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Thread: Oil for a Sunnen Hone Machine.

  1. #1
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    Default Oil for a Sunnen Hone Machine.

    Sunnen wants you to think the sun may not rise again if you don't use their specialty honing oils.

    I don't know what I don't know about oils, but it seems this is a very simple and undemanding use, at low rpm's it lubrication one side of the hone, while flushing chips away from the other. Not sure where the fact and BS start and stop, and want to avoid drinking the koolaid, er um, Sunnen MB-30 honing oil

    It would be faster, easier and much cheaper to grab a pail of hydraulic oil, basically a pure mineral oil, vs ordering the Sunnen oil.

    Maybe its better for the skin? I've never had oils bother my skin, otoh I've not spent a long time with hands immersed in it.

    Anyone used regular oil with a Sunnen hone, any reason not to? Curious what you guys think.
    Last edited by Mcgyver; 12-30-2018 at 05:26 PM.
    .

  2. #2
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    I've always felt that the cost of the oil used during a honing operation is probably the cheapest component involved during that process. The cost of the part being honed, the stones, and of course the labor involved have all lead me to not compromising on that last ingredient. The doing it right the first time philosophy has been ingrained firmly into my skull from prior experience.

    The chemistry to not only flush the chips away, keep the stones clean and working efficiently is there, as well as the assurance that the bore of the cylinder has the proper surface finish is more important than the inconvenience or cost involved by sourcing the proper oil. It gives me the assurance that all those other costs are not gambled away on an unknown quantity.

    Are there other oils with the prerequisite qualities to be used as a honing oil for the desired finish I'm after in the material I'm working with? I'm sure there are but not knowing which ones are suitable or are a compromise. I've always chosen to use the oil that was intended for that application.

    Kind of like using chainsaw bar oil on slide ways or using a proper way oil, the difference is obvious once you've used both on the same machine.
    But as mentioned I'm sure there are others that may be suitable so it will be interesting to see the input from others.
    Home, down in the valley behind the Red Angus
    Bad Decisions Make Good Stories

  3. #3
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    Sunnen hone oils list chlorinated, sulphurized mineral oil, animal fats and vegetable based oils as ingredients. So dome of them are quite a potions..

    Homebrew from kerosene+atf+dark thread cutting oil?

  4. #4
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    Wink

    Schaeffer's honing oil-

    https://www.schaefferoil.com/documents/23-125-td.pdf

    Texaco Sultex D-

    https://cglapps.chevron.com/msdspds/...&docFormat=PDF

    Sunnen MB-30 -

    https://www.sunnen.com/graphics/asse...02ca3fc914.pdf

    Particularly-" Also very effective as a
    general cutting oil for drilling,
    tapping, and reaming. No matter the metal, from aluminum
    to zirconium, MB-30 works."

    It's also "very effective" because they are all the same,light to medium sulferized cutting oil,non-chlorinated with Lard added.They will all also stain some copper based alloys,but it's not that big a concern so long as you don't store the finished parts without washing them.

    Oh,forgot to add,I've worked with all three "low odor" cutting/honing/grinding oils and I can pick up that stink a mile away.If that stuff is low odor I would hate to smell the regular blend
    Last edited by wierdscience; 12-30-2018 at 05:54 PM.
    I just need one more tool,just one!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wierdscience View Post
    Oh,forgot to add,I've worked with all three "low odor" cutting/honing/grinding oils and I can pick up that stink a mile away.If that stuff is low odor I would hate to smell the regular blend
    good point about the smell....going in the garage so its somewhat isolated. Do you think the sulferized oil is even needed for this - I mean its not exactly high pressure, you're withstanding the torque by hand

    Willy, you're a big spender I might end up with more in the oil than I spent on the machine. I'm the first guy to want to do things properly, but I wanted the rational or confirmation that regular oil won't work, i.e. don't want to shell out just for marketing.

    Homebrew from kerosene+atf+dark thread cutting oil?
    how'd you came up with that? might be great, just curious what your thinking is.
    Last edited by Mcgyver; 12-30-2018 at 08:49 PM.
    .

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mcgyver View Post
    good point about the smell....going in the garage so its somewhat isolated. Do you think the sulferized oil is even needed for this - I mean its not exactly high pressure, you're withstanding the torque by hand
    I don't think it would be needed,it's probably been used just because it's good oil that is ubiquituos in the metal trades.The viscosity needs to be similar,too thin and the stones will load,too thick and they will plane over without cutting.A good candidate to try might be Rigid Nu-Clear threading oil.Should be a plumbing supply near you that carries it or similar.It's just a blend of Mineral,parrafin and vegtable oil-

    https://www.ridgid.com/us/en/thread-cutting-oil
    Last edited by wierdscience; 12-30-2018 at 08:50 PM.
    I just need one more tool,just one!

  7. #7
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    Not sure what the project is and it doesn't really matter to anyone but you, and of course it is you that have to justify and keep the cost and materials in perspective. I certainly wouldn't entertain the idea of buying a $200 pail of oil to do a couple of lawnmowers but I'm sure you know better than this, probably better than me. LOL

    I did have a look around just now to see what else might be an option.

    At the Flexhone's site I see they have a preferred oil for honing that they too are pretty proud of as well at about $225 a pail. And some of their brush hones aren't exactly cheap either so one would assume they do not suggest an alternative.

    http://www.brushresearch.com/brushes.php?c1=5

    Upon a closer look I see that they in fact do offer an alternative, an alternative I have not tried myself.

    http://www.brushresearch.com/flex-hone-instructions.php


    The Flex-Hone REQUIRES the use of a lubricant. Always generously lubricate prior to use with10-30 weight motor oil or BRM's custom Flex-Hone Oil. Hydraulic brake fluid may be used when honing hydraulic brake cylinders.
    It is certainly an option worth considering.
    Home, down in the valley behind the Red Angus
    Bad Decisions Make Good Stories

  8. #8
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    Mcgyver,

    I went down this rabbit hole, in depth, earlier this year. You are more than welcome to do all the research you want. I have only two things to say.

    1. The in-depth discussions are over on Practical Machinist. Feel free to search my name +MB30.

    2. In the end, I bought 20 Gallons of MB30. That should tell you something about your quest.

    With that said, with agreeable circumstances it is a rather simple affair to arrange things so that you can get away with 5 Gallons. It is even possible to get away with 1 Gallon. I do not recommend it, but you can.

    If you should wish any more input or assistance, just holler. I'm happy to help.

    EDIT - I feel remiss if I do not add - do not waste your time with other oils if you desire quality. Seriously. /EDIT
    Last edited by Zahnrad Kopf; 12-30-2018 at 09:56 PM.

  9. #9
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    You don't state what machine and set up you bought. It will have much to do with how you approach things.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahnrad Kopf View Post
    You don't state what machine and set up you bought. It will have much to do with how you approach things.

    Sunnen makes a small hone and the big engine block one.
    You know so much about it, you tell us the difference in oil requirements then.

    -D

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