machine tools in the USA

[wierdscience]

Last I heard the B-port mill castings are cast in Brazil,remember,most places here you can't cast metal anymore,the NIMBY'S don't like the soot landing on the're Beemers

Here are a few reasons I can think of for the demise of the machinetool mfgrs-

Longevity of product,many machines have been scrapped,but many 1940 and newer machine still exist and are working daily.Mnay times the machines a company built outlasted the company that built them,Hendey is a good example of this.We got one.1946 model,still running strong and suits our needs so why change?
CNC machines are cheaper and simpler to make.Take a look under the hood and what do you see? On a CNC machine the controller is the most complicated part,the machine it's self is simple by comparison to a manual machine of the same capacity.Instead of 1500-2000 precisly made moving parts in a manual mill or lathe,you may only have 200-300 in it's NC sibling.

Apprenticeship programs and people who want to train in them are nonexistant,need I say more on this one?

Government/NIMBY'S/guidence counselers/parents,if you decide to go into one of the metal or mechanical trades these days you get funny looks from people like your throwing your life away ,or are some kind of LD student.

If you decide to start your own business mfg something the odds are stacked against you form jump.No one wants a foundry,machineshop or other in thier nieghborhood,even if you can get the nieghbors to go along the goverment will make you jump through hoops to get any sort of permit.

Poor/declining work ethic,goverment recieves partial credit for this one,why work when you can get paid for sitting around all day?

Finally liability,stupidity does pay and pay well,just ask Snapper lawn mower.You may never get sued,but if you borrow money you will be required to have insurance and it ain't cheap.

I'm sure there are more,but I am tired.

[bob308]

the bridgeports are made in singapore since the 80's. that is what the tag said on the ones i have seen.

[moldmonkey]

I believe KO Lee is still going in Aberdeen SD of all places. I'm from the area and still find it hard to believe a machine tool company started there. Crazy Norwegians .

http://www.kolee.com/

[This message has been edited by moldmonkey (edited 06-10-2005).]

[QSIMDO]

Bridgeport was sold to a British firm and then ..well this is what I found;

http://www.bpt.com/index.asp?pageID=682&nid=4890

[pete913]

KO Lee is most definitely still in business in Aberdeen SD. I was in the plant a couple of months ago, although the bulding is for sale (3 million last I heard), at which point the Lee family , who really isn't involved in it anymore, will sell off the business to the highest bidder, which will be easy once they figure out how to dump the building. That I think is probably the sticking point. It's too bad too, all their castings are done in Iowa, and the entire machines are made right there at the plant in Aberdeen, always have been. People always wonder why they build grinders way out in SD. Simple, before the start of WW2, practically every grinder manufacturer in the US was within battleship range of the east coast. The govt approached KO Lee, who was building mostly automotive valve refacers and seat grinding equipment at the time, to expand their plant to deliver X amount of several different types of grinders every month, with the govt paying for their plant expansion. At the end of the war, the company wound up with basically a free building, although they didn't make all that much money selling grinders to the govt. ( no $1500 hammers at that time).
I remember that original sawtooth brick factory building well from my childhood. My grandfathers house was about 6 blocks away from it, and he worked directly across the street from the front door of the plant. It wasn't a big place then,although today it covers about a two city block area not counting the parking lot.
The way I hear it, nowdays what's keeping it alive isn't grinders, but mostly subcontract defense work.
Another place in Aberdeen that most folks never heard of is Clark equipment. Not sure what they build there, but I've been told that the Aberdeen Clark plant has the largest OD grinder west of the Mississippi. Supposed to swing 120" or so, so I've been told.


[This message has been edited by pete913 (edited 06-11-2005).]

[This message has been edited by pete913 (edited 06-11-2005).]

[moldmonkey]

pete913

Do they give tours? I'm going home the end of July for my Grandma's B-day. She lives in Aberdeen. I grew up in the Mobridge area straight west on Hwy 12 on the missouri river. My brother-in-law who is also a machinist by chance will be in town too so he might be interested in checking it out.

I had very limited knowledge of machining while growing up so I guess I didn't pay attention to what was in the area. Probably used to be more with all the railroads. Hub City and all.

Jon Bohlander

[This message has been edited by moldmonkey (edited 06-11-2005).]

[pete913]

Jon, I'm not sure, as I was down there on a saturday (no one was working). I picked up a used 6x18 grinder from them. But you might call customer service and ask for Dean Erickson there. He's a real nice guy and I'm sure if he has the time he'd gladly show you around.

[HTRN]

A couple of thoughts....

Haas is currently the biggest Machine tool builder in the USA, shipping recently hit 600 machines a month, and they're undergoing yet another expansion. Gene Haas has said he wants to be the biggest machine tool builder in the world in ten years... I'd put money on him reaching his goal. He's seen the future in his toolroom machines and can't make them fast enough

Yes, the Clausing Mitosa(spelling?) is made in spain, and is supposed to be a first class machine.

Alot of the "Machine Tool builders" are buying back machines they formerly made and rebuilding them. Leblond is doing this because one of my friends got contacted by Leblond for one of their lathes he had for sale. Monarch and South Bend are doing this as well...

Manual Machines are a relatively small profit, small sale base item. They also last damn near forever, partially due to the dominance of CNC - manuals are now secondary ops machines, which means they get used lightly and much less often. CNC's are expensive and the technology is improving constantly, so they're "ridden hard and put away wet"... Ever see a 20yo VMC? The asking price is usually just above scrap. Life expectancy for a new production CNC is eight years, then it's replaced with something newer and faster.


HTRN

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This Old Shed

[Milacron of PM]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Yes, the Clausing Mitosa(spelling?) is made in spain, and is supposed to be a first class machine.
</font>

Unless they have improved in the past few years, they may be "supposed" to be first class, but if anything I have the opposite impression of that in reality. I've been in the thick of things via manufacturing machine tools until 1998, with booth at IMTS show every two years, and heard many negatives about the Metosas during that time. Plus reports on Metosa troubles on Practical Machinist as recently as two years ago.

This is curious, as the Spanish make some of the best drilling machines in the world. But their lathes have never been much to write home about. Some folks get a "good one", perhaps even many, but there have been many serious repeatability and accuracy issues with the Metosas over the years and personally I wouldn't touch one.




[This message has been edited by D. Thomas (edited 06-11-2005).]

[ronsmith100]

I met Gene Haas on several occasions (his ex tooling foreman taught a few night classes for us at Cerritos). Every time I said howdy to him and the conversation drifted towards business he said that very same thing. He does have a vision of becoming the biggest CNC machine tool maker in the USA.. perhaps in the world.
If you ever get a chance take the tour. The entire plant is ringed with a catwalk (Just like Boeing Everett and Ford rouge river). The interesting thing is to see the machines that machine the Hass castings... thye of course are not Haas. They are Hitachi Seki.

As an aside, before Haas Automation moved out to the new plant they used to be side by side with Fadal. Interesting how much of the machine tool industry moved from the rust belt to the west coast.