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ibewgypsie
06-09-2004, 05:17 PM
I passed a lady in town today. I used to live with her in the 80's.
She was a buxsom pretty thing ten years younger than me. I was a foreman on a job working 12's doing construction. I came in from work got me a glass of iced tea, she was sunbathing in the back yard. I was admiring her in the window. She came in, got herself a glass of tea. She asked me, "what kind of tricks are you pulling on me?"

AS she was talking to me, a Crow flew down and got something off her towel in the yard. She then related that some of her silver rings I had bought her were missing and she didn't think it was funny. I tried to tell her I saw a crow get them, that made things worse. WHen me and her finally split up she was still mad thinking I had stolen her rings.

Today, I was looking for my air chuck to fill a portable tank, looking everywhere and cussing.. I looked down and my pup had laid the quick connect and chuck right at my feet. He must have snatched it sometime.

DOES THIS JUST HAPPEN TO ME? Is my Karma all screwed up. Does strange things just happen to strange people?

My dog got rewarded with a bowl full of beer, I got a beer drinking pup. Ain't that strange too? Sometimes I worry.

Now I am going to have me a few too. Do some cad work on a new invention.

David

vinito
06-09-2004, 05:29 PM
Dr. Dolittle,
Too bad you didn't have the pup back when the klepto crow was hanging around - it might have balanced out.

Legend has it that crows are the bird of wisdom. He might have been doing you a favor. Now your pup is there doing you favors. After all, who knows for sure some other critter didn't snatch it first. Maybe it is all balancing out. Sounds like good karma to me.

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

[This message has been edited by vinito (edited 06-09-2004).]

John Stevenson
06-09-2004, 05:34 PM
Are Karma's left hand threaded?

Evan
06-09-2004, 05:39 PM
That depend on how it all winds up.

wierdscience
06-09-2004, 08:03 PM
Nah your not messed up,your just noticing things others don't,I do it all the time,has been helpful my whole life.

[This message has been edited by wierdscience (edited 06-09-2004).]

Happy
06-09-2004, 08:43 PM
one of my good friends had his dog sparky drag away his best ever prized buck antlers one year. he looked everywhere and never found them. The next spring he accidentally ran the dog over with a big tractor. I ride him about that poor dog all the time. and, if I have a good audience, I tell everyone that sparky was still chained up.

CCWKen
06-09-2004, 09:27 PM
Around here I'm always having to hunt down the rat nests. 16p nails, bolts, auto bulbs, small car parts; I even pulled a wire brush out of one. I end up having to set out poision then seek out the stink. It's the only way to find the nest. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//frown.gif

jim davies
06-11-2004, 12:53 AM
"...Legend has it that crows are the bird of wisdom. He might have been doing you a favor..."

Not this time. He did say Buxom, did he not?

vinito
06-11-2004, 03:00 AM
Indeed he did say that.
I lived with a buxom beauty for a spell - in my case she was the biggest pain-in-the-ass ever. Of course I'm probably not done yet.
Hopefully David fared better.

tonydacrow
06-11-2004, 03:24 PM
Ibew,

Just take a clue from Happy and don't let your Karma run over your Dogma!

Evan
06-11-2004, 03:48 PM
It happens to me. A couple of months ago I bought a new 18 volt drill, two battery packs and charger with carrying case for $35 US. A real steal! I can't find the charger. I can find any one of the other 57 chargers I have but not that one. It doesn't make any sense. It hasn't left the building and I wouldn't put it far from an electrical outlet. It seems to have slipped sideways into the sock dimension.

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 06-11-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-11-2004, 03:55 PM
Yesterday, my dog ran to the shop, jumped on the door and barked one time.

I came outside and he was back at the gate bouncing straight up about 4 feet and snarling and barking.. It was the UPS man. It kinda reminded me of a tasmanian devil.

I love him being smart, I hate him being so damn aggressive. Especially to people I need.

I think he understands about ten words now. He is 7 1/2 months old and I am really attached to him. He really is stubborn too, I got rid of the shock collar since it would hardly work anymore, he'd stop and scratch it where it was shocking his neck.
http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/Dscn0382.jpg
David

BillH
06-11-2004, 04:01 PM
My friend from High SChool, he had a pet German Shepard. This dog would bark at ANYONE that came to the house except for me. Never ever barked at me.
I go to Florida to visit my Uncle, his neighbor has a black lab, this dog is very nice to everyone but me. The second the dog see's me, she starts growling and barking and runs away. The dog must sense that I want to blow its head off with a shotgun, and runs away. Ofcourse growling back at her never seamed to help things.

Alistair Hosie
06-11-2004, 04:12 PM
IBEW Dear boy
would the schock coller fit my mother in law size 63"neck tightly packed with bulging veins and muscles,and also if you had a bite guard /muzzle to protect my fingers from her gnashing teeth (EVERY ONE TUNGSTEN CARBIDE TIPPED)TO THROW in I would make you a bid for them.I would prefer nothing too harmfull say a coller with a maximum voltage of say 60.000 volts and a minimum of say
59.999 volts.
I like to start of slowly till she gets used to it the crank that switch up till she lights up like a chritmas tree and the blue bottles which swarm around her head constantly buzzing all day long fry.Alistair pheewww sorry for the rant http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif Alistair

pgmrdan
06-11-2004, 04:18 PM
Gee Alistair, don't hold back! Tell us how you really feel about your mother-in-law. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

Alistair Hosie
06-11-2004, 04:57 PM
just joking unfortunately she died a number of years ago and was really a nice old gal http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif Alistair

ibewgypsie
06-11-2004, 05:05 PM
Sorry Alistair..

The shock collar is now lighting up the life of a Rotwieller in Iowa..

David

Dave Opincarne
06-11-2004, 06:52 PM
David, is he intact? From what you're describing it sounds like you're going to have troubles with him and I could see it ending badly. Sounds like a definite alpha wanabe.

Dave

ibewgypsie
06-11-2004, 09:51 PM
Dave:

I really do think he is a Alpha.. I am too.

He just now was raising cane about some kids on bicycles. Not sure what to do with him. I sure am attached to him.

David

Dave Opincarne
06-11-2004, 11:17 PM
Again, I've got red flags going up. From experience I can tell you this could end up with someone hurt and/or overreacting but with a trip to the pound, fines, or the dog being put down. If he's intact have his 'nads removed. I know guys hate the thought but it will reduce agresive dominence behavior and greatly reduce the risk of cancer. I know, I lost a dog to cancer and we didn't heed the advice. If you're playing tug of war or similar games either stop or NEVER let him win or get the upper hand. People like to think about everyone getting a chance, dogs see it as an oportunity to move up the ranks. Watch dogs at play. The alpha always ends up with the prize and will goad the others into trying to take it away. Don't let him get away with anything. Don't be abusive, and be fair, but don't give him an inch. Make eye contact with him and hold it until he looks away or shows a submisive posture. If he doesn't then increase your posture and try a low guteral growl. He'll know what you mean. If he does not back down when push comes to shove or shows that he is going to asssert himself when chalenged by a human then get an experienced trainer involved ASAP. I'm not a profesianal trainer so this advice is worth what you paid for it, but a few things you've said are giving me reason to be concerned.

Dave

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 08:58 AM
Howdy Dave:

Yeah, His "nads" are now in decision. I got a friend with a Bull Mastiff. That dog has bit about ten people now and his nads are gone. I'll talk to a vet.

Reckon it'd help me too? I still have fits of temper. Good thing milling machines don't tip easily.

I am worried about my dog, he gets all the petting he can stand from everyone that comes around and enjoys it. He just don't like people going up the road, or coming into the yard, or... strangers? He has not been aggressive to anyone I/he knows. He waggs that lil stub just happy as can be. He is about 60 pounds now. He is formidable.

I understand what you are saying about body language and Alpha struggle for dominance. He runs beside you and bumps your legs, bully. My daughters Mother was the same way, redhead. People exhibit the same body language.

I stop, correct him. I almost had him out of grabbing tennis shoes too, My wife ( the submissive dear) has him started again. If you pick up something to correct him he minds really good, again a struggle for dominance.

He is my friend, I'd hate to lose everything I have worked for at his mistakes. I have about $600 in vet bills invested in him.

If he has to be put down, well you just bite your lip and do it painlessly. That's the way I want to go anyways, painless.

Ohh and last night, While he was barking at the kids on bicycles I called him down three different times. He'd stand there quivering wanting to raise hell. If you don't teach one of these dogs when they are young, you never will. I've had friends send thiers (same bloodline) to K9 of Chattanooga, they'll take them to train while young, not older. On the upside, I've not lost anything out of the yard lately.

David

[This message has been edited by ibewgypsie (edited 06-12-2004).]

pgmrdan
06-12-2004, 09:36 AM
I've been around dogs all of my life. We have a male dog that was neutered before we got him as a very young pup. He's 2 years old now and still aggressive but never with anyone in the family. He gives people in the vet's office fits. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

Point is, neutering helps but it doesn't take care of everything.

He's very territorial. Growls and barks at everyone that comes within 100' of our yard. But that's not really all bad, of course.

As far as you establishing your dominance, you'll have to work through some exercises on that. Things like holding him like a baby, holding him down on the floor gently by the neck, keeping him off of furniture, making him allow you to examine his eyes, ears, teeth, feet, etc. Things that show that you are the dominant critter in the social pack.

Ask your vet for a good book about dogs.

Good puppy classes teach these things too and allow your dog to socialize with other dogs and people. The training is really for the owners.

It's perfectly normal for a dog to attempt to establish dominance over every member of the pack (family members). Everyone in the family must establish dominance over the dog or else it no longer is a pet, it's the boss. The sooner this is done the easier it will be for the family members and the dog.

And when he knows he's the lowest critter on the totem pole he'll listen better when he's given commands.

Evan
06-12-2004, 10:40 AM
I gained a 75 lb White German Shepard from my brother some years ago. He wouldn't stop fighting with his father at the age of two so they had to be separated. We brought him home to Canada. He was already trained to walk on an invisible leash ( your finger slyly pointed to where he was supposed to be) and was incredibly intelligent. But, he was an alpha male, hence the fights with his dad. We brought him home. One one occasion not long after we got him (allegiance not yet formed) we were at our cabin at a lake and he decided to run off and run some cattle. He wasn't shot and came back after a couple of hours covered in cattle **** (disguise). We had a small argument over his behaviour, he drew some blood from my hand. I got a very thin stick and beat him for for a couple of minutes. He decided that perhaps he should listen to what I said. Some time later when I was at work he decided that our other dog was not to be allowed in the house and took hold of my wife's ankle to stop her from opening the door to let it in. She called me on the cell and I came home pronto. Thor and I had an argument. I beat the crap out of him with a 1/4" X 2" piece of lathe stick, no broken bones, just bruises that he felt for a couple of weeks. After that he was the most obedient and loving dog you ever would want for the rest of his life. He figured out who was the boss and the boss was willing to tussle.

This won't work with all dogs, some it will turn into cowards. Border collies won't stand for this sort of discipline, it will cow them. My Bear Dog just needs a slightly raised voice and a stern look. Although she is an alpha female she knows instinctively what her place is in the family pecking order. But, that shepard needed to be educated or he would have been dead. As it turned out he was one of the best dogs we ever had.

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 06-12-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 10:55 AM
http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/butchsfirstbath.jpg
My pups first bath..

http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/butcbeggin.jpg
Recent picture showing his build, lots of good dog food and love made him this size.

He never growls when you take his food bowl away, never hurries a treat, sits paitiently waiting on you to give it to him.

The old indian way, put the food into your mouth, share your scent with the animal be it horse or dog, the dog bonds with you. I used to feed Carrols housecat like that, bits I was chewing on. The cat prefers me over her.

David

John Stevenson
06-12-2004, 11:00 AM
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by pgmrdan:
Gee Alistair, don't hold back! Tell us how you really feel about your mother-in-law. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif</font>

My Mother in Law is the only woman on record to be kicked out of the Waffen SS for cruelty.

John S.

John Stevenson
06-12-2004, 11:09 AM
Our pup.......

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/stevenson.engineers/lsteve/files/rocky1.jpg


John S.

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 11:29 AM
Evan:

You remember the Monkey and truckdriver movie that was on in the 80s?
The monkey bit him all the time they tried to shoot a scene. The trainer told him to bite him back to show dominance.
When a child bites you, you have to bite them back to stop them. They understand it hurts and don't do it again. Kinda mean but it teaches them primal like.

My dog knows who the Boss is around here, I worry when I ain't around who the boss is thou. I'd hate for him to get ambitious and take the road, the neighbors yard, the whole neighborhood as HIS domain. That'd get him dead and me a big lawsuit.

David

Alistair Hosie
06-12-2004, 12:09 PM
David what kindn of dog did you say that was? the recent two pictures look like a bull dog but the first doesn't must be the angle of the shot. Alistair

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 12:43 PM
Well his father is a Staffordshire terrier, His mom a gentle white american pittbulldog. His father is high strung and very active. Runs around the dog lot most the time. Mine too is hyper.

Someone said the two are the same, His head is more rounded, My pup has too much skin, he was so wrinkled when I got him he looked like a hound dog. I wish they had not cut his tail.
I had a 3/4 pitt 1/4 english bulldog for 8 years. He was protective but not aggressive. Someone poisoned him in a attempt to steal my harley. His head was huge. He weighed 120lbs.

This pup both his parents are about 70 pounds. He is 7 1/2 months old and 60.

David

laddy
06-12-2004, 02:10 PM
Hey,
Maybe the dog thought it was a woodchuck! Get It?? Birds will pick up shiney stuff for their nest. If you look at nests alot of cellophane and old tinsel and cigarrett paper and wrappers end up in the nest. Never dated a buxom good lookin girl though... Fred

CompositeEngr
06-12-2004, 02:21 PM
Evan, what you described doing to your dog would get you arrested most places. If you have to resort to that much force, maybe you should think about not having dogs.

I have a 95 lb dog (@13 months) that never saw that kind of abuse, and he still minds. He is still intact, and he still tries to be the alpha male in the house, but it gets nipped in the bud before he gets out of hand.

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 02:38 PM
Composite:

I have had to resort to force several times with animals. A stick is not as good training as a paper or something that scares and pops. A paper magazine is better than the shock collar I had, but the shock collar would reach out and touch him.

I have had to put several down too. A 22 through the head at close range.
We had one wonderfully natured pitt that was just eat up with red mange. I tried for six months to doctor her, finally had to help her out of this world. That hurt. Sometimes it hurts to do what is right, especially if you don't or won't afford a vet to do it. (euthanasia?)

Sometimes force must be met with force. Keeping calm during times of training is a must thou.

Sometimes I think the Arabs only understand force also. Pity..

David

Dave Opincarne
06-12-2004, 04:21 PM
Evan, I've got to agree, that sounds like too much. A technique for severe transgresions is to grab the dog by the skin at the back of the neck and shoulders. Jerk the dog up and back lifting their front paws off the ground and keeping them off balance. As you're doing this shake them violently from side to side and growel or shout using the lowest guteral tones you can muster. Don't be so violent as to cause injury but be agresive. Be prepared with a towel, the dog will likley pee itself. I've used this once or twice. I've been able to just growel at my dog when she's made a major transgesion now and she'll empty her bladder on the spot. A little messy but at least I know I can "reach out and touch" her with just my voice. This is a technique recomended by the monks of New Skete who as part of there order train and raise shepards.

Three boks I highly recomend are:

How to Be Your Dog's Best Friend
by Monks of New Skete http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1565113373/absolutsearch05/104-6855069-4651915[/UR L]

Good Owners, Great Dogs
by Brian Kilcommons, Sarah Wilson [URL=http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0446675385/ref=pd_sxp_elt_l1/104-6855069-4651915]http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0446675385/ref=pd_sxp_elt_l1/104-6855069-4651915 (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1565113373/absolutsearch05/104-6855069-4651915)

Don't Shoot the Dog: The New Art of Teaching and Training
by Karen Pryor http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0553380397/ref=pd_sxp_elt_l1/104-6855069-4651915 (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0553380397/ref=pd_sxp_elt_l1/104-6855069-4651915)

Hope this helps

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v245/dmopincarne/Abby_Nov-02_018-A.jpg

Dave and Skye



[This message has been edited by Dave Opincarne (edited 06-12-2004).]

pgmrdan
06-12-2004, 04:37 PM
Evan,

I agree that what you described will get you into trouble in a lot of places and I don't think I could bring myself to do what you did in the second incident but from what you said I will have to say you may have been right doing what you did.

What our (on the surface) sanitized society says is that violence is never necessary and you should never have to resort to physical punishment. Nonsense!

Punishment through pain is how nature teaches critters every day.

If we touch something hot we get burned and learn not to do it again. If we stick scissors in a wall outlet we get zapped and don't do it again. Pain teaches valuable lessons!

Sounds like you didn't do any permanent damage to the dog and it became an acceptable pet. Through punishment you probably saved its life.

I gotta back you up on this one.

It's strange that a smack with a switch is not acceptable but a zap from a shock collar is. Neither does permanent damage and both hurt like hell.

I also agree with what you said about Border Collies. Our Border Collie would do something wrong and all you had to do was say, "Nooooo!" in a low harsh voice and he would slink away embarassed. He wouldn't repeat the offense.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 06-12-2004).]

Dave Opincarne
06-12-2004, 04:53 PM
pgmrdan-

Valid points. I'm not saying punishment is not apropriate, only some types (abusive). Negative stimuli needs to be imidiate and in such a manner the dog is capible of understanding. I do use a shock collar at times. There's a key difference though between the collar and the switch. If the collar is used corectly the dog assosiates the shock with the behavior. You can't do that with the switch. In order for the punishment to truely be effective the dog needs to be able to make the connection between its actions and the results.
Edit:

Boarder Collies are notorious for being 'soft' dogs. Soft means beeing sensative to punishment. Basicly the opposite of hard headed. My concern with physical punishment is it seems like an easy solution and can get out of hand. It's easy to ruin a good dog that way. An example: Dog bites; If the dog bit out of aggresion then quick severe retrabution is in order. But if the dog bit out of fear then physical punishment is going to make the problem worse, not better. All you've done is reinforce the dog's need to defend itself. Careful thought and understanding of the dogs action is required. Apropriate punishment is OK, abuse or a kneejerk reaction is not. BTW, the collar is no as bad as the switch. I tried out the collar myself before it went anywhere close to Skye. Woman at the store though I was nuts trying it on myself. Told here there was no way I'd use it without knowing what it felt like. What it feels like is bad 'pins and needles' when your foot falls asleep.

Dave

[This message has been edited by Dave Opincarne (edited 06-12-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-12-2004, 04:55 PM
When My little girl throwed a temper tantrum at the local 5&dime store I took her outside and wore her bottom out.

I was concerned cause all the people standing in the window with thier mouths open. (watching the large tattooed bearded man whip a kid) I might have went to jail. But, I am a parent and until they do I rule the roost around here.

She is 8 and not acted up like that since. Hard lesson, hard on a parent to spank a child, but easier then getting spanked yourself as they mature. I know one couple that adhered to some shrinks' method of raising children without spankings, NOW two are in prison, others are stealing thier retirement checks. A little late now.

Picking the dog up, shaking it might work to get thier undivided attention. Not real sure I want to do that to a very muscular 60 pound dog with sparkly white teeth thou.
I did pick my dog up recently, put him under my rt arm and walk him to the house. He had grabbed my shoe and I was drinking. When I put him down he did the head down, okay you're the boss look to me. Snatching them up and controlling them teaches them as well as hurting them.

What I have learned, never hit any animal with your hand, they will lose respect. If you hit a horse with a stick, they will fear the stick and not you. If you hit them with your hand they fear you. Dogs bite out of fear. Just like scared people in a bar will kill you.

David

[This message has been edited by ibewgypsie (edited 06-12-2004).]

Evan
06-12-2004, 07:07 PM
The punishment I meted out to my dog Thor saved his life. He had been raised in a non-optimal situation and thought he was the boss. The only way to convince him to change his attitude was to give what he thought was a near death experience. He was not actually hurt beyond what you would experience in a fist fight, that basically is what it was. I was hurt, he was hurt more, but nothing lasting. If I hadn't done that he would have been put down. As it turned out he became a proud and extremely loyal and protective dog. He was not cowed or submissive in any way. He just decided that he knew who the boss was and was never going to try to challenge again.

This is the way you must deal with some dogs. It is not appropriate for most. Most "pure bred dogs" are nothing of the sort. The real Dog is the exact same DNA as the wolf, the are the same species, Canis Lupis. In the wild the teacher is the leader of the pack. If necessary he will kill the subordinate. Usually he will simply teach him a tough lessson as I did, and the subordinate will live.

I know dogs. I know what they need and what they want. I love dogs, some times too much. They don't live long enough. When they die it hurts so bad that it feels like a child has died. Our Border Collies lived for 18 and 19 years.

Thor, the white shepard that I disiplined with the stick lived for 12 more years until he died of a twisted bowel. I couldn't take him to the vet to have him put out of his misery. My wife did it. He was the most incredible dog I have ever known. He was the Einstein of the dog world. He was loyal, obedient and like a child of mine. When he died I cried for days.

[This message has been edited by Evan (edited 06-12-2004).]

Arcane
06-12-2004, 09:03 PM
I have two German Shepherds from the same parents but different litters. The male is 21 months older than the female and at 125 lbs is half again as heavy as her, but she is the alpha dog and he knows it, even though he is intact while she has been spayed. She is faster than he is and she knows it and she torments the hell out of him somedays! She ran off one day for a couple of minutes to check out the neighbourhood and when she came back, I was waiting for her on the sidewalk. She knew she wasn`t supposed to run off like that and as soon as she was at my feet I said her name in a disapproving tone of voice and she peed herself. I have never had to physically correct her which is a very good thing as she is a very sensitive little girl. My male on the other hand has gone head to head with me on more than one occassion. He has learned not to try to Dominate me, and is really a gentle dog now as he understands when he stands in the order of things. He is territorial as all get out and the pair of them are the best security I could ask for. No one in their right mind would try to enter my yard with the noise and din they make but once outside the yard they are completely fine with people. Best of both worlds I think! They may be "just dogs" but I love them like they were my children.

Arcane
06-12-2004, 09:03 PM
Oops! Double post!

[This message has been edited by Arcane (edited 06-12-2004).]

Alistair Hosie
06-12-2004, 09:19 PM
DAVID I never raised my hands to any of my boys in my life.
I have as you know three sons all grown up now I don't believe in it sorry that's just my opinion, and they all turned out smashing kids into wonderful adults still well behaved and full and good members of the community etc.
I like you am a big man weigh in at around three hundred pounds and broad with it I am like you as strong as a horse and never like the idea of hitting them, and I always repeat "always" found that growling at them with my voice lowered a few bars did i. e "RIGHT NOW THAT'S ENOUGH OF THAT ETC" in a very low tone did the trick they knew when I meant business and stopped misbehaving immediately.
Worked for me but then I wondered sometimes if I just had good kids a couple of my neighbours real christian bible beater types was bringing up three kids she was always getting in between them as the boys fought like cat and dog and the father wore out too but they were very well behaved kids just fought with each other at every opportunity which mine never did so was it me or was it them I suggest I just was lucky enough to have good kids who never tried it too hard. Alistair

wierdscience
06-12-2004, 09:51 PM
B.J.McCay and his best friend bear,was the show,hey I know!Maybe what you need is a orange and white cabover http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif Either that or take him to truckdriving school http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//biggrin.gif

[This message has been edited by wierdscience (edited 06-12-2004).]

CompositeEngr
06-12-2004, 10:56 PM
Evan, This is the part I had a problem with: "... and beat him for for a couple of minutes". That sounds more like anger, not training.

I'm not saying force isn't necessary, and my dog has been smacked a couple of times, and he has had some force applied. Especially when he was at that stage all dogs get when they bite EVERYTHING!
We have an invisible fence for him with the shock collar, too. I tried it out, and while its worse than pins and needles, it is a lot better than a fist fight, or getting hit by a truck.
Tone and posture, and not letting the dog win at tug-of-war goes a long way toward solving behavioral issues.

BillH
06-12-2004, 11:04 PM
Well, my neighbor got a new dog, Max is part Pit Bull, and something else. The head and neck is extremely muscular, this dog if he wanted to, could bite your arm off.

However, with that said, I've never seen a more friendly dog that loved people so much.
Just walk near him, his tail starts wagging like nothing else, runs up to you licking and wanting to be petted. Just loves everyone. It kinda kills the stereotype of pitbulls, but I am more inclined to think that Max is just different.

Evan
06-13-2004, 01:17 AM
Composite,

It wasn't anger, it was a fight. He lost. He never tried me again. It changed his mind for the rest of his life. It did not hurt him and he was a proud dog.

http://vts.bc.ca/img/thor.jpg

ibewgypsie
06-13-2004, 10:10 AM
Pittbulldogs love people as a rule, One thing to watch out for with them. DON"T let the neighbor kids come into the yard and start wrestling with your kids. They are protective. Wagging the tail one second and pulling the neighborkid off your kid in the next. AND, what is that mailman doing in "YOUR yard"? He used to mace mine. Made him hate him. I cursed him out and he said I could pick my mail up at the post office.

I have saw that firsthand. I also didn't spank my stepkids around that dog. He'd try to eat me up. The kids would lay on him and twist his ears and put dirt into his mouth. I could not crank a harley without him getting really mad at me. Someone told me the dog thinks the motorcycle is getting you, and he tries to save you by pulling you off it.

He was a terrier. Like Spuds. I could throw a tennis ball as fast as I could on either side of his head and he'd catch it. Sometimes bursting the ball. Right out of the air.

American Pitt bulldogs were the most popular breed in America in the 1900s. Spanky had one on the lil rascals, it was a stray that walked onto the set and they drawed a circle around his eye for effect. ONLY one dog, not seven like lassie.
I recently had a friend bring a "mountain cur" over to his parents house to keep a bear out of the garden. Sure enough it was a pitt bulldog. Loving and gentle untill it saw a bear or wild hog, then all business.

ANY animal that has been abused, has mental problems or sick is dangerous to everything and everyone around it (people too). Pitts because of thier speed and muscle really are a danger, just like any large strong animal. I saw a jack mule shake a small boy by the shoulder one day. Really mean crazed animal.

Well.. other then having several of these dogs as friends that is about the extent of my knowledge about them.

David

pgmrdan
06-13-2004, 02:54 PM
.

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 06-13-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-13-2004, 08:33 PM
Now why did you delete that?

Perhaps with a lil cheddar sauce?

HA ..

David

pgmrdan
06-13-2004, 08:45 PM
On second thought, I didn't want to hurt your feelings by saying something bad about your best friend. We all know how sensitive you are. http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//smile.gif

[This message has been edited by pgmrdan (edited 06-13-2004).]

BillH
06-13-2004, 11:27 PM
Well, too bad my pistol permit is not good in NY, incase that dog ever decides to hurt someone in my family.
You know, thinking about it now, I Think it might be a terrier bull mix.
Those American Pittbulls, inbreading them, to get that look, they have to have C sections to give birth.

ibewgypsie
06-13-2004, 11:52 PM
Bill..

My lil girl was bit by my brothers chihuahua when she was 4.
I hate it, my ears ring when I see it. I picked it up right after it bit her and twisted its head over 270 degrees around, his mouth went over the top and nearly back around, things crunched and I thought I killed it. I throwed it down, it bounced, got up and ran off. It eats out of the corner of his (my brothers) mouth, he loves it that much, it's lil cockroach eyes bug out when it sees me or her. I probably won't visit again untill it passes. I want to stomp it everytime I see it. she was tramatized. Perhaps feed it to my dog for a snack. I hold a grudge.

If the pitt is friendly and wags its tail, odds are it will never be aggressive to you or yours. Sounds like a even tempered dog. Mixed blood dogs you can never be sure how they will turn out, either a diamond or a stone.

Getting a purebred dog is much better, you at least know what the parents acted like. That is , without considering inbreeding.

David

SJorgensen
06-14-2004, 12:17 AM
I was playing with my Uncles dog once. I was probably the only on who taught the dog anything and it was quite a coddled dog and I didn't get to see it very often. Something like every other summer. One time it challenged me. I think it was over a stick that I was taking from it or something. This dog was probably a 50 or 60 pounder. When it bared it's teeth at me and tried to bite I grabbed its neck with both hands and lifted it up off the ground. It trashed and snarled like a little devil for a while, but it learned that I was in total control and it didn't like it a bit. When I tossed it away it didn't come back for more. I never had any more trouble with it but I advised my uncle not to let it around any kids.

Sometimes when animals act like this it is because they are suffering from something and we have no way of knowing it.

Spence

BillH
06-14-2004, 12:18 AM
Yeh, the dog is really a very nice dog, but you just cant not notice how thick its neck is, and the head, and just wonder what it could do if he ever snapped. Almost wonder if its a ticking time bomb.
I used to have a cat, would jump on my lap, pur like crazy, loved to be petted. THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN, its claws would come out, GROWLING. I would stop moving instantly, not make a move, and let the cat get off my lap by itself. Tuxedo allways had the damn sharpest claws I ever felt. You'd think he would be as pashionate as Evan towards projects, as this cat was with the sharpness of his claws. I wonder if he used a buffing wheel.

[This message has been edited by BillH (edited 06-14-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-14-2004, 08:05 AM
BillH:

Sounds like my exwife.

David