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Thread: Drawings and hands held.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Nottingham, England
    Posts
    15,188

    Default Drawings and hands held.

    Not quite OT but I'm looking for views on this.

    On another forum I go on someone posted a simple dividing head, block of metal bored for a spindle with a division plate and peg on the end, very simple and neat.

    Another poster came on and asked he the OP was prepared to supply drawings for it.

    Now I had the same a couple of years ago and in that case I stuck my foot in it and said why do you need drawings, it's that simple you can work it out for yourself. Plus the fact that if the drawings were published they would only work for the host machine and probably not be suitable for the second persons use.

    A better job could be made my transposing the design to suit.

    I got some right stick over this, not being helpful [ moi ? ] etc.

    I stick stick by my guns though in that if you spoon feed everything how can someone develop the skill necessary to stand on their own two feet.

    Flames ?, bricks ?, donations by Paypal ??
    .

    Sir John , Earl of Bligeport & Sudspumpwater. MBE [ Motor Bike Engineer ] Nottingham England.




  2. #2
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    Apr 2009
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    Ashburton, near Christchurch New Zealand
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    Default

    I agree Sir John, sometime I wonder if the people who ask questions like that are actually active in their workshops or not or are they just dreaming about doing something 'one day'.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    Prestatyn, North-Wales
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    Default

    yup make em work it out by them selves

    ive done drawings for people on the net that took me an hour to draw..wasnt thanked for them ...and didnt really emjoy drawing them

    all the best.markj

  4. #4
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    Oct 2002
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    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
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    Default

    I can see where you're coming from. The line between simple and complicated varies from person to person, but there is a lower limit where everybody should be able to figure it out on their own with the help of a #2 pencil and a napkin; I believe the simple dividing head you mentioned falls into this category.

    The guy that gave you a hard time is lucky! Someone with a twisted sense of humour might have sent him a lovely set of plans with all the dimensions off by just enough that the final product would make anything made in a backwoods Indian village look good..

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    3,039

    Default

    I know both kinds.

    I knew one fellow that had an interesting art talent; He could virtually perfectly copy any existing line art. At the time, he was dabbling in comic books- he'd redraw the character from the cover (not trace) and it'd be virtually line-for-line perfect. No tricks, no tracing while I wasn't looking- I watched him do it. Slow, methodical, totally absorbed, absolutely perfect. No trouble enlarging or shrinking either- he could draw it 50% blown up just as easily as he could do half-size.

    But he couldn't come up with any of his own original art. If he didn't have something to copy- as in, physical lineart in front of him- he was lost. Didn't know what to do. When I last saw him, he was having a huge amount of difficulty even just changing the costume on the comic character- which, on the average spandex superhero type was just a few lines marking the top of a boot or different logos on the chest.

    But even just doing that was immensely difficult for him.

    On the other hand, I knew a guy that built entire aluminum fishing boats from cocktail-napkin drawings. The customer would say yeah, I want it 32' long, I want a big cabin, I'm gonna use this motor, etc. He'd sketch something up- literally- the customer would basically okay the chicken-scratch drawing, and three months later, they'd roll out a shiny new 32' gillnetter.

    No blueprints, no patterns. Lots of hand fitting- that he made look absurdly easy- and the occasional visit from the customer who'd say oh yeah, I want the goat locker over here, and I want the scuppers right about here.

    Some people have to have a plan. I'm that way with electricals. I fully admit I don't "get" it, beyond the basic positive, negative and glowing coil of tungsten. I can wire a shop and I did wire an entire car, but I have to carry around a "how-to-for-dummies" book like a prosthesis to do so.

    On the other hand, some people can look at something, understand it, and design and build one for themselves on the fly. I've lost count, for example, of the number of Frank Ford's doodads I've copied- he almost never supplies any measurements, and his stuff is built out of whatever he's got on hand, but who cares? I built 'em to fit my tooling and my shop.

    Some people can only follow instructions, some people make their own path.

    Doc.
    Doc's Machine. (Probably not what you expect.)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Harwich,Essex,UK
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    1,142

    Default

    I somehow think that the point of being a newby to machining is being lost here!
    Theres enough to learn without worrying about clearances, bearings, fittings etc, the learner is better following some drawings, even if they are of a simple nature in that it is better to walk first then run!
    After all whats relatively simple to a proficient machinist/engineer to a newby its all unknown!
    I for one thought that a collets a collet but no, as JohnS has pointed out many times 5c collets have only a limited grip range,after all we all had to star somewhere.
    Personally I prefer the drawings even if I end up changing what I eventually make!

    Peter
    I have tools I don't know how to use!!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Grand Blanc Michigan
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    3,603

    Default

    I, of necessity, practice hand holding. In the articles I write for DM, HSM and MW, I try to explain, photograph and illustrate (drawings) such that a beginner has a chance of accomplishing the project.

    However, with the exception of my Geneva Mechanism article, I have heard of no instances where anyone has copied any of my projects, and even those doing the Geneva modified them to suit their own purposes.

    I don't find this too surprising, as I have subscribed to the magazines, and others, for most years of their existence, and have never built someone elses project, excepting a flycutter.
    Weston Bye - Author, The Mechatronist column, Digital Machinist magazine
    ~Practitioner of the Electromechanical Arts~

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Heidelberg, Melbourne, Australia
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    24

    Default

    JS,

    So where's the bloody drawings so we know what you are talking about?

    No drawings, it doesn't exist!

    Ken

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Burnet, TX
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    The idea is the most important thing to present. A picture is worth a thousand words. The swing-threading tool is a good example. I have now built several and learned and benefited from doing each one. Mine were mostly built from materials that were on hand. They were fitted to my machine and they definitely are useful tools to have on the shelf. I donít often do left hand threads and I didnít include the features that were the subject of your first post. I would have never thought this sort of thing on my own, but given a good idea I can make use of it. Thank You!
    Byron Boucher
    Burnet, TX

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    On the Oil Coast,USA
    Posts
    16,812

    Default

    Picture is free,drawings are $19.95
    I just need one more tool,just one!

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