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1943 Sidney Lathe Partial Restore

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  • Don't worry about a macro lens. I don't need that much detail.

    Just a good cellphone snap is fine, all I really need is just that it's as square to the plate as possible, so there's minimal distortion. Too close and you can start getting a "fisheye" effect, off to one side or high or low and that gives a trapezoidal effect, etc.

    Doesn't have to be perfect, just pretty close. I just use it as a "guide", really, to draw the art over the top.

    Also, don't worry about the possible changes in speed- once I have the artwork, it'll be trivial to change the actual numbers. I think I mentioned I'm planning to make a new chart for my Springfield (etched brass, not cast like yours) reflecting the change to a 1725 motor rather than the original 1150.

    Doc.
    Doc's Machine. (Probably not what you expect.)

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    • Originally posted by Doc Nickel View Post
      Don't worry about a macro lens. I don't need that much detail.

      Just a good cellphone snap is fine, all I really need is just that it's as square to the plate as possible, so there's minimal distortion. Too close and you can start getting a "fisheye" effect, off to one side or high or low and that gives a trapezoidal effect, etc.

      Doesn't have to be perfect, just pretty close. I just use it as a "guide", really, to draw the art over the top.

      Also, don't worry about the possible changes in speed- once I have the artwork, it'll be trivial to change the actual numbers. I think I mentioned I'm planning to make a new chart for my Springfield (etched brass, not cast like yours) reflecting the change to a 1725 motor rather than the original 1150.

      Doc.
      Cell phone isn't fine to me. Shop lighting isn't good and I use bottom feeder phones. The few pictures that I have shot with my phone are quite obvious. I actually have shot 95% of the photos in this thread with my 10 year old Canon T2i and my Rokinon 16mm, then post processed in lightroom, mostly for resizing and getting rid of the awful color cast from florescent lighting. In the past month or so I've started shooting in raw since I like the colors better. Your threads are always such a treat because everything is well lit, sharp, easy to see and understand what's going on. I liked that, and tried to emulate that in mine.

      The Rokinon is very sharp and I can crop a lot, but I just can't get that close to the small details. I've got a second body that I got for video work and never use, so having a 60mm macro would really round out my capabilities and I wouldn't have to swap any lenses.

      But yeah, I know exactly what you want, and I'll get a nice crisp image and correct for any distortion. I just want to make sure that I'll be able to get a plate before I have you waste your time. Glad to hear on the numbers. I'll have to get out the digital tach and figure out all the new speeds. Top end is around 800 now. We replaced the 1150 with a 1725 as well. It sounds like the PO had the original motor, just dumped it when he went to single phase. Shame.
      21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
      1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

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      • Would like to add, I have done plates this way for a while, using a photo or just put the original plate on a scanner. Get a heavy chunk of brass and etch it in ferric chloride and it comes out nice. I did plates for my welder and a BBQ for a buddy this way, using 1/16 thick 360 brass.

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        • Originally posted by The Metal Butcher View Post
          ...It's a little challenging to get a good finish on....
          .
          You'll want to ream it.
          12" x 35" Logan 2557V lathe
          Index "Super 55" mill
          18" Vectrax vertical bandsaw
          7" x 10" Vectrax mitering bandsaw
          24" State disc sander

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          • Originally posted by ezduzit View Post

            You'll want to ream it.
            Reamer would be good. I'm not sure if we have a 1 1/4". I'll look. We've got a few, but always the wrong ones. :/


            So, Re: Gearbox,

            The next part to come out to strip it was the leadscrew driver, and it has 3 components, an exterior sleeve, attached to a shaft, running through an interior sleeve. There was no where good to hit on the inside, just the dog engagement showing. I was thinking about making yet another tool, when I had the idea of using a 3 jaw chuck clamped on and beating on the chuck with a soft faced hammer. That worked great and didn't damage anything.

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            Then the cluster came out easily enough.

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            Then there was just two shafts left. On the leadscrew reverse shaft (hidden) there were a couple of really tough taper pins. I remembered seeing or having tried an air hammer in the past and that working well. Brap! Taper pins out.

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            Stripped! After two more pressure wash and purple power cycles for a total of 5 or so, the case is pretty clean. It will still get one final wash in the parts washer to clean up and remove the flash rust from the precision bores.

            That's as much process as we've made on the GB for now. We're waiting on some bearings. Dad waited to see if any were good before ordering. 1 was. 8 weren't. Surprise. A bearing distributor on ebay sent us a 10 pack of 6208 RS bearings when we ordered a 10 pack of 6206 ZZs. That's like... not even close to right. Whatever, they're not asking us to send them back.
            21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
            1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

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            • With the paint dry on the saddle I turned my attention to the cross slide. The cross-slide was complete, just needed a few finishing touches.

              First, a 5 thou shim for the gib to get a little more travel.

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              Then it could be installed with the two new gib screws.

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              I was having some binding at the near end, and discovered that due to wear the saddle had been effectively shifted to the left and bunch and the lead screw wasn't allowing for that. So I oversized the holes and added washers. It's still not tight. At all. I can't add any more shim if I want full travel. Is what it is. I also apparently installed an apron gear backwards (fully symmetrical) and now the wear is running opposite that of the cross-slide leadscrew gear and it does not run smoothly. I think because one gear hung just a tic off the other, there some displaced metal causing it to be grumbley. It seems to already be getting better so I'm hoping just to leave it because I do not intend to pull the apron again. I can live with it at least.

              Since I was finished behind it we shoved it up against the wall. Not a good place for machines I know, but we don't have any other options. I can still get to stuff behind it, I just have to work ontop of the machine.

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              We got it removed from it's dollies and onto concrete blocks. Last time we moved it, I bent my Johnson bar slightly. I reinforced it, but now with the added weight of the machine and and slightly worse mechanical advantage of the bar, I cannot lift it. It may finally be time to invest in a toe jack. I need it to come up another inch or so for my leveling feet. I'm starting to like the color scheme a bit more too as it balances out and dulls a bit.

              Getting closer. Not that much more to do. I'm hopeing it will be done before I'm back in school (Aug 19), and I think it will be.
              21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
              1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

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              • TMB, I found that piece of Ampco 18. Measuring with calipers I get an OD of about 1.57X" Would that work for you?
                It's not real rough but it would probably require a slight clean up or skim cut on the OD.

                It's some strange looking stuff. Looks kind of tiger striped, except the stripes are more like patches, but in a consistent pattern.
                Lynn (Huntsville, AL)

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                • I think that would work extremely well actually. I think each bushing is around 3/4" long, so I'd need just over 1 3/4" with parting allowance. Only bad thing would be that I'd feel bad running such nice bushings against the undersized shaft haha. It's only worn about 4 thou under so I don't think it's worth remaking, not given the rest of the machine. If I do get this material from you do you mind if I borrow the whole bar and then give the rest back? That would make it a lot easier to machine in one setup.
                  21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
                  1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by The Metal Butcher View Post
                    ........... do you mind if I borrow the whole bar and then give the rest back? That would make it a lot easier to machine in one setup.
                    That's a good idea ...less wasted in the chip pan that way. We can work out the details tomorrow.
                    Lynn (Huntsville, AL)

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                    • Well I was about getting ready to machine the bore on the brass/bronze tumbler, but it's swing radius is 7". The Lagun will swing that, but not with a chuck jaw hanging on the outside. So, it was either pull the chuck, pull the gap, reinstall the chuck, machine, pull the chuck, reinstall the gap, or just do it in the Sidney and I can take it as slowly as I like. So I need to get this thing operational.

                      I needed to make the CXA toolpost for the Lagun usable and preferably at the same height as the Lagun so I don't have to reset toolholder height. Ideally it would have a CA, but we don't have one right now.

                      I started with the T-nut, which which went well except for one goof. I didn't tighten the collet enough and was being greedy with a .730" deep cut taking the sides down in one pass and my endmill slipped deeper. I'm not pleased about it, but I don't want to remake it so I'll probably just fill it with JB weld and remachine.

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                      Then I made a stud. Nothing special, 3/4"-10 on the one end and M18x1.5 on the other. Single pointed. Went well. Clearly I'm much better with a lathe than a mill. I power tapped the block 3/4"-10 on the Royersford.

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                      Now I just need a riser. I calculated the difference in center height between the two machines and looked for some suitable material. Didn't have any, but I we did have some old weight plates kicking around. I decided to trepan one out of the center. So I spent some time and ground up a face-grooving tool and tried that.

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                      It could have been a bit thinner, but it worked superb. Took almost all the rigidity the Lagun had to offer. I fed at 0.0045" per rev at 60 RPM.

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                      There's the ring sitting inside it's captor.

                      Mounted up and ready to go!

                      21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
                      1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

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                      • That’s a good looking face groover. I’m always impressed by your can-do attitude.

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                        • Thanks SVS. Can do attitude is a must. I have no choice but to finish this.
                          21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
                          1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

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                          • Another "Why didn't I think of that" moment from this site? I have two lathes and the both have BXA tool posts, but one sits quite a bit higher than the other. A shim under the low one and I can use the tool holders on both without having to readjust for height! Thank you, thank you!!
                            Grantham, New Hampshire

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                            • Well you're very welcome CPeter! Just make sure your toolposts are the same height. I'm not sure if it's 100% consistent across brands. In my case I steal the entire post so it's no concern. I did the same thing on the Lagun with the AXA post off the Rockwell if I need use smaller tools.
                              21" Royersford Excelsior CamelBack Drillpress Restoration
                              1943 Sidney 16x54 Lathe Restoration

                              Comment


                              • Beautiful work!

                                Yeah I know about getting too greedy... I had to break a dozen pcs of carbide (Incl a 1/2" endmill) before I learned my lesson. Believe it or not, my little 9" SB did that --- in the last split second before something breaks, you can see the entire chuck and the slides flexing like 1/4".... then, BANG and its gonna be a long day.....

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