Moglice Application

[madman]

Would Moglice be useable in a centerless grinder that comes with whats called Filmatic Bearings? This is a Cincinnatti number 2 Machine. Its my friends and it needs some repair in the bearings.

[TGTool]

Is that spindle or way bearings?

[Forrest Addy]

Nope. You don't use Moglice on journal bearings. Not that it wouldn't work but because babbitt and bearing bronze work better and at lower cost. You use Moglice and other bonded bearing materials on linear axis ways where speeds are low, restoration to original assembly fit-up is desired, and hot processes cannot be used.

Do your research before you take on Filmatiic bearings. These are pivoting shoe spilndle bearings. Babbitt on bronze shoes I think. Not complicated but they do have to be set up properly and precisely. Here's some info:

http://books.google.com/books?id=0-H...-1&output=html

I've never seen a Cincinnati Filmatic bearing apart but if they are llike other babbitt bearings they have to have a "lead" or a "throat" scraped into the leading edge and first third of the bearing surface to enhance the oil flow into the bearing. I'm sure there's some hard won lore on just how to do this. I mention it not because I've done it in this particular application but to put you on notice that these little details are important to the bearing's function. If they are not done properly the bearing may run hot, starve for oil, or be "soft" acting (that is be easly diflected by varying loads from the running axis; a fatal flaw in a grinder spindle).

[lazlo]

You don't use Moglice on journal bearings.

I don't see why you couldn't use Moglice to repair journal bearings, since it's used to repair quills, and even cast conforming nuts. A lot of guys use Moglice to re-coat the sliding bearing in their Clausing vari-speed sheave.

Here's an example of restoring the 22" diameter quill on a giant horizontal boring mill:

http://www.moglice.com/applications/...oll_quill_bore

This is a 22 inch diameter quill from an Ingersoll horizontal boring mill. Being severely scored it was re-ground under size to a clean up which required about a 1/16 of stock removal on radius. Note that it is not necessary to chrome, spray weld or otherwise build up the quill so it could be re-ground to original size.

[Fasttrack]

I think there might be a slight RPM difference between a 22" quill and centerless grinder spindle...

Forrest said that they could be used, but that the bronze/babbit works better for this particular application.

[lazlo]

Sure, but Babbit is pretty soft. I'd imagine that Moglice (which is two-part epoxy embedded with either Teflon or Molybdenum Disulfide) has a higher PV rating than Babbit, which is basically Tin.

Madman: you might want to look around the "Application Examples" on the Moglice web page:

http://www.moglice.com/applications/applications.html

[Forrest Addy]

The problem is when it fails. When babbit bearings fail they fail gracefully. When Moglice fails it either turns to crumbs or expandes into the clearance space oveheating the journal.

The most desireable property of babbitt is its failure mode. A failed babbitt bearing leaves the journal almost undamaged. At worst the journal requires clean-up and polishing and the babbitt shell (shoe, whatever) needs to be cleaned up, tinned, repoured and machined. Two to three hours for a hot millwright for a plain babbitt bearing. Considerably more for a Filmatic.

I dunno. Maybe Moglice would worrk. I'm sure it would work but who well and what would the failure mode be like. I wouldn't llike to experiment with my Cincinnatti centerless. Maybe some other guy.

Speaking of which, Filmatic bearings last 50 years or more in 8/5 production. I've never heards of one failing unless it was run without oil or had been in a fire.

[lazlo]

The problem is when it fails. When babbit bearings fail they fail gracefully. When Moglice fails it either turns to crumbs or expandes into the clearance space oveheating the journal.

Ah, good point. You know, I bought a 5lb ingot of original Babbit, circa 1890's, on Ebay for the cost of shipping. I'm been trying to decide if there's any use for it in a home shop? Does anyone use babbit bearings in model engines? It makes a cool paperweight though

Speaking of which, Filmatic bearings last 50 years or more in 8/5 production. I've never heards of one failing unless it was run without oil or had been in a fire.

I had to Google "Filmatic bearing" and the first hit is this thread Apparently a fluid-film (hydrostatic) bearing? That sounds way out of the realm of repair in a home shop.

Here's a cool diagram of Cincinnati's Filmatic bearing:

http://books.google.com/books?id=QrQ...um=6&ct=result