OT: Learning to Fly

[Puckdropper]

I looked in to learning to fly after the "what would you do differently?" thread, and it's surprisingly accessible. I chatted with the flight instructor tonight, and looks like I'm going ahead with it. What are some of the things you guys have learned that you wish someone had told you sooner?

[chipmaker4130]

It's just as addicting as machining, but even more expensive.
I flew professionally for 36 years. It beat working for a living, but scheduled flying isn't quite the same as doing it for fun. Sadly, I didn't do any 'fun' flying at all after going at it full time.

[GNM109]

I took flying lessons in the late 1980's. I have about 40 hours and soloed a number of times. I started doing the required cross-countries. It was fun, but it was very expensive and I had to stop and concentrate on my profession instead.

Its a lot of fun and very interesting. You really need to continue and become proficient at instrument flying in order to remain safe. You can get caught in weather despite reports.

It's well worth it if the finances permit.

[Evan]

I highly recommend it. It is so different to occupy the full 3D environment. Learning what things look like from above takes a while although it should be a lot easier now with things like Google Earth. One of the things the instructor will do is cut your power and tell you to find some place to land. When he did that to me there was a perfect field directly under me that I couldn't see without do a bit of rolling left and right. I still found a good spot but it would have been so easy to just circle a bit to the field below. Also, when flying at lower altitudes always keep an eye out for a place to land. Also, do at least a bit of IFR practice so you don't lose control when you hit some clouds (and no, I do not mean I Follow Roads).

[flylo]

I would learn in a taildragger. It will be harder to find one but you'll be a better pilot for it & it's so much easier to learn in one than transition later. Imagine driving a forklift very fast with no load the CG is in the rear & at speed want's to be in the front. In a plane that's called a ground loop when the tail passes ends up in front on landing usually scaping a wing in the process. If you can buy the plane you learn to fly in & save that high rental fee. I bought an old Taylorcraft, got my license in 45 hours flew it a couple hundred then sold it back to the guy I got it from. I paid a flight student at WMU $10 an hour, started in mid January on ski's got my license in July. Take a flight in an old hand prop, 2 seat taildragger before you sign up for anything. Go to an small airport meet some pilots, ask questions & find a Cub or Tcraft & ask to buy a ride. Most guys like in machining will be glad to help a potential new pilot get addicted. I don't know where you are but if possible get some ski & float time. Flying has caused my most peaceful & my terrifying moments. I envy you as your in for a great adventure!

[Puckdropper]

Flylo,

Are there planes out there that would make owning more competitive than renting? By the time I total in the cost of the plane, fuel, storage, and basic maintenance, it's going to be hard to beat... Although, being able to fly somewhere and not worry about getting it back for the next guy would be a nice benefit.

All,

I've got a choice between the Cessna 152 and 172. The 152 is smaller and $30/hr cheaper to rent. The instructor was favoring the 172, saying it was a very common plane to learn to fly in and a very stable plane. It's also (probably due to its added cost) a lot more available. Any input on that?

[10KPete]

I've put a lot of hours in a 150 and a 172. I personally like the 172 'cause I'm 6'-4" and 220 lbs. With a passenger of size there is little room for baggage in the 150. If you build up hours in the 150 the transition to the 172 will be as easy a rolling out of bed...

Pete

[Evan]

I have also put in hours on both aircraft. Start with the 152. It is more nimble and is a relative of the Cessna 140 I owned. Very nice plane to learn in although the tail dragger is the best way to start. Learning in that will enlarge your options if you decide to buy a plane. It only took me a few hours to get the hang of driving the Fleet Canuck I started in. It is like learning to ride a bicycle. Once you have it you never forget how. The switching to nose wheel is zero problem. Also, a tail dragger is safer on rough ground. It can also be landed on shorter runways than a nose wheel craft. With practice it can be landed in a full stall landing. I could put my 140 down in just a couple of hundred feet on grass and that was with pretend flaps.

[Scotty H]

I started to learn way back in the late 80's, but gave up to race cars.
Now I work part time in a hangar containing a DH94 Moth Minor, a DH60 Moth Major (being rebuilt) an L4 Grasshopper (cub), and a DH84 dragon.
I've been offered flying lessons in the L4 in exchange for the work I do. A real "warbird" - flew over the Normandy landings, and a tail dragger to boot. How can I say no....

[AD5MB]

• take a ground school class. they teach things that are not in the books
• pass your written by the time you solo.
• renting makes way more sense than buying. in 1985 buying would have meant monthly payments on the plane, $100 a month insurance and $45 monthly tie down fees, regardless of how much or how little time you logged.
• read Stick & Rudder by Wolfgang Langwieische

[George Bulliss]

What I would suggest is that once you start, keep at it on a regular schedule. It doesn't take much time off to forget what you just learned and if you can't keep at it steadily you will spend a lot of time relearning things. There are enough ups and downs in the learning process, no need to make it longer and more frustrating.

For the $30 savings I would go for the 152. Both planes are pretty much identical in operation and it's easy enough to jump between the two. Yes, the 172 is much more comfortable, but for most of your training you will be concentrating so much on the lesson you won't notice. Of course, the instructor will notice and I'm sure he enjoys the 172 much more.

[Lew Hartswick]

I may be a bit biased, BUT. I suggest get a sail plane license first. That is a real sport. :-) You will already know most of the important parts of flying if you
later want to get a power license. I (back when I was flying) knew a bunch of commercial pilots who flew sail planes for the enjoyment of flying . It's
quite a varied group and can be a lot more economical than power.
...lew...

[pinstripe]

I've never flown a plane, so this "advice" is worth exactly what you paid for it. If I were to ever learn to fly, I would go with a school that integrates aerobatics from early on. It's like advanced driver training. They teach you how to recover from situations that you might accidentally find yourself in.

These schools are more expensive when you look at the total course cost. You need to consider however that their planes are less common and you will be getting more hours on the ground and in the air. Their planes are less docile and faster, so switching to another plane later should be easy.

[fjk]

In the 90s I took lessons. Soloed, never finished ... for both good and bad reasons.
Anyway, my thoughts...

- I started in a 152, went to the 172. _I_ was more comfortable in the 172. Meant that I was not distracted by being squished shoulder to shoulder with the instructor. YMMV.

Most of the responses here are about the good times ... and for the most part, I agree. But I also had a few negative experiences that seem (to me) to be things that might not be totally unique to me... Please take them as things to watch out for and not advice to run away screaming...

- One of the big sources of instructors is 20-somethings who have just received their "Aviation Science" degree from a local college and are now building flight hours before they try and get an airline job. They generally have not been taught how to teach, nor are they really interested in teaching. Some even look down on it. For example, I was having problems doing steep turns around a point. We'd go up, do one or two, and the instructor would say how they were not
being done right, then we'd go off and do something else. After a few weeks, I basically threw a fit in mid-air
Me: "NO, we are NOT going to go do something else, we are going to do steep turns for the entire hour..."
Him: "But that's not how the chief instructor wants us to do things!"
Me: "Screw the chief instructor"
Him: "but glubble florp babbleflibble..."
and an hour later
Him: "That was really boring, but, gee, you got steep turns really well"

- Some schools are kind of programmatic and rigid in their approach to things. Where I started was like that. They are, still, a pretty big local operation. But they had sort of a fixed notion that if you don't get your license in X time, you should not be flying. I was taking lessons during the 1990s --- at the same time I was doing a startup in the dot com boom, had some health and family issues, and went through 4 or 5 different instructors as one young kid moved on to the airlines and another took his place. There was even one period one summer where we had something like 3 straight months of hazy-hot-and-humid weather (no visibility) or local thunderstorms ... no flying then! Net result was that I had big gaps in my lessons, could only do an hour every two weeks, etc, etc, etc. I did manage to solo. Eventually the "Chief Instructor" called me in for a meeting and said that they felt I was not making the progress I should, etc, etc ... he wasn't interested in my real life getting in the way, etc, etc. My _interpretation_ is that he was acting as if X% of the students didn't get their license within Y months, then he would not get his bonus or whatever --- and I was placing it in jeopardy.

- Instructors don't talk to each other, and in fact often don't even "fly the same". I had one instructor who was nuts about me taking turns too steeply when in the pattern (flying around an airport, preparing to land...). Eventually I got things the way he wanted. He goes off to the airlines and I get another instructor... "Are you planning to turn? Today? Steeper turns! More crisperly!"... sigh.

Anyway, be aware of some of the pitfalls ... and enjoy

[Seastar]

I started taking flying lessons in a J3 Cub in 1959 and then finished my private in a 172.
I can highly recommend starting in a taildragger.
After owning and flying 2 172s, 2 Cessna 337s, Several Mooneys, a Navajo, a Cheyenne, and a CitationJet I have now come full circle and am flying a CarbonCub in my old age.
I have flown several 152s and except for the size they are a fine trainer.
The main thing is get started in whatever aircraft is available and see if it's for you.
I have loved every minute of my 5000+ hours and hope you do as well.
Bill

Edit
One of my grandsons just graduated from Purdue and is staying with us in Fort Lauderdale taking flying lessons. He is training in a 172.
He wants to be an airline pilot.