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Off topic we wont sell to you ,,a rant

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  • Off topic we wont sell to you ,,a rant

    Two times in the last month ,I have run into the old fashioned ".wholesale ".BS. The first was Michigan pneumatics..I wanted an unusual $200 single hit air chisel.They ran me around to a ""concrete products distributer in St Louis ,that wouldnt return my calls.The second is Marcone appliance part supply..I have bought from them for 30 years and never had a problem or returned a part.Now they say they are "WHOLESALE ONLY' I guess they have too much money and they dont need mine.For those who are young and dont remember the "good old days' of the 50s,It was horrible.. Everything had multiple levels of distribution and priceing..Every auto part store had 3 or 4 prices for the same part depending on who you were..Some states had fair trade laws that said that you couldnt sell below the "list" price.The phrase "I CAN GET IT FOR YOU WHOLESALE WAS VERY COMMON"I hope those days are over for good I think that the price that you charge a person or business for a product. should be based on how much it cost you to sell it to them.In other words ,if Ford motor company buys 2 bolts from me in a year,they should pay the same as Joe blow down the street..Edwin Dirnbeck.

  • #2
    I grew up in the same era, and I know the frustration of which you speak. However, if I were running a business I would want to be at liberty to run it in the most efficient way as I saw fit, without any mandates or regulations aimed solely at keeping everyone happy.
    Lynn (Huntsville, AL)

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    • #3
      I get it. Not the same thing but I tried to buy a sprayer from Northern tool last Saturday and they wouldn’t sell it to me. Said they couldn’t sell me the display unit. Grr

      Comment


      • #4
        There is also that sales tax thing, which they don't have to collect and pay to the state. Here in CA you do not want to run afoul of the Board of Equalization, better to stiff your bookie. I recently ran across the "here's our distributor in your area" thing trying to get a replacement screen for my 40 y/o chipper. I decided to make my own, twice as thick as the original.
        It's all mind over matter.
        If you don't mind, it don't matter.

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        • #5
          I think a big part of it is to avoid having a lot of time spent on $5 items where the customer has a million questions and takes over a half hour of the sales rep's time.

          If such places had a variety of stuff I often buy and told me that they have a $40 or $60 minimum invoice billing amount I'd be fine with such a thing. But I too have run into places where I used to buy stuff just fine and now they are "purchaser order only" with the only across the counter sales being to companies that already have an account with them.
          Chilliwack BC, Canada

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Edwin Dirnbeck View Post
            Two times in the last month ,I have run into the old fashioned ".wholesale ".BS. The first was Michigan pneumatics..I wanted an unusual $200 single hit air chisel.They ran me around to a ""concrete products distributer in St Louis ,that wouldnt return my calls.The second is Marcone appliance part supply..I have bought from them for 30 years and never had a problem or returned a part.Now they say they are "WHOLESALE ONLY' I guess they have too much money and they dont need mine.For those who are young and dont remember the "good old days' of the 50s,It was horrible.. Everything had multiple levels of distribution and priceing..Every auto part store had 3 or 4 prices for the same part depending on who you were..Some states had fair trade laws that said that you couldnt sell below the "list" price.The phrase "I CAN GET IT FOR YOU WHOLESALE WAS VERY COMMON"I hope those days are over for good I think that the price that you charge a person or business for a product. should be based on how much it cost you to sell it to them.In other words ,if Ford motor company buys 2 bolts from me in a year,they should pay the same as Joe blow down the street..Edwin Dirnbeck.
            The minute you try to legislate a level playing field like that, you're gonna get some nutters screaming about their "Freedoms" to be complete scam artists, and they'll start yelling about how you're some kind of commie if you don't let them do absolutely anything they want.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by BCRider View Post
              I think a big part of it is to avoid having a lot of time spent on $5 items where the customer has a million questions and takes over a half hour of the sales rep's time.

              If such places had a variety of stuff I often buy and told me that they have a $40 or $60 minimum invoice billing amount I'd be fine with such a thing. But I too have run into places where I used to buy stuff just fine and now they are "purchaser order only" with the only across the counter sales being to companies that already have an account with them.
              And at least here(Finland) you need to display all the product prices in the shop if you sell to consumers. If business only the shelves don't need to have prices shown. Plus the warranty terms are often different for consumers vs business. And end user support.

              Around here most of the "business only" walk-in places still accept personal credit card as a payment as long as you give any company name to keep them happy and you don't ask too many stupid questions. Some might even ask for the company VAT number but that is rare.
              Usually I use the company name where I work but sometimes I just make up some bogus "HSM incorporated"

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              • #8
                I know this isn't the same thing but similar. When I got my surface plates and tried to get a company to come and calibrate them out in my Podunk workshop. I just got a runaround. Guy from supposedly reputable company schedule with me 3 times and no-showed all 3. Frustrating.

                I went and bought an autocollimator and a Supramess indicator. So I will at least have half a chance of knowing how far out my plates are.

                Best Regards,
                Bob

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                • #9
                  With the internet I seem to be able to find good prices and someone to sell me just about any item I need or want. Seems like progress from the old days for me.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Another slightly similar: My Clopay garage door spring broke, purchased originally from Home Depot. I went to both websites to get a replacement. No Go! Only links to qualified service techs.

                    WAIT! WHAT!

                    When I bought this EZ-Set door, it was sold as EZ for DIY installers to install. I installed the damn thing! Now I'm not qualified to replace the spring WTH

                    Ok ok. I know we've become the land of snowflakes. After searching online, I did find a site http://ddmgaragedoors.com that would sell me the springs and had great customer service.


                    Best Regards,
                    Bob
                    Last edited by rjs44032; 07-29-2020, 04:50 PM.

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                    • #11
                      My last position before I retired was in sales. We had two prices, one for equipment dealers, one for consumers. We also had a $60 minimum parts order requirement that I would sometimes bend a bit for customers that I dealt with on a regular basis. If they were under but close to the minimum, I'd include our standard $10 P/H as part of the price to get it to the minimum. We had our own part numbers for every nut, bolt and washer that we used in our products. They were nothing special, just grade 8 NC or NF or Metric grade 10.9. If a customer just needed a bolt or two, I'd just tell them what it was so they could buy it at their local hardware store. I figured if it helped them get up and running quicker, it was customer service. I was also told that I if I had a customer that was a real @$$ I could charge as much as I wanted which I ended up doing a time or two! That company has been in business for about 80 yrs, I worked there 44 of those. ANYTHING that we ever built, if at all possible, we provided parts and support for it. Pretty rare now a days.
                      One of our local steel suppliers used to accept walk in customers, you could just walk into the office and have them pull a 20 ft stick of 2X2 angle and they'd write it up and take your money. Not anymore! No walk in's and a $250 minimum order!

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                      • #12
                        I have a preferred place to buy my metal needs from. These people will deal with you if you just need a couple bolts, or if you need a truckload of stuff. I think the key for the business is to be able to handle both- cut out the little guy and you probably lose some of the bigger clients too. The roots of this business are old school, and they have adhered to the original tenets. I can imagine that they have become victims at least in some small way of 'short sighted university graduate economists' , but still show an appreciation for every customer. They have lost money on me a couple times, but the attitude there keeps me coming back- and over all they have made money from me, plus I have brought them some customers. Any place that has treated me poorly doesn't get my future business- but they do get my negative verbal advertising.

                        What really gets me is when there's only one place I can get some particular item, and they have it- but I have to buy it from some other middle man. If I read about that company going TU, I'd laugh.
                        I seldom do anything within the scope of logical reason and calculated cost/benefit, etc- I'm following my passion-

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Edwin Dirnbeck View Post
                          I think that the price that you charge a person or business for a product. should be based on how much it cost you to sell it to them.
                          Business do not exist for altruistic reasons. They generally exist for the sole purpose of making money for the owner(s). Most business in the US do everything possible to maximize profits (sometimes at the expense of the long term good, the environment, etc.). The consumers main power in a free market system is to shop elsewhere if they find the practices of any particular business unsuitable.

                          The price a product sells for usually has rather little to do with it's cost to manufacture and sell. It DOES determine if a business can make a profit, and is thusly viable. Items are typically priced at what the market will bear. 'Fair' doesn't usually enter into the picture, but profitability MUST. If there is healthy competition, the selling price will likely not be a whole lot over the costs associated with manufacturing and sales. Having a monopoly is good for profits, but not so good in other ways (so legislation becomes involved). Variable pricing is a mechanism to squeeze the most out of people. Several posters point out the legitimacy of some policies that may seem bad, but exist for good reason,

                          Think about it - YOU make a product that costs $1 to manufacture and you can sell it for $5 - how 'wise' would it be to sell it for a $1,10?
                          Margins are often ridiculously high, and many businesses are inefficient because it is easier and they can afford to be. Some business have to take big risks, which of course costs extra. Some, like grocery stores, operate on a comparatively tiny margin, but do tremendous volumes, which makes them viable profit centers.
                          Some business models are fantastic, some business models suck, some are flat-out bad policy (often because a lot of people are simply crappy at business), but hey, it's a semi-free country.

                          To recap:
                          1) Business are in business to make money/maximize profit.
                          2) The cost of a product is typically what the market will bear and has little to do with its cost.

                          Ask 10 random people why the company they have worked for for 20 years is in business. You will get some truly ridiculous answers.
                          A useful skill is the ability to take a moment and look at things from the perspective of the business owner, or of your employer or boss, or whomever is on the 'other side' of the issue. Things typically look different when various responsibilities fall upon your own shoulders.

                          That being said, I agree with your sentiment Edwin. A business that can't be bothered to call me back doesn't deserve my business, and if they want to make it difficult for me to buy from them, I will put a whole lot of effort towards giving my money to someone who shows me that they value me as a customer.
                          Last edited by Joel; 07-29-2020, 06:18 PM.
                          Location: North Central Texas

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Joel View Post
                            ....
                            To recap:
                            1) Business are in business to make money/maximize profit.
                            2) The cost of a product is typically what the market will bear and has little to do with its cost.
                            ....
                            I was shocked in a marketing course when in selling the proverbial widget, cost had nothing to do with it. It was if we price it at $1 we sell so many, at $10 so many. In other words it created a Bell curve. The point was at what price and number of pieces sold can we generate the most money.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Nice thread.
                              I owned a small machine shop for 20+ years.
                              One thing that I learned was to not be obviously open on Saturdays, this is when the enthusiasts are off from work, the automotive "classic" car owners, cyclists, motorcycle fans, fisherman, archers, gun nuts, bee keepers, boat owners and the general public.

                              Classic car owners will talk about their babies for hours using my valuable time.
                              A typical conversation is much like this.

                              Cheap Car Owner
                              Car Owner: I need a new alternator adjusting bracket for my restored cherry 1967 Pontiac GTO, can you make a new one, here is the broken part to model.
                              (This includes a 1 hour verbal history of the GTO)

                              Me: Yes

                              Car owner: How much?

                              Me: After a quick estimate, cut material, bend, mill radius adjusting slot, drill other holes and deburr, $350.00.

                              Car Owner: That is absurd, Pontiac sold them for $19.00 in 1970, If I could buy one I would.

                              Me: It is the year 2015, Pontiac's vendor made thousands of them at a time in 1966, you want 1 correct?

                              Car Owner: Yes, but you do not understand, this is a CLASSIC 1967 Pontiac GTO being restored.

                              Me: This is your baby, I have no interest in cars classic or otherwise, go away.

                              Not Cheap Car Owner

                              Car Owner: I need a new alternator adjusting bracket for my restored cherry 1967 Pontiac GTO, can you make a new one, here is the broken part to model.

                              Me: Yes

                              Car Owner: How much?

                              Me: $350.00

                              Car Owner: Good, make 2 just in case.


                              The retail cost of a product is what people are willing to pay, manufacturing costs mean little.

                              I can not verify the veracity of this article.
                              https://www.investopedia.com/financi...an-iphone.aspx









                              Last edited by Bented; 07-29-2020, 08:38 PM.

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