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View Full Version : Putting the feed motors on the Shaper, any suggestions?



ibewgypsie
06-15-2004, 03:18 PM
I was going to use some 75rpm motors I have, Now I have ended up with a couple of Gast air motors

According to spec, they are 1.1 hp at 3,000 rpm, using the small gearboxes I ratholed, 15:1 (across) and 20:1 (up) and a small pair of cylinders to pulse the down feed on the ram. I aired them up and can't hold them with a 12" pair of channeloks.. I liked to have broke a wrist trying.

Problem to overcome is a square crank hole in a coupling to direct mount the gearbox to the feed shaft. I plan on saw splitting a piece of 1" stock and milling a square then welding it back up. I was tempted to tack weld lovejoy couplings to the shaft.

I won't have encoder input this first go around, only moveable limits. Logic is simple like a lathe. I do have a plan somewhere using old cdroms as encoder discs. Not this week thou, I'll be lucky to get the gearboxes on with everything else going on.

Hydraulic motor drive for the ram is still what I want. I was opting for a hydrostat transmission, but.. Hyd motor is on the way.

From everything I have read, shapers are cheap to operate. I know I always am hunting and buying mills, I hardly ever hunt tool steel for the lathe. I want to be able to cut splines too, keyways without broaches.. and some other odd project in the works.

David

John Stevenson
06-15-2004, 04:34 PM
IBEW,
You can cut a square hole for the coupling on the shaper........................

ibewgypsie
06-15-2004, 04:54 PM
John:

Yes, if it ran yet.. It is a boat anchor at the moment. I am putting a hydraulic motor on it soon.. and then the ram will work..

I just cranked the table all the way up, I am soaking wet. Geeze.. I took off about 200 pounds of broken linkage off it. I got round shafts behind the square. I may just bandsaw it behind the square shaft.

IT took "real men" to crank a table like that up and down.. whew.. Too much beer and pasta?
I got another twelve of Newcastle, the pup was doing flips when he saw that. He'll drink budwieser but prefers brown beer.

He learned a new word.. Look out.. when I say that now his ears perk up and he looks around.. I dropped something on him. Good to pay attention huh? He's smart, and he better pay attention, he is always laying on my feet.

All the linkages have been brazed, repaired a dozen times on this machine, the feed shaft was broken this time and I wanted a power feed.

David

Alistair Hosie
06-15-2004, 05:25 PM
David that's strange my dog lies on my feet too all the time. When I'm not around he lies on my shoes, or slippers etc when their not around he will pull down my jacket and curl up on that. My wife says he just wants to feel near me all the time.
He loves when we watch t v to come into the lounge and sit on my feet not near them on them won't take no for an answer. and when I tell him to go lie elsewhere he always sneaks back, when he thinks I am not paying attention, and curls up on my feet again.
I like it anyway and always stroke him all the time. When I am having a bath he comes into the bathroom and watches me soon as I lather up he jumps up on the side of the bath and licks all the suds away from my arm.
He always does it.
I know this is disgusting but he always loves to do it done it ever since we had him anyone ever witness this with their dogs let me know.Alistair

ibewgypsie
06-15-2004, 08:32 PM
Alistair:
my pup, he has this rawhide bone, his favorite place to chew it is to lay it in my shoe and chew it there..

I think it adds to the flavor.(whew). he lays at my feet about all the time.. he adores the Big hairy dog in his life I guess. I share my beer and my life with him, how lucky can he be?

David (aka the big hairy dog)

And: Not all kids are as nice as yours, some are wild creatures you have to train to be human. Maybe it's the cherokee in my blood mixed with the scottish and german? Maybe it's the bloodline? Mine are wild indians..

ibewgypsie
06-16-2004, 10:24 AM
Got talked into using sprockets on the motor to gearbox.. That way I can adjust the final speed.

I been told the speed of the motor drops off inverse to the air pressure maintained. When I put it through a solonoid valve with reduction of flow (not full port) then it will slow and lose power.

David

John Stevenson
06-16-2004, 11:10 AM
IBEW, Just run one of those Gast motors on the bench for 1/2.
The noise will drive you mad.

Add the compressor to that and all hell will break loose.

No joking, just test one before you go any further, it may save you some work.

John S.

ibewgypsie
06-16-2004, 11:42 AM
John:
I got a big stereo in the shop It masks the noise with louder noise.

You may be right, I just bought the faulk couplings for it all thou, am too vested into it. I got servos too if I decide to waste them. I got them ratholed for when I finish the gantry table.
They put out 3,000 rpm too, so Maybe it will all work from the input side of the gearbox on with a motor change if I go nuts with the sound. The machine will be ran real infrequent. I need it right now to put some splines in the press project. I may have to rig a motor up if the hydraulics don't get here soon. I got a old auto transmission and a 3 phase motor that was on it.

Off to the shop, mounting gearboxes and boring couplings.. I wonder where I put the brass shim.. ya know I can't hit my mark like I used to, I have to cheat with shim.

I moved the compressor out under the eave of the building too.. Thou the pipe does resonate the sheetmetal on the building.

David

[This message has been edited by ibewgypsie (edited 06-16-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-16-2004, 04:36 PM
What a pain:

I installed both gearboxes, I have to build the air motor mounts now.

The bottom gearbox had to be reversed. I flipped it upside down, the spec said any position, it had fill plugs on all corners..

It has been dripping oil since I installed it. Not really happy with that. Just a seal, but still a problem. The other one was new, and does not leak, but the shafts are mirror of each other.

They are mounted.. Not beautiful yet.. but mounted.. All the plate is torch cut and not grinded yet. Rough as a cobb.

Other then that, everything is peachy keen.
I Took pictures, but the camera is still in the shop.. oops..
David.

charlie coghill
06-16-2004, 09:22 PM
The dog laying on your feet. Have you ever seen a dog find a dead anumial or a cow pie and lay and roll in it. Maybe that is what he thinks your feet represents. Could be.
Charlie.

[This message has been edited by charlie coghill (edited 06-16-2004).]

ibewgypsie
06-16-2004, 10:17 PM
Now Charlie..

I have been having to take two showers a day or I get Complaints from Carrol. 95 here today, and rained twice..
It is humid and muggy here. I sure appreciate the air conditioner, too bad the shaper is not in "that" side of the shop.
I should get the air motors mounted tomorrow. It ain't going as fast as I like, but the boss is really mean and I am "slow walking the job" Ohh yeah, I am the boss..

David

ibewgypsie
06-17-2004, 02:58 PM
http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/Dscn0389.jpg

http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/Dscn0394.jpg

http://img28.photobucket.com/albums/v85/ibewgypsie/Dscn0395.jpg

Notice that the first mount I made wadded up like a tissue paper.. not real good, the chain then came off and flew up and hit the tin roof..

Them motors have some torque..

David

ibewgypsie
06-19-2004, 04:22 PM
John:

If you ever go to use one of these air motors, when you hook it to a solonoid bank, take the exhaust off the bank to a poly line outside the shop. Makes it quiet in the shop.. AS quiet as a electric motor..

The airflow reduction in the solonoid to and from the air motor (both sides) makes it slower and weaker. Direct hose connection is about 4 times the speed.

I have the gearboxes and air motors on the bench, not back on the machine yet. I hope I got enough power. I may have to sprocket upsize the gearbox end.

David

John Stevenson
06-19-2004, 05:28 PM
Ibew,
I have fitted these in the past as auxiliary drives on conveyors but the problem was the building was so big any pipe run to the outside would have dropped the power off.We did fit oversize silencers but to be honest for continiouis work running and maintainance costs are too high.
I know in your case that they will be intermittant use motors but personally I'd have gone for some robust DC drives.

One of my customers who make boring machines for oil rig work used to buy in large air motors for their machines as electic motors are banned. These use terric amounts of air, in fact when they are testing they hire one of those big road compressors in. Unless specified they are moving over to hydraulic motors as being cheaper in the long run, quieter and even more powerfull for the size.

John S.

ibewgypsie
06-19-2004, 05:33 PM
Have you ever saw a surface grinder set up on one of these old shapers?

Or possibly a boring bar spindle?

It is pretty tight, they don't make machinery like this today, or if they do I can't afford it.

I'll take your note on the dc motors, I thought about hooking up some 1/2hp motors I got and relay switching out a single drive. It only has to move one axis at a time, and then not in any hurry.

I can't figure out why the Z (up dn) axis is so hard to crank.. it has a 90 going to a vertical screw with a fixed nut on the bottom. I have cleaned and light-oiled everything. I know the table weighs about 500 pounds..

David