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lakeside53
02-26-2017, 10:30 PM
I stumbled across a big haul of brand new 1 inch shank tooling. I have a Dorian CXA tool post, but it's limited to 3/4, has trouble on some tooling getting high enough to meet center and I don't like milling down the shanks, so.... I decided to get a CA tool post and an ever growing selection of CA holders. Hey, I can run a 1-1/2 inch boring bar if I like. lol

So... found a great deal on brand new Dorian CA tool post. Collected a few Aloris CA tool holders, machined the compound "nut" and... rats.. Aloris holders don't quite fit Dorian anymore. Dorian has a nice resettable handle feature, but that increases the size of the top flange and the adjuster nut fouls.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_165452%20Custom_zpsnawgwvkn.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_165452%20Custom_zpsnawgwvkn.jpg.html)

Hmmmm.. Quick check shows the OEM part (you have to buy the "elevator" assembly) to be made of gold and nothing that fits from Mcmaster etc. It's only 3pm.. I'll make some. 1.125 diameter, .3125 thick, 1/2-20 thread, chamfered edges.

I have an old bump Kurling tool with well-used wheels and a POS import "scissor style" that is... well... a real pos. I'll use the bump tool "once more" until I can save up for an Aloris CA19. The import scissor can go in the trash.

Stock.. Hmmm... Stainless would be good. 303 should work. Na.. barely made a dent; not with my knurler. Found some 1144 and got to work.

First, knurl the entire work length. 120 rpm, slow feed, 50 thou in-feed from contact.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_154058%20Custom_zpssvo5xx7w.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_154058%20Custom_zpssvo5xx7w.jpg.html)


Nice (crappy cell phone pic) .. maybe I'll keep the old tool a bit longer! No.. I didn't do all the math - just turned and knurled - it worked out.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_154358%20Custom_zpsd8jndy2j.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_154358%20Custom_zpsd8jndy2j.jpg.html)

Partially parted... ass backwards but I figured this would make it easier to chamfer all the edges. It did, and I found a use for one of those cheap triangle tools - both sides at once and the same measurement.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_160302%20Custom_zpsab0zukml.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_160302%20Custom_zpsab0zukml.jpg.html)

lakeside53
02-26-2017, 10:30 PM
Drill and thread the center. I threaded in two parts as I parted off - the tap didn't reach to the end.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_161300%20Custom_zps8wf8gn7r.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_161300%20Custom_zps8wf8gn7r.jpg.html)

Part off, countersink (in tail stock) the next thread on each slightly (second op each parting), clean up with 3M debur wheel .. done!

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_165227%20Custom_zpstbtrh3ed.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_165227%20Custom_zpstbtrh3ed.jpg.html)


Final result

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170226_165638%20Custom_zpssvfn8lhd.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170226_165638%20Custom_zpssvfn8lhd.jpg.html)


Aloris holders have a nice feature - the thread elevator has a groove and a internal tabbed washer. This isolates the adjuster from the locking nut so one does not make the other rotate. Easy to add to existing import and Dorian. But.. the tab washers are hard to find and expensive in small quantities.

BTW... When mucking around with tool holder height, not all are created the same. Here's CXA Dorian (on the right) verses an import. Both have a 3/4 tooling slot.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff150/lakeside53/Tool%20holders/20170212_152822%20Custom_zpsp3jn7aex.jpg (http://s238.photobucket.com/user/lakeside53/media/Tool%20holders/20170212_152822%20Custom_zpsp3jn7aex.jpg.html)

Willy
02-26-2017, 10:52 PM
Nice! Thanks for taking the pics, you know how we all like pics. And a machining related thread to boot, who would have thought? LOL

Ya know I've made tool holders before and made them out of one long blank to be cut up into individual tool holders later after cutting the dovetails and slots but I never though of doing the nuts the same way. This gave me a good idea for the next time I'm faced with a similar task.
Thanks!

lakeside53
02-26-2017, 10:58 PM
The Aloris CA19 I mentioned earlier. The pic in the link is a BXA size but the CA is just scaled up. Scissor style.. One day...


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aloris-CA-19-Quick-Change-Adjustable-Knurling-Holder-/281704541483?hash=item4196e62d2b:g:btMAAOSwv0tVEhQ B

wierdscience
02-27-2017, 12:07 AM
Good job on the adjusting nuts.I have noticed too that there can be a lot of difference between tool holders depending on mfg.

Those Aloris knurling holders are nice,but I just don't see $340 for one.Looks like about 4 hours shop time to me.

lakeside53
02-27-2017, 12:16 AM
I agree.. $$$$.

If you look on the Aloris website you can see the "the other side" where the SHCS squeeze in the dovetails. Doesn't look too hard to make especially as an "add-on" to an existing holder (find one that can be drilled and tapped). Some heat treating involved or maybe 4140ph. L/R threads on the screw so need a LH tap for the bottom holder.

Mr Fixit
02-27-2017, 12:20 AM
Not sure of the size you need for the tab washers. But they are used on bike wheel axles the solid kind, and the quick release kind . What I'm saying is you might check the local bike shop that does more than just sell bikes and be in luck.

TX
Mr fixit for the family
Chris. :)

lakeside53
02-27-2017, 12:27 AM
1/2 inch ID. I found a USA manf that's quite reasonable if you want a 1000. But about $3.55 plus freight each in small quantities. Can't find anyone other the manf. that stocks them.

http://seastrom-mfg.com/washerdetails.aspx?productNumber=5746-14

wierdscience
02-27-2017, 12:57 AM
I agree.. $$$$.

If you look on the Aloris website you can see the "the other side" where the SHCS squeeze in the dovetails. Doesn't look too hard to make especially as an "add-on" to an existing holder (find one that can be drilled and tapped). Some heat treating involved or maybe 4140ph. L/R threads on the screw so need a LH tap for the bottom holder.

Agreed on the easy to make part,worst part to make would be the knurl holders,but only because of the mirror image.The screw looks like a big differential screw from an insert toolholder.

wierdscience
02-27-2017, 12:57 AM
1/2 inch ID. I found a USA manf that quite reasonable if you want a 1000. But about $3.55 plus freight each in small quantities. Can't find anyone that stocks them.

http://seastrom-mfg.com/washerdetails.aspx?productNumber=5746-14

Looks like a good part for a laser cutter.

Tundra Twin Track
02-27-2017, 01:16 AM
Nice job,I have to make a bunch of those for my Rapidue Tool Post.Did you power tap those or turn chuck by hand?

lakeside53
02-27-2017, 01:42 AM
No chuck movement - just by hand, big tap wrench, but supported in the tail-stock. 1144 at 1/2-20 is dead easy. Used a spiral point tap and just wound it in.

MattiJ
02-27-2017, 02:23 AM
Nicely executed, I like your well thought out working sequence!

lakeside53
02-27-2017, 11:33 AM
If there were more of them I'd have made soft-jaws to countersink and cleanup of the "back side". For these I just popped them in the jaws for the rear countersink and eyeballed "true".

mattthemuppet
02-27-2017, 12:34 PM
Nice work! I made the adjusters for my home made holders (much smaller) a similar way, although I don't have a knurler yet so I took the collet chuck off the lathe and used a ball nose endmill to cut 6 flutes on the sides. then put it back on the lathe, part-parted, knocked off edge, tapped and parted. I did used a countersink in an electric to clean up the hole though.

http://i1349.photobucket.com/albums/p752/mattthemuppet/IMG_5222_zpsmyqa60oh.jpg

PStechPaul
02-27-2017, 03:51 PM
Maybe instead of a keyed washer, you could use a thrust bearing, like this:

https://www.mcmaster.com/#5909k31/=16jgynn

https://www.mcmaster.com/mva/library/20100712/5909k310l.gif
About $5 for the bearing assembly and two thin flat washers.

Also, it might be possible to add a key to a plain washer, by cutting a notch and pressing in a key (or maybe welding it).

boslab
02-27-2017, 04:34 PM
Very nice job, I think I'd like to change my old 4 way for a quick change this year, I hope.
Mark

lakeside53
02-27-2017, 04:36 PM
I think the bearing would be susceptible to crap in no time (and it's more expensive than the simple tab washer). Even two thin washers work somewhat if they are lubed. Dorian uses a star washer, imports vary, but the Aloris solution works very well where one surface is held by finger and the other tightened to lock by wrench.

I could probably cut the washer center by cnc with a small EM (carefully) then file the tab edges for "square", but it's not worth it.

Another way to get them "tight" without rotation is to adjust the height, clamp tightly in the tool post and while watching for rotation of the thumb nut just tighten the top. It's what I do on my Dorian holders with the star washer.