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John Stevenson
05-15-2015, 05:36 AM
Went out and bought meself a new lathe. A Colchester Bantam 1600 MKII

Well new to me and was new in 1980 but has been in storage ever since, a bit tatty and needs a real good clean up as it's had stuff piled on top of it for the last 35 years.

At the moment it's hard to see full condition but to having to literally climb over mountains of gear to get to it.

Looks like this one off Tony's page but has the stand with the central drawer in it.

http://www.lathes.co.uk/bantam/img2.gif

Got gears, chucks and faceplate but couldn't see any steadies.

Need to pop back in two weeks to collect it as they need to get a large 10 tonne or so fork truck in to move some power presses that are in the way.

Bought it for me new girlfriend as it's an imperial machine and she spent all of her working life in the States and don't do metric and my lathes confuse the hell out of her.

Black Forest
05-15-2015, 06:21 AM
Went out and bought meself a new lathe. A Colchester Bantam 1600 MKII

Well new to me and was new in 1980 but has been in storage ever since, a bit tatty and needs a real good clean up as it's had stuff piled on top of it for the last 35 years.

At the moment it's hard to see full condition but to having to literally climb over mountains of gear to get to it.

Looks like this one off Tony's page but has the stand with the central drawer in it.

http://www.lathes.co.uk/bantam/img2.gif

Got gears, chucks and faceplate but couldn't see any steadies.

Need to pop back in two weeks to collect it as they need to get a large 10 tonne or so fork truck in to move some power presses that are in the way.

Bought it for me new girlfriend as it's an imperial machine and she spent all of her working life in the States and don't do metric and my lathes confuse the hell out of her.

Clumsy Blond is she?

John Stevenson
05-15-2015, 07:37 AM
She was blonde but I wouldn't say clumsy, she's a gen-u-ine rocket scientist and coded welder as well.
If she wants thou's, she's got thou's.

No contest.;)

oldtiffie
05-15-2015, 07:47 AM
Great news John.

mars-red
05-15-2015, 08:29 AM
Sounds like you have yourself a real keeper there, John! (and the lathe is pretty good too!)

Did your lady friend work in Huntsville, by any chance? I have family there, they don't call it "Rocket City" for nothing.

flylo
05-15-2015, 08:36 AM
Good for you, did the owner take those 100 year old notes that have been hiding in that wallet all these decades?

John Stevenson
05-15-2015, 09:02 AM
Sounds like you have yourself a real keeper there, John! (and the lathe is pretty good too!)

Did your lady friend work in Huntsville, by any chance? I have family there, they don't call it "Rocket City" for nothing.

No Davis AFB then for Bert Rutan.

tlfamm
05-15-2015, 09:26 AM
Congrats on the new lady friend, John.


Does she like Bridgeports???

:)

justanengineer
05-15-2015, 09:33 AM
Gonna paint it bright neon pink for her too Sir John? Or would that be for yourself so you have a lathe thats easy to see when you get old?

Toolguy
05-15-2015, 10:20 AM
Sounds like a good trade to me! A lathe for a girlfriend!:rolleyes: It sounds like life is pretty good now. I am happy for you and wish you both All the Best.

wierdscience
05-15-2015, 10:31 AM
Are you going to get his and hers insert tool holders?:D

browne92
05-15-2015, 10:32 AM
Bought it for me new girlfriend...

She caught you hook, line, and sinker, didn't she? Clumsy bastard. :D

Toolguy
05-15-2015, 10:36 AM
Are you going to get his and hers insert tool holders?:D

Just guessing - I suspect they already have that.:cool:

wierdscience
05-15-2015, 11:06 AM
Just guessing - I suspect they already have that.:cool:

Get your mind out of the gutter :D

loose nut
05-15-2015, 11:08 AM
Wasn't Clolchester bought out by Bridgeport?

mikem
05-15-2015, 12:51 PM
Congratulations on the new girlfriend and the new lathe!

Looking forward to the posts of your next projects!

RichR
05-15-2015, 12:52 PM
Clumsy Blond is she?

That's LeBlond to you.

jhe.1973
05-15-2015, 01:45 PM
That's LeBlond to you.

Now THAT'S funny!

:D

malbenbut
05-15-2015, 02:26 PM
post a picture of your lathe

MBB

John Stevenson
05-15-2015, 03:31 PM
post a picture of your lathe

MBB

I would if I could see enough of it to take one :)

In another building either side of a central gangway, various machine parts like automated packaging machines, printing machines etc are stacked to a hight of about 6'. The guy pointed to the far corner, about 30' away and said "There is a Myford Super 7 long bed in that corner with all the attachments." Wasn't interested but this also could have been a brand new machine that went straight into storage.
Anyone who was interested would have to wait years before they got to all this.

There were some double linear slides with servo motors and ball screws, 2 screw and 4 slides, 2 motors per unit, probably 20mm screw and a travel of 18" ? They were stacked crossed in pairs to a hight of 6', rows and rows of them. No idea how many 500 plus, could even have been thousand plus as don't know how deep the rows went.
He said they put them on Ebay from time to time and people make cnc things [ his words ] out of them.

I only got to see in 3 buildings and there must have been 10 -15 other buildings. This whole place has been shut down for years and the guy who bought the whole place is slowly stripping bits and and selling them, and I mean slowly.

Black Forest
05-15-2015, 03:54 PM
post a picture of your lathe

MBB

Screw that, post a picture of the girlfriend!

justanengineer
05-15-2015, 04:37 PM
I would if I could see enough of it to take one :)


Blind bastard, a good coat of pink would surely solve that! :p

tmarks11
05-15-2015, 04:43 PM
No Davis AFB then for Bert Rutan.
man, he has been my hero since I was 10 yo.

boslab
05-15-2015, 05:24 PM
I didn't expect less of a pedigree, the lathe I mean, nice one john
Mark

Mcostello
05-15-2015, 10:08 PM
Lets see a few pictures of Her skills, fixtures, and machining jobs. Maybe John has a challenge on His hands! Who is the best? Competition from His own house! :)

Evan
05-15-2015, 10:32 PM
Well, if John can find a new girlfriend there must be hope for me. ;)

wierdscience
05-15-2015, 10:58 PM
Well, if John can find a new girlfriend there must be hope for me. ;)

That's just what you need Evan,a hot young thing,if that doesn't kill you nothing will:D

JRouche
05-15-2015, 11:34 PM
I would if I could see enough of it to take one :)

In another building either side of a central gangway........... The guy pointed to the far corner, about 30' away and said "There is a Myford Super 7 long bed in that corner with all the attachments." Wasn't interested but this also could have been a brand new machine that went straight into storage.

WoW John!!! You found a honey hole. I have been lucky only once to have "stumbled" onto the proverbial stack of stashed machines. My problem was one of space, no room for the machines. The money was not an issue cause the seller was asking 10% of the marketable value.

And a honey hole is where you stumble upon someone else's, stored, practically new machines and tools and they are stack to 6' high.

A Myford with attachments? NICE!!

OH... That Bantam... Nice!! D1-3 head? Great headstock, oil bathed, roller bearings. Gonna be a nice lathe for the shop. Congratulations.... JR

Evan
05-15-2015, 11:39 PM
That's just what you need Evan,a hot young thing,if that doesn't kill you nothing willhttp://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/images/smilies/biggrin.png

It beats the hell out of some of the possible alternatives. http://ixian.ca/pics11/grin.png

LKeithR
05-16-2015, 12:07 AM
...needs a real good clean up as it's had stuff piled on top of it for the last 35 years...

Sounds like it'll be right at home in your shop...;)

John Stevenson
05-16-2015, 01:52 AM
Sounds like it'll be right at home in your shop...;)

ROTFLMAO

That's gotta be a classic.

AFAIK there are these two lathes, a small folder ~2 foot and a larger 4' guillotine that make the machine tools up. Everything was bought to set a maintenance shop up but it never happened and everything was stored.

Everything else there is production equipment or what is left of production equipment like line printers, packaging and the like, but just buildings full of it.
OK if you want air cylinders, linear rails, air valves by the tonne etc.

I have been looking for this lathe for about 2 - 3 years as a lot of people know the story but TBH I thought it was an urban legend, like the brand new WWII motor bikes in crates and it's only been the last three weeks I got a true lead on it.

AS regards the girlfriend I'm wary of posting as she is a very nice lady but a very private person. As regards projects she can definitely hold her own.

Before she went to the States she started to build a plane from a set of plans, not a kit. She was 15 when she bought the plans. The plane was part built before she went and after her degree she had it shipped over and she finished it there. It's a Long-Ez but modified with a 6 cylinder Lycoming instead of the standard 4.

She used to use this to fly into work at Davis from the High Sierras where she lived.

When she left the States to move back here she flew this across the Atlantic, single handed and it's still here in storage at the moment.

OK sneak preview.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/rocket%20scientist%20small.jpg

;)

wierdscience
05-16-2015, 02:22 AM
ROTFLMAO

Before she went to the States she started to build a plane from a set of plans, not a kit. She was 15 when she bought the plans. The plane was part built before she went and after her degree she had it shipped over and she finished it there. It's a Long-Ez but modified with a 6 cylinder Lycoming instead of the standard 4.

She used to use this to fly into work at Davis from the High Sierras where she lived.

When she left the States to move back here she flew this across the Atlantic, single handed and it's still here in storage at the moment.


I'm impressed,sounds like one in a million to me!

Toolguy
05-16-2015, 02:41 AM
Sounds like one in a hundred million to me. ;) John - quick go buy a bunch of lotto tickets!!!

Black Forest
05-16-2015, 03:39 AM
Sounds like one in a hundred million to me. ;) John - quick go buy a bunch of lotto tickets!!!

Why would he buy lotto tickets now.........what are the chances of winning the lotto twice?

Black Forest
05-16-2015, 03:40 AM
ROTFLMAO

That's gotta be a classic.

AFAIK there are these two lathes, a small folder ~2 foot and a larger 4' guillotine that make the machine tools up. Everything was bought to set a maintenance shop up but it never happened and everything was stored.

Everything else there is production equipment or what is left of production equipment like line printers, packaging and the like, but just buildings full of it.
OK if you want air cylinders, linear rails, air valves by the tonne etc.

I have been looking for this lathe for about 2 - 3 years as a lot of people know the story but TBH I thought it was an urban legend, like the brand new WWII motor bikes in crates and it's only been the last three weeks I got a true lead on it.

AS regards the girlfriend I'm wary of posting as she is a very nice lady but a very private person. As regards projects she can definitely hold her own.

Before she went to the States she started to build a plane from a set of plans, not a kit. She was 15 when she bought the plans. The plane was part built before she went and after her degree she had it shipped over and she finished it there. It's a Long-Ez but modified with a 6 cylinder Lycoming instead of the standard 4.

She used to use this to fly into work at Davis from the High Sierras where she lived.

When she left the States to move back here she flew this across the Atlantic, single handed and it's still here in storage at the moment.

OK sneak preview.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/rocket%20scientist%20small.jpg

;)

Does she work the Border Collie on sheep?

aostling
05-16-2015, 05:29 AM
John,

Is your new partner really a rocket scientist? Ask her: "what is the integral of one over cabin d(cabin)." Let us know If she doesn't laugh when you tell her the answer ("log cabin") -- there are other tests.

malbenbut
05-16-2015, 06:46 AM
I'm at the stage now when my wife says are you going to sleep or what I pretend I've never heard her.

MBB

camdigger
05-16-2015, 10:46 AM
Congratulations on the excellent finds - both of them. May you enjoy both for many years to come!

flylo
05-16-2015, 01:08 PM
I would if I could see enough of it to take one :)

In another building either side of a central gangway, various machine parts like automated packaging machines, printing machines etc are stacked to a hight of about 6'. The guy pointed to the far corner, about 30' away and said "There is a Myford Super 7 long bed in that corner with all the attachments." Wasn't interested but this also could have been a brand new machine that went straight into storage.
Anyone who was interested would have to wait years before they got to all this.

There were some double linear slides with servo motors and ball screws, 2 screw and 4 slides, 2 motors per unit, probably 20mm screw and a travel of 18" ? They were stacked crossed in pairs to a hight of 6', rows and rows of them. No idea how many 500 plus, could even have been thousand plus as don't know how deep the rows went.
He said they put them on Ebay from time to time and people make cnc things [ his words ] out of them.

I only got to see in 3 buildings and there must have been 10 -15 other buildings. This whole place has been shut down for years and the guy who bought the whole place is slowly stripping bits and and selling them, and I mean slowly.

Sounds like it may be a gold mine to me, I'd try to buy them out.:p

flylo
05-16-2015, 01:12 PM
Looks like a WIN-WIN for you, Congrats!

motorworks
05-16-2015, 07:48 PM
A Colchester ! wow great lathe and a lady who can drive one !! Win Win
Could not happen to a better person
all the best
eddie

mike4
05-16-2015, 08:05 PM
Lets see what happens in his shop , women have a tendency to tidy things up , we could see some concrete again!.

Congratulations on both finds Sir John .

Michael

John Stevenson
05-17-2015, 09:20 AM
I'm gradually seeing concrete again as I start to downsize a bit.

Not a Tiffie move and bin everything but some stuff has been sold off and some given away to deserving users. Shortly need to do a welding bench cull as it's grown out of all proportion. Three machines there have not been used in the last 4 or 5 years so no real point in continuing to own them and should free up some real estate, more for better working that replacement.

At the moment I get by with two MiG's, one TiG and a small plasma cutter plus a stick welder for cast iron. As these do all I need then everything else can go.

Back in 2000 I cleared a local college out, machines, tooling, literally loads of gear, there were 7 Harrison 140 lathes for a start. I lot of this was sold on which was what it was bought for but the pack rat virus hit and this box of xxx and that box of yyy was saved as " might be useful "

Well these boxes just sit here to this day, I have an idea of what is in some but not everything, so why do I need them if I have never been in the boxes in 15 years ?

I pride myself on working smart but I could work faster if I could get around better with less clutter.

At the moment Debs and myself do not share a property, she is 110 miles away in a tiny house owned by her parents and she lives there to look after them, both are quite elderly and cannot live on their own. The plan is when anything happens to them she will move out and come to live with me. In the meanwhile her parents take top slot.

When that day does come though I will have to be ready to take an influx of her possessions and tools so any help at getting organised will be gratefully received.

sawlog
05-17-2015, 10:07 AM
At the moment Debs and myself do not share a property, she is 110 miles away in a tiny house owned by her parents and she lives there to look after them, both are quite elderly and cannot live on their own. The plan is when anything happens to them she will move out and come to live with me. In the meanwhile her parents take top slot.

.

John that is good of her, also of your self. Too bad more folks don't feel the same way

Black Forest
05-17-2015, 10:11 AM
John that is good of her, also of your self. Too bad more folks don't feel the same way

Maybe some folks don't have nice parents!

motorworks
05-17-2015, 05:11 PM
John
A long time back you post about having a high speed threading attachment for a Colchester 15" x50"
Do you still have it ?
LMK
eddie

John Stevenson
05-17-2015, 05:57 PM
Yes got two of them, imperial model and the metric model.

Charles P
05-17-2015, 06:02 PM
Yes got two of them, imperial model and the metric model.

Two Colchester Ainjests and no Colchester lathe is great shorthand for "Too much stuff that I don't need"!



Charles

John Stevenson
05-17-2015, 06:50 PM
Two Colchester Ainjests and no Colchester lathe is great shorthand for "Too much stuff that I don't need"!



Charles


Never a truer word spoken although I will soon be the owner of a Colchester although it is the Bantam which these will not fit

Mcostello
05-17-2015, 09:34 PM
If it EVER gets here, I've just bought a Clausing Colchester in 15"X 50",later model. Lathe impatience is setting in.

oldtiffie
05-17-2015, 09:42 PM
Well done both John and his good lady.

I sincerely wish you both all happiness and everything that you wish for yourselves - you both deserve it and each other- a really really good match.

motorworks
05-18-2015, 07:33 AM
Yes got two of them, imperial model and the metric model.

can we make a deal ? :)

John Stevenson
05-18-2015, 07:39 AM
Yup,
Pop over and collect them, I'll be in all summer.

John Stevenson
05-31-2015, 09:22 AM
OK update.

Right, Friday shot off in the Donald to collect it.
I had seen it or rather part of the top corner as in the new place it was completely covered - again [ best Forrest Gump voice ]


It was clear when I got there, only a couple of pallets in the way but soon sorted with a fork truck, then dragged it out.

Jesus H Christ with a Bridgeport !! What a mess, this thing was lathered. I think what they had done is sprayed it with old oil about 100 times then just stored but all every bit of wind blown rubbish from Birmingham to Bristol had managed to stick to it. I didn't take a picture as it was so bad.

Hover everywherr you wiped it came off OK and what was underneath was good.

So got it back, dragged it out of the van, chucked about a gallon of degreaser all over it and staem cleaned it off.

Da-da.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam3.jpg

Come up like new.

So a quick furkle round and get the doors off the back place as they won't fold back flat and the fork truck only has 2" clearance down the side of the shop.

As I say a bit tight.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam4.jpg

And that's as far as it will go with a lift, so now down to handball.

I have a set of very good skates but don't like them on lathes as they are too top heavy, plus when you are done you have to get them off the skates which is a job and a worry in itself.
Hate rollers with a vengeance, pick up move, pick up , move and if one slips out it 10:1 over on it's arse.

I prefer railway lines.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam5.jpg

How can it fall over if it's only 3/8" off the floor [ if it were a metric lathe it would be 10mm ] Plus you get to go 5 or 6 feet at a time unaided.
End of the job just pry up and pull the bar out, no jacks etc.

So 49 minutes later all into position and that included taking the doors off. Just me doing this, no help at all.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam6.jpg

God this thing is tiny. It measures 36" from floor to centre of cross slide. To compare the TOS and the Great Wall lathe are both 39" plus Gert MKll ™ is 5' 15" tall so i reckon it needs a 4" 'I' beam frame making up with jacking screws ?

Got a couple of weeks before she is down again. Got all the chucks, headstock centre, the stubby 4 1/2 Morse thing and all the imperial screw cutting gears. Not worried about metric, easier to swap lathes. Missing the steadies though, not too worried about travelling steady but will have to make a fixed steady as they fetch mega serious money over here.

Anyway now got it and it's in so time to play later. From checking dates these first came out in late 1979 and this one has been stood for 35 years so at the most it's only 3 and a bit years old so not too bad a deal seeing as it cost less than the average Myford S7 here.

mickeyf
05-31-2015, 10:38 AM
What are you using for railway lines? Please explain how this works, it's new to me. The few times I've moved machines I've made do (nervously and awkwardly) with rollers or something else with wheels.

Guido
05-31-2015, 11:02 AM
3/8 x 3/8 sq, or 3/8 in. dia steel bars, your choice.

KIMFAB
05-31-2015, 11:30 AM
What are you using for railway lines? Please explain how this works, it's new to me. The few times I've moved machines I've made do (nervously and awkwardly) with rollers or something else with wheels.

For one person moves it is almost as easy to slide it along a piece of steel as it is to roll on rollers and have to move the rollers constantly and you have full control.
Sometimes with rollers the machine will get a mind of its own if the floor isn't perfect.

Congrats John on the lathe and girlfriend, watch out tho my new girlfriend is working me pretty hard.

http://www.kimfab.com/pictures/DSC05705a.JPG

That was all plain dirt.
It's OK tho - my girlfriend came with a Hossfield bender.

mickeyf
05-31-2015, 11:33 AM
And you simply push it, and small contact area = small friction = not much pressure needed?

KIMFAB
05-31-2015, 11:47 AM
Yeah, you'll need a bar, of course but specially with a lathe the tradeoff between a little extra push on the bar against the possible uncontrolled movement of a roller is an easy choice.

John Stevenson
05-31-2015, 11:52 AM
And you simply push it, and small contact area = small friction = not much pressure needed?

Exactly, saw this done first years ago when I went to pick an Elliot vertical mill up [ similar to a bridgy but more rigid ] it was in a shop with a laid brick floor belonging to a 72 year old guy who was retiring. Now laid brick is bad on a floor, every joint is a catch hazard.
I offered to get it out and he said no, just pry barred it up, slide a couple of 1/2" round bars under it that had been greased and then another two at the side of where the original two ended. Got behind it and just pushed it straight out thru the doors.

Never seen anything so simple and quick.

DICKEYBIRD
05-31-2015, 12:06 PM
Right, Friday shot off in the Donald to collect it.SAY WHAT??

Something new to sell on ebay? I know you fancy yerself a clever b@stard but this one is disgusting!



;)

RichR
05-31-2015, 01:12 PM
... plus Gert MKll is 5' 15" tall ...

We imperialists call that 6' 3".

John Stevenson
05-31-2015, 01:40 PM
We imperialists call that 6' 3".

We Brits call that humour :p

mickeyf
05-31-2015, 01:44 PM
Railway lines. I will definitely try this. I expect to have a move coming up hopefully before the year is out. Wanting downsize the house and upsize the shop to something larger than my single car garage. (And hope to retire within several more years so that I actually have time to spend in it. ;-) )

EddyCurr
05-31-2015, 02:36 PM
Aye, 65 posts and naught a single "You Suck" ?

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam3.jpg

.

J Harp
05-31-2015, 02:36 PM
For years when people would ask "how tall are you", I would answer five-eighteen. It took a while for the light to come on with some of them.

aribert
06-01-2015, 01:02 PM
"Bought it for me new girlfriend as it's an imperial machine and she spent all of her working life in the States... "

After much to do the past several years regarding the OP and his former POS bridgy, seven pages to this thread and no one has speculated that the new girlfriend, having worked in the US, might be itching to have a Bridgeport to go with the imperial lathe? Back to lurk mode.

John Stevenson
06-01-2015, 03:38 PM
No way, Bridgeport free zone here, got something similar but a lot better.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/Blidgeport.jpg

It's a clone on steroids.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bligeport%20rising%20block%20travels.jpg

511 mm spindle to table or just over 20"
10 x 54 table and 3Hp motor. Three phase motor built into the knee for power feed.
Weights about 1500 Kg or 1 and a half tonne. Fully tooled, every extra made.

So why would she want a licorice, 9 x 42, one horsepower , 2000lbs lightweight machine ? :o

boslab
06-01-2015, 04:01 PM
Perhaps the Bridgeport is aesthetically pleasing, all the right curves in all the right places,
Mark

MrFluffy
06-01-2015, 04:15 PM
The one you flogged me was 2hp. Just saying :-)

Rosco-P
06-01-2015, 04:31 PM
"Bought it for me new girlfriend as it's an imperial machine and she spent all of her working life in the States... "

After much to do the past several years regarding the OP and his former POS bridgy, seven pages to this thread and no one has speculated that the new girlfriend, having worked in the US, might be itching to have a Bridgeport to go with the imperial lathe? Back to lurk mode.

No, she'd want a real mill like a K&T, Cincinnati, Van Norman, etc.

John Stevenson
06-01-2015, 06:39 PM
She will have a choice.

Starting with a tiny little Proxon that's handy for circuit boards.
An unused Taig CNC mill.
Conect CNC mill based on a UK Rishton, again brand new.
Sieg SX2L manual mill, again new, what you call the high torque mill from LMS
The original KX1 that started the turn key mills off.
Her KX3 CNC mill,
A X3 manual converted to CNC, one of the first kit mills made.
Myford VMB, brand new but robbed of some bits from the Myford closing down sale and being converted to CNC to do one job.
Brand new Sieg SX4, same as a Grizzly G0720R, manual.
Brand new Sieg KX4 CNC based on a G0720R but with high speed head, an experimental one that never saw the light of day.
Blidgeport.
Beaver NC5 CNC with 4th axis. And yes we have heard all the jokes about the Beaver.

After reading that list i now have to ask myself if i's me she's interested in or the workshop ?

Doggie
06-01-2015, 11:41 PM
That's a really nice lathe. I really do like a Colchester lathe. The controls are easy to work, all the feed directions are on the apron, always have a decent size hole through the spindle, to me a real easy lathe to run. I have always wanted a Colchester, but every time that I found one for sale they were either too expensive, or too worn out.
BUT
I have 2 LeBlonds. One is a 13" X 80" Regal,,,, the other is a sliding bed model. Closed up it will work 20" over the bed 14" over the crosslide and about 75" between centers. With the bed slid back it will open up to a 46" swing and up to 120" between centers. They say that LeBlonds have more fun, now I don't know if that's true, but these are a real joy to run. They are both old but in real good condition. The folks that had them before me didn't use them a lot. I also have an really old, flat belt driven, American that is a 27" X 60" that I may get running someday, but that will take a lot of work.
Your friend, Doggie

John Stevenson
06-24-2015, 08:57 PM
OK bit of an update.

Because with modern tooling we run far faster than ever before the makers have anticipated this and top speeds of up to 2,500 are not uncommon.
What they haven't taken into account is that bloody great train of mangle gears hanging off the end for screw cutting and in most cases fine feed.

Now I know you don't screw cut at 2,500 but you do use fine feed so what is the point of having an oil bath headstock and mangle gears, usually 14 1/2degree PA with massive undercuts on the smaller sizes, running in fresh air? Just never kept up.

This is the Bantam as it stood.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20drive1.jpg

This is the range used for the coarsest threads, the next range gives most of the popular threads and the fine feeds. If you work the compound train out of the other ratio, not shown, it works out to 21 driving a 72.

It's possible to buy HTD timing pulleys off the shelf in these sizes so two were ordered ad a new belt.

On the bantam the gears are not bored and keyed but have 8 shallow splines to Colchester's own spec and nothing is a standard size. The splines are 4.36mm wide which isn't a size in metric or imperial.
Fortunately in a box of broaches I bought there was an 8mm broken one about 2/3 long so surface ground this down to the size needed.

Now a bush is needed so turn one to size and mill a 4.37mm slot in it for the broach, then spin the bush 1/8th of a turn and pop a hole in with the cutter.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20drive2.jpg

Fit a top hatted pin in and broach the first slot in the pulley then use the pin to locate this slot and do the second slot, rinse and repeat until all 8 are done.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20drive5.jpg

And you get this. The bit on the pulley is the top carrier which carries a shear pin but the top pulley will be made in one piece with it's own shear pin to save having to spline this as well.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20drive8.jpg

Final picture with all setup and bearing follower fitted to the existing banjo. This machine can now run at 1600 rpm which is it maximum with hardly any increase of noise between being in drive or neutral.

That should make Ower Gert MKll ™ happy

Next job is to fit DRO's all round but this won't be easy because of how it is built but more later.

Toolguy
06-24-2015, 09:35 PM
Great fix! Thanks for sharing John.:)

rklopp
06-25-2015, 01:01 AM
My how Chipmaster of you! Those have the option of gears or timing belts.

The Chipmaster uses the same saddle. I put a DRO on mine, and I agree it is a pain. This is due to the low profile of the cross slide. My cross-slide scale hangs way out the back.

boslab
06-25-2015, 01:29 AM
Seeing as you've nailed all the knobbly bits with a beltectomy on colchesters, why not knock out a few more as kits?, I'm certain that there's a market for them.
I have a harrison, and as you say "mangle" gearing (yes I wound a shirt button breaker as a kid out the back of the kitchen, you could hear em crack, oops mam), to do metricals the thing needs a 127, generally the imperial whatever size lives there, personally I haven't got round to making a 127 as the blue smoke has got out of the mill motor, another job, so there would either need to be 2 sets imp and napoleons own, or a double pulley to get the both, does that sound feasible?
It's a nice job too!
Regards
Mark

flylo
06-25-2015, 06:00 AM
I'd pick the Beaver with the 4th axis.

John Stevenson
06-25-2015, 06:56 AM
My how Chipmaster of you! Those have the option of gears or timing belts.

The Chipmaster uses the same saddle. I put a DRO on mine, and I agree it is a pain. This is due to the low profile of the cross slide. My cross-slide scale hangs way out the back.

Any chance of any pictures of the cross slide please to give me ideas ?

Seen the one in this link.

http://www.gtprecision.co.uk/Colchester-Bantam-lathe.html

But it looks ugly to me and the scale is above the hight of the cross slide. I'd like something a lot neater for me best girl.

rklopp
06-25-2015, 11:16 AM
John,

My lashup is about as ungainly as the GT Precision setup you linked, though perhaps slightly better looking due to being built for the purpose rather than using slotted adapters. Besides the low profile cross-slide, the other aspect that makes my setup ungainly is that the scale is too long. It is a Sony Magnescale, which uses a taut metal tape welded into the housing under tension. I determined that shortening it would have been a PhD thesis project. I will take some photos this evening, as I am at work and the lathe is at home.

Best regards,

RKlopp

rklopp
06-25-2015, 11:17 AM
John,

My lashup is about as ungainly as the GT Precision setup you linked, though perhaps slightly better looking due to being built for the purpose rather than using slotted adapters. Besides the low profile cross-slide, the other aspect that makes my setup ungainly is that the scale is too long. It is a Sony Magnescale, which uses a taut metal tape welded into the housing under tension. I determined that shortening it would have been a PhD thesis project. I will take some photos this evening, as I am at work and the lathe is at home.

Best regards,

RKlopp

Toolguy
06-25-2015, 01:23 PM
I think it's DROPros that a slimline magnetic scale that can be cut to length. That is probably the best scale (that I know about) for any lathe cross slide install.

Charles P
06-25-2015, 04:21 PM
...... Ower Gert MKll ™



Lovely turn of phrase John

Charles

Doc Nickel
06-25-2015, 07:01 PM
http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20drive8.jpg

Final picture with all setup and bearing follower fitted to the existing banjo. This machine can now run at 1600 rpm which is it maximum with hardly any increase of noise between being in drive or neutral.

-I've been thinking about this mod ever since it was first posted a while back. On my Sheldon, my most-used lathe, there's quite the 'ring' from the geartrain when threading or feeding, and when doing long jobs or large batches of parts, it can unpleasant after a while.

My geartrain looks like this:

http://www.docsmachine.com/machineshop/shel5c02.jpg

I know just enough about gears to be dangerous, but as I understand it, I only need to go by the ratio between the upper drive gear, and the lower driven gear on the QC box, right? The tooth count of the big middle/idler doesn't really matter?

Doc.

John Stevenson
06-25-2015, 07:35 PM
Yes Doc, whatever those two are is the ratio you want or anything equal to it.

They look about equal ? so if it's 50:50 you want any two equal pulleys that will fit in. tell us what you have and the centre distance between the two shafts and I'll work it out for you.

John Stevenson
06-25-2015, 07:36 PM
Next job is to fit a DRO. This is also applicable to a Chipmaster as they share the same saddle and it's not a good design to fit a DRO to. This is what you are faced with.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam11.jpg

There is a groove machined into the saddle either side but it's not wide enough to take the scale. Add to this these lathes have the slot for the compound bolts in the side of the cross side so you cannot cover these up.
Result is the whole lot has to stick out the back and into the air. Asked around for pictures as to people who have done this and everyone has had the same problem.

This is a typical one.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20dro1.jpg

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam%20dro2.jpg

Which puts the scale right out the back, sticking up above the cross slide by 1/2" and needs a further 1" at the rear. In all fairness this is about the best you will get fitting even the slim profile glass scales. Possibly do better with a Newall system but these are not budget systems.

So staring at this and wondering how I can do better I decided to remove the carriage to have a better look. It was slated for removal as it's only equipped with one ball oiler per side and a tiny one at that, plus when up ended there are no oil grooves in the flat face. Whilst on the subject the cross slide has no oilers fitted at all ?

Those two grooves ? Well they are purely clearance and no reason at all why they have to be that size. So any purists now need to get their Horlics and go off to bed or if you are reading this in the morning I'm sure your Audi need polishing - again.
So onto the mill with the saddle and with a nice sharp cutter open the groove up by 1/2".

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam14.jpg

John Stevenson
06-25-2015, 07:36 PM
Cont:

While we are at it, poke the tiny oilers out, drill thru for some of Mr ARC's finest 8mm ball oilers and gouge an oil groove in the flat section, the V is taken care of by the vee on the bed being flat topped.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam15.jpg

That takes care of the saddle.

Hunt a bit of 5" x 5" alloy plate out and using precision felt tip marks, pocket the insides out.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam16.jpg

The two screw holes line up with two existing holes on the back end of the cross slide so when it's bolted to the slide it forms a nice neat extension.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam17.jpg

Scale offered up and it all fits where it touches so job must be a good un?

Bracket underneath to take the read head and a bracket on the headstock to take the display arm and display.

http://www.stevenson-engineers.co.uk/files/bantam19.jpg

Quick test and it's half past dark so that will do me for tonight.
Just need the long scale fitting which isn't too bad other than the flat machined surface on the rear is at an angle to the bed so needs some bent plates to carry the read head but that for later.

EddyCurr
06-25-2015, 08:01 PM
Well !

I rather think you are going be told to whistle if you
need to go back to the manufacturer seeking warranty
coverage for anything now ...

.

John Stevenson
06-25-2015, 08:15 PM
Warranty ????

It's 39 years old. It's been in storage for 35 years.

Toolguy
06-25-2015, 08:24 PM
Now there is a lathe I would be happy to own and use! I bet Deb will be pretty happy with it too!:D

Doc Nickel
06-25-2015, 10:53 PM
They look about equal ? so if it's 50:50 you want any two equal pulleys that will fit in. tell us what you have and the centre distance between the two shafts and I'll work it out for you.

-Just checked, and yep, they're both 44-tooth. Shaft center-to-center is 5.250" (133.3 mm) and the gears themselves are approximately 2.875" OD. (73 mm.) Pretty sure both are just a simple single-key shaft.

If you could figure up what I need, that'd be wonderful. :)

Doc.

rklopp
06-26-2015, 12:42 AM
https://c4.staticflickr.com/4/3842/18543345214_74d8f3046b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ufBuuw)Chipmaster Sony DRO 5 (https://flic.kr/p/ufBuuw) by kloppo2001 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/127030460@N07/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/304/18545273543_40845cd52e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ufMnHz)Chipmaster Sony DRO 6 (https://flic.kr/p/ufMnHz) by kloppo2001 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/127030460@N07/), on Flickr

Note how the cross-slide scale is mounted with its back toward the tailstock. That lets it all fit without having to widen the saddle groove.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/278/18978301508_f8b9ccde87_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/uV3KQY)Chipmaster Sony DRO 2 (https://flic.kr/p/uV3KQY) by kloppo2001 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/127030460@N07/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/449/19160119562_8fdb979e50_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vc7C21)Chipmaster Sony DRO 4 (https://flic.kr/p/vc7C21) by kloppo2001 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/127030460@N07/), on Flickr

John Stevenson
06-26-2015, 05:40 AM
Doc,
Give me a link to who you use for pulleys so I can quote what you can actually buy

Doc Nickel
06-26-2015, 03:06 PM
I have no regular supplier for pulleys- the last time I bought a commercial V-belt pulley, I picked it up from a local bearing shop. Any dealer that has the necessary parts, and is either in the US or will ship to the US, is fine.

[edit] If you're looking for a US supplier, I've dealt with McMaster-Carr (http://www.mcmaster.com/) many times, and have been satisfied with their stock and service.

Doc.

Doc Nickel
06-26-2015, 04:07 PM
Another poster also suggested Maury Manufacturing (http://www.maurey.com/prod_tp.php). Haven't dealt with them, but looks like they have a decent selection.

Doc.

JCHannum
06-26-2015, 04:56 PM
Doc; The two 44 tooth gears on your Sheldon (one drives the 100 tooth intermediate gear, the other is driven by same) should be micarta, not steel. That will go a long way to reducing your gear noise.

John Stevenson
06-26-2015, 05:16 PM
Jesus H Freeking Christ with a Bridgeport, can anyone help Doc out and suggest someone who doesn't quote in telephone numbers starting with 555-

Maurey don't do 5mm pitch HTD so move up to 8mm pitch and a 22 tooth pilot bore which is about 2.2" OD [ looks about right size is $52.00, we pay 6.82 so say $10

Automation direct are still on trapezoidal belts so a 20 tooth in size L is $27.00 we pay 6.20 so about $9.00
I did my whole lathe, two pulleys and a belt for less than Maurey want for one pulley. Are timing belts a new thing over there ? You lot still on chains ? :o

Peter.
06-26-2015, 05:31 PM
Sillimeters = sillyprices :)

Doc Nickel
06-26-2015, 06:22 PM
Doc; The two 44 tooth gears on your Sheldon (one drives the 100 tooth intermediate gear, the other is driven by same) should be micarta, not steel. That will go a long way to reducing your gear noise.

-As in micarta from the factory? Or "should be replaced with"?

I seem to recall some reference to a plastic/micarta gear in the geartrain as a safety (it breaks before something more expensive does) but I'd always thought that was one of the tumbler gears- as you can see, one of mine has been replaced with a brass one, and had been before I got it.

I was considering cutting a couple gears out of Delrin, to see if that'd quiet things down, just never got around to it.

Doc.

John Stevenson
06-26-2015, 06:33 PM
Sillimeters = sillyprices :)

L and H series are imperial so no excuse.
However it gets worse, tried Mc Master-carr and in the L series they only do 1/2" wide pulleys you need to do the H to get 3/4"

They do stock a HTD 5m with 15mm width at $48.08

So taking this as the best / only bet you need two 32 tooth 5M pulleys # 6497K81 at $48.08 each
and a belt, 425-5 # 7939K14 at $19.97


So $48.08 + $48.08 + $19.97 = $116.13

From our people 6.11 + 6.11 + 4.73 = 16.95 or $26.44

Something seriously wrong here.

JCHannum
06-26-2015, 06:50 PM
As in micarta from the factory.

The 30 tooth gear on the tumbler assembly for right to left carriage drive is the sacrificial micarta gear. The other tumbler gear is a 28 tooth brass gear.

wierdscience
06-26-2015, 09:09 PM
L and H series are imperial so no excuse.
However it gets worse, tried Mc Master-carr and in the L series they only do 1/2" wide pulleys you need to do the H to get 3/4"

They do stock a HTD 5m with 15mm width at $48.08

So taking this as the best / only bet you need two 32 tooth 5M pulleys # 6497K81 at $48.08 each
and a belt, 425-5 # 7939K14 at $19.97


So $48.08 + $48.08 + $19.97 = $116.13

From our people 6.11 + 6.11 + 4.73 = 16.95 or $26.44

Something seriously wrong here.

Your looking at the *suggested* retail price in the catalog,the street price is a good bit less,but as someone mentioned things metric here cost more,that's one reason why we don't convert.Everyone who sells metric thinks the stuff is gold.

Oh and those will most likely be steel or cast iron instead of extruded Aluminum,so that costs a bit more.

John Stevenson
06-27-2015, 01:50 AM
Weird,
XL and L series pulleys are Imperial so na excuse there.
In the smaller 22tooth range they will be steel or cast, they only go to aluminium when they get to the larger sizes.

Compare these prices and these are not suggested, they are available to trade and the man in the street alike.

http://www.beltingonline.com/timing-pulleys-bars-272/

Doc Nickel
06-27-2015, 01:54 AM
Well, if those guys will ship to the US, and for a decent price, whip me up a similar parts list and I'll place an order. Heck, they even take PayPal. :)

Doc.

EVguru
06-27-2015, 03:17 AM
This is the cross-slide scale installation on my Harrison L5.

http://www.compton.vispa.com/Pictures/magencdr.jpg

http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/threads/52334-Magnetic-DRO-scale?