The chief source of ptyalin (salivary a-amylase) is the glands in the mouth. Ptyalin acts most effectively at an optimal pH of 6.7, and it catalyzes hydrolysis of starch into two disaccharides, maltose and isomaltose. In le stomach, ptyalin may act for up to an hour in the center of the food mass before the fundic contents are mixed with acid gastric secretions.

Once pH of the food in the stomach declines below 4.0, the activity of ptyalin is inhibited. Before this inhibition takes place, up to 40 percent of ingested starches will have been converted into maltose by ptyalin. The activity of ptyalin is also inhibited by the presence of protein because he presence of any protein food in the stomach initiates the secretion of the hydrochloric acid for its digestion. Therefore we recommend that proteins and starches not be eaten together."

One thing I do strongly believe - is don't venture too far from what got us here in the first place - we simply don't adapt that quick, all these tiny little "assaults" on our bodies add up if done multiple times a day... anotherwords - if you think that pulling up to some drive through is the way it's always been then youv most likely already lost the battle...

oldtiffie
10-28-2014, 08:50 PM
Possibly the best advice I have seen or was given to reduce food intake was to do two essential exercises at all meals:

- when offered "more" just shake your head sideways and say: "Thanks but no thanks" and:

- use your arms and legs to push yourself away from the table and then walk away.

mike4
10-28-2014, 09:23 PM
Eating salads and other healthy foods would be easier if the salads were more appealing in both taste and appearance.
I am often getting weird looks from the people serving when I ask for no beetroot and keep the salad to manageable proportions .

It would be easier to get people to eat "healthy " if it was more apetising, some salads taste more like grass clippings, thats why people shy away from them .

I have always eaten what I like and thats a mix of so called unhealthy and the boring stuff as well .

Dont go much on current fads as most are not suitable for my work style , where I will drive four or five hours to a site work for four or six hours and then drive back to base ,sometimes with a detour to a job on the way back .
And when I work its physical work not just computer screens at a desk.
Michael

A.K. Boomer
10-29-2014, 09:48 AM
This is quite a long read but very interesting,

http://www.rawfoodlife.com/Articles___Research/Science_of_Raw_v__Cooked/science_of_raw_v__cooked.htm

cooking food has been around for a very long time and depending on the first evidence of it to the evidence of when we started doing it to the bulk of it there is a vastly different time frame,
and like I stated earlier - not until Louis Pasteur hit the scene with his "Germ theory of disease" did it become open season on all enzyme activity --- but it does not stop there, cooking totally changes the structure of food and for the most part not only ruins it's molecular structure for proper assimilation - it creates dozens of highly toxic substances that lead to a life of misery and illness.

When in doubt and wondering how things got so out of control and taking a look around you and seeing people who should be in their absolute prime that are on copious amounts of medication just so they can struggle through their day both physically and mentally, ask yourself whats going on? and first ask what's going on in the most basic level, are we screwing up with something real simple?

the answer is yes we are, and in fact so many simple mistakes that most people don't even consider - but are actually very critical,,,
Don't get me wrong, Mr. Pasteur's find was a huge one, but lets work with it, and not loose our heads about it and change the entire biological systems of what got us here in the first place... use intelligence to solve problems - not panic...

I will add this to anyone still interested in reading just where we go wrong, for answers to your healthy future all you need to do is look to the past, put it together, I had too with a mind that barely functioned and yes it took me time - but it worked,

My 5 disciplines that helped bring things around for me and made total sense when reading and thinking about it are the following.

#1. Raw food, start small but make efforts to curb your intake towards eating living things and you will feel like part of the living again, keep track of your percentage ratio's and take it by 10% increments at first - after you surpass the 50% mark you might want to start making it 5% increments, I probably hover around the 70% mark when im being good, it's hard to do much more than that for me as some cooked is just plain handy and some you actually need to to help break it down like rice and beans and such...

#2. proper meal combining, for one can eat the most pristine diet and simply ruin it by combining the wrong foods together at the same time - and that is simple biological chemistry. if you need to know more then study the secretions we use to break things down and how they are not compatible with one another... There was actually allot of care in proper meal preparations this way up until recently - again something that is totally lost now and deemed "unimportant".

#3. fasting. has so many benefits and is also "the norm" of what got us here, it's great to give the system a break so it can focus on repairs and purify itself, remember - hunger is normal - it's that starvation thing you want to try and avoid.

#4. stress management, this is huge in today's fast paced lifestyle - we've literally spun it around on a dime and are going full throttle at all times, not good.

#5. alkalize. you really don't need to worry about this one as the raw food and the proper meal combining will take care of it for you as you will be surviving on allot of fresh alkalizing produce and also not creating huge acidic values by combining the wrong foods, so it just happens naturally.

there's other things like exercise but I generally don't have to remind myself of that one as I usually get plenty...

for what it's worth. my two cents and I wish everyone here a long and happy life no matter how they get it done. :)

flylo
10-29-2014, 10:57 AM
As far as being fit in the shop I do what I can when I can.Breaking my back totally changed my life. My mind still runs 100 but my body at 10. I'm not complaining as I am a very blessed man. You young guys don't take your health & mobility for granted or think " it won't happen to me". Live life to the fullest & with GUSTO! I was 49 & in the best shape in my life, had no back problems & no stenosis, could leg press 650# & bench 400#, hit the gym 5 days a week & loved hard work. Also don't put off the fun stuff, I'm so glad I was able to skydive, motocross, scuba dive, fly, backpack, mountain bike,etc,etc. I was a total adrenaline junkie. And guess what I'm still having a Blast! Oh I get frustrated when I have to have help as I was very independent. As I've said before I'm going to love living till they roll me in the hole. Enjoy life everyday, be Thankful & count your Blessings, not your problems. It's sad to see so many people worry about & let the 2% of what's not right in their lives ruin the 98% that is right.

A.K. Boomer
10-29-2014, 11:48 AM
Flylo you reminded me of something important I forgot --- attitude is also huge - a will to keep going and a general positive outlook and you my friend have just that, and this coming from a fellow "meathead" - that's some pretty good weight you were pushing around... Kudos

oldtiffie
10-29-2014, 07:01 PM
You sure got that right AK

If a positive attitude is not the very top that you need to keep you going it must be very close to it - as my wife and I have found out quite a few times over quite a number of years.

We've had some pretty solid set-backs and some exhilarating highs too - and so far we've come out of it pretty - very!! - well.

We sure do look forward to each day no matter what it brings as we are well able to cope with the aid of some excellent medicos and our positive attitudes.

We are both in our mid-70's and quite well set up comfortably - so long as we are careful.

Life is there to be lived and we live it.