Anyone here familair with underhammer muzzle loaders?

[G.A. Ewen]

They intrigue me and I'd like to build one. What keeps the cap from falling off the nipple when the gun is cocked?

[JCHannum]

Bear grease.

The cap can be crimped too, but I seem to recall a small dab of grease being used on underhammer guns and revolvers to keep the cap in place. I think tallow was originally used but Crisco is a good substitute. It is also used when loading revolvers to prevent flashover from firing the other cylinders. It softens powder fouling as well.

[38_Cal]

Percussion caps are essentially straight cylinders, rifle and most revolver nipples are slightly tapered, so when you cap the rifle, it's a push-fit. I'm in the process right now of building one for a client, the lock components are from these folks: http://tinyurl.com/dhrm49. Page down to see the complete kit. (No relationship with the firm other than as a customer.) I'm using a Green Mountain .45 caliber barrel, fitted with a false muzzle, for slugs. Wood is a piece of late 1800's cut curly black walnut.

PM me if you have specific questions...I'll try to answer them!

David
Montezuma, IA

[Rusty Marlin]

Bear grease.

The cap can be crimped too, but I seem to recall a small dab of grease being used on underhammer guns and revolvers to keep the cap in place. I think tallow was originally used but Crisco is a good substitute. It is also used when loading revolvers to prevent flashover from firing the other cylinders. It softens powder fouling as well.

if you get grease on the priming compund the primer is DEAD. I declare this answer as faciful historical lore at best, and.... well I'll be polite.

38's answer is correct, tapered nipples.

[Bob Ford]

R M
"if you get grease on the priming compund the primer is DEAD. I declare this answer as faciful historical lore at best, and.... well I'll be polite." Quote

I hunt with muzzle loading cap lock in a area That gets up to 120 inches of rain in one year. If you wish your rifle to fire, you use grease/ bullet lube around the cap and nipple. Water kills caps far quicker that grease. Flinters put grease, wax, or tallow around the pan to help keep water out. Proper fitting caps pressed on the tapered nipple then heavy grease/ bullet lube usually keeps the water out.

Bob

[Rusty Marlin]

R M
"if you get grease on the priming compund the primer is DEAD. I declare this answer as faciful historical lore at best, and.... well I'll be polite." Quote

I hunt with muzzle loading cap lock in a area That gets up to 120 inches of rain in one year. If you wish your rifle to fire, you use grease/ bullet lube around the cap and nipple. Water kills caps far quicker that grease. Flinters put grease, wax, or tallow around the pan to help keep water out. Proper fitting caps pressed on the tapered nipple then heavy grease/ bullet lube usually keeps the water out.

Bob

Never hunted with a flinter, my sence of humor isn't that good.
I used to use a swab of clear nail polish around the cap and nipple to water proof mine. Last year I made a new priming system that's fully enclosed and uses large pistol primers. Direct thread in replacement of the old nipple for the new one.

[JCHannum]

I must admit that it has been several decades since I actively did any muzzle loading and I am sure that there have been changes since then. But back then lubricants of varying types were used to protect, seal and soften fouling. I may have exaggerated a bit with bear grease, but not with tallow and Crisco. Both were used for the purposes cited. We had a hard time finding nail polish, clear or otherwise, on the frontier.

[Rusty Marlin]

I must admit that it has been several decades since I actively did any muzzle loading and I am sure that there have been changes since then. But back then lubricants of varying types were used to protect, seal and soften fouling. I may have exaggerated a bit with bear grease, but not with tallow and Crisco. Both were used for the purposes cited. We had a hard time finding nail polish, clear or otherwise, on the frontier.

We use crisco as an over ball lube and spark arrestor in the cap and ball revolvers. Creamy peanut butter works good too in a pinch. Just have to fight the squills off your back trail.

[KDuffy]

I grew up shooting an under hammer of my fathers own design. It used coil springs in the lock rather than the trigger guard for the mainspring. Nipples being tapered is the answer, the method is to use old nipples freshened up and reformed (shortened and resharpened at the top) to match original profile at the top. Caps then are forced onto the nipple with the hammer slowly by hand just before the shot, properly fitted they will not fire from the first hammer fall.

The most important thing is to use low powered caps, such as the old Dixie Gun Works caps, rather than the RWS, CCI or Remington caps. These caps will stay together and generally stay on the nipple without splitting and releasing gasses. Best thing is they come off when you want, not when they want and they wind up on the ground not in your shirt or stuck in your hand or arm!

I started building an underhammer pistol years ago, never finished it. I fired it several times, but never expected to hit anything with it, I used a .395 round balls in a double pillow ticking patch in an old piece of Marlin microgroove barrel off a .44 rifle. It did shoot much better than I expected, just a thought to keep in the back of your mind. I should try to post some pictures of them some day. I hope he still has his underhammer, it used a Douglas XX in .45 cal. that was 36" of 1 1/8 octogon, hell to get up, but stable as the day is long when you got set.

[ellis5502]

Try to look at Herschel Logan's book "Underhammer Guns", published by Stackpole in 1960. Basic look at the different actions, predominately pistols but some long guns, lists of makers, good writeup of serious shooting at long range during the 1950s at Friendship and description of home made slug gun.

ellis