Gentlemen

[Weston Bye]

During my recent participation at NAMES, I had the opportunity to chat with a number of members and “lurkers” on this BBS; some well known and frequent posters and a larger number who posted considerably less frequently or who just lurked. To my surprise, and without my prompting, this latter group, to a man, volunteered that they held back from posting because they felt intimidated by some of the more opinionated “regulars” that inhabit this place. I didn’t press the issue, and nobody named names. I did promise to pass the sentiments along to George.

I was mildly surprised at this, as I find the BBS to be reasonably civil, but I suppose, like the body’s response to a repetitive minor irritation, I may have grown a callous.

I relate all this to suggest that we all consider our posts more carefully. We can be Gentlemen – a little more gentle - but still men.

Ladies are welcome, too.

[dian]

i remember an automotive forum, that i frequented to gather some information, where the general greeting formula was "hi ****ers". this place is the most civilized one in english i know of.

[Dr Stan]

Weston,

Amen to what you have written. I have avoided submitting comments to various threads due to the way they were heading. Usually the members avoid politics & religion, but every now & then someone will just have to bring it up.

That said, the HSM is still one of the most civilized forums on the Web.

Stan

[A.K. Boomer]

Iv always stood up for the newbie - esp. the ones with a great attitude, without the newbies this place would get very "oldbies"

let em get their feet wet - then if they get out of line do what Roy D. Mercer would do - give em a gool ole fashioned country ass whoopin...

I don't like it when people pick on someone else for their spelling either - old member or new,
nobody spells so bad that you have to break out your secret decoder ring, we all know what their talking about --- I have to admit one guy was pretty tough to figure out - but when you took a little extra time he had a great mind and allot to add - yet he was getting picked on by others...

The "rib jabbing" by many of the senior members is for the most part intentional --- we don't have all day to ***** foot around - cut to the chase and lay it out there and lets see what you got, it also makes the learning experience easier to recall when there's a little spanking along with it - and that goes both ways...

[mikem]

When I think about your conversation with the reluctant posters, it does affect the way I post. I don't attack where not needed ( I did comment on the guy who ran his lathe at 400 RPM to check for runout with his dial indicator) and don't offer advice in areas where I know that I am not qualified to offer advice.

If the boardmembers that really have the experience about a topic don't attempt to correct the posters that offer stupid and/or dangerous advice, then what is the benefit of the BBS. We all come for more knowledge (and some for companionship ) and if I have to be wise enough to recognize bad info listed here, how am I going to trust the info here if it is anything beyond what I already know?

I read every day and post when I can help. Thanks to all!

[justanengineer]

If the boardmembers that really have the experience about a topic don't attempt to correct the posters that offer stupid and/or dangerous advice, then what is the benefit of the BBS. We all come for more knowledge (and some for companionship ) and if I have to be wise enough to recognize bad info listed here, how am I going to trust the info here if it is anything beyond what I already know?

+1 ^^^

Unrelated to the quote, but relevant to the topic - I find agreements hardly productive, and usually learn the most from those that disagree with my views and argue their own fiercely as it forces me to see more deeply into the logic on both sides. If someone comes up with a dozen arguments for something Im against, I may have seen 6 reasons in support of my logic previously, but you can bet Im going to go look for a full 12. :P

I suspect Weston isnt necessarily saying we should all agree, just that we need to be more civil. With (quite literally) one or two exceptions, I would say that the majority that post here are very generous and understanding folks.

I would question how this board could act any more civil/gentlemanly. I get more crap in one day from the relatives I never see than I do from this collective board all year. Heaven help the lurkers that try speaking up over on PM or one of the more "hostile" boards Im a member of.

[Mcgyver]

My sense is its just how people few as the new stranger upon encountering a crowd of men hard at a conversation. It'll be mostly the same even if all here study Emily Post. New posters are always welcomed and I would say there is just about zero BS here along the lines "I've got X # posts so what I say matters more" Offensive is offensive but no one gets beat up for asking questions or not knowing. None of us was born knowing anything, and all are ignorant of many things so please do not fear asking; its behaviour that is welcome here.

If there's any newbie's listening, just ask a question, or post a "thanks for posting that" to a thread or better yet introduce yourself. Its maybe slightly uncomfortable for some getting started but no more so than going to lunch room at new job, screw up that courage and say hello.

[Mcgyver]

When I think about your conversation with the reluctant posters, it does affect the way I post. I don't attack where not needed ( I did comment on the guy who ran his lathe at 400 RPM to check for runout with his dial indicator) and don't offer advice in areas where I know that I am not qualified to offer advice.

If the boardmembers that really have the experience about a topic don't attempt to correct the posters that offer stupid and/or dangerous advice, then what is the benefit of the BBS. We all come for more knowledge (and some for companionship ) and if I have to be wise enough to recognize bad info listed here, how am I going to trust the info here if it is anything beyond what I already know?

For the most part I agree with you, but how do you decide who is the experienced one? imo you can't tune in here once and have it of much value. You read opposing info/ view points with no sense of the posters' credibility. Your approach imo is good and buildings credibility; restricting absolute statements to things you really know. I think we'd all benefit from a reminder of that now and again.

Poster B disagreeing with A gives me the heads up there's more than one possible answer, not which one is correct. The real value though comes from having a sense of who's credible, who has a background, education, experience in the subject matter and who tends to only make assertive statements around things they know. it's the basic challenge of internet info anywhere vs print media; no reseacher or editor function

[Optics Curmudgeon]

It was only in the last few years that I realized that there is a subset of humanity that appears to be argumentative and determined to win any argument at any cost, but in fact are simply fond of the art of "debate" and find it to be a stimulating mode of social interaction. The rest of us, on the other hand, find it annoying because we don't understand. For the "debaters" (some are very good at it, we call those "masterdebaters") the object isn't to be right, or "win", because then the debate would be over, and the fun would stop. Getting in the middle of one of these can be a bad experience for the uninitiated and it's not always easy to tell whether it's an honest discussion or something else.

[Alistair Hosie]

Good thought provoking point well said Weston. Alistair